PDA

View Full Version : Two questions valley of death



Zorgblar
Sep 22nd 2007, 09:22 AM
In the bible it says in the afterlife there is a valley of death. I have two questions about it.
1.What is the valley of death?is it part of the spirit world?
2.Is the valley of death in between heaven and hell?

enarchay
Sep 22nd 2007, 09:25 AM
In the bible it says in the afterlife there is a valley of death. I have two questions about it.
1.What is the valley of death?is it part of the spirit world?
2.Is the valley of death in between heaven and hell?

What are you talking about? A quote would be nice.

Serve-N-Protect
Sep 22nd 2007, 09:28 AM
the sin and temptation we encounter in this world. "The valley of the SHADOW of death" is in Psalms. The use of the word "shadow" I believed to be sin and temptation that exists in the "valley" meaning the world.

The Psalmist goes on to say that he will fear no evil as the lord is with him. I take this to mean that the "Shadow" will not lure him into eternal death as the grace of God protects him.

Zorgblar
Sep 22nd 2007, 09:31 AM
The verses are in psalms23:4:D

Zorgblar
Sep 22nd 2007, 09:34 AM
the sin and temptation we encounter in this world. "The valley of the SHADOW of death" is in Psalms. The use of the word "shadow" I believed to be sin and temptation that exists in the "valley" meaning the world.

The Psalmist goes on to say that he will fear no evil as the lord is with him. I take this to mean that the "Shadow" will not lure him into eternal death as the grace of God protects him.

You might be right.I might have just misinterpreted.

Serve-N-Protect
Sep 22nd 2007, 09:41 AM
this psalm is usually heard right before somebody is going to die or be killed. I believe this is where people think it is a prayer that prepares one for death and what they might encounter in the afterlife.

Where as it is actually a plea to God to rescue them from the fear of the evil that is about to befall them and cause their death.

It is not what I would consider a prayer of last minute repentance either. I believe that this mistake is made about it as well.

Rather this Psalm is a faith statement made in the face of evil by an already repentant heart.

enarchay
Sep 22nd 2007, 09:49 AM
If you are referring to the "valley of the shadow of death" of Psalm 23, it seems to be a hyperbole for death and the grave (both figuratively and literally), similiar to the phrase "gates of hades (pulai hadou)" of Mat 16:18.
"Have the gates of death been revealed to you, or have you seen the gates of deep darkness [shadow of death]?" (Job 38:17).
In the case of Psalm 23, it seems the phrase also acts as a metaphor for the tribulations the followers of God, particularly David, face in every day life, especially in the form of military captivity.
Then they cried to the LORD in their trouble, and he delivered them from their distress. He brought them out of darkness and the shadow of death, and burst their bonds apart. ... they loathed any kind of food, and they drew near to the gates of death. Then they cried to the LORD in their trouble, and he delivered them from their distress. He sent out his word and healed them, and delivered them from their destruction" (Psa 107:13-14, 18-20).
The phrase itself describes death in a very poetic fashion. In other cases, the phrase refers to spiritual blindness, i.e. death and bondage in sin (e.g. Luk 1:79). So the phrase (even if the phrase is acting as a metaphor) can refer to death and tribulation in quite a literal way and even in a figurative way, but also death and bondage in sin in a more figurative ("spiritual") way. This is similar to how Jesus uses the same word for "dead," nekros, in Mat 8:22 to refer both to an actual corpse and the spiritually blind that were going to attend the funeral; he uses the same word in both a literal and figurative manner in the same verse. In any case, the phrase is context dependent.

enarchay
Sep 22nd 2007, 09:55 AM
this psalm is usually heard right before somebody is going to die or be killed. I believe this is where people think it is a prayer that prepares one for death and what they might encounter in the afterlife.

I agree with what you said at first, that the "psalm is usually heard right before somebody is going to die or be killed," but I disagree that it anticipates the "afterlife." The Psalms are concerned with the sorrow and the disaster of tribulations and the death they often bring. David faced hard times, times so hard it seemed the gates of death were opening up to him, and he sought the Lord in his Psalms to deliver him.

Serve-N-Protect
Sep 22nd 2007, 10:00 AM
I agree with what you said at first, that the "psalm is usually heard right before somebody is going to die or be killed," but I disagree that it anticipates the "afterlife."

Yes.

But I think many misinterpret it that way because of the scenarios it is delivered in.

I also said that people will misinterpret it as a prayer of last minute repentance which I think is wrong as well.

I always saw it as a faith statement made in the face of evil by an already repentant heart.

BTW given that it is a psalm that I needed tonight. Thank You E.

enarchay
Sep 22nd 2007, 10:11 AM
BTW given that it is a psalm that I needed tonight. Thank You E.

I was gonna quote it for you but I figured it was too well known :saint:

Serve-N-Protect
Sep 22nd 2007, 10:14 AM
The lord blessed me through you tonight. Yes I do know the Psalm and learned other Psalms tonight thanks to a merciful God working through his people.

tgallison
Sep 22nd 2007, 04:50 PM
the sin and temptation we encounter in this world. "The valley of the SHADOW of death" is in Psalms. The use of the word "shadow" I believed to be sin and temptation that exists in the "valley" meaning the world.

The Psalmist goes on to say that he will fear no evil as the lord is with him. I take this to mean that the "Shadow" will not lure him into eternal death as the grace of God protects him.

Serve-N-Protect

Very well worded. We are under the shadow of Satan, and our soul is in danger as we take our pilgrimage on earth. Unless we are in Christ.

Here is a picture of the shadow. 31 chapter of Ezekiel

Behold, the Assyrian wa a cedar in Lebanon with fair branches, and with a shadowing shroud, and of an high stature; and his top was among the thick boughs. (4) The waters made him great, the deep set him up on high with her rivers running round about his plants, and sent out her little rivers unto all the trees of the field. (5) Therefore his height was exalted above all the trees of the field, and his boughs were multiplied, and his branches became long because of the multitude of waters, when he shot forth. (6) All the fowls of heaven made their nests in his boughs, and under his branches did all the beasts of the field bring forth their young, and under his shadow dwelt all great nations. (7) Thus was he fair in his greatness, in the length of his branches: for his root was by great water. (8) The cedars in the garden of God could not hide him: the fir trees were not like his boughs, and the chesnut trees were not like his branches; nor any tree in the garden of God was like unto him in his beauty. (17) They also went down into hell with him unto them that be slain with the sword; and the that were his arm, that dwelt under his shadow in the midst of the heathen.

Psalm 23:2------he leadeth me beside still waters.


Notice the waters that water the tree representing Satan are running and great. But Jesus is the still water, that comes from within God. Look at Isaiah 53:2
Isaiah 53:2 For he shall grow up before him as a tender plant, and as a root out of dry ground: he hath no form nor comeliness; and when we shall see him, there is no beauty that we should desire him. Contrast that with "Genesis 3:6 ---and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired---------."

The tender plant in Isaiah 53:2 is in dry ground, it does not need watering the water comes from within. (The Living Water) It has no form. God is a Spirit.

In Jesus Christ

Toymom
Sep 24th 2007, 03:01 AM
I grew up Jewish and always heard the 23rd Psalm at funerals. But I did not understand what it was about. Who was in the valley of the shadow of death? If it was the dead person, then they would be in death, not just the valley of its shadow.
Those who say that the psalm is about faith, I think are on the right track. It is not about dead people at all.
But, it is fitting to read at a funeral because the mourners are in the valley of the shadow of death.
And it is comforting to know that the Lord is always with us.

Teke
Sep 24th 2007, 03:06 PM
In the bible it says in the afterlife there is a valley of death. I have two questions about it.
1.What is the valley of death?is it part of the spirit world?
2.Is the valley of death in between heaven and hell?

If you've been to the "valley of the shadow of death" you know it. It is like twilight, not light but not dark. So yes, you could say it is like being between heaven and hell. You have no power and are in the hands of God and His angels. :)

AlainaJ
Sep 24th 2007, 04:29 PM
In the bible it says in the afterlife there is a valley of death. I have two questions about it.
1.What is the valley of death?is it part of the spirit world?
2.Is the valley of death in between heaven and hell?

It is symbolic-

Psalm 23-
Pss.23 (http://quod.lib.umich.edu/cgi/k/kjv/kjv-idx?type=DIV2&byte=2224058)

[4] Yea, though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I will fear no evil: for thou art with me; thy rod and thy staff they comfort me.

It is not a literal place....

What the Psalmsit is saying is, as we cross over from life to death God is with us.:pp

tgallison
Sep 24th 2007, 04:53 PM
It is symbolic-

Psalm 23-
Pss.23 (http://quod.lib.umich.edu/cgi/k/kjv/kjv-idx?type=DIV2&byte=2224058)

[4] Yea, though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I will fear no evil: for thou art with me; thy rod and thy staff they comfort me.

It is not a literal place....

What the Psalmsit is saying is, as we cross over from life to death God is with us.:pp


Alaina

Our cross over is done here on earth, it is from death unto life. The trip you are talking about is in a twinkling of an eye. The rod is for correction, the staff for leading the sheep.

Frances
Sep 24th 2007, 06:20 PM
The verses are in psalms23:4:D

'the valley of the shadow of death' - passing through a dark shadow may be rather scary but a shadow never hurt anyone, and the sun shines the other side of it. For a Christian physical death is only a shadow we must all pass through, but the Light of Christ is shining for us on the other side of the shadow.