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Thread: Hell an everlasting never ending torment?

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    Hell an everlasting never ending torment?

    I was raised up in an old country church and was always taught that those that go to Hell were punished for all eternity suffering in pain and anguish. Luke 16 about a drop of water to cool the tounge verse's of weeping and gnashing of teeth, eternal flames and the worm never dieth etc... were read. It's 25-30 years later and I got to thinking about what I've always just taken for granted all these years.

    Is this really the hell that is pictured in the Bible. So I have just started studying on this but what better way to study than to get the thoughts and ideas of fellow brothers and sisters in Christ.

    So from your studies what happens to the damned who go to Hell?
    Last edited by uric3; May 12th 2017 at 02:03 AM. Reason: Misspelling

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    Re: Hell an everlasting never ending torment?

    Quote Originally Posted by uric3 View Post
    I was raised up in an old country church and was always taught that those that go to Hell were punished for all eternity suffering in pain and anguish. Luke 16 about a drop of water to cool the tounge verse's of weeping and gnashing of teeth, eternal flames and the worm never dieth etc... were read. It's 25-30 years later and I got to thinking about what I've always just taken for granted all these years.

    Is this really the hell that is pictured in the Bible. So I have just started studying on this but what better way to study than to get the thoughts and ideas of fellow brothers and sisters in Christ.

    So from your studies what happens to the damned who go to Hell?
    Yes, I'm afraid that it is that's why man so desperately needs a saviour....

    John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.


    Jude
    Matthew24:29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

    30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.



  3. #3

    Re: Hell an everlasting never ending torment?

    Well, some people think yes, others no.

    (Rev 20:10 KJV) And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

    Tormented G928. basanizo, bas-an-id'-zo; from G931; to torture:--pain, toil, torment, toss, vex.


    (Rev 20:11 KJV) And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them.

    (Rev 20:12 KJV) And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.

    (Rev 20:13 KJV) And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.

    (Rev 20:14 KJV) And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

    (Rev 20:15 KJV) And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.


    Note in Verse 14 - hell is also cast into the lake of fire

    Hell G86. haides, hah'-dace; from G1 (as a neg. particle) and G1492; prop. unseen, i.e. "Hades" or the place (state) of departed souls:--grave, hell.


    (Rev 21:8 KJV) But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.




    Quote Originally Posted by uric3 View Post
    I was raised up in an old country church and was always taught that those that go to Hell were punished for all eternity suffering in pain and anguish. Luke 16 about a drop of water to cool the tounge verse's of weeping and gnashing of teeth, eternal flames and the worm never dieth etc... were read. It's 25-30 years later and I got to thinking about what I've always just taken for granted all these years.

    Is this really the hell that is pictured in the Bible. So I have just started studying on this but what better way to study than to get the thoughts and ideas of fellow brothers and sisters in Christ.

    So from your studies what happens to the damned who go to Hell?

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    Re: Hell an everlasting never ending torment?

    Quote Originally Posted by uric3 View Post
    I was raised up in an old country church and was always taught that those that go to Hell were punished for all eternity suffering in pain and anguish. Luke 16 about a drop of water to cool the tounge verse's of weeping and gnashing of teeth, eternal flames and the worm never dieth etc... were read. It's 25-30 years later and I got to thinking about what I've always just taken for granted all these years.

    Is this really the hell that is pictured in the Bible. So I have just started studying on this but what better way to study than to get the thoughts and ideas of fellow brothers and sisters in Christ.

    So from your studies what happens to the damned who go to Hell?
    I'm not sure that's the best way to study!

    And yes, hell is just as the Bible describes.

  5. #5

    Re: Hell an everlasting never ending torment?

    Quote Originally Posted by uric3 View Post
    So from your studies what happens to the damned who go to Hell?
    More recently, the Bible doctrine of Hell has come under severe attack, and even by so-called evangelicals. Many who are new to the faith (or do not know enough Scripture) are being swayed by these false teachers.

    But the Bible is crystal clear about Hell (Greek Gehenna) also called the Lake of Fire. It is a place of eternal torment and located in *outer darkness*. The warnings regarding Hell as given by Christ Himself (who created Hell for the devil and his angels) should be sufficient for everyone, but the cults especially reject the doctrine of Hell, just as the reject the doctrines of the Trinity and the Deity of Christ.

    Hades (also translated as *hell* in the KJV) is currently also a place of torment for those awaiting their final judgment. Only the souls and spirits of the unsaved go to Hades, since the resurrection of Christ, and the OT concept of Sheol (equivalent to Hades) is no longer valid. All the OT saints are now in Heaven awaiting their resurrection.

    Purgatory is a complete fiction, but this concept is strongly promoted by the RCC. If anyone reading this is not saved, you should understand that there are only two destinations for souls and spirits upon death -- Heaven or Hell. That is why you are commanded to repent and believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, since only those who are in Christ will be in Heaven.

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    Re: Hell an everlasting never ending torment?

    For me it is difficult to reconcile Lake of Fire V.S. It being the second death.
    If death is ceasing to exist, it seems eternal torment would still be having partial life, at least enough to feel torment---

    But of course death and hell are cast into the fire, which I suppose would mean either death is also tormented, or somehow death is destroyed, therefore life in burning flame continues...very confusing.
    Peace to you!

    If anyone makes the assistance of grace to believe the gospel depend on the humility or obedience of man and does not agree that it is a gift of grace itself that we are obedient and humble, he contradicts the Apostle who says, "What have you that you did not receive?" and, "But by the grace of God I am what I am" - Council of Orange

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    Re: Hell an everlasting never ending torment?

    Quote Originally Posted by Scooby_Snacks View Post
    For me it is difficult to reconcile Lake of Fire V.S. It being the second death.
    If death is ceasing to exist, it seems eternal torment would still be having partial life, at least enough to feel torment---

    But of course death and hell are cast into the fire, which I suppose would mean either death is also tormented, or somehow death is destroyed, therefore life in burning flame continues...very confusing.
    Death is not "ceasing to exist", it is more properly thought of as being separated from something. Physical death is the separation of our spirit from our body. Spiritual death is the separation of our spirit from God's presence. I think that will be one of the greatest torments of Hell; the lost will have seen God in person (at the Judgement), but then will be separated from Him for all eternity.

    But to answer the OP question, yes, Hell is an eternal, never ending torment for those who reject God, and never accept Christ's sacrifice for them. It is clear in Scripture that only those who love God enough to obey Him will be blessed with eternal paradise, and those who do not love God enough to obey Him will be separated from God for all eternity to wallow in torment, and fire forever.

  8. #8

    Re: Hell an everlasting never ending torment?

    Quote Originally Posted by Scooby_Snacks View Post
    For me it is difficult to reconcile Lake of Fire V.S. It being the second death.
    If death is ceasing to exist, it seems eternal torment would still be having partial life, at least enough to feel torment---

    But of course death and hell are cast into the fire, which I suppose would mean either death is also tormented, or somehow death is destroyed, therefore life in burning flame continues...very confusing.
    There are many who misunderstand the meaning of the second death, as well as the meaning of Death and Hades (not Hell) being cast into the Lake of Fire.

    So the first thing to clarify is that if there is a second death, there must be a first death. The first death is not the annihilation of the soul and spirit but rather the SEPARATION of the soul and spirit from the body. When believers die their souls and spirits go to be with Christ. See Acts 7 & 8. When the unsaved die, their souls and spirits go to Hades. At the same time, all bodies go into their graves and return to dust. There is no such thing as Soul Sleep (which is taught by some cults).

    So the second death should also be seen as separation, but this is eternal separation of the body, soul, and spirit from God. Those who are cast into the Lake of Fire are eternally separated from God, and that is also a part of their torment. Therefore Scripture says "This is the second death".

    When Scripture says that Death and Hades were cast into the Lake of Fire, we should recall that Death and Hades are personified in the book of Revelation, and are in fact shown riding on a pale horse (Rev 6:8). Thus Death and Hades are also cast into the Lake of Fire metaphorically. What it simply means is that after the Great White Throne Judgment, death and Hades will cease to exist, since all those who died will be resurrected (at the resurrection unto damnation) and all the occupants of Hades will be in the Lake of Fire.

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    Re: Hell an everlasting never ending torment?

    Quote Originally Posted by uric3 View Post
    So from your studies what happens to the damned who go to Hell?
    They are completely destroyed.

    And do not fear those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather fear him who can destroy both soul and body in hell. (Mt. 10:28)

    They will suffer the punishment of eternal destruction, away from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of his might, (2 Thes. 1:9)

    And they shall go out and look on the dead bodies of the men who have rebelled against me. For their worm shall not die, their fire shall not be quenched, and they shall be an abhorrence to all flesh. (Is. 66:24) [quoted as "hell/gehena" in Mark 9:48]

    By turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah to ashes He condemned them to extinction, making them an example of what is going to happen to the ungodly (2 Pt. 2:6)

    I can give an argument if you'd like or add the entire list of verses I have to support this, but these four/five speak for themselves and I don't feel the need to add commentary.
    Rejoice in the Lord always; again I will say, rejoice. Let your reasonableness be known to everyone.
    The Lord is at hand; do not be anxious about anything, but in everything by prayer and supplication with thanksgiving let your requests be made known to God.
    And the peace of God, which surpasses all understanding, will guard your hearts and your minds in Christ Jesus. Ph 4

  10. #10

    Re: Hell an everlasting never ending torment?

    Hell is everlasting punishment, even eternal torments in the lake of fire...Matthew 25:46 is my favorite verse to use when dealing with this subject. Also "there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth" somewhere in Matthew 13.
    For <in the gospel> the righteousness of God is revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith. Romans 1:17

    Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ. Romans 5:1

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    Re: Hell an everlasting never ending torment?

    Quote Originally Posted by justbyfaith View Post
    Hell is everlasting punishment, even eternal torments in the lake of fire...Matthew 25:46 is my favorite verse to use when dealing with this subject. Also "there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth" somewhere in Matthew 13.
    It seems to me the wailing and gnashing of teeth happens prior to (as I would argue my case for my own righteousness in that case, feeling wronged) before being thrown into the LoF...that would be torment to think I was innocent, when I was not.
    Peace to you!

    If anyone makes the assistance of grace to believe the gospel depend on the humility or obedience of man and does not agree that it is a gift of grace itself that we are obedient and humble, he contradicts the Apostle who says, "What have you that you did not receive?" and, "But by the grace of God I am what I am" - Council of Orange

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    Re: Hell an everlasting never ending torment?

    Quote Originally Posted by Daniel567 View Post
    There are many who misunderstand the meaning of the second death, as well as the meaning of Death and Hades (not Hell) being cast into the Lake of Fire.

    So the first thing to clarify is that if there is a second death, there must be a first death. The first death is not the annihilation of the soul and spirit but rather the SEPARATION of the soul and spirit from the body. When believers die their souls and spirits go to be with Christ. See Acts 7 & 8. When the unsaved die, their souls and spirits go to Hades. At the same time, all bodies go into their graves and return to dust. There is no such thing as Soul Sleep (which is taught by some cults).

    So the second death should also be seen as separation, but this is eternal separation of the body, soul, and spirit from God. Those who are cast into the Lake of Fire are eternally separated from God, and that is also a part of their torment. Therefore Scripture says "This is the second death".

    When Scripture says that Death and Hades were cast into the Lake of Fire, we should recall that Death and Hades are personified in the book of Revelation, and are in fact shown riding on a pale horse (Rev 6:8). Thus Death and Hades are also cast into the Lake of Fire metaphorically. What it simply means is that after the Great White Throne Judgment, death and Hades will cease to exist, since all those who died will be resurrected (at the resurrection unto damnation) and all the occupants of Hades will be in the Lake of Fire.
    Perhaps looking at why death would = separation, rather than actual death is in order.
    I recall having conversations concerning this in regard to the garden...
    Peace to you!

    If anyone makes the assistance of grace to believe the gospel depend on the humility or obedience of man and does not agree that it is a gift of grace itself that we are obedient and humble, he contradicts the Apostle who says, "What have you that you did not receive?" and, "But by the grace of God I am what I am" - Council of Orange

  13. #13

    Re: Hell an everlasting never ending torment?

    Quote Originally Posted by Scooby_Snacks View Post
    It seems to me the wailing and gnashing of teeth happens prior to (as I would argue my case for my own righteousness in that case, feeling wronged) before being thrown into the LoF...that would be torment to think I was innocent, when I was not.
    If you look at Matthew 25:46, and Matthew 13:42,50 together, and understand them as complementing each other, then you will understand that there is wailing and gnashing of teeth involved in everlasting punishment.

    Understand that the devil's experience in the lake of fire will also be the experience of all who go there. Consider that those whose names are not written in the Lamb's Book of Life will be cast into the lake of fire, and that their experience will be the lake of fire and brimstone wherein the devil and they shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever. Revelation 20:10.

    Consider also that everlasting torments for humanity IS A REALITY according to Revelation 14:9-11.
    For <in the gospel> the righteousness of God is revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith. Romans 1:17

    Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ. Romans 5:1

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    Re: Hell an everlasting never ending torment?

    Just a few thoughts-- my current understanding:

    When mankind was separated from God (being dead in trespasses and sin) only in Christ could the dead be brought into newness of life and live eternally--

    Only those who are alive in Christ will actually live (their spirit and soul) for eternity from what I understand.
    When we physically die, we do not auto go to heaven, or auto hell but it is like we are sleeping until Christ returns.


    Then the dead in Christ will be resurrected with new bodies.
    The rest will perish, already separated from God and spiritually dead in sin, no longer having bodies-
    based on John 3:16--

    “For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.

    So even though unquenching fire and torment is mentioned in passages, so is being destroyed or perishing.

    It cannot be both, certainly. I would offer a possible meaning of unquenched eternal fire as a fire that will do what its intended purpose is to do, without faltering in anyway. This is destruction in a very painful manner, and is permanent. (cannot be undone, or is eternal)
    Peace to you!

    If anyone makes the assistance of grace to believe the gospel depend on the humility or obedience of man and does not agree that it is a gift of grace itself that we are obedient and humble, he contradicts the Apostle who says, "What have you that you did not receive?" and, "But by the grace of God I am what I am" - Council of Orange

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    Re: Hell an everlasting never ending torment?

    My apologies for not joining in sooner, I have been a little busy and just got some time to check back in. As an FYI I know Hell exist and I know those who are not saved will go there no doubt about that, however after doing some studying of my own I am starting to lean toward what Aviyah posted. Several of the passages posted note a 2nd death and in Revelation when it notes the devil being tormented night and day it only refers to him and not any human. Everytime we are referred to it notes second death. Also the other passages mentioned above have the same words. Granted the OT doesn't say anything about Gehenna the word used by Jesus used in the NT to describe Hell. However the end of the wicked is there several times.

    It notes there death and the righteous will walk upon the ashes of the corpses(we know a corpses is a lifeless body.) That is the theme throughout OT as the end of the wicked. The same words used in the NT about weeping and gnashing of teeth is used as well in Psalm 112 those that are weeking and gnashing there teeth will vanish away per verse 10. As it was mentioned earlier Jesus' warning was clear to fear God who could destroy both body and soul in hell. I know what destroy means and why would Jesus threaten it, if it wasn't the case. Why not threaten burning forever... in every instance 90% of the time I notice three words used to describe what will happen to the wicked in the NT.

    1. Perish look at John 3:16 "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." Why would this word be used instead of endless torment? We all know what perish means our choice in John 3:16 is to live forever or die.

    2. Destory in Matth 10:28 "And do not fear those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather fear him who can destroy both soul and body in hell." Once again we all know what this word means why not live forever in torment.

    3. Second Death see almost the entire end of Revelation every time it refers to mankind and their punishment its always the second death. Only time torment for ever and ever day and night is used isn't pointed at anyone other than the Devil himself... every time those not found in the book of life are mentioned or those who didn't worship the lamb its always the 2nd death.

    So in the entire OT no mention of burning forever, only the death of the wicked or vanishing away is found. In the NT only three terms are used in referring to the end of the wicked. Destroy, Perish, and Second Death with this in mind I can't really find a single verse in the Old or New Testament to say yep right here it says our punishment mankind is to burn forever... Granted I have more passages and can go into more detail and would like to hear more from Aviyah and her studies but from a Bible and Scripture standpoint I can point to a lot of versions that threaten death perish or destroy but none for the other I believed for so long. I'm not 100% convinced but so far I have far more verses to support one than the other... the others are assumptions...

    Something else that amazed me is several times the Flood and Sodom and Gomorrah are noted as everlasting punishment and everlasting fire... however the flood is over and that fire from those city's being destroyed has been extinguished long ago. However the consequences were eternal an a eternal punishment if we were to die an cease to exist then the fire and punishment is everlasting. So regardless of which ever it is I still don't want ot go there and am so thankful for our savior Jesus Christ for saving any who listen and obey. My reason for this study is due to 2nd Peter 3:15 I want to have an answer... and well so far from scripture I can't support burning forever when the terms used over and over and over again are all perish, destroy and second death. None of those words carry with it the meaning of burning forever alive and in pain... all three mean death or if something is destroyed it cease to exist.

    Anyway I would like to hear more, and if you want to debate please due I am not saying I am right I am studying this but I just can't find the verses to support my old thoughts and looking at what was posted those very words was in those verses... yet the assumption is taking its to burn forever when it isn't there... so if I missing something please point it out but thus far in this study I am starting to think I have been wrong all these years. Doesn't make Hell any better in anyway but it puts things in a different light.
    Isaiah 6:8 "Then I heard the voice of the Lord saying, "Whom shall I send? And who will go for us?" And I said, "Here am I. Send me!" We should always be willing to do God's bidding, seek ye first the kingdom of God.

    I use Linux because I don't like Windows

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