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Thread: Is the Promise of Regeneration Enunciated in the Old Testament?

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  1. #1
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    Is the Promise of Regeneration Enunciated in the Old Testament?

    Regeneration of the human spirit is a cornerstone doctrine of the New Testament, taught in Jesus’ famous ‘born again’ discourse with Nicodemus. (John 3) Likewise, St. Paul explains our restoration in scriptures such as Colossians 3:9-10.
    “You have put off the old self with its practices and have put on the new self, which is being renewed in knowledge after the image of its creator.”
    Given that New Testament revelation finds its fountainhead in the Old Testament, was this experience explicitly promised by the prophets? And where in the Old Testament is the source of the doctrine of Regeneration?
    "Your name and renown
    is the desire of our hearts."
    (Isaiah 26:8)

  2. #2

    Re: Is the Promise of Regeneration Enunciated in the Old Testament?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cyberseeker View Post
    And where in the Old Testament is the source of the doctrine of Regeneration?
    Since the New Covenant is already stated in the Old Testament, regeneration is already mentioned there.

    25 Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you.
    26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.
    27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them. (Ezek 36:25-27)

    31
    Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:
    32 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD:
    33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people. (Jer 31: 31-33)

    There are also other related Scriptures.


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    Re: Is the Promise of Regeneration Enunciated in the Old Testament?

    Also, the individual (soul) is regenerated, not the spirit (from God - not human). The scripture reference (old self) is the individual (soul). The old self is body+spirit=soul, the new self is body+spirit-Spirit=soul. The old is gone and no longer exists.

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    Re: Is the Promise of Regeneration Enunciated in the Old Testament?

    Quote Originally Posted by Daniel567

    25 Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you.
    26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.
    27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them. (Ezek 36:25-27)
    This is indeed an impressive promise. But if we apply it to regeneration of the believer at conversion, we get a conflict with another widely held teaching. Im referring to the Christian possessing two natures - his new nature in Christ, and the adamic nature he was born with. What Ezekiel seems to be saying here, is that the 'old nature' is extracted from us at the same time as the 'new nature' is put in us. Is that what Ezekiel is saying?
    "Your name and renown
    is the desire of our hearts."
    (Isaiah 26:8)

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    Re: Is the Promise of Regeneration Enunciated in the Old Testament?

    I don't see a conflict, and the teaching of two natures is false. The nature of a thing is the essence of a thing.

  6. #6

    Re: Is the Promise of Regeneration Enunciated in the Old Testament?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cyberseeker View Post
    What Ezekiel seems to be saying here, is that the 'old nature' is extracted from us at the same time as the 'new nature' is put in us. Is that what Ezekiel is saying?
    What the Lord was saying through Ezekiel was primarily about regeneration -- a new heart and a new spirit. What Titus calls "the washing of regeneration and renewing of the Holy Ghost". A supernatural work of God to convert a vile sinner into a saint.

    So the issue of the old Adamic sin nature is not addressed here. Ideally every Christian should be "filled with the Spirit" which means continuously walking in the Spirit and producing the fruit of the Spirit.

    But since the old Adamic sin is not immediately eradicated, we are told over and over again to crucify or mortify the flesh. So if the Christian would reject the lusts of the flesh constantly, the new heart, the new spirit, and the new creature in Christ would always be overcomers and have the victory. But that is the ideal, and not always the case.

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    Re: Is the Promise of Regeneration Enunciated in the Old Testament?

    Quote Originally Posted by Daniel567
    So the issue of the old Adamic sin nature is not addressed here.
    Can you suggest what the prophet may have had in mind by his statement, "... and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh"
    "Your name and renown
    is the desire of our hearts."
    (Isaiah 26:8)

  8. #8

    Re: Is the Promise of Regeneration Enunciated in the Old Testament?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cyberseeker View Post
    Can you suggest what the prophet may have had in mind by his statement, "... and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh"
    A stony heart is a hard heart, and a hard hard resists the voice of the Holy Spirit (Heb 3:7-10; Acts 7:51-53).

    Wherefore (as the Holy Ghost saith, To day if ye will hear his voice,
    8Harden not your hearts, as in the provocation, in the day of temptation in the wilderness:
    9When your fathers tempted me, proved me, and saw my works forty years.
    10Wherefore I was grieved with that generation, and said, They do alway err in their heart; and they have not known my ways.


    51Ye stiffnecked and uncircumcised in heart and ears, ye do always resist the Holy Ghost: as your fathers did, so do ye.
    52Which of the prophets have not your fathers persecuted? and they have slain them which shewed before of the coming of the Just One; of whom ye have been now the betrayers and murderers:
    53Who have received the law by the disposition of angels, and have not kept it.

    God had already deemed Israel (in general) as being resistant to the Holy Spirit. But when Israel is converted at the second coming of Christ, that resistance will be taken away and Israel will mourn and repent and be converted. They will finally submit to the Lord Jesus Christ.

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    Re: Is the Promise of Regeneration Enunciated in the Old Testament?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cyberseeker View Post
    This is indeed an impressive promise. But if we apply it to regeneration of the believer at conversion, we get a conflict with another widely held teaching. Im referring to the Christian possessing two natures - his new nature in Christ, and the adamic nature he was born with. What Ezekiel seems to be saying here, is that the 'old nature' is extracted from us at the same time as the 'new nature' is put in us. Is that what Ezekiel is saying?
    The idea that we have two natures is not a Biblical idea, and frankly it's absurd on the face of it. What Ezekiel has described is a change in a person's nature. Likewise, the new creature in Christ is a changed person, not two natures in one person.

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    Re: Is the Promise of Regeneration Enunciated in the Old Testament?

    Quote Originally Posted by CadyandZoe View Post
    The idea that we have two natures is not a Biblical idea, and frankly it's absurd on the face of it. What Ezekiel has described is a change in a person's nature. Likewise, the new creature in Christ is a changed person, not two natures in one person.
    It is rather absurd isnt it? Yet, its surprising how many believe we have 2 natures. When the NIV first came out it translated 'the flesh' as 'the old nature', and that was unhelpful too.
    "Your name and renown
    is the desire of our hearts."
    (Isaiah 26:8)

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    Re: Is the Promise of Regeneration Enunciated in the Old Testament?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cyberseeker View Post
    It is rather absurd isnt it? Yet, its surprising how many believe we have 2 natures. When the NIV first came out it translated 'the flesh' as 'the old nature', and that was unhelpful too.
    This concept will cause you problems. In Romans Chapter 7, Paul, a seasoned Christian and zealous for God, discovers that he is unable to keep the Law of God even though he wants to. There, he establishes TWO things;
    1. Sin dwells IN him and NO good thing dwells in his flesh (v.17-18)
    2. His body is a body of death with a Law of sin and death (v.23-24)

    But then he says that there is ANOTHER Law, which enable him to overcome this Law of sin, that is "the Law of Life in Christ Jesus", which is to be found in the spirit of man (8:1-6). Later, Paul tells us in Galatians 5:17; "For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would."

    I'm sure that I do not have to write any more. One can immediately see the dilemma and problems that the doctrine of a SINGLE nature in a Christian causes.

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    Re: Is the Promise of Regeneration Enunciated in the Old Testament?

    Quote Originally Posted by Walls View Post
    This concept will cause you problems. In Romans Chapter 7, Paul, a seasoned Christian and zealous for God, discovers that he is unable to keep the Law of God even though he wants to. There, he establishes TWO things;
    1. Sin dwells IN him and NO good thing dwells in his flesh (v.17-18)
    2. His body is a body of death with a Law of sin and death (v.23-24)

    But then he says that there is ANOTHER Law, which enable him to overcome this Law of sin, that is "the Law of Life in Christ Jesus", which is to be found in the spirit of man (8:1-6). Later, Paul tells us in Galatians 5:17; "For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would."

    I'm sure that I do not have to write any more. One can immediately see the dilemma and problems that the doctrine of a SINGLE nature in a Christian causes.
    Paul is not describing two natures. He is describing his current nature. What you think is two natures, is actual a single complex nature.

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    Re: Is the Promise of Regeneration Enunciated in the Old Testament?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cyberseeker View Post
    Regeneration of the human spirit is a cornerstone doctrine of the New Testament, taught in Jesus’ famous ‘born again’ discourse with Nicodemus. (John 3) Likewise, St. Paul explains our restoration in scriptures such as Colossians 3:9-10.


    Given that New Testament revelation finds its fountainhead in the Old Testament, was this experience explicitly promised by the prophets? And where in the Old Testament is the source of the doctrine of Regeneration?
    What a great question! Yes, I think Jesus indicated, in his conversation with Nicodemus, that teachers in Israel should've known about regeneration. I think the whole interest in the Prophets was in discerning the difference between outward observance of the Law and an inner spiritual relationship with God. This inner "marriage" to God was to result in genuine spiritual fruit, such as love and compassion. It was the spring out of which God's own love became mercy towards us. In a nutshell, I see regeneration as a character change, a "falling in love," so to speak. This is, however, a different kind of romance. It is a complete transformation in which we exchange our carnal selves for God's virtues. It is the abandonment of autonomous living in favor of dependence upon the spiritual life of God, a new chance at the tree of life.

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    Re: Is the Promise of Regeneration Enunciated in the Old Testament?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cyberseeker View Post
    Regeneration of the human spirit is a cornerstone doctrine of the New Testament, taught in Jesus’ famous ‘born again’ discourse with Nicodemus. (John 3) Likewise, St. Paul explains our restoration in scriptures such as Colossians 3:9-10.


    Given that New Testament revelation finds its fountainhead in the Old Testament, was this experience explicitly promised by the prophets? And where in the Old Testament is the source of the doctrine of Regeneration?
    Adam, perfect in his construction and habits until the fall, was placed in front of the Tree of Life and commanded to eat. When a man eats anything the system which God has put in place causes that food to be assimilated by the man. It becomes organically one with the man and permeates his being. So Adam, although perfect in his humanity, needed another "birth" in which the divine life would be infused into him. This was necessary because to be a "help meet" for our Lord Jesus he needed to have the same nature - the divine nature.

    The New, and additional, and heavenly, and necessary birth is found in Genesis 2.

    And by the way, contrary to some peoples' belief, the new birth only applies to the SPIRIT of man (Jn.3:6). From there, it works its way into the SOUL of man, not by REBIRTH, but by TRANSFORMATION (Rom.8:29; 2nd Cor.3:18; Col.3:10). Later, the body, by this same Holy Spirit, will be resurrected (or changed if the saint is alive at Christ's coming) in the image of Christ's body to complete the full salvation of man. 1st Corinthians 15:49; "And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also (in resurrection) bear the image of the heavenly."

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    Re: Is the Promise of Regeneration Enunciated in the Old Testament?

    Quote Originally Posted by Walls View Post
    Adam, perfect in his construction and habits until the fall, was placed in front of the Tree of Life and commanded to eat.
    Never read that. Where might that be?


    Quote Originally Posted by Walls View Post
    And by the way, contrary to some peoples' belief, the new birth only applies to the SPIRIT of man (Jn.3:6).
    Neither that verse or that passage say that.

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