View Poll Results: Who is the ‘little horn’ of Daniel 7

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  • Future world leader, who rises to power from a revived Roman empire before Jesus returns

    3 30.00%
  • The Pope, or papal dynasty, arising out of the old Roman Empire during the dark ages.

    0 0%
  • An Islamic Caliphate that existed once in history, and will appear again in the future.

    1 10.00%
  • Other person or kingdom – Please explain

    6 60.00%
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Thread: Who is the Infamous Little Horn?

  1. #181
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    Re: Who is the Infamous Little Horn?

    Quote Originally Posted by Revelation Man View Post
    And what does that have to do with the Temple being defiled? You go to a Church? If someone offers a Ritual Sacrifice to a Demon on the Alter of your Church then the Church would be deemed to have been DEFILED.

    The Point is the word SACRIFICE is not on the Scripture of Daniel 8:11, so he is not taking away a a Sacrifice per se. I think he takes away the Daily Prayers unto God. A tribute unto God, an Oblation so to speak.

    If your Government came around today and forbid you from worshiping Jesus in your Church and then placed an Image in your Church to a Man and demanded you Worship that man as GOD, you would deem the Government to be defiling your Church wouldn't you?
    Well sure I would but there are Christian churches in Jerusalem so God doesn't need a temple there. We don't even need Christian churches to worship God now. In the book of Acts we hear of the Christians meeting in houses

  2. #182
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    Re: Who is the Infamous Little Horn?

    Quote Originally Posted by Revelation Man View Post

    By starting at the ending of both the Beasts Timeline (7th Vial) and the ending of the Two-witnesses time-line (2nd Woe) we understand that the two 1260 Time-lines do not match up perfectly one ends at the Second Woe and the other ends at the Seventh Vial. So this means if both have 1260 Day timelines (42 Months is 1260 Days) that the Two-witnesses have to show up before the Beast comes to power. The length of time before is not exactly known, but since the only thing left after the Second Woe is the THIRD WOE or all Seven Vials it can't be very long. I expect all seven vials to last about a month or two because it says the vials come in QUICK SUCCESSION !!
    Timelines:
    The 70th Week Length is 7 times (years) : It Starts at the signing of Holy Covenant and Ends at 7th trumpet sounding.
    The Midpoint of the 84 months (7 Years) is 42 months: Is is marked by the Antichrist stopping the Sacrifices and setting up the Abomination of Desolation on that exact date.
    Jerusalem is "tread underfoot" for 42 months : It starts at the Midpoint of the 70th Week, 42 months into the 70th week and Ends at the 7th Trump.
    The two witnesses ministry lasts 1260 days : It starts slightly before the Midpoint of the 70th week, and ends slightly before the 7th Trump.

    Is this what you are saying? If so, I agree...

    The Jews are not "saved" until Christ returns and sets foot on the mount of Olives... (Not the Rapture, but His return WITH THE CHURCH) Only then will they "Look upon Him whom they pierced" and believe in Him.

    Zech 14:2 For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle; and the city shall be taken, and the houses rifled, and the women ravished; and half of the city shall go forth into captivity, and the residue of the people shall not be cut off from the city. 3 Then shall the Lord go forth, and fight against those nations, as when he fought in the day of battle. 4 And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south. 5 And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah: and the Lord my God shall come, and all the saints with thee.

    Zech 12:8 In that day shall the Lord defend the inhabitants of Jerusalem; and he that is feeble among them at that day shall be as David; and the house of David shall be as God, as the angel of the Lord before them. 9 And it shall come to pass in that day, that I will seek to destroy all the nations that come against Jerusalem. 10 And I will pour upon the house of David, and upon the inhabitants of Jerusalem, the spirit of grace and of supplications: and they shall look upon me whom they have pierced, and they shall mourn for him, as one mourneth for his only son, and shall be in bitterness for him, as one that is in bitterness for his firstborn. 11 In that day shall there be a great mourning in Jerusalem, as the mourning of Hadadrimmon in the valley of Megiddon.

    Are you saying that the Jews believe in Jesus and are sacrificing to Jesus BEFORE the Midpoint of the 70th week?

  3. #183
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    Re: Who is the Infamous Little Horn?

    Quote Originally Posted by marty fox View Post
    Well sure I would but there are Christian churches in Jerusalem so God doesn't need a temple there. We don't even need Christian churches to worship God now. In the book of Acts we hear of the Christians meeting in houses
    It doesn't matter what God needs.I run into this all the time. You fail to understand Prophecy. The Israeli Nation builds the Temple to their God as they see him as not having come the first time yet, even though they are wrong, that is how they see it !! Then after they build the Temple, the Two-witnesses show up and preach Jesus Christ Crucified, no doubt they do so and show powers and wonders. Its said they have power to stop the rains etc. etc. Israel REPENTS, accepts Jesus as their Messiah (Zechariah 12:10 and 13:1) and thus they no doubt start worshiping Jesus. The Temple is ALREADY BUILT !! Its OK to worship God/Jesus in the Temple isn't it?

    The Prophecy says they will rebuild the Temple and Satan will sit in the Temple and claim that he is God. These are facts.

    Its not important what WE NEED and DON'T NEED, what is important is what actually happens.

    When they build the Temple to their God, then realize Jesus is their Messiah, they are not going to just tear the Temple down, that would just be stupid.

    You are telling me what they don't need, and I am telling you what Prophecy says will happen.

    We don't need Churches either, but we have them.

  4. #184
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    Re: Who is the Infamous Little Horn?

    Soldier_of_Faith
    Timelines:
    The 70th Week Length is 7 times (years) : It Starts at the signing of Holy Covenant and Ends at 7th trumpet sounding.
    The Midpoint of the 84 months (7 Years) is 42 months: Is is marked by the Antichrist stopping the Sacrifices and setting up the Abomination of Desolation on that exact date.
    Jerusalem is "tread underfoot" for 42 months : It starts at the Midpoint of the 70th Week, 42 months into the 70th week and Ends at the 7th Trump.
    The two witnesses ministry lasts 1260 days : It starts slightly before the Midpoint of the 70th week, and ends slightly before the 7th Trump.

    Is this what you are saying? If so, I agree...
    Not exactly, but close. If the Anti-Christ rules for 42 Months then he rules until the Seventh Vial not the Seventh Trumpet. The Covenant is not a "HOLY" Covenant. The Word Covenant only means Agreement and if God is not involved it is not, nor can it be, a Holy Covenant. Its an Agreement between nations like NATO or something. I think this Anti-Christ forces a Peace/Security deal on Israel and the Arabs whereas he assures their Security, kind of like the USA assured Japan and Germany for many years.

    I also do not see the Anti-Christ stopping Sacrifices, that word is not even in Daniel 8:11, the English Translators put that in there themselves. Israel have REPENTED before the Anti-Christ Conquers Jerusalem and commits the Abomination of Desolation, why else would they "Flee unto the Mountains" like Jesus asked them to 2000 years before? They of Course have accepted Jesus as their Messiah by this time, common sense tells us that or else they would not heed his voice. They read Matthew 24 !!

    The time line you have pretty much on Target, if you mean by the 7th Trumpet (3rd Woe) all Seven Vials are included, then that would be spot on. I should have remembered even though its called the Seven Trumpet, it actually has to be the Third Woe, which is all Seven Vials. I like to just say the Seventh Vial ends the Beasts Reign since we see that the Nations are defeated and God sees them as Babylon (Rev. 16:9).

    The Jews are not "saved" until Christ returns and sets foot on the mount of Olives... (Not the Rapture, but His return WITH THE CHURCH) Only then will they "Look upon Him whom they pierced" and believe in Him.

    Zech 14:2 For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle; and the city shall be taken, and the houses rifled, and the women ravished; and half of the city shall go forth into captivity, and the residue of the people shall not be cut off from the city. 3 Then shall the Lord go forth, and fight against those nations, as when he fought in the day of battle. 4 And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south. 5 And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah: and the Lord my God shall come, and all the saints with thee.

    Zech 12:8 In that day shall the Lord defend the inhabitants of Jerusalem; and he that is feeble among them at that day shall be as David; and the house of David shall be as God, as the angel of the Lord before them. 9 And it shall come to pass in that day, that I will seek to destroy all the nations that come against Jerusalem. 10 And I will pour upon the house of David, and upon the inhabitants of Jerusalem, the spirit of grace and of supplications: and they shall look upon me whom they have pierced, and they shall mourn for him, as one mourneth for his only son, and shall be in bitterness for him, as one that is in bitterness for his firstborn. 11 In that day shall there be a great mourning in Jerusalem, as the mourning of Hadadrimmon in the valley of Megiddon.

    Are you saying that the Jews believe in Jesus and are sacrificing to Jesus BEFORE the Midpoint of the 70th week?
    There is a Rapture of the Church, and we go to Heaven to Marry the Lamb, we are together on that. But Zechariah 12:10 and Zechariah 13:1 happens before Jesus sets foot on the Mt of Olives.Something else people miss is Zechariah 14:1-2 is not Jesus landing on Mt Zion, but its the Anti-Christ/his Kings conquering Jerusalem, then the Anti-Christ becomes the Beast for 32 Months...............Then in verses 3 and 4 is where Jesus/God starts fighting the battle for Israel, and is when Jesus actually lands on Mt. Zion.

    Zechariah 14:1 Behold, the day of the Lord cometh, and thy spoil shall be divided in the midst of thee. 2 For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle; and the city shall be taken, (Anti-Christ becomes the BEAST) and the houses rifled, and the women ravished; and half of the city shall go forth into captivity, and the residue of the people shall not be cut off from the city.

    3 Then shall the Lord go forth (Jesus/Holy Spirit), and fight against those nations (Rev. 16:19), as when he fought in the day of battle. 4 And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.

    So Israel Repents Zechariah 12:10 and 13:1, then Jerusalem is Conquered by the Anti-Christ who becomes the Last BEAST for a 42 Month period, that happens on the DAY OF THE LORD, Gods Wrath begins with the opening of the very FIRST SEAL. So as you see, just in Zechariah it shows the Jews repent before Jesus lands on Mt Zion.

    The Two-witnesses, as we agree, show up before the Anti-Christ conquers Jerusalem to become the Beast, we can't know when exactly, but probably about a month or two before the Abomination of Desolation happens, we know it is BEFORE.

    Scriptures that back this up: Malachi chapter 4.

    Malachi 4:5 Behold, I will send you Elijah the prophet before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the Lord (Gods Wrath starts at the Mid-way point also):

    6 And he shall turn the heart of the fathers to the children, and the heart of the children to their fathers, lest I come and smite the earth with a curse.

    So as we see, Elijah the prophet, one of the two-witnesses shows up to turn Israel back unto God, BEFORE the Day of the Lord, which is a 3.5 year period of Gods Wrath.

    As per are the Jews Sacrificing to Jesus NO....The word Sacrifice IS NOT in Daniel 8:11, the English Translator added it. Its just called the Daily. And thus it could be a Sacrifice or an OBLATION (Where they pay tribute to God, Daniel did it twice daily, it is the Jew honoring their God, its like Prayer unto God). So my contention is the DAILY that is taken away is not a Sacrifice, but an Oblation unto Jesus Christ/God. They honor THE SACRIFICE, Jesus OF COURSE !!

    Since they have accepted Jesus as their Messiah and thus understand he is THEIR SACRIFICE once and for all, why would they be offering SACRIFICES? They wouldn't, of course.

  5. #185
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    Re: Who is the Infamous Little Horn?

    Quote Originally Posted by Revelation Man View Post
    Not exactly, but close. If the Anti-Christ rules for 42 Months then he rules until the Seventh Vial not the Seventh Trumpet. The Covenant is not a "HOLY" Covenant. The Word Covenant only means Agreement and if God is not involved it is not, nor can it be, a Holy Covenant. Its an Agreement between nations like NATO or something. I think this Anti-Christ forces a Peace/Security deal on Israel and the Arabs whereas he assures their Security, kind of like the USA assured Japan and Germany for many years.

    I also do not see the Anti-Christ stopping Sacrifices, that word is not even in Daniel 8:11, the English Translators put that in there themselves. Israel have REPENTED before the Anti-Christ Conquers Jerusalem and commits the Abomination of Desolation, why else would they "Flee unto the Mountains" like Jesus asked them to 2000 years before? They of Course have accepted Jesus as their Messiah by this time, common sense tells us that or else they would not heed his voice. They read Matthew 24 !!

    The time line you have pretty much on Target, if you mean by the 7th Trumpet (3rd Woe) all Seven Vials are included, then that would be spot on. I should have remembered even though its called the Seven Trumpet, it actually has to be the Third Woe, which is all Seven Vials. I like to just say the Seventh Vial ends the Beasts Reign since we see that the Nations are defeated and God sees them as Babylon (Rev. 16:9).



    There is a Rapture of the Church, and we go to Heaven to Marry the Lamb, we are together on that. But Zechariah 12:10 and Zechariah 13:1 happens before Jesus sets foot on the Mt of Olives.Something else people miss is Zechariah 14:1-2 is not Jesus landing on Mt Zion, but its the Anti-Christ/his Kings conquering Jerusalem, then the Anti-Christ becomes the Beast for 32 Months...............Then in verses 3 and 4 is where Jesus/God starts fighting the battle for Israel, and is when Jesus actually lands on Mt. Zion.

    Zechariah 14:1 Behold, the day of the Lord cometh, and thy spoil shall be divided in the midst of thee. 2 For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle; and the city shall be taken, (Anti-Christ becomes the BEAST) and the houses rifled, and the women ravished; and half of the city shall go forth into captivity, and the residue of the people shall not be cut off from the city.

    3 Then shall the Lord go forth (Jesus/Holy Spirit), and fight against those nations (Rev. 16:19), as when he fought in the day of battle. 4 And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.

    So Israel Repents Zechariah 12:10 and 13:1, then Jerusalem is Conquered by the Anti-Christ who becomes the Last BEAST for a 42 Month period, that happens on the DAY OF THE LORD, Gods Wrath begins with the opening of the very FIRST SEAL. So as you see, just in Zechariah it shows the Jews repent before Jesus lands on Mt Zion.

    The Two-witnesses, as we agree, show up before the Anti-Christ conquers Jerusalem to become the Beast, we can't know when exactly, but probably about a month or two before the Abomination of Desolation happens, we know it is BEFORE.

    Scriptures that back this up: Malachi chapter 4.

    Malachi 4:5 Behold, I will send you Elijah the prophet before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the Lord (Gods Wrath starts at the Mid-way point also):

    6 And he shall turn the heart of the fathers to the children, and the heart of the children to their fathers, lest I come and smite the earth with a curse.

    So as we see, Elijah the prophet, one of the two-witnesses shows up to turn Israel back unto God, BEFORE the Day of the Lord, which is a 3.5 year period of Gods Wrath.

    As per are the Jews Sacrificing to Jesus NO....The word Sacrifice IS NOT in Daniel 8:11, the English Translator added it. Its just called the Daily. And thus it could be a Sacrifice or an OBLATION (Where they pay tribute to God, Daniel did it twice daily, it is the Jew honoring their God, its like Prayer unto God). So my contention is the DAILY that is taken away is not a Sacrifice, but an Oblation unto Jesus Christ/God. They honor THE SACRIFICE, Jesus OF COURSE !!

    Since they have accepted Jesus as their Messiah and thus understand he is THEIR SACRIFICE once and for all, why would they be offering SACRIFICES? They wouldn't, of course.
    There is a Rapture of the Church, and we go to Heaven to Marry the Lamb, we are together on that. But Zechariah 12:10 and Zechariah 13:1 happens before Jesus sets foot on the Mt of Olives.Something else people miss is Zechariah 14:1-2 is not Jesus landing on Mt Zion, but its the Anti-Christ/his Kings conquering Jerusalem, then the Anti-Christ becomes the Beast for 32 Months...............Then in verses 3 and 4 is where Jesus/God starts fighting the battle for Israel, and is when Jesus actually lands on Mt. Zion.
    I unfortunately disagree with this... "his feet" on the mount of Olives does not belong to the attacker, but is confirmed to Be Jesus' feet in the last part of verse 5, "and the Lord my God shall come, and all the saints with thee." This links that specific splitting of the mountain to the coming of Christ with His Bride on the White Horse to destroy utterly at the Battle of Armageddon. Let me show you what I see here:

    Zach 14:1 Behold, the day of the Lord cometh, and thy spoil shall be divided in the midst of thee. 2 For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle; and the city shall be taken, and the houses rifled, and the women ravished; and half of the city shall go forth into captivity, and the residue of the people shall not be cut off from the city. 3 Then shall the Lord go forth, and fight against those nations, as when he fought in the day of battle.

    Luke 21:20 And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh.21 Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out; and let not them that are in the countries enter thereinto.22 For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled.23 But woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck, in those days! for there shall be great distress in the land, and wrath upon this people.24 And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.25 And there shall be signs in the sun, and in the moon, and in the stars; and upon the earth distress of nations, with perplexity; the sea and the waves roaring;26 Men's hearts failing them for fear, and for looking after those things which are coming on the earth: for the powers of heaven shall be shaken.27 And then shall they see the Son of man coming in a cloud with power and great glory.28 And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.

    Luke 21:20-28 is a parallel to these events:

    Matthew 24:15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand16 Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains:17 Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house:18 Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes.19 And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days!20 But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day:21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.22 And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.23 Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not.24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.25 Behold, I have told you before.26 Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not.27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.28 For wheresoever the carcase is, there will the eagles be gathered together.29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

    SO we have a surrounding of Jerusalem, and a warning to flee because She is about to be ransacked by armies all around. And this event is tied DIRECTLY to the Abomination and the stopping of the DAILY (Sacrifices). Then SHORTLY after that (not 3.5 years later...) The Sign of the Son of Man ocures. I say shortly becaue the GREAT TRIBULATION that is initiated at the Abomination Of Desolation, IS CUT SHORT.

    So then we have this:
    Jerusalem Surrounded by Armies ZECH 14:1-2. But then there is a pause for the GREAT TRIBULATION, then the Coming of Christ to take His Church up, THEN a Return after the 7th Vial is poured out. ZECH 14:3

    Zech 14:3 Then shall the Lord go forth, and fight against those nations, as when he fought in the day of battle. 4 And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.5 And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah: and the Lord my God shall come, and all the saints with thee.

    All this happens AFTER the marriage supper of the Lamb of God.

  6. #186
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    Re: Who is the Infamous Little Horn?

    Quote Originally Posted by Soldier_of_Faith View Post
    I unfortunately disagree with this... "his feet" on the mount of Olives does not belong to the attacker, but is confirmed to Be Jesus' feet in the last part of verse 5, "and the Lord my God shall come, and all the saints with thee." This links that specific splitting of the mountain to the coming of Christ with His Bride on the White Horse to destroy utterly at the Battle of Armageddon. Let me show you what I see here:

    Zach 14:1 Behold, the day of the Lord cometh, and thy spoil shall be divided in the midst of thee. 2 For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle; and the city shall be taken, and the houses rifled, and the women ravished; and half of the city shall go forth into captivity, and the residue of the people shall not be cut off from the city. 3 Then shall the Lord go forth, and fight against those nations, as when he fought in the day of battle.
    The problem is you are getting the "timing of events" wrong here. No one denies Jesus lands on Mt. Zion/the Mount of Olives and splits it, my point is you do not seem to have the verses correct in your theorem. You are suggesting that verses 1 and 2 in Zechariah 14 is Jesus setting foot in Jerusalem, when that is not what the verses say.

    Zechariah 14:1 Behold, the day of the Lord cometh (Comes at the 3.5 Year mark or Midway point), and thy spoil shall be divided in the midst of thee. 2 For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle; and the city shall be taken (The City of Jerusalem is taken WHEN? When the BEAST takes it for 42 Months ! ), and the houses rifled, and the women ravished; and half of the city shall go forth into captivity, and the residue of the people shall not be cut off from the city.

    3 Then shall the Lord go forth, and fight against those nations (Plagues/Seals/Trumpets and finally the Vials), as when he fought in the day of battle. 4 And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.

    Jerusalem is Conquered by the Anti-Christ who becomes a BEAST for 42 Months, so the CITY can not be taken by the Nations at the END when Jesus shows up, it is OF COURSE taken when the Anti-Christ Conquers it and treads over the City of Jerusalem for 42 Months !! The first two verses happen at he Mid-way point, scriptures bear this out.

    Rev. 11:2 But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.

    Rev. 13:5 And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months. 6 And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven. 7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them:

    This above, Rev. 13, is when Zechariah 14:1 and 2 happen. Zechariah 14:3 and on...... happens during Rev. 16 during the 6th and 7th Vial.

    Luke 21:20 And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh.21 Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out; and let not them that are in the countries enter thereinto.22 For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled.23 But woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck, in those days! for there shall be great distress in the land, and wrath upon this people.24 And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.25 And there shall be signs in the sun, and in the moon, and in the stars; and upon the earth distress of nations, with perplexity; the sea and the waves roaring;26 Men's hearts failing them for fear, and for looking after those things which are coming on the earth: for the powers of heaven shall be shaken.27 And then shall they see the Son of man coming in a cloud with power and great glory.28 And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.
    The Desolation happens after the Anti-Christ conquers Jerusalem, then rules it for 42 MONTHS, thus Jesus does not show up until 42 MONTHS LATER !! You have to know how to read these prophetic scriptures, and believe me, you have to do it like a puzzle by putting everything together.

    And YES those are the Days of Vengeance, they start at the Mid-way point, when the Beast comes Forth, the Seals/Trumpets and Vials are Gods Wrath (Vengeance) upon mankind. This passage supports my above comments, the City will be Trodden under foot until the time of the Gentiles be fulfilled. There will be signs in the Sun, Moon and Stars, this happens in Rev. ch. 6, the Seals Judgments, not the END TIME Vial Judgments per se. Then later on they see Jesus Returning, just as in Matthew 24:29-31.

    Matthew 24:15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand16 Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains:17 Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house:18 Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes.19 And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days!20 But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day:21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.22 And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.23 Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not.24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.25 Behold, I have told you before.26 Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not.27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.28 For wheresoever the carcase is, there will the eagles be gathered together.29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

    SO we have a surrounding of Jerusalem, and a warning to flee because She is about to be ransacked by armies all around. And this event is tied DIRECTLY to the Abomination and the stopping of the DAILY (Sacrifices). Then SHORTLY after that (not 3.5 years later...) The Sign of the Son of Man ocures. I say shortly becaue the GREAT TRIBULATION that is initiated at the Abomination Of Desolation, IS CUT SHORT.
    The Abomination of Desolation happens at the Midway point. That's when Israel FLEES for how long? 1260 Days, the same amount of time the BEAST Rules over Jerusalem. You say the time is CUT SHORT, but of course that is a misunderstanding by YOU and MANY OTHERS. God doesn't make mistakes. He knows all things, thus His Jacobs 70th Week is a Week, that is why the BEAST rules Jerusalem for 42 Months, unless Gods a liar. The problem is you are not understanding Jesus' quote it seems, he is saying it was CUT SHORT via the ORIGINAL PLANING, to only SEVEN YEARS, or to only 3.5 Years of Wrath in reality because that is the time-frame of Gods Wrath. You are assuming Jesus is saying he is going to SHORTEN the time period, I ASSUME Jesus is speaking about Gods original Plan that took all the information into account and decided on 7 Years of Jacobs Troubles and 3.5 Years of Gods Wrath/Judgment on mankind. You see I understand God sees all and knows all, He did not create a plan He had to shorten later, He created the perfect plan and told everyone its length was chosen so as to save human flesh from becoming extinct. A 14 or 21 year plan might have made all human flesh extinct, so God chose 7 years or 3.5 years of Wrath instead.


    So then we have this:
    Jerusalem Surrounded by Armies ZECH 14:1-2. But then there is a pause for the GREAT TRIBULATION, then the Coming of Christ to take His Church up, THEN a Return after the 7th Vial is poured out. ZECH 14:3
    Ummmm NO, The Rapture happens FIRST..........Then at the 3.5 (Middle of the Week) year mark the Anti-Christ conquers Jerusalem and becomes the BEAST. Then after 3.5 Years of Gods Wrath upon all mankind who worshiped the BEAST and his Image, the Seventh Vial comes (Zechariah 14:3) and Jesus lands on the Mt. of Olives (See Vials 6 and 7 Revelation ch. 16) so the Rapture comes FIRST.

    All this happens AFTER the marriage supper of the Lamb of God.
    The Marriage Supper is the Carnage of the BEAST/KINGS/Wicked Men killed at Armageddon, what do you think Matthew 24:28 means? 28 For wheresoever the carcase is, there will the eagles be gathered together. It means we the Church are Gathered where the Carcass is at, for the Marriage Feast...SEE BELOW.

    Rev. 19:17 And I saw an angel standing in the sun; and he cried with a loud voice, saying to all the fowls that fly in the midst of heaven (Church/Bride of Christ), Come and gather yourselves together unto the supper of the great God;

    18 That ye may eat the flesh of kings, and the flesh of captains, and the flesh of mighty men, and the flesh of horses, and of them that sit on them, and the flesh of all men, both free and bond, both small and great.

    The EAGLE in Matthew 24:28 is the FOWL of Rev. 19:17. Jesus is telling you the Church is going to be coming back with him. And we will be at the Marriage Feast which is the KILLING OF THE WICKED at Armageddon.
    Last edited by Revelation Man; Sep 13th 2017 at 05:25 AM.

  7. #187
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    Re: Who is the Infamous Little Horn?

    Quote Originally Posted by Revelation Man View Post
    Ummmm NO, The Rapture happens FIRST..........Then at the 3.5 (Middle of the Week) year mark the Anti-Christ conquers Jerusalem and becomes the BEAST. Then after 3.5 Years of Gods Wrath upon all mankind who worshiped the BEAST and his Image, the Seventh Vial comes (Zechariah 14:3) and Jesus lands on the Mt. of Olives (See Vials 6 and 7 Revelation ch. 16) so the Rapture comes FIRST.
    Here is the correct timeline of events according to chronological scripture, and what I believe...

    1) Seal 1 - Matt 24 false prophets (LITTLE HORN STARTS TO RISE UP)
    2) Seal 2 - Matt 24 Wars and Rumors of Wars
    3) Seal 3 - No mentioned in Matt 24
    3.5) The two witnesses appear (Start of the 1260 days of the witnesses)
    4) Matt 24 Abomination of Desolation (Daniel Abomination of Desolation and the Daily [sacrifice] taken away)
    4.5) Start of the 42 months of reign of the Little HORN)
    5) Seal 4 - Matt 24 Great Tribulation
    6) Seal 5 - Matt 24 Luke 21 Great persecution during Great Tribulation
    7) Matt 24 GREAT TRIBULATION CUT SHORT BY NEXT EVENTS
    8) Seal 6 - Matt 24 Sun/Moon/Stars event
    9) Matt 24: Sign of the Son of Man
    10) Appearing of Christ on the Clouds of Heaven Rev 1:7, Matt 24
    11) Gathering of Saints from heaven to earth and RESURRECTION and Quickening of the Living who believe in Christ - 1 Thess 4, Matt 24
    12) Seal 6 - People Hiding from the COMING wrath of the Lamb.
    14) Sealing of the 144,000 (Start of the Woman's 3.5 times) Rev 7:1-8
    15) RAPTURE of the dead Resurrected, and the Living Quickened Rev 7:9-17
    16) Seal 7
    17) 1st 4 Trumpets (Wrath of the Lamb)
    18) 5th and 6th Trump
    19) The Two witnesses killed, resurrected, and caught up (End of the 1260 days of the witnesses)
    20) 7th Trump (This marks the end of the Mystery of Daniel... Rev 10:7)
    21) the 144,000 are redeemed from the earth in to the HEAVENLY Zion, and are WITH CHRIST in the heavens.
    22) 3 Angels announce proclamations
    22.5) Gospel preached unto all the earth by angels
    23) Destruction of Babylon
    24) Warning of not taking the Mark:
    24.5) Be-headings for not taking the Mark are rampant
    25) Reaping of the SOULS of the Beheaded by the Son of Man(ONLY THE BEHEADED)
    NOTE: At this point ALL SOULS who believe in Christ Jesus and Who make up the Bride of Christ are in Heaven, and not one Believing Soul is on Earth. This then fulfills (WE ARE NOT APPOINTED UNTO WRATH)
    26) Wrath of God poured out -
    27) Marriage of the Lamb to His NOW COMPLETE Bride (Because without the beheaded, she was not complete...)
    28) Marriage Supper of the Lamb
    29) Satan and Antichrist gather the nations together for Armageddon
    30) Jesus Returns on a white horse with His Bride following.
    31) Jesus saves those trapped in Jerusalem when he lights off His horse and sets foot on the Mount of Olives.
    32) (Wine press blood unto the horses bridle) Jesus Destroys with the Sword of His mouth at Armageddon
    33) Antichrist and False Prophet caught and throne into Lake of Fire
    34) Satan caught and Pit opened - Satan sealed for 1000 years and tossed into bottomless pit.
    35) The Beheaded Souls (who are now married to Christ Jesus) are re-united with their bodies in the First Resurrection.)
    36) a New Millennial Kingdom is set up with new Laws and Judgement seats and the temple is rebuild and the Great Jerusalem.
    37) HamonGog- the city of the dead is built and people are employed to pick up the dead and all the weapons of Armageddon are burned for fuel.
    38) The Bride reigns with Christ for 1000 years.
    39) After 1000 years, Satan is released
    40) Satan gathers an army and attacks Jerusalem
    41) God burns them all
    42) Satan thrown into Lake of Fire
    43) GWT Judgement by the Father of all Souls EXCEPT THE BRIDE.
    44) Death and Hell thrown into the Lake of Fire
    45) Those who are not in the book of life are thrown into the lake of fire.
    46) Heaven and earth are passed away and God makes a new Heaven and earth

    Well, I did this without double checking all of it, but it should be 99% correct... Blessings!

  8. #188
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    Re: Who is the Infamous Little Horn?

    Quote Originally Posted by Soldier_of_Faith View Post
    Here is the correct timeline of events according to chronological scripture, and what I believe...

    1) Seal 1 - Matt 24 false prophets (LITTLE HORN STARTS TO RISE UP)
    2) Seal 2 - Matt 24 Wars and Rumors of Wars
    3) Seal 3 - No mentioned in Matt 24
    3.5) The two witnesses appear (Start of the 1260 days of the witnesses)
    4) Matt 24 Abomination of Desolation (Daniel Abomination of Desolation and the Daily [sacrifice] taken away)
    4.5) Start of the 42 months of reign of the Little HORN)
    5) Seal 4 - Matt 24 Great Tribulation
    6) Seal 5 - Matt 24 Luke 21 Great persecution during Great Tribulation
    7) Matt 24 GREAT TRIBULATION CUT SHORT BY NEXT EVENTS
    8) Seal 6 - Matt 24 Sun/Moon/Stars event
    9) Matt 24: Sign of the Son of Man
    10) Appearing of Christ on the Clouds of Heaven Rev 1:7, Matt 24
    11) Gathering of Saints from heaven to earth and RESURRECTION and Quickening of the Living who believe in Christ - 1 Thess 4, Matt 24
    12) Seal 6 - People Hiding from the COMING wrath of the Lamb.
    14) Sealing of the 144,000 (Start of the Woman's 3.5 times) Rev 7:1-8
    15) RAPTURE of the dead Resurrected, and the Living Quickened Rev 7:9-17
    16) Seal 7
    17) 1st 4 Trumpets (Wrath of the Lamb)
    18) 5th and 6th Trump
    19) The Two witnesses killed, resurrected, and caught up (End of the 1260 days of the witnesses)
    20) 7th Trump (This marks the end of the Mystery of Daniel... Rev 10:7)
    21) the 144,000 are redeemed from the earth in to the HEAVENLY Zion, and are WITH CHRIST in the heavens.
    22) 3 Angels announce proclamations
    22.5) Gospel preached unto all the earth by angels
    23) Destruction of Babylon
    24) Warning of not taking the Mark:
    24.5) Be-headings for not taking the Mark are rampant
    25) Reaping of the SOULS of the Beheaded by the Son of Man(ONLY THE BEHEADED)
    NOTE: At this point ALL SOULS who believe in Christ Jesus and Who make up the Bride of Christ are in Heaven, and not one Believing Soul is on Earth. This then fulfills (WE ARE NOT APPOINTED UNTO WRATH)
    26) Wrath of God poured out -
    27) Marriage of the Lamb to His NOW COMPLETE Bride (Because without the beheaded, she was not complete...)
    28) Marriage Supper of the Lamb
    29) Satan and Antichrist gather the nations together for Armageddon
    30) Jesus Returns on a white horse with His Bride following.
    31) Jesus saves those trapped in Jerusalem when he lights off His horse and sets foot on the Mount of Olives.
    32) (Wine press blood unto the horses bridle) Jesus Destroys with the Sword of His mouth at Armageddon
    33) Antichrist and False Prophet caught and throne into Lake of Fire
    34) Satan caught and Pit opened - Satan sealed for 1000 years and tossed into bottomless pit.
    35) The Beheaded Souls (who are now married to Christ Jesus) are re-united with their bodies in the First Resurrection.)
    36) a New Millennial Kingdom is set up with new Laws and Judgement seats and the temple is rebuild and the Great Jerusalem.
    37) HamonGog- the city of the dead is built and people are employed to pick up the dead and all the weapons of Armageddon are burned for fuel.
    38) The Bride reigns with Christ for 1000 years.
    39) After 1000 years, Satan is released
    40) Satan gathers an army and attacks Jerusalem
    41) God burns them all
    42) Satan thrown into Lake of Fire
    43) GWT Judgement by the Father of all Souls EXCEPT THE BRIDE.
    44) Death and Hell thrown into the Lake of Fire
    45) Those who are not in the book of life are thrown into the lake of fire.
    46) Heaven and earth are passed away and God makes a new Heaven and earth

    Well, I did this without double checking all of it, but it should be 99% correct... Blessings!
    Matthew 24 has absolutely nothing to do with Revelation until you get past verse 14. This is you/others confusing the scriptures, thus confusing the timeline of everything and buying into the Seals as being opened already which they of course or not.

    Matthew 24:1-6 is about the Temple and Jerusalem being destroyed.

    Matthew 24:7-13/14 is about the 2000 some odd years between 70 AD and the Rapture.

    Matthew 24:14/15-27 is about the Tribulation/Jacobs Troubles.

    Matthew 24:28 is Jesus speaking about the coming/future Marriage Feast.
    43
    Matthew 24:29-31 is the Church returning with Jesus IMMEDIATELY AFTER the Tribulation of those days.

    The Parable of the Fig tree states that ALL OF THESE SIGNS must come to pass before Jesus returns.

    1. false christs will come (The Pharisees fulfilled Jesus' prophecy about them rejecting him but accepting another who would come in his own name) John 5:43 I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive. They knew that Rome was the Fourth Beast so they expected the Little Horn to show up, thus they tried to FORCE A MESSIAH to come forth a few times...If they only knew, the Little Horn shows up 2000 years later.

    2. Wars and rumors of wars is of course Rome destroying the Temple and Jerusalem. Jesus warned them no doubt, because he wanted his disciple to STAY AWAY, do not believe it is "ME COME AGAIN" yet had to be his plea unto them, he needed them to live and spread the Gospel, thus he told them what? THE END IS NOT YET....Why those words? He wanted them to know this is not the Little Horn attacking Jerusalem, and it will not be me, but a FALSE CHRIST.........The End is NOT YET....

    3. Then the 2000 year period kicks in, Jesus gives his disciples a panoramic view of the 2000 year period or Church Age we are now in. There will be Nations and Kingdoms warring (CHECK), Earthquakes/Famines/Sorrows (CHECK), they will deliver the Disciples up to be killed (Most were murdered during this time from 70 A.D. on), MANY FALSE PROPHETS (Preachers/Jones town/Robert Tilton types etc. etc), he that endures unto the end (of his life in the FAITH/Run that RACE) shall be Saved. The GOSPEL has to be Preached unto all the World, THEN THE END WILL COME !! Only then. (So when the Gospel is preached unto all the World, Jesus Raptures the Dead in Christ and the Living in Christ.)

    4. Then we get the Abomination of Desolation, the Fleeing of Israel unto the Wilderness, the Trouble like never before and THE ANTI-CHRIST and FALSE PROPHET who work WONDERS and MIRACLES !! Jesus warns do not go unto them if you hear they are in the desert or in the secret chambers, for I am telling you I will come from the Eastern SKIES IMMEDIATELY AFTER the Tribulation of those days.

    So we see Jesus mentions false christs/false prophets THREE Distinct times, and that is because each time is a different period.

  9. #189
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    Re: Who is the Infamous Little Horn?

    Quote Originally Posted by Revelation Man View Post
    Matthew 24 has absolutely nothing to do with Revelation until you get past verse 14. This is you confusing the scriptures, thus confusing the timeline of everything and buying in t the Seals as being opened already which they of course or not.

    Matthew 24:1-6 is about the Temple and Jerusalem being destroyed.

    Matthew 24:7-13/14 is about the 2000 some odd years between 70 AD and the Rapture.

    Matthew 24:14/15-27 is about the Tribulation/Jacobs Troubles.

    Matthew 24:28 is speaking about the coming Marriage Feast.
    43
    Matthew 24:29-31 is the Church returning with Jesus IMMEDIATELY AFTER the Tribulation of those days.

    The Parable of the Fig tree states that ALL OF THESE SIGNS must come to pass before Jesus returns.

    1. false christs will come (The Pharisees fulfilled Jesus' prophecy about them rejecting him but accepting another who would come in his own name) John 5:43 I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive. They knew that Rome was the Fourth Beast so they expected the Little Horn to show up thus they tried to FORCE A MESSIAH to com forth a few times...If they only knew, the Little Horn shows up 2000 years later.

    2. Wars and rumors of wars is of course Rome destroying the Temple and Jerusalem. Jesus warned them no doubt, because he wanted his disciple to STAY AWAY, do not believe it is "ME COME AGAIN" yet had to be his plea unto them, he needed them to live and spread the Gospel, thus he told them what? THE END IS NOT YET....Why those words? He wanted them to know this is not the Little Horn attacking Jerusalem, and it will not be me, but a FALSE CHRIST.........The End is NOT YET....

    3. Then the 2000 year period kicks in, Jesus gives his disciples a panoramic view of the 2000 year period or Church Age we are now in. There will be Nations and Kingdoms warring (CHECK), Earthquakes/Famines/Sorrows (CHECK), they will deliver the Disciples up to be killed (Most were murdered during this time from 70 A.D. on), MANY FALSE PROPHETS (Preachers/Jones town/Robert Tilton types etc. etc), he that endures unto the end (of his life in the FAITH/Run that RACE) shall be Saved. The GOSPEL has to be Preached unto all the World, THEN THE END WILL COME !! Only then. (So when the Gospel is preached unto all the World, Jesus Raptures the Dead in Christ and the Living in Christ.

    4. Then we get the Abomination of Desolation, the Fleeing of Israel unto the Wilderness, the Trouble like never before and THE ANTI-CHRIST and FALSE PROPHET who work WONDERS and MIRACLES !! Jesus warns do not go unto them if you hear they are in the desert or in the secret chambers, for I am telling you I will come from the astern SKIES IMMEDIATELY AFTER the Tribulation of those days.

    So we see Jesus mentions false christs/false prophets THREE Distinct times, and that is because each time is a different period.

    Jesus is telling His disciples that from the point of:

    Matt 24:3 And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

    Until the event of:

    Matt 24:31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

    Is contained within

    Matthew 24:33 So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors. 34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.

    And there is no reason to believe otherwise, unless you have a belief where you need to twist scripture to match your understanding. I let scripture define itself.

  10. #190
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    Re: Who is the Infamous Little Horn?

    Quote Originally Posted by Soldier_of_Faith View Post
    Jesus is telling His disciples that from the point of:

    Matt 24:3 And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

    Until the event of:

    Matt 24:31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

    Is contained within

    Matthew 24:33 So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors. 34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.

    And there is no reason to believe otherwise, unless you have a belief where you need to twist scripture to match your understanding. I let scripture define itself.
    You confuse the scriptures here brother, maybe its the KJV which does it to some, I don't know, but they confuse the scriptures constantly and it really bothers me that people are confused on this. I get it, I did an exegesis on Matthew chapter 24 and spent some major time on it, not everyone has that much time to spend I suppose.

    It seems to me you have allowed verse 33 to sway you all the way to believing the Seals have been broken and into believing that all of those things happened to THAT GENERATION, when that is not what Jesus said at all, that is just what you think you see, I can prove it is not so. You do understand that there was no chapters or verses right? So sometime we put things together that do not quite go together, at other times we do not understand the Olde English writings of the KJV. Lets look at the Parable of the Fig Tree.

    Matthew 24:32 Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh: 33 So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors.34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled. 35 Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.

    So what is THIS GENERATION? How can people not understand that THIS GENERATION is speaking about the GENERATION that SEES ALL OF THESE THINGS? Its right there in the TEXT. Lets try the Holman version (HCSB) instead.

    The Parable of the Fig Tree
    32 “Now learn this parable from the fig tree: As soon as its branch becomes tender and sprouts leaves, you know that summer is near. 33 In the same way, when you see all these things (ALL OF THE SIGNS not some but ALL of the Signs), recognize that He is near—at the door! 34 I assure you: This generation will certainly not pass away until all these things take place. 35 Heaven and earth will pass away, but My words will never pass away.

    So now we have to go over ALL OF THESE THINGS (Signs) to see when Jesus is coming back. Just like when a Fig is near ripe we know summer is near, when we see ALL OF THESE THINGS (SIGNS) we know Jesus return is very near !! Amen.

    SIGNS WE MUST SEE BEFORE Jesus Returns
    1. false christs before 70 AD (Check)
    2. Wars and Rumors of Wars via 70 AD but the END IS NOT YET (Check, Jerusalem and the Temple were both Destroyed.)
    3. Kingdoms will rise against Kingdoms (Many Wars over a 2000 year period) Earthquakes, Famines, Sorrows. (Check)
    4. They delivered the Disciples up to be killed. (Check)
    5. Many false prophets (preachers) arise and deceive many over a 2000 year period. (Check)
    6. The Gospel has to be Preached unto ALL THE WORLD, then the End will come. (Not here yet, when this happens the Rapture will end the Church age)

    ALL OF THE SIGNS ARE STILL NOT HERE !!!

    7. NEXT SIGN happens during the Tribulation period....The Abomination of Desolation is the Anti-Christ defiling the Temple (HAS NOT HAPPENED OF COURSE)
    8. Israel is told to FLEE UNTO THE Mountains and (Rev. 12) shows they do Flee for 1260 Days. (This is a SIGN ALSO, this has not happened yet.)
    9. Verse 21 says there will be GREAT TROUBLES like never seen before. (So this sign of course has not happened yet.)

    10. Verse 24 says we must see the sign of the False Prophet and Anti-Christ who work Wonders/Miracles and tries to deceive the ELECT. But can not because Jesus has forewarned then about this evil man. Thus they know not to go unto him in the Desert or in his Secret Chambers. They know Jesus will come in the Eastern Skies.(Future Event)

    All the SIGNS have still not been seen yet, BUT......THERE IS MORE TO COME !!

    11. Immediately AFTER the Tribulation of those days [START for 3.5 Years] the Sun will be Darkened, the Moon will not give its light and the Stars will be shaken or fall from Heaven, this could be Satan and his Angels being cast out of Heaven. (Rev. 6, this SIGN has not yet happened)

    The last sign of course is we will SEE Jesus coming in the clouds, but the Parable of the Fig Tree says you will know the TIME IS NEAR when you see ALL OF THESE THINGS (SIGNS) so Jesus coming in the Clouds wouldn't count as a sign per se, because that is the ACTUAL EVENT.

    So the Parable of the Fig Tree is very clear, when YE (The Generation that sees ALL OF THE SIGNS) see ALL of these things, know ye that LIKEWISE Jesus is VERY NEAR to coming so what is the very LAST SIGN? The Sun being Darkened, the Moon not giving its light and the Heaven being Shaken !! So this is a Message unto ISRAEL, of Course, not unto the Church per se who will be in Heaven Marrying the Lamb at that time !!

    Thus the ELECT is gathered from HEAVEN when we Return, just like verse 31 says , from the Four Corners of Heaven !!

    This GENERATION is speaking about THE GENERATION, that SEES ALL OF THOSE SIGNS !! We are very near Matthew 24:14 right now, the Gospel being preached unto all the Earth. Then the End will come as in END TIMES/Tribulation period.

  11. #191
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    Re: Who is the Infamous Little Horn?

    Quote Originally Posted by Revelation Man View Post
    You confuse the scriptures here brother, maybe its the KJV which does it to some, I don't know, but they confuse the scriptures constantly and it really bothers me that people are confused on this. I get it, I did an exegesis on Matthew and spent some major time on it, not everyone has that much time I suppose.

    It seems to me you have allowed verse 33 to sway you all the way to believing the Seals have been broken and into believing that all of those things happened to THAT GENERATION, when that is not what Jesus sad, that is just what you think you see, I can prove it is not so. You do understand that there was no chapters or verses right? So sometime we put things together that do not quite go together, at other times we do not understand the Olde English writings of the KJV. Lets look at the Parable of the Fig Tree.

    Matthew 24:32 Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh: 33 So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors.34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled. 35 Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.

    So what is THIS GENERATION? How can people not understand that THIS GENERATION is speaking about the GENERATION that SEES ALL OF THESE THINGS? Its right there in the TEXT. Lets try the Holman version (HCSB) instead.

    The Parable of the Fig Tree
    32 “Now learn this parable from the fig tree: As soon as its branch becomes tender and sprouts leaves, you know that summer is near. 33 In the same way, when you see all these things ALL OF THE SIGNS not some but ALL of the Signs), recognize that He[p] is near—at the door! 34 I assure you: This generation will certainly not pass away until all these things take place. 35 Heaven and earth will pass away, but My words will never pass away.

    So now we have to go over ALL OF THESE THINGS (Signs) to see when Jesus is coming back. Just like when a Fig is near ripe we know summer is near, when we see ALL OF THESE THINGS (SIGNS) we know Jesus return is very near !! Amen.

    SIGNS WE MUST SEE BEFORE Jesus Returns
    1. false christs before 70 AD (Check)
    2. Wars and Rumors of Wars via 70 AD but the END IS NOT YET (Check, Jerusalem and the Temple were both Destroyed.)
    3. Kingdoms will rise against Kingdoms (Many Wars over a 2000 year period) Earthquakes, Famines, Sorrows. (Check)
    4. They delivered the Disciple up to be killed. (Check)
    5. Many false prophets (preachers) arise and deceive many over a 2000 year period. (Check)
    6. The Gospel has to be Preached unto ALL THE WORLD, then the End will come. (Not here yet, when this happens the Rapture will end the Church age)

    ALL OF THE SIGNS ARE STILL NOT HERE !!!

    7. NEXT SIGN happens during the Tribulation period....The Abomination of Desolation is the Anti-Christ defiling the Temple (HAS NOT HAPPENED OF COURSE)
    8. Israel is told to FLEE UNTO THE Mountains (Rev. 12) shows they do Flee for 1260 Days. (This is a SIGN ALSO, this has not happened yet.)
    9. Verse 21 says there will be GREAT TROUBLES like never seen before. (So this sign of course has not happened yet.)

    10. Verse 24 says we must see the sign of the False Prophet and Anti-Christ who work Wonders/Miracles and tries to deceive the ELECT..But can not because Jesus has forewarned then about this evil man. Thus they know not to go unto him in the Desert or in his Secret Chambers. They know Jesus will come on the Eastern Skies.(Future Event)

    All the SIGNS have still not been seen, THERE IS MORE TO COME !!

    11. Immediately AFTER the Tribulation of those days [START for 3.5 Years] the Sun will be Darkened, the Moon will not give its light and the Stars will be shaken or fall from Heaven, this could be Satan and his Angels being cast out of Heaven. (Rev. 6, this SIGN has not yet happened)

    The last sign of course is we will SEE Jesus coming in the clouds, but the Parable of the Fig Tree says you will know the TIME IS NEAR when you see ALL OF THESE THINGS (SIGNS) so Jesus coming in the Clouds wouldn't count as a sign per se, because that is the ACTUAL EVENT.

    So the Parable of the Fig Tree is very clear, when YE (The Generation that sees ALL OF THE SIGNS) see ALL of these things, know ye that LIKEWISE Jesus is VERY NEAR to coming so what is the very LAST SIGN? The Sun being Darkened, the Moon not giving its light and the Heaven being Shaken !! So this is a Message unto ISRAEL, of Course, not unto the Church per se who will be in Heaven Marrying the Lamb at that time !!

    Thus the ELECT is gathered from HEAVEN when we Return, just like verse 31 says !!

    This GENERATION is speaking about THE GENERATION, that SEES ALL OF THOSE SIGNS !!
    "I assure you: This generation will certainly not pass away until all these things take place."

    Your Understanding is such: "This generation" is speaking to those who are alive at the witnessing of the LAST ITEM ON THE LIST being fulfilled. Then they see "All these things" HAVE ALREADY Taken Place.

    Again look at this: "until all these things take place."

    My understanding is such: "This Generation" is speaking to those who are alive during the season while ALL THE fig leaves fall from the tree. They see "All these things" TAKE PLACE.

    I am not saying that Matthew 24:1-2 is one of those things though. He did not say that in the Olivet discourse, but rather before he sat on the mount of Olives. But from Verse 3 on, this generation will witness all of it.

  12. #192
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    Re: Who is the Infamous Little Horn?

    Quote Originally Posted by Soldier_of_Faith View Post
    "I assure you: This generation will certainly not pass away until all these things take place."

    Your Understanding is such: "This generation" is speaking to those who are alive at the witnessing of the LAST ITEM ON THE LIST being fulfilled. Then they see "All these things" HAVE ALREADY Taken Place.

    Again look at this: "until all these things take place."

    My understanding is such: "This Generation" is speaking to those who are alive during the season while ALL THE fig leaves fall from the tree. They see "All these things" TAKE PLACE.

    I am not saying that Matthew 24:1-2 is one of those things though. He did not say that in the Olivet discourse, but rather before he sat on the mount of Olives. But from Verse 3 on, this generation will witness all of it.
    You do not seem to understand the passage in full. No use me rehashing what is obvious. You rely way to much on singular words instead of looking at the bible like the bible tells you to look at it, line upon line, precept upon precept, here a little there a little. Translations from the Hebrew language is difficult, there was 4000 Hebrew words with no vowels, compared to our 500,000 English Words.

    You allow this to seeming twist your view of the end times, when its Obvious that Jesus is speaking about the END TIMES in the future.

    Your understanding is odd at best, Jesus was not speaking about the Generation that lived during his time, he was speaking about the Generation that saw ALL OF THE SIGNS come to pass, he says LIKEWISE, when you see all of these things.

    We will agree to disagree here brother...God Bless.

  13. #193
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    Re: Who is the Infamous Little Horn?

    Quote Originally Posted by Revelation Man View Post
    You do not seem to understand the passage in full. No use me rehashing what is obvious. You rely way to much on singular words instead of looking at the bible like the bible tells you to look at it, line upon line, precept upon precept, here a little there a little. Translations from the Hebrew language is difficult, there was 4000 Hebrew words with no vowels, compared to our 500,000 English Words.

    You allow this to seeming twist your view of the end times, when its Obvious that Jesus is speaking about the END TIMES in the future.

    Your understanding is odd at best, Jesus was not speaking about the Generation that lived during his time, he was speaking about the Generation that saw ALL OF THE SIGNS come to pass, he says LIKEWISE, when you see all of these things.

    We will agree to disagree here brother...God Bless.
    I receive this in Love. But I ask that you accept that I may know more than it seems I do. I believe that All of the Matt 24:3-51 is future, or currently just starting... There has always been wars, yes. There has always been false prophets, yes... BUT There will SPECIFIC wars that the BEAST will fight in, and false prophets from the religion of the Beast. THESE are they which the ONE generation will see. THAT generation will know for sure when the Abomination of Desolation and great tribulation occur. But you were saying that some of the events of Matt 24 happened 2000 yeas ago or long ago. So then, not ALL of the events happen in the future.

    I think that you do not clearly see my view, so it is distorted in your view.

    As a fake example: Lets say I was born in 1970. Lets say that there was rise of a seven headed Government in 1960s, and the rise of a world religion. False prophets become prevalent in the 80s, and I see them. In the 90s there are wars and rumors of wars. A temple is built in Jerusalem next to the Dome. Sacrifices start, and the BEAST is creating a peace agreement with Israel. I am watching all this as I grow up. In 2000 A 7 year treaty is signed, and quietly put into affect. I am WATCHING, so I notice. 3.5 Years later a great army goes into Jerusalem and defiles the temple and an Abomination is set up. Suddenly A commandment to kill all Christians goes out, and I go into Hiding. The Slaughter is Great. about 2 billion people are killed. Suddenly there is falling stars and the sun and moon go dark, and the sky recedes. I see the Sign of the Son of Man, Then Christ appears on the clouds of Heaven. Then the gathering happens at an undisclosed time .

    Now you see? All of Matt 24:3-51 happened in MY GENERATION.

    Your definition of the Generation was this:

    SIGNS WE MUST SEE BEFORE Jesus Returns
    1. false christs before 70 AD (Check)
    2. Wars and Rumors of Wars via 70 AD but the END IS NOT YET (Check, Jerusalem and the Temple were both Destroyed.)
    3. Kingdoms will rise against Kingdoms (Many Wars over a 2000 year period) Earthquakes, Famines, Sorrows. (Check)
    4. They delivered the Disciple up to be killed. (Check)
    5. Many false prophets (preachers) arise and deceive many over a 2000 year period. (Check)
    6. The Gospel has to be Preached unto ALL THE WORLD, then the End will come. (Not here yet, when this happens the Rapture will end the Church age)

    All of these ALREADY HAPPENED in your view... Not in mine.

    Is my way still twisted in your view?

  14. #194
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    Re: Who is the Infamous Little Horn?

    Quote Originally Posted by Soldier_of_Faith View Post
    I receive this in Love. But I ask that you accept that I may know more than it seems I do. I believe that All of the Matt 24:3-51 is future, or currently just starting... There has always been wars, yes. There has always been false prophets, yes... BUT There will SPECIFIC wars that the BEAST will fight in, and false prophets from the religion of the Beast. THESE are they which the ONE generation will see. THAT generation will know for sure when the Abomination of Desolation and great tribulation occur. But you were saying that some of the events of Matt 24 happened 2000 yeas ago or long ago. So then, not ALL of the events happen in the future.

    I think that you do not clearly see my view, so it is distorted in your view.

    As a fake example: Lets say I was born in 1970. Lets say that there was rise of a seven headed Government in 1960s, and the rise of a world religion. False prophets become prevalent in the 80s, and I see them. In the 90s there are wars and rumors of wars. A temple is built in Jerusalem next to the Dome. Sacrifices start, and the BEAST is creating a peace agreement with Israel. I am watching all this as I grow up. In 2000 A 7 year treaty is signed, and quietly put into affect. I am WATCHING, so I notice. 3.5 Years later a great army goes into Jerusalem and defiles the temple and an Abomination is set up. Suddenly A commandment to kill all Christians goes out, and I go into Hiding. The Slaughter is Great. about 2 billion people are killed. Suddenly there is falling stars and the sun and moon go dark, and the sky recedes. I see the Sign of the Son of Man, Then Christ appears on the clouds of Heaven. Then the gathering happens at an undisclosed time .

    Now you see? All of Matt 24:3-51 happened in MY GENERATION.

    Your definition of the Generation was this:

    SIGNS WE MUST SEE BEFORE Jesus Returns
    1. false christs before 70 AD (Check)
    2. Wars and Rumors of Wars via 70 AD but the END IS NOT YET (Check, Jerusalem and the Temple were both Destroyed.)
    3. Kingdoms will rise against Kingdoms (Many Wars over a 2000 year period) Earthquakes, Famines, Sorrows. (Check)
    4. They delivered the Disciple up to be killed. (Check)
    5. Many false prophets (preachers) arise and deceive many over a 2000 year period. (Check)
    6. The Gospel has to be Preached unto ALL THE WORLD, then the End will come. (Not here yet, when this happens the Rapture will end the Church age)

    All of these ALREADY HAPPENED in your view... Not in mine.

    Is my way still twisted in your view?
    So I see you don't think all of Revelation has already past like most of the people that like to link Matthew 24 and Revelation which is WAY TWISTED, but instead you think most of Matthew is future tense, which I have never heard of to be honest.

    So you do just the opposite of those guys and you allow the THIS GENERATION passage to make everything in Matthew 24 a FUTURE PROPHECY from the present on, not FUTURE from Jesus on, so that the MY GENERATION passage fits, but just like them, you overemphasize ONE WORD Generation.

    The Generation that sees ALL OF THESE SIGNS does not have to live for the full 2000 years to see them, I have understanding that the Temple and Jerusalem were destroyed by the Romans so I HAVE SEEN THOSE SIGNS !! I understand that the Pharisees and Jews brought forth false christs who they hoped would save them just before 70 AD. I understand there was Rumors of wars because Jesus was speaking about Jerusalem being destroyed, and he then tells the Disciples, THE END IS NOT YET...Have you ever wondered why he said that? This was after Jesus' death, there was false christs, and there was Wars and Rumors of wars.....What happens when Jesus Returns? There will be Messiah that comes to save Israel from an Army, a Roman Army, just like in 70 AD, but Jesus tells them, THE END IS NOT YET.....He is telling them this is not him landing in the Mt. of Olives it is a FALSE CHRIST !!!

    Then we get Kingdom against Kingdom and Nation against Nation, Earthquakes/Pestilences/Famines etc. etc. By using logic we understand exactly where we are here. We are not yet in the Tribulation period because the Gospel has not been preached unto all the world yet see Matthew 24:14. And the Disciples are told specifically that they will be delivered up and killed, and that happens in verse 9. The false prophets means false preachers and Rabbis here, NOT the False Prophet that preforms Miracles in verse 24. Why do you think Jesus Mentions false christs that deceive in verse 5.........false prophets that deceive many in verse 11.........and THE False Prophet and Anti-Christ in verse 24 that WORK MIRACLES !!! The others DECEIVE.......these work WONDERS and MIRACLES. It is because there are three distinct periods

    The Gospel is preached unto all the WORLD then the End Time Comes............then we see the Abomination of Desolation, these signs from here on will all come within a Seven Year period of time. THIS GENERATION, having SEEN The Temples Destruction via HISTORY, having seen the Disciples Martyrs via HISTORY, will now see ALL OF THESE OTHER SIGNS ADDED to what they have seen via HISTORY !!

    I understand exactly what the Valley of Dry Bones Prophecy is about, even though I did not actually SEE Israel REBORN, I know they were as Dead Men's Bones and came ALIVE AGAIN, via History brother....I SEEN IT !!!! I understand it, its the same thing.

  15. #195
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    Re: Who is the Infamous Little Horn?

    Quote Originally Posted by Revelation Man View Post
    So I see you don't think all of Revelation has already past like most of the people that like to link Matthew 24 and Revelation which is WAY TWISTED, but instead you think most of Matthew is future tense, which I have never heard of to be honest.

    So you do just the opposite of those guys and you allow the THIS GENERATION passage to make everything in Matthew 24 a FUTURE PROPHECY from the present on, not FUTURE from Jesus on, so that the MY GENERATION passage fits, but just like them, you overemphasize ONE WORD Generation.

    The Generation that sees ALL OF THESE SIGNS does not have to live for the full 2000 years to see them, I have understanding that the Temple and Jerusalem were destroyed by the Romans so I HAVE SEEN THOSE SIGNS !! I understand that the Pharisees and Jews brought forth false christs who they hoped would save them just before 70 AD. I understand there was Rumors of wars because Jesus was speaking about Jerusalem being destroyed, and he then tells the Disciples, THE END IS NOT YET...Have you ever wondered why he said that? This was after Jesus' death, there was false christs, and there was Wars and Rumors of wars.....What happens when Jesus Returns? There will be Messiah that comes to save Israel from an Army, a Roman Army, just like in 70 AD, but Jesus tells them, THE END IS NOT YET.....He is telling them this is not him landing in the Mt. of Olives it is a FALSE CHRIST !!!

    Then we get Kingdom against Kingdom and Nation against Nation, Earthquakes/Pestilences/Famines etc. etc. By using logic we understand exactly where we are here. We are not yet in the Tribulation period because the Gospel has not been preached unto all the world yet see Matthew 24:14. And the Disciples are told specifically that they will be delivered up and killed, and that happens in verse 9. The false prophets means false preachers and Rabbis here, NOT the False Prophet that preforms Miracles in verse 24. Why do you think Jesus Mentions false christs that deceive in verse 5.........false prophets that deceive many in verse 11.........and THE False Prophet and Anti-Christ in verse 24 that WORLD MIRACLES !!! The others DECEIVE.......these work WONDERS and MIRACLES. It is because thee are three distinct periods

    The Gospel is preached unto all the WORLD then the End Time Comes............then we see the Abomination of Desolation, these signs from here on will all come within a 7 Year period of time. THIS GENERATION, having SEEN The Temples Destruction via HISTORY, having seen the Disciples Martyrs via HISTORY, will now see ALL OF THESE OTHER SIGNS ADDED to what they have seen via HISTORY !!

    I understand exactly what the Valley of Dry Bones Prophecy is about, even though I did not actually SEE Israel REBORN, I know they were as Dead Men's Bones and came ALIVE AGAIN, via History brother....I SEEN IT !!!! I understand it, its the same thing.
    God bless you! Thank you for taking a moment to understand where I stand. And now I understand better where you stand. Yes, I believe that Matt 24 is FUTURE (or even about to start in my generation).

    Yes, the world continues as it has for eons. Wars, false prophets ect. But why do you think I build my case on just a word (Generation)? That word had nothing to do with what I believe by over 20 years of studying the timeline of end times. If I could sit down with you, I could show you how perfectly Matt 24, Mark 13, Luke 21, Daniel 8, Daniel 7, Daniel 2, Daniel 11:21>, Daniel 12, 1 Thess 4, 1 Cor 15, Ezekiel 38, ALL Alight within the CHRONOLOGICAL timeline of Revelation. You just have to look at them as Future, not past.

    I am not saying that there is not truth to Daniel prophecies being fulfilled (Most of them). They were. BUT they will be fulfilled to the FULLEST in the Future. It all makes sense. The Mystery has been revealed.

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