Gods blessings to them that keep his law.

[Firstfruits]

All these blessing shall come on thee, and overtake thee, if thou shalt hearken unto the voice of the Lord thy God.

Blessed shalt thou be in the city,
And blessed shalt thou be in the field.
Blessed shall be the fruit of thy body, and the fruit of thy ground, and the fruit of thy cattle, the increase of thy kine, and the flocks of thy sheep.
Blessed shall be thy basket and thy store.
Blessed shalt thou be when thou comest in,
and blessed shalt thou be when thou goest out.

Deut.28:1-14 for complete scripture.

Is the fact that all the blessings for obedience to God's holy law are temporal and not eternal, the reason the law is associated with the flesh?

While we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen; for the things which are seen are temporal.
2 Corinthians 4:18

[Studyin'2Show]

As those who have truly accepted Messiah have received the blessings that are eternal, does that mean He will no longer bless us physically? Or simply that it shouldn't be what we seek after? Yeshua tells us that our Father knows the physical needs we have and will supply for them if we seek Him FIRST. The eternal is by far the priority. However, when Paul says that we are not to look at the things that are seen, does he mean we should physically close our physical eyes as we walk out God's word in out lives? I believe His point is that the eternal should be what motivates us, not the temporal. In that way my focus is on that which is eternal, though I recognize that following God's instruction is profitable, physically, financially, emotionally, and spiritually.

God Bless!

[Sold Out]

Psalm 1:2, "But his delight is in the law of the LORD; and in his law doth he meditate day and night."

I 'delight' in God's law. It is not bondage....it is true freedom! I know that every 'thou shalt not' is a promise of God's protection over me. There is no greater feeling than being secure in God's hands, obeying His commandments in order to please him with my life.

It's not unlike a parent/child relationship. We all know that children need structure & rules to feel secure and loved. That is how we (Christians) should view God's law. We are his children by faith in Christ, and we remain secure and feel loved when we obey His commands, understanding that these boundaries are good for us.

[Firstfruits]

As those who have truly accepted Messiah have received the blessings that are eternal, does that mean He will no longer bless us physically? Or simply that it shouldn't be what we seek after? Yeshua tells us that our Father knows the physical needs we have and will supply for them if we seek Him FIRST. The eternal is by far the priority. However, when Paul says that we are not to look at the things that are seen, does he mean we should physically close our physical eyes as we walk out God's word in out lives? I believe His point is that the eternal should be what motivates us, not the temporal. In that way my focus is on that which is eternal, though I recognize that following God's instruction is profitable, physically, financially, emotionally, and spiritually.

God Bless!

In answer to you question it is written;

Therefore take no thought, saying, what shall we eat? or What shall we drink? or , wherewithal shall we be clothed?
(For after all these things do the Gentiles seek for your heavenly Father knoweth that ye have need of all these things.
But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you.
Ref: Matthew 6:25-34.

This applies to all who have truly accepted the Messiah.

[Studyin'2Show]

In answer to you question it is written;

Therefore take no thought, saying, what shall we eat? or What shall we drink? or , wherewithal shall we be clothed?
(For after all these things do the Gentiles seek for your heavenly Father knoweth that ye have need of all these things.
But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you.
Ref: Matthew 6:25-34.

This applies to all who have truly accepted the Messiah.

Then we must agree since in my previous post I said that we MUST seek Him FIRST! Look at the scripture you have quoted. We are to seek the kingdom of God and His righteousness...

Psalm 119:142 - Your righteousness is an everlasting righteousness, And Your law is truth.

Isaiah 42:21 - The LORD is well pleased for His righteousness’ sake; He will exalt the law and make it honorable.

Isaiah 51:7 - Listen to Me, you who know righteousness, You people in whose heart is My law: Do not fear the reproach of men, Nor be afraid of their insults.

John 8:31-32
31 Then Jesus said to those Jews who believed Him, “If you abide in My word, you are My disciples indeed. 32 And you shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.”

It has ALWAYS been about faith. Having His Law in your heart, not just on stone. I would never walk in His Word to get stuff! I haven't purposed in my heart to not lie BECAUSE I want to get a blessing. I don't keep the Sabbath holy for the sake of stuff. I don't offer my tithe to be financially secure (though that's how many preach it ). Let us not forget that His righteousness comes as a free gift from Messiah so how can we seek after it once He has imputed it upon us? Yeshua and the Father are One. God's words are His words and vice-versa; without any conflict or contradiction. We have to remember that Yeshua told us to follow Him. He walked out Torah without flaw. He did abide in the Word of God. Did he stay in His home during the Sabbath or did He enjoy it? Did He stay away from foreigners or Samaritans; or did He draw them also to Himself? Walking out Torah as He did is not denying faith or His blood. It is honoring Him by walking in the Word of God as He did. What would Jesus do (WWJD)? How about, what did Jesus do (WDJD)?

God Bless!

[Firstfruits]

With regards to section one;

Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel: neither because they are the seed of Abraham, are they children; but in Isaac shall thy seed be called.
That is they which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.
For he is not a Jew which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, Which is outward in the flesh: But he is a Jew which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men but of God.

Second question:

And it shall come to pass, if thou shalt hearken diligently unto the voice of the Lord thy God, to observe and to do all his commandments which I command thee this day, that the Lord thy God will set thee high above all nations of the earth. Deuteronomy 28:1

The Lord shall establish thee an holy people unto himself, as he hath sworn unto thee, if thou shalt keep the commandments of the Lord thy God, and walk in his ways. Deuteronomy 28:9
And all the people of the earth shall see that thou art called by the name of the Lord; and they shall be afraid of thee. Deuteronomy 28:10.

Remember as a non Jew you have never been given the law, and as long as it stands those who keep it are above all nations of the earth.

Section three:

It is written; Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace.

With regards to Malachi 3:7-10; was tithing a commandment or an ordinance?

[Studyin'2Show]

What are you not hearing? Somehow, it seems that I keep answering the same exact questions just worded slightly differently and using different scriptural references. Let's do this again.

First section, huh? I don't see a question in here. It's about faith, not putting people in separate categories saying, 'God told you this but He told me that'. Do you not recognize that God is not a respecter of person? Do you not see that Yeshua IS God the Father? They are One and they do not change so His Word has not changed.

Second section. Please refer to first answer. Why do you feel it is necessary to dissect the people of God? It is NOT about the flesh; those who are the seed of Abraham by birth. It IS about faith; those who are the seed of Abraham by faith. Do you not see that one who is physically born of Abraham, who come to faith, will be the seed of Abraham by faith. It has ALWAYS, ALWAYS, ALWAYS been about the faith. It was the pride of man that has made it appear that it has ever been about physical birthright.

Section three. YES! The ordinances that came through man have been abolished making us one new man in Messiah. YES! Do not make the error of believing that God's Law is equivalent to 'ordinances that came through man'. As to the second part of section three, I'm not going to turn this into a tithing thread. I call my offering 'my tithe'. I use the tenth as a starting point. I do this because I want to, because He has put the desire within my heart, not through obligation.

God Bless!

[Firstfruits]

What are you not hearing? Somehow, it seems that I keep answering the same exact questions just worded slightly differently and using different scriptural references. Let's do this again.

First section, huh? I don't see a question in here. It's about faith, not putting people in separate categories saying, 'God told you this but He told me that'. Do you not recognize that God is not a respecter of person? Do you not see that Yeshua IS God the Father? They are One and they do not change so His Word has not changed.

Second section. Please refer to first answer. Why do you feel it is necessary to dissect the people of God? It is NOT about the flesh; those who are the seed of Abraham by birth. It IS about faith; those who are the seed of Abraham by faith. Do you not see that one who is physically born of Abraham, who come to faith, will be the seed of Abraham by faith. It has ALWAYS, ALWAYS, ALWAYS been about the faith. It was the pride of man that has made it appear that it has ever been about physical birthright.

Section three. YES! The ordinances that came through man have been abolished making us one new man in Messiah. YES! Do not make the error of believing that God's Law is equivalent to 'ordinances that came through man'. As to the second part of section three, I'm not going to turn this into a tithing thread. I call my offering 'my tithe'. I use the tenth as a starting point. I do this because I want to, because He has put the desire within my heart, not through obligation.

God Bless!

I was just replying to your Post in Bond vs free as you requested and are as you gave them in order of the sections 1,2,3.

If that which is written is not what God has promised or commanded then of the 613 commandments, which would you say are ordinances of men?
And which scriptures affirm what you believe?

[Studyin'2Show]

If that which is written is not what God has promised or commanded then of the 613 commandments, which would you say are ordinances of men?
And which scriptures affirm what you believe?

None of the 613 commands that are prefaced with or followed by a statement such as 'Thus sayith the LORD (YHWH) can be considered anything but from God. That which is an ordinance from man would be something like these:

• You can not eat meat and cheese together. This is not found in scripture yet many keep this ordinance and call it law.
• You must have a mother that is Jewish to be considered Jewish. Yet both Rahab and Ruth (from Jericho and Moab) are in the lineage of David, who's lineage no Jew would dispute.
• No Gentile can enter the Temple (as observed in Acts 21 with Paul in the Temple). Yet God's Word clearly shows that the Gentiles; the nations were to be led to His holy Temple so they could worship Him also.
• Yeshua gave one of these when He said that God's command is to honor your parents, yet by their law (these ordinances) they had made a way to avoid this by pledging what you would have given in support to your parents (see scripture below).

Matthew 15:3-9
3 He answered and said to them, “Why do you also transgress the commandment of God because of your tradition? 4 For God commanded, saying, ‘Honor your father and your mother’; and, ‘He who curses father or mother, let him be put to death.’ 5 But you say, ‘Whoever says to his father or mother, “Whatever profit you might have received from me is a gift to God”— 6 then he need not honor his father or mother.’ Thus you have made the commandment of God of no effect by your tradition. 7
8 Hypocrites! Well did Isaiah prophesy about you, saying: ‘ These people draw near to Me with their mouth,
Andhonor Me with their lips,
But their heart is far from Me.
9 And in vain they worship Me,
Teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.’”

The above scripture is a prime example affirming that the ordinances (traditions) of man had been elevated higher than the Law of God, and thus needed to be eradicated. There are literally thousands of these ordinances (laws) that are a heavy yoke around the neck of observant Jews to this today. They, unfortunately, are still teaching and observing AS DOCTRINE these commandments of men.

God Bless!

[Firstfruits]

None of the 613 commands that are prefaced with or followed by a statement such as 'Thus sayith the LORD (YHWH) can be considered anything but from God. That which is an ordinance from man would be something like these:

• You can not eat meat and cheese together. This is not found in scripture yet many keep this ordinance and call it law.
• You must have a mother that is Jewish to be considered Jewish. Yet both Rahab and Ruth (from Jericho and Moab) are in the lineage of David, who's lineage no Jew would dispute.
• No Gentile can enter the Temple (as observed in Acts 21 with Paul in the Temple). Yet God's Word clearly shows that the Gentiles; the nations were to be led to His holy Temple so they could worship Him also.
• Yeshua gave one of these when He said that God's command is to honor your parents, yet by their law (these ordinances) they had made a way to avoid this by pledging what you would have given in support to your parents (see scripture below).

Matthew 15:3-9
3 He answered and said to them, “Why do you also transgress the commandment of God because of your tradition? 4 For God commanded, saying, ‘Honor your father and your mother’; and, ‘He who curses father or mother, let him be put to death.’ 5 But you say, ‘Whoever says to his father or mother, “Whatever profit you might have received from me is a gift to God”— 6 then he need not honor his father or mother.’ Thus you have made the commandment of God of no effect by your tradition. 7
8 Hypocrites! Well did Isaiah prophesy about you, saying: ‘ These people draw near to Me with their mouth,
Andhonor Me with their lips,
But their heart is far from Me.
9 And in vain they worship Me,
Teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.’”

The above scripture is a prime example affirming that the ordinances (traditions) of man had been elevated higher than the Law of God, and thus needed to be eradicated. There are literally thousands of these ordinances (laws) that are a heavy yoke around the neck of observant Jews to this today. They, unfortunately, are still teaching and observing AS DOCTRINE these commandments of men.

God Bless!

I do not know where the examples are found in the scriptures, but looking through the 613 MItzvot (commandments) the sriptures for each Mitzvot (commandment) are in agreement with that which was given. If you can identify any that do not agree please supply the example with the scipture it does not agree with.

Thanks

[Studyin'2Show]

I do not know where the examples are found in the scriptures, but looking through the 613 MItzvot (commandments) the sriptures for each Mitzvot (commandment) are in agreement with that which was given. If you can identify any that do not agree please supply the example with the scipture it does not agree with.

Thanks

I stated that the 613 commandments are indeed commands from God. But find for me in the commandments of God where is says you can not eat meat and cheese in the same sitting or from the same dishes. Or find for me where it says that Gentiles are not allowed in the Temple. Those things are not there yet there are many who hold to these things as if they were commandments of God. There are thousands of these ordinances; not just 613. The scripture I've posted above shows how Yeshua felt about going against the Law of God to follow these traditions/ordinances.

God Bless!

P.S. Check out this blog http://www.askmoses.com/article.html?h=146&o=1337 to see the strange logic used to add to God's Word and His commands. You must read the comments on the bottom of the page.

[Firstfruits]

I stated that the 613 commandments are indeed commands from God. But find for me in the commandments of God where is says you can not eat meat and cheese in the same sitting or from the same dishes. Or find for me where it says that Gentiles are not allowed in the Temple. Those things are not there yet there are many who hold to these things as if they were commandments of God. There are thousands of these ordinances; not just 613. The scripture I've posted above shows how Yeshua felt about going against the Law of God to follow these traditions/ordinances.

God Bless!

P.S. Check out this blog http://www.askmoses.com/article.html?h=146&o=1337 to see the strange logic used to add to God's Word and His commands. You must read the comments on the bottom of the page.

Thanks for the info, very informative.

One important thing to note, is that the 613 mitzvot of the Torah are not binding on non Jews, non Jews are only required to to keep the Noahic commandments. unless the non Jew is prepared to follow all the extra rules, it is better for him or her to stay a Gentile.

Are you thinking of converting?

[Studyin'2Show]

Thanks for the info, very informative.

One important thing to note, is that the 613 mitzvot of the Torah are not binding on non Jews, non Jews are only required to to keep the Noahic commandments. unless the non Jew is prepared to follow all the extra rules, it is better for him or her to stay a Gentile.

Are you thinking of converting?

There is no need for conversion. This is what Paul was referring to when he spoke of 'the circumcision'. I do not need to become a Jew, ritually. Ruth didn't go through any ritual conversion (the circumcision); Rahab didn't go through it either. They simply attached themselves to God's people by FAITH. Do you realize that the view you have concerning the Noahic law for the Gentiles and the Torah for Jews; comes from the non-Messianic Jews point of view? They believe there is a separation between us and them. Two categories of people, with them held to a different standard; a cut above. This is not true as in Messiah we are one new man with the unbiblical dividing wall removed. Let me ask you this, do you believe that someone who is born Jewish and then comes to faith in Messiah should become 'uncircumcised'? Are they 'bound' to the Torah and so they must adhere to the 613 laws of God while we adhere to only 2?

It comes down to this for me. Yeshua IS God! Yeshua's commandments are God's commandments and God's commandments are Yeshua's commandments. God does not change. When He said that all the Law and the Prophets hang on these two, He was not rejecting the 613 but rather confirming them. If I say that all my hubby's ties hang on two tie racks, am I saying that all my husband's ties are gone and now he wears a tie rack around his neck instead? No, I would be saying that these two tie racks control the ties which hang on them. Each of the 613 commands will fit into one of the two categories in that they entail either loving God with all our hearts, souls, minds, and strength or are loving our neighbor as ourself. How you say? Well, if you are unclean from let's say touching a dead body and you love your neighbor as yourself, you will let your neighbor know that you are unclean so that they don't touch you and become unclean. How many plagues could have been stopped if people had loved their neighbor in such a way?

God Bless!

[Firstfruits]

There is no need for conversion. This is what Paul was referring to when he spoke of 'the circumcision'. I do not need to become a Jew, ritually. Ruth didn't go through any ritual conversion (the circumcision); Rahab didn't go through it either. They simply attached themselves to God's people by FAITH. Do you realize that the view you have concerning the Noahic law for the Gentiles and the Torah for Jews; comes from the non-Messianic Jews point of view? They believe there is a separation between us and them. Two categories of people, with them held to a different standard; a cut above. This is not true as in Messiah we are one new man with the unbiblical dividing wall removed. Let me ask you this, do you believe that someone who is born Jewish and then comes to faith in Messiah should become 'uncircumcised'? Are they 'bound' to the Torah and so they must adhere to the 613 laws of God while we adhere to only 2?

It comes down to this for me. Yeshua IS God! Yeshua's commandments are God's commandments and God's commandments are Yeshua's commandments. God does not change. When He said that all the Law and the Prophets hang on these two, He was not rejecting the 613 but rather confirming them. If I say that all my hubby's ties hang on two tie racks, am I saying that all my husband's ties are gone and now he wears a tie rack around his neck instead? No, I would be saying that these two tie racks control the ties which hang on them. Each of the 613 commands will fit into one of the two categories in that they entail either loving God with all our hearts, souls, minds, and strength or are loving our neighbor as ourself. How you say? Well, if you are unclean from let's say touching a dead body and you love your neighbor as yourself, you will let your neighbor know that you are unclean so that they don't touch you and become unclean. How many plagues could have been stopped if people had loved their neighbor in such a way?

God Bless!

Am I to take it that we are in agreement that if we love God and love one another as commanded by Christ that we are complete in the will of God?

Matthew 7:12 explains what Christ was talking about.

Therefore all things whatsoever ye would that men would do to you, do ye even soo to them: for this is the law and the prophets.

That also is what he was talking about in Matthew 5:17
Think not that I am come to destroy the law or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.

When we love God, and love one another we fulfil the law and the prophets.

[Studyin'2Show]

Am I to take it that we are in agreement that if we love God and love one another as commanded by Christ that we are complete in the will of God?

Matthew 7:12 explains what Christ was talking about.

Therefore all things whatsoever ye would that men would do to you, do ye even soo to them: for this is the law and the prophets.

That also is what he was talking about in Matthew 5:17
Think not that I am come to destroy the law or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.

When we love God, and love one another we fulfil the law and the prophets.

firstfruits, we agree on what I believe is fundamental. Salvation through faith in Messiah and His precious blood. Where we obviously do not agree is in our interpretation of Apostolic scriptures as they relate to God's Law. The word destroy, in my understanding, can only mean 'to do away with'. When Yeshua says that He has not come to 'destroy' the Law, His meaning is clear for me. In my understanding, He did not come to 'do away with' the Law. He lived the Law; He walked it out perfectly showing us that the way it had been interpreted before His arrival, was flawed because the people did not really know God. He walked with man once again; His glory veiled in human flesh. He showed us, through loving God with everything we are and everything we have, and loving our neighbor, how to perfectly fulfill God's Law. It has never been ABOUT following a list of rules. I has always been about our relationship with God and man. The Israelites missed that extremely crucial point because they chose not to hear directly from God; not to seek His face. They did not desire that personal relationship with Him and therefore never understood His Law. Because I know that God is Yeshua and Yeshua is God, I know that His commands are synonymous with each other. They do not contradict one another but rather support one another. So, yes, loving God and loving neighbor is the fulfillment of the whole Law. If you have touched a diseased person and become unclean, if you truly love your neighbor wouldn't you inform them as the Law commands so they can make the choice to become unclean or remain safe? If they are a rescuer they may chose to become unclean because they are loving their neighbor by choosing to save them as they would hope to be saved if in trouble. All the little commands of God are for a reason and that reason is that LOVE of which Yeshua speaks! That is the point for me. It all fits together perfectly and makes perfect sense for me.

God Bless!