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Thread: The 144,000 of Rev 14

  1. #31
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    Re: The 144,000 of Rev 14

    Quote Originally Posted by Tony P View Post
    That is a question worthy of its own thread. I'll start one.
    Really Tony this is one my favorite question for the Post tribs some never even try to answerr LOL

  2. #32
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    Re: The 144,000 of Rev 14

    Quote Originally Posted by Jesuslovesus View Post
    Really Tony this is one my favorite question for the Post tribs some never even try to answerr LOL
    Malachi 1:2 “I have loved you,” says the Lord.
    “Yet you say, ‘In what way have You loved us?’
    Was not Esau Jacob’s brother?”
    Says the Lord.
    “Yet Jacob I have loved;
    3 But Esau I have hated,
    And laid waste his mountains and his heritage
    For the jackals of the wilderness.”
    4 Even though Edom has said,
    “We have been impoverished,
    But we will return and build the desolate places,”
    Thus says the Lord of hosts:

    “They may build, but I will throw down;
    They shall be called the Territory of Wickedness,
    And the people against whom the Lord will have indignation forever.
    5 Your eyes shall see,
    And you shall say,
    ‘The Lord is magnified beyond the border of Israel.’

    The first harvest is the whole house of Jacob. The second harvest is the whole house of Esau. "YOUR EYES SHALL SEE!!" Every Jew who has ever read this is included. They ALL will see the house of Esau in the winepress. Trodden by none other than Jesus alone, a Jew.

  3. #33
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    Re: The 144,000 of Rev 14

    If my interpretations of the prophets are correct, God will bring on Israel a locust plague 3 or 4 years running. During that time, after all the food runs out and Israel faces an existential crisis, the religious leaders of Israel will announce that the population should come to Jerusalem to pray for Israel, to seek God's mercy and an end to the plague. Just after that, God will send fire throughout the land of Israel, burning every house, animal, and person into ashes who did not make the trip to Jerusalem. Isaiah refers to these people as "the survivors."

    Isaiah 1:9 Unless the Lord of hosts Had left us a few survivors, We would be like Sodom, We would be like Gomorrah.

    Isaiah 4:2 In that day the Branch of the Lord will be beautiful and glorious, and the fruit of the earth will be the pride and the adornment of the survivors of Israel.

    Isaiah 37:32 For out of Jerusalem will go forth a remnant and out of Mount Zion survivors. The zeal of the Lord of hosts will perform this.”’


    And Joel also calls them survivors.

    Joel 2:32 “And it will come about that whoever calls on the name of the Lord Will be delivered; For on Mount Zion and in Jerusalem There will be those who escape, As the Lord has said, Even among the survivors whom the Lord calls.

    The survivors are those who decide to obey the call and come to Jerusalem to pray for the nation. In this context, "to call on the name of the Lord" is to travel to Jerusalem for a very large prayer meeting, and as it happens, only those who actually make the trip to Jerusalem will be saved because the rest of the country will be utterly destroyed.

    If I am right, we know these survivors as the 144,000 Jews who meet with Jesus on Mt. Zion.

  4. #34
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    Re: The 144,000 of Rev 14

    Where is the lamb?

    In heaven thus so too must already the 144000

    Which means the 144000 have already been resurrected and judged having gods name in thier foreheads.

    They are the firstfruits of the resurrection. The rest of the dead believers are not resurrected until the first resurrection once Christ returns to the earth.

    The 144000 make up the army which returns with the lamb. Why well we know they are already resurrected and they follow the lamb. Not not all can be the army since the second coming occurs before the gathering of all from the grave.

    These 144000 did not commit fornication ie receive the woman's Mark.

    These 144000 are those beheaded and seen in Rev 20:4

  5. #35
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    Re: The 144,000 of Rev 14

    Quote Originally Posted by CadyandZoe View Post
    If my interpretations of the prophets are correct, God will bring on Israel a locust plague 3 or 4 years running. During that time, after all the food runs out and Israel faces an existential crisis, the religious leaders of Israel will announce that the population should come to Jerusalem to pray for Israel, to seek God's mercy and an end to the plague. Just after that, God will send fire throughout the land of Israel, burning every house, animal, and person into ashes who did not make the trip to Jerusalem. Isaiah refers to these people as "the survivors."

    Isaiah 1:9 Unless the Lord of hosts Had left us a few survivors, We would be like Sodom, We would be like Gomorrah.

    Isaiah 4:2 In that day the Branch of the Lord will be beautiful and glorious, and the fruit of the earth will be the pride and the adornment of the survivors of Israel.

    Isaiah 37:32 For out of Jerusalem will go forth a remnant and out of Mount Zion survivors. The zeal of the Lord of hosts will perform this.”’


    And Joel also calls them survivors.

    Joel 2:32 “And it will come about that whoever calls on the name of the Lord Will be delivered; For on Mount Zion and in Jerusalem There will be those who escape, As the Lord has said, Even among the survivors whom the Lord calls.

    The survivors are those who decide to obey the call and come to Jerusalem to pray for the nation. In this context, "to call on the name of the Lord" is to travel to Jerusalem for a very large prayer meeting, and as it happens, only those who actually make the trip to Jerusalem will be saved because the rest of the country will be utterly destroyed.

    If I am right, we know these survivors as the 144,000 Jews who meet with Jesus on Mt. Zion.
    Agree however survivors from the second death. Theses 144000 would be the dry bones ez 38 would they not

  6. #36
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    Re: The 144,000 of Rev 14

    Quote Originally Posted by ross3421 View Post
    Agree however survivors from the second death. Theses 144000 would be the dry bones ez 38 would they not
    Ultimately, all of those in Christ are survivors of the second death, which not only includes the 144,000 but all of Jesus' followers. But these "survivors" are the ones who continued to live even after God's final destructive judgment against Israel.

  7. #37
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    Re: The 144,000 of Rev 14

    Quote Originally Posted by T W Taylor View Post
    You are correct, The first harvest, the Firstfruits harvest is part of the harvest of Israel. The resurrection and harvest at the end of the age. It is the 144,000 servants of God

    Matt 13:39 "The enemy who sowed them is the devil, the harvest is the end of the age, and the reapers are the angels.

    Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat on them, and judgment was committed to them. Then I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for their witness to Jesus and for the word of God, who had not worshiped the beast or his image, and had not received his mark on their foreheads or on their hands. And they lived and reigned with Christ for a thousand years.

    Rev 20:5 But [B]the rest of the dead did not live again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.[/B]
    You have me confused here. On one hand, you say the 144,000 are the harvest of Israel and then you go and quote Rev 20:4-5, where do the scriptures fit in? Are you saying the 144,000 are those in Rev 20:4, ie, the first resurrection?

  8. #38
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    Re: The 144,000 of Rev 14

    Quote Originally Posted by marty fox View Post
    Symbolic as the church the 144 000 made up of the 144=12 tribes x the 12 disciples and 1000 meaning many. Just like Jesus hears of the symbolic lamb he turns and sees the symbolic lion John hears of the 144 000 and then sees the great multitude of every tribe tong & nation

    Just in case you missed this Trivalee.

  9. #39
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    Re: The 144,000 of Rev 14

    Quote Originally Posted by CadyandZoe View Post
    Ultimately, all of those in Christ are survivors of the second death, which not only includes the 144,000 but all of Jesus' followers. But these "survivors" are the ones who continued to live even after God's final destructive judgment against Israel.
    Can't agree here...one has to die to enter into the eternal kingdom

  10. #40
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    Re: The 144,000 of Rev 14

    Quote Originally Posted by CadyandZoe View Post
    Ultimately, all of those in Christ are survivors of the second death, which not only includes the 144,000 but all of Jesus' followers. But these "survivors" are the ones who continued to live even after God's final destructive judgment against Israel.
    Which second death are you talking about?

  11. #41
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    Re: The 144,000 of Rev 14

    Quote Originally Posted by ross3421 View Post
    Can't agree here...one has to die to enter into the eternal kingdom
    Just curious where do you fit Revelations 12:10-12 into your view? Revelations 12:10 And I heard a loud voice in heaven, saying, “Now the salvation and the power and the kingdom of our God and the authority of his Christ have come, for the accuser of our brothers[b] has been thrown down, who accuses them day and night before our God. 11 And they have conquered him by the blood of the Lamb and by the word of their testimony, for they loved not their lives even unto death. 12 Therefore, rejoice, O heavens and you who dwell in them!

  12. #42
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    Re: The 144,000 of Rev 14

    Quote Originally Posted by ross3421 View Post
    Can't agree here...one has to die to enter into the eternal kingdom
    Have you not read that we who are alive at the coming of the Lord will be transformed?

  13. #43
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    Re: The 144,000 of Rev 14

    Quote Originally Posted by Trivalee View Post
    Which second death are you talking about?
    Join coins the phrase "second death" to indicate what happens to those who were not given eternal life in the final judgment.

  14. #44
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    Re: The 144,000 of Rev 14

    Quote Originally Posted by CadyandZoe View Post
    Join coins the phrase "second death" to indicate what happens to those who were not given eternal life in the final judgment.
    OK. Thanks for clarifying.

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    Re: The 144,000 of Rev 14

    Quote Originally Posted by CadyandZoe View Post
    Have you not read that we who are alive at the coming of the Lord will be transformed?
    Sure.....the dead in Christ once risen become those who are alive and remain...

    The dead in Christ shall rise first then we (the dead in Christ resurrected) which (now) are alive and remain shall be caught together with (others) whom sleep.

    Paul speaks 1cor15 that we are made ALIVE from the dead at the resurrection.

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