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Thread: what about "prophets" of today?

  1. #76
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    Re: what about "prophets" of today?

    Quote Originally Posted by Slug1 View Post
    Then Agabus wasn't speaking prophetically AFTERwards in the "past" and after Jesus' ascension as well??
    Let's define the role of a "prophet" as it was understood in the first century before we go any further.
    Those who seek God with all their heart will find Him and be given sight. Those who seek their own agenda will remain blind.

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    Re: what about "prophets" of today?

    Quote Originally Posted by randyk View Post
    Something can happen in the past, and also be in the present. It can also be in the future.
    Yes, the sun appears to rise every morning. It will appear to rise again tomorrow.

    I guess I am a prophet...?
    Those who seek God with all their heart will find Him and be given sight. Those who seek their own agenda will remain blind.

  3. #78
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    Re: what about "prophets" of today?

    Quote Originally Posted by randyk View Post
    Yes, that's true. But for me the bigger issue is, What about Christians who sometimes give true prophecies and sometimes do not? I'm talking about the Christian who always says, "God told me this, and God told me that?" He or she might say, "I feel God telling you to do this or that." But sometimes it is God, and sometimes it is not.

    I think that people try to fit into their theology, into their doctrine. They think they should prophesy "on demand," and so prophesy sometimes when they feel inspired, and also prophesy just because they think "they can." They think they can, and should, prophesy everything that enters into their minds!

    This is, I believe, a matter of people confusing the genuine gift of prophecy with their doctrines. We are flawed people, and need to "judge prophecy," as Paul indicated in 1 Corinthians. I think it suggests that sometimes Christians do get it wrong with respect to prophecy.

    1 Cor 14.29 Two or three prophets should speak, and the others should weigh carefully what is said.
    I think many Christians are simply undiscipled concerning their gifting. For example, a Christian is "inspired" to say something to another Christian and this "something" is spot on and in response, they are told that they may have the gift of prophecy, or worse... are told they might be a prophet. This undiscipled Christian has a seed planted in their mind and in many cases, run with it and begin "prophecying" and in time, they are Prophet So-in-so. And because a bunch of other undiscipled Christians are listening, they don't KNOW how to be careful (per Paul's lesson) and allow Prophet So-in-so the freedom to prophecy without any regard (no accountability) concerning all the false prophecy.

    And all this by saying one inspired thing years ago and being allowed to continue without any accountability
    Slug1--out

    ~Titus 2:11 For the grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to all men,~

    ~Honestly, the pain of persecution lets you KNOW you are still alive... IN Christ!~

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    ~"In the turmoil of any chaos, all it takes is that whisper that is heard like thunder over all the noise and the chaos seems to go away, focus returns and we are comforted in knowing that God has listened to our cry for help."~


  4. #79
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    Re: what about "prophets" of today?

    Quote Originally Posted by keck553 View Post
    Let's define the role of a "prophet" as it was understood in the first century before we go any further.
    I think Paul defines it the best:

    1 Cor 14: 3 But he who prophesies speaks edification and exhortation and comfort to men.

    Maybe defining "edification/comfort" is the need. Exhortation is bringing the scriptures to life into ones life in a way that is both contextually accurate yet specific to the need of the listener, no matter how many are listening. This is edifying and comforting also.

    However, here are some examples of edification that is not as common but needed by God (thus called "a gift of prophecy"). It IS edifying for a prophet to call out another person's sin (Nathan). It is edifying when a person is silently praying OR waiting on God, and another Christian is given the answer or a task for, the person who is praying/waiting (Ananias). It is edifying to be told beforehand what will happen in the future if you do something (Agabus). It is edifying to be told of "secrets" in your life (Jesus).

    These are just some examples of the gifting of prophecy being used for the edifying, exhorting and the comforting of the Body of Christ.
    Slug1--out

    ~Titus 2:11 For the grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to all men,~

    ~Honestly, the pain of persecution lets you KNOW you are still alive... IN Christ!~

    ~Colossians 1:28 Him we preach, warning every man and teaching every man in all wisdom, that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesus.~


    ~"In the turmoil of any chaos, all it takes is that whisper that is heard like thunder over all the noise and the chaos seems to go away, focus returns and we are comforted in knowing that God has listened to our cry for help."~


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    Re: what about "prophets" of today?

    Amos 3:7 Indeed; the Lord does nothing without revealing His plans to His servants, the prophets.
    Ezekiel 12:27-28 The people say the visions and prophesies you tell are not to be fulfilled for many years, they are for a time far off. The Lord says: no Word of Mine shall be delayed, it will be done at its proper time.
    Isaiah 42:9 The earlier prophesies have come to pass, now I declare new things....
    Solomon said: Whatever is to come, has been already, God summons each event back in its turn. Eccl 5:15

    There are many other scriptures telling us of things and events that must happen in our future. As 2 Peter 1:10 says; studying them will enlighten our minds and we can be prepared for all that God has planned.

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    Re: what about "prophets" of today?

    Quote Originally Posted by randyk View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by ProDeo View Post
    And what did you learn?
    I'm still learning....
    That's not an answer shall I start first then?

    In my early Christian years I believed God spoke to me about a particular issue that would happen in the near future. Convinced of that I waited and waited until it became clear it wasn't going to happen. Very painful. What went wrong? It took me quite some years to figure that out. Basically that my (no doubt) godly wish was mixed with a lot of self interest and that that cocktail eventually made me to believe God confirmed the wish. Ps 37:4 comes to mind.

    What I learned, never ever trust myself again. Unless I am swallowed by a whale and like Jonah are vomited on the place God wants me to be. Okay, I am overreacting but I feel very strong about it having wandered 20+ years in the charismatic movement and seen a lot of damage done by well meaning Christians speaking in the name of the Lord. At least I only damaged myself, not others.

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    Re: what about "prophets" of today?

    I am with some on earlier pages of this thread that do not think there are true prophets today nor the gift of prophecy. If either exist, then sola Scriptura is necessarily false. One cannot have both sola Scriptura and active proohets/prophecy.

    In essentials, unity; in non-essentials, liberty; in all things, charity. - Rupertus Meldenius

    Read your Bible and pray every single day. - Pastor Jon Courson

    If your grace ain't greasier than a bucket full of chitlin's and gravy, you might be a legalist - an internet friend.

  8. #83
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    Re: what about "prophets" of today?

    Quote Originally Posted by ProDeo View Post
    That's not an answer shall I start first then?

    In my early Christian years I believed God spoke to me about a particular issue that would happen in the near future. Convinced of that I waited and waited until it became clear it wasn't going to happen. Very painful. What went wrong? It took me quite some years to figure that out. Basically that my (no doubt) godly wish was mixed with a lot of self interest and that that cocktail eventually made me to believe God confirmed the wish. Ps 37:4 comes to mind.

    What I learned, never ever trust myself again. Unless I am swallowed by a whale and like Jonah are vomited on the place God wants me to be. Okay, I am overreacting but I feel very strong about it having wandered 20+ years in the charismatic movement and seen a lot of damage done by well meaning Christians speaking in the name of the Lord. At least I only damaged myself, not others.
    This is a prime example of what I mentioned in post #78 concerning a lack of proper discipleship where "words/prophecy" is tossed around without any accountability. People are hurt.

    Please know that out there in the Body are those who are discipled and are held accountable and when words or prophecy is given, based on the fruit, the accuracy is clearly of God!!
    Slug1--out

    ~Titus 2:11 For the grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to all men,~

    ~Honestly, the pain of persecution lets you KNOW you are still alive... IN Christ!~

    ~Colossians 1:28 Him we preach, warning every man and teaching every man in all wisdom, that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesus.~


    ~"In the turmoil of any chaos, all it takes is that whisper that is heard like thunder over all the noise and the chaos seems to go away, focus returns and we are comforted in knowing that God has listened to our cry for help."~


  9. #84
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    Re: what about "prophets" of today?

    Quote Originally Posted by TrustGzus View Post
    I am with some on earlier pages of this thread that do not think there are true prophets today nor the gift of prophecy. If either exist, then sola Scriptura is necessarily false. One cannot have both sola Scriptura and active proohets/prophecy.
    I agree.
    The ancient prophets have told us all what God plans for our future. The problems mainly arise when people believe things which are not scriptural and become confused. Isaiah 29:9-12 says what happens when people do that.

    However, the only really important thing, is to be born again into Christianity and to never lose your faith in God, whatever happens.

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    Re: what about "prophets" of today?

    Quote Originally Posted by TrustGzus View Post
    I am with some on earlier pages of this thread that do not think there are true prophets today nor the gift of prophecy. If either exist, then sola Scriptura is necessarily false. One cannot have both sola Scriptura and active proohets/prophecy.
    Question: Which prophecies that Paul was referring to in 1 Corinthians 14 - the ones that Paul was encouraging the Corinthians to give - are included in Scripture?

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    Re: what about "prophets" of today?

    Quote Originally Posted by randyk View Post
    No, I would agree with you. I was not speaking "in absolutes" as you suggested.
    Ok, I misunderstood and thank you for clarifying. In a format such as this, it often takes several back and forth to get a clear understanding. I should have asked for clarification first. Thank you for your patience.😊

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    Re: what about "prophets" of today?

    Quote Originally Posted by ChangedByHim View Post
    Question: Which prophecies that Paul was referring to in 1 Corinthians 14 - the ones that Paul was encouraging the Corinthians to give - are included in Scripture?
    Of course they weren’t. But first century proohecies have nothing to do with sola Scriptura. Remember all those prophets hidden in caves from Ahab and Jezebel? The OT is filled with prophets that we know nothing of what they said. But again, that has nothing to do with the Protestant understanding and teaching of sola Scriptura.

    In essentials, unity; in non-essentials, liberty; in all things, charity. - Rupertus Meldenius

    Read your Bible and pray every single day. - Pastor Jon Courson

    If your grace ain't greasier than a bucket full of chitlin's and gravy, you might be a legalist - an internet friend.

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    Re: what about "prophets" of today?

    Quote Originally Posted by TrustGzus View Post
    I am with some on earlier pages of this thread that do not think there are true prophets today nor the gift of prophecy. If either exist, then sola Scriptura is necessarily false. One cannot have both sola Scriptura and active proohets/prophecy.
    Why does sola scriptura exclude prophesying?
    Matt 9:13
    13 "But go and learn what this means: ' I DESIRE COMPASSION,AND NOT SACRIFICE,' for I did not come to call the righteous, but sinners."
    NASU

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    Re: what about "prophets" of today?

    Quote Originally Posted by ChangedByHim View Post
    Question: Which prophecies that Paul was referring to in 1 Corinthians 14 - the ones that Paul was encouraging the Corinthians to give - are included in Scripture?
    29 Let two or three prophets speak, and let the others weigh what is said.

    30 If a revelation is made to another sitting there, let the first be silent.

    31 For you can all prophesy one by one, so that all may learn and all be encouraged,

    ------

    From this I conclude that a revelation has a higher priority (is more important) than what prophets have to say?

    Makes me wonder if our perception of prophecy is the same as in the early church.

    Also if we look at the OT and the school of prophets, see gotquestions gives the impression that prophecy can be learned?

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    Re: what about "prophets" of today?

    Quote Originally Posted by TrustGzus View Post
    Of course they weren’t. But first century proohecies have nothing to do with sola Scriptura. Remember all those prophets hidden in caves from Ahab and Jezebel? The OT is filled with prophets that we know nothing of what they said. But again, that has nothing to do with the Protestant understanding and teaching of sola Scriptura.
    Your point seems to be that since Scripture is complete there is no longer need for prophecy. But not all prophecy is considered Scripture. Prophecy has many elements, including what many pastors do on Sunday mornings when they speak the Word by the Spirit.

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