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Samantha
Oct 11th 2007, 09:12 PM
OK, I'm here

What do you want to know?

rchivers
Oct 11th 2007, 09:14 PM
OK, I'm here

What do you want to know?

What happened?



............

Samantha
Oct 11th 2007, 09:17 PM
The first thing:

My father committed suicide. I was told that I could have the same demons as he had and they subsequently tried to free me from these demons..... and this is where it all started

rchivers
Oct 11th 2007, 09:23 PM
The first thing:

My father committed suicide. I was told that I could have the same demons as he had and they subsequently tried to free me from these demons..... and this is where it all started


Do you know why he did it? (his reasoning) How old were you when it happened?

Many times mental illness is mistaken for demon possession/opression, there was just a thread about that floating around.

I'm simply saying that a lot of suicides are related to deep depression or bipolar or the like....

Samantha
Oct 11th 2007, 09:25 PM
7 months

don't know

Serve-N-Protect
Oct 11th 2007, 09:29 PM
How old are you Sam? And do you live with your mother and siblings?

Saved7
Oct 11th 2007, 09:29 PM
OK, I'm here

What do you want to know?

Ok dear, I understand losing trust in the church, but not every church is the same. It sounds to me like this particular church is "over the top" on the demon thing. :rolleyes: Many people get that way, unfortunately. Just don't let that make you lose faith in Jesus, He has the answer and the power that you need. And remember the church is filled with nothing more than human beings who are a part of the new creation...we don't know everything like some would have you to believe. We are not God, we are only to "represent" God, but we don't do a very good job of it I'm ashamed to say.
HOwever, like rchivers said, sometimes it is nothing more than a mental illness, of which we can be freed from, through prayer and even fasting. But in the meantime, if meds are needed to get a person through until the healing comes, then a person should take meds.
I've seen people with depression and bipolar, and these things are rough to deal with. I myself have been a victim of depression and even anxiety. But the Lord healed me. :pp:pp

mikebr
Oct 11th 2007, 09:29 PM
The first thing:

My father committed suicide. I was told that I could have the same demons as he had and they subsequently tried to free me from these demons..... and this is where it all started

Wow, Samantha. First let me say that you were never supposed to put your trust in people. God can be trusted. I've found out that men, including myself, will sometimes lie to make God look good. But they will always lie to make themselves look right. Not on purpose. Its OK not to trust people who have wronged you. Love 'em though. For the most part they (we) don't know what we are doing. I'm sorry for you loss and for your bad experience. I think you have come to the right place. This board is full of Grace-filled lovers of Jesus who will help you heal by pointing you to Him.

Sometimes Shattered but Still in One Peace

Mike

rchivers
Oct 11th 2007, 09:34 PM
7 months

don't know

And how old were you when they tried to cleanse you of these "demons"?

Samantha
Oct 11th 2007, 09:40 PM
How old are you Sam? And do you live with your mother and siblings?


27, nope, I live by myself

jiggyfly
Oct 11th 2007, 10:02 PM
Wow, Samantha. First let me say that you were never supposed to put your trust in people. God can be trusted. I've found out that men, including myself, will sometimes lie to make God look good. But they will always lie to make themselves look right. Not on purpose. Its OK not to trust people who have wronged you. Love 'em though. For the most part they (we) don't know what we are doing. I'm sorry for you loss and for your bad experience. I think you have come to the right place. This board is full of Grace-filled lovers of Jesus who will help you heal by pointing you to Him.

Sometimes Shattered but Still in One Peace

Mike

Mike has made a very good point, you don't need to trust people in the "church" and in most cases it would be foolish to do so. But you do need to forgive them. I know many take offense if you don't trust them right away again but these are generally the ones who are not trust-worthy to start with. Just forgive them and move on.

Samantha
Oct 11th 2007, 10:07 PM
If it was so easy to just forgive and forget, the world wouldn't have been in the state it's in.
Yes, I put my trust in people "God's people"
People who convinced me that they were sent by God :B

People that gave me messages, "directly from God"

I want out, really I have so many questions, and no answers

:giveup:

judi<>><
Oct 11th 2007, 10:12 PM
Okay.... so take a deep breath, and ask one... that's O-N-E question....

Let's see if "God's people" here can't give you some answers. We are sent by God, because we are His ambassadors, but any ambassador that uses his own words rather than those of the One who sent him isn't worth his salt.

That means, let's keep it biblically based, brothers and sisters....

amazzin
Oct 11th 2007, 10:19 PM
Okay.... so take a deep breath, and ask one... that's O-N-E question....

Let's see if "God's people" here can't give you some answers. We are sent by God, because we are His ambassadors, but any ambassador that uses his own words rather than those of the One who sent him isn't worth his salt.

That means, let's keep it biblically based, brothers and sisters....

LOL,...what?
Have you read the initial post?
How does one keep it Biblical!!!

hootinannie
Oct 11th 2007, 10:57 PM
Dear Samantha,

I know what you're going through and what you've been through with people in the church. First let me say that many people, although far from being most, in some of the pentecostal and charismatic churches, especially the "old line" churches, seem to "see demons" "behind every bush" and blame everything on demons.:rolleyes: Jesus did not do that. He was well aware that human nature gives us more problems than demons do. He dealt with demons when the matter came up, but in the New Testament, there are relatively few times in the account of Jesus's dealings with people that He had to take authority over demons in anyone.

Secondly, let me say that the others who have told you that you shouldn't put your trust in people or churches are "right on". It's easier to take our problems to people and hear their answers than it is to take our problems to Jesus and hear HIS answers, because that (hearing Jesus's answers) requires that we spend quality time with Him so that we can get to know and recognize His voice when we hear it, and the "old nature" remaining in us resists that. And too, we usually can get an answer from a person immediately and sometimes we have to WAIT for our answers from God. We don't like to wait.

In many of the old-line "full gospel" churches today (still, I'm not saying "most"), there is such an emphasis put on the gifts of the Spirit (tongues, word of knowledge, prophecy, discernment, etc) that the gifts have become almost the entire FOCUS, and carnal Christians who "pride themselves" on having the gifts in operation (whether the gifts actually ARE in operation or not) will OFTEN tell a younger Christian "Thus saith the Lord....." and proceed to tell the younger Christian what it is that THEY think the young Christian should do, and saying "thus saith the Lord" is but an attempt to manipulate the young Christian into doing whatever it is that the carnal Christian thinks they should be doing.

There is a MAJOR problem with that. I experienced this myself, and it was a significant factor in why I ran away from God and the church and turned my intense, deep hatred toward everything having to do with God or the church or Christianity in general. Here's what happens:

You go to person "A" with a problem or with questions. Person "A" thinks he knows what you should do, and because he thinks it's really important, he may go off into some "prophetic tirade" designed to tell you what he thinks you should do, and he adds "thus saith the Lord" to give it an air of authority it wouldn't otherwise have....so he tells you what you should do.

So then you go to person "B" for another opinion or for answers or help, and person "B" does the same thing, only he tells you something entirely different, but adds "thus saith the Lord" to give it an air of authority because he really thinks you should do what it is HE is telling you.

The problem is, that if you DO what person "A" has said you should do, then person "B" says you're being rebellious and disobedient because you didn't do what "GOD" said you should do. :B And if you do what person "B" says you should do, then person "A" says you're being rebellious and disobedient because you didn't do what they told you "GOD" said you should do.:B So it's a LOSE/LOSE situation. No matter WHAT you do, you're being rebellious and disobedient and can't seem to do anything right. This results in frustration and confusion and despair, and will eventually cause you to turn away from God, unless you stop listening to people and begin to listen to God.

There are some very mature and wise Christians here on this forum, and many will give you very sound, very scriptural advice. But even though that is true, you STILL must take whatever they tell you and hold it up to the Word of God for confirmation. I've found people here to be very gentle and caring and very desirous of LEADING people to find their answers from the Holy Spirit, which is the only place you can expect to find the RIGHT answers for your life and your situation.

If you are in a church where people are attempting to manipulate you in this way, I would HIGHLY recommend finding another church where they don't do that. There are many good churches out there. Ask the Lord to lead you to where HE wants you to go.

I hope this has helped some.

Love in Christ, :hug: :hug:
Hoot (Jan)

HopeFaithLove
Oct 11th 2007, 10:59 PM
I just want to say, that I'm sorry for the loss of your father. My best friend's father commited suicide too....and it was very hard on her!

I just want to remind you that you are not your father.....you are a child of God and your own, individual being. So, whatever, made your dad struggle....were 'his issues' and don't take that upon yourself.

:hug: and :pray:'s for you!

FaithfulSheep
Oct 11th 2007, 11:08 PM
LOL,...what?
Have you read the initial post?
How does one keep it Biblical!!!

For those just tuning in, this was originally part of another thread in a different part of the forum and then moved here... :)

:hug:

FaithfulSheep
Oct 11th 2007, 11:28 PM
From another thread...


Well, if you don't give the Church enough money, you are not a good enough Christian, if you don't hang out with the preacher and / the elders, you are not good enough.
If you stumble, you are lost and you have to be punished.
if you are sick and stay in bed on a Sunday morning, you are a weak Christian and you don't deserve to be healed because of your lack of faith.
No wonder Christians are confused and fragmented!!!!



well, basically I was sent to hell and back. I'm not worthy of God's love and will never have it.

I don't have long online tonight, but I want you to know that God DOES love you. No matter what we do in this life we will never "be good enough" but you know what... thankfully God loves us anyway. :hug: I cannot imagine the sorrow you are going through but there is nothing that the Lord cannot do. Isaiah 53:4 tells us that He bore our grief and He carried our sorrow. And Psalm 34:18 tells us that the Lord is near the brokenhearted and saves those who are crushed in Spirit.

In closing, remember that is is better to take refuge in the Lord than to trust in man. Psalm 62:1 says My soul finds rest in God alone; salvation comes from Him.

If I can I'll try to get back online later tonight and post more.

judi<>><
Oct 12th 2007, 12:04 AM
Beg pardon, amazzin. I was merely saying that it sounds like this individual has received enough advice that was more a matter of opinion than not, and not bibilically based. Here, I hope she will find counsel that is wise, godly, balanced and above all, biblical.

Honestly, though, I have yet to hear a question from Samantha that I felt I could give an answer... so....

hootinannie
Oct 12th 2007, 12:31 AM
Originally Posted by Samantha http://bibleforums.org/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://bibleforums.org/showthread.php?p=1407835#post1407835)
Well, if you don't give the Church enough money, you are not a good enough Christian, if you don't hang out with the preacher and / the elders, you are not good enough.
If you stumble, you are lost and you have to be punished.
if you are sick and stay in bed on a Sunday morning, you are a weak Christian and you don't deserve to be healed because of your lack of faith.
No wonder Christians are confused and fragmented!!!!

Oh my my, yes. I didn't see this post before. Yes, my dear, you need to get out of that church. That is old-line religiosity and it has nothing to do with true Christianity and Christ-LIKENESS. There is a world of difference between religion and relationship with Jesus. I grew up in that kind of church and it almost destroyed my eternal soul. That's the kind of church I was referring to. You know, when I came back to Jesus, the Lord took me OUT of the churches I had always known and put me in a church in the "Christian Church" denomination. Well, they didn't speak in tongues, and it was the first time I had ever attended a church that didn't. I had always been taught that non-pentecostal people were not even really Christians, and were CERTAINLY not going to heaven. But it was there, in the midst of those 'nominal' (in name only, as I had been taught) Christians that the Holy Spirit healed me. He used the people in that church, with their love and acceptance to heal all the spiritual abuse I had been subjected to all my life. I attend the Nazarene church now, and I love it. They don't speak in tongues either, but they sure do love Jesus, and they sure do have the fruits of the spirit evident in their lives. This is the 2nd Nazarene church I've attended, and both of them have really opened my eyes to see that it's not speaking in tongues that proves you are filled with the Spirit...it's having the fruits of the Spirit evident in all that you do and how you live and relate to others. There are many good churches, like I said before. Baptist churches are usually pretty good too. But I do hope that you will get out of the one you're in before it destroys you.

Praying for you, dear :pray: :pray: :pray: :pray: :pray:
Hoot


Originally Posted by Samantha http://bibleforums.org/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://bibleforums.org/showthread.php?p=1407864#post1407864)
well, basically I was sent to hell and back. I'm not worthy of God's love and will never have it.

NONE of us are worthy of God's love, and we NEVER WILL BE, so forget that criteria....but He loves us anyway, with a love that took Him all the way to the cross....a love that took HIM all the way to hell so that we would not have to go there. My dear, I wish I could just erase from your mind everything that those people have indoctrinated you with, and start at square one to help you rebuild on a solid foundation. God loves you so much that you will never be able to comprehend the depth of His love, and NOTHING you can do or say will ever take His love away from you.

Rom 8:38-9:1
38 For I am persuaded , that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come,
39 Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

KJV

hootinannie
Oct 12th 2007, 02:23 AM
Samantha...

If you will go to the upper left part of your screen, on the blue bar, and click on "User CP", that will take you to the User Control Panel. Then click on "Edit Options" and scroll down to the second section "Messaging and Notification" and click the box that says "Enable Private Messaging".

I'd like to send you a private message, but you don't have it enabled yet.

Thanks,
Hootinannie (Hoot)

ravi4u2
Oct 12th 2007, 02:48 AM
There is video titled 'THE DROPOUTS' (http://lifegathering.bravejournal.com/entry/22426) that I would like to share with you. I pray that you will truly be free from the matrix to a loving relationship with the Father.

ServantofTruth
Oct 12th 2007, 03:16 PM
I can't get the you tube link video to work, but i'll certainly do it on my other 'main' computer later.
To Samantha - i am in the UK and can't be inside the church. My father's been a lay preacher in the church of england/ anglican church since i was a baby. The damage that denomination and every church i have approached in my life have done is too much and varied to post here.
But my advice and 'gift' to you is read the word daily, despite what anyone tells you or advises you to do. When you read, read freely and let the spirit guide you. Each time you see meaning different to those people who taught you wrong - say i was right and the spirit guided me to that conclusion then and now.
The churches i've known, especially anglican ones are taking Jesus's most simple parables, stories and people he spoke to and destroying them. The whole point of the 4 gospels is there SIMPLICITY! Thank you father for hiding this from clever people and revealing it to simple people! Badly put by me, but you probably know the quote i'm refering to.

Don't let churches destroy your faith. I'm met people on sites unable to leave and despite continuously posting how wrong that church was continuing to go and letting those people destroy them. Believe me Satan/ the Devil is using many in churches right up to ministers/ priests, bishops and those in positions nationally. You will know them by their fruits. Those who are part of a religion without showing bible truth.

It is not for me to say which denominations are biblical and i believe all denominations, YES ALL, have many biblical people and teachers. Even the ones many on this site condem.

Join me as one person reading the bible outside of all churches alone. But know as i do i have millions of brothers and sisters world wide who love God and our Lord Jesus. I just can't seem to join in fellowship/ worship with them at the moment! Hope to speak to you soon and regularly Samantha - I'm Paul 39 in East Sussex England.

Sold Out
Oct 12th 2007, 05:31 PM
If it was so easy to just forgive and forget, the world wouldn't have been in the state it's in.
Yes, I put my trust in people "God's people"
People who convinced me that they were sent by God :B

People that gave me messages, "directly from God"

I want out, really I have so many questions, and no answers

:giveup:


The first thing to understand about being a Christian is that you stand alone, even though you might be a part of a local church. I don't trust ANYBODY (including my pastor) because the One that has the last say in my life is God. The way He has the last say in my life is by what He has said in His Word. The bible is my life's manual, and I will spend the rest of my life digging for the many truths contained therein.

By knowing the scriptures, it is harder for you to be deceived. It sounds like you have been deceived.

"My people are destroyed by a lack of knowledge." Hosea 4:6

What you need is some intense bible study and discipleship. No wonder you are discouraged, having been thru what you went thru. Not only did your father take his own life, but to add insult to injury, this church tries to tell you that you may face the same fate? How cruel and mind-controlling.

When it's all said and done, no one can say I gave allegiance to anyone or anything except the One who saved me. I owe no one else and neither do you. This should be your attitude. Try and find a bible-teaching church that preaches the truth of the scriptures, not engaging in sensationalism.

Samantha
Oct 14th 2007, 03:03 PM
so......

did you all enjoy your day, going to church?

did you all get the soppy "this will be a good week for you" ?

did you remember to smile at all the pastors and to dress your best?

did you arrive at least 20 minutes prior to the service?

did you give ENOUGH money to the church today?

did you make sure people saw how much you've put in?

If not.......... then I'm sorry to say that this is going to be one hell of a rough week :cry:

hootinannie
Oct 14th 2007, 06:26 PM
so......

did you all enjoy your day, going to church?

did you all get the soppy "this will be a good week for you" ?

did you remember to smile at all the pastors and to dress your best?

did you arrive at least 20 minutes prior to the service?

did you give ENOUGH money to the church today?

did you make sure people saw how much you've put in?

If not.......... then I'm sorry to say that this is going to be one hell of a rough week :cry:

Samantha....

First of all dear, you have been given a totally skewed picture of Christianity and churches by attending the church you've been attending, and like I said before...they have indoctrinated you falsely. What they represent is not Christianity at all, but legalistic RELIGION, which, as I also said before has absolutely nothing to do with TRUE Christianity. The word CHRISTIAN means LIKE CHRIST...and from what you've said, there is nothing LIKE CHRIST about the church you have been attending. Salvation and relationship with Jesus has nothing to do with how much money you give or who you hang out with, or what you wear or what time you arrive at church, or even if you GO to church. It's all about your heart, and what's in your heart toward Jesus. It's a personal thing...a personal relationship between you and Jesus.

As I also said before, you need to GET OUT of that church immediately and cut off all contact with those who have been abusing you in the name of Christ. If you stay, things will only get worse, and you will eventually turn your back on God altogether because of the false image you have of Him....and from the sound of things, you already have deep, intense resentment and frustration toward God because of what these people have done to you. PLEASE give God a break...don't blame HIM for what these people have done to you. Give Him a chance to show you what He's REALLY like....and you won't find it in that church. Get on your knees before Him and tell Him all about the picture these people have given you, and tell Him that you're sorry you've listened to these religious "liars" and abusers. Tell Him you want to know HIM as He REALLY IS, and ask Him to show you. You can get some TRUTH about Him from listening to some of the people on this forum, who really KNOW Him, and who can give you a TRUE picture of what He is like....but don't depend on people to tell you what He's like....HE wants to reveal HIMSELF to you...but you'll have to go to HIM for that. His Word says repeatedly that He WILL BE FOUND of you WHEN you seek Him WITH ALL YOUR HEART. If you truly want to know God, you will know Him....if you only want to know ABOUT God, then you will be content to take information input from anyone, and will make judgements about God based on what people tell you. But don't get your "picture" of God from people who CLAIM to know Him but whose words and actions and attitudes prove that they DON'T. If you believe these people about what God is like, you are believing lies, because He's not like the picture they paint of Him AT ALL....and His love for you does not depend on what you do or say or how you dress or what time you arrive at church or whether you paste a phony smile on your face and pretend to be "Miss Christianity" or not. He loved you when you were at your worst. He loves you when you are at your best, because even our best is not worthy of Him. Praise God that His love does not depend on our worthiness.

Samantha, you can use the way you've been treated as an excuse to reject God and everything about Him and nobody would "blame" you, and if you've decided that you really don't want to know God after all, it's a convenient "way out". But deep inside you, you know that you need Him. That's why you began to "seek Him out" in the first place. That's what brought you to "church" in the first place. Unfortunately, however it came about that you got to the church you've been attending, you got into the WRONG church. It's time to accept the fact that you've been lied to and God has been completely misrepresented by people who don't know Him personally, and it's time to set about to get to know Him as He really IS. I've BEEN where you are, and I can tell you from personal experience and personal knowledge that what you are believing about God and Christianity is false....untrue. I don't blame you for rejecting the lies....the Spirit of God that is calling you to Himself is the one Who is whispering to your spirit that you DON'T WANT what you've been told thus far because it's WRONG....and He's pleading with you, through His people, to search for the truth about Him, because He LONGS to show you what He's really like.

Give God a chance to show you, Samantha. He's waiting with open arms. He loves you more than you'll ever know, and His love is WITHOUT CONDITION. Just come as you are, faults, warts, blemishes, failures, sins, bitterness, resentment,....come just as you are and let Him show you that His love and His grace and His mercy and relationship with Him do not depend on you, but on what Jesus did FOR YOU.

I'm here whenever you want to talk, either publicly or privately. Like I said, I've travelled the road you're on....and I think many other people at this site also have....it's a pretty good idea, if you want to get somewhere, to talk to people who have been there and who can tell you how to get to where you want to be.

You're in my prayers, dear. In fact, I'm going to be talking to Abba about you quite a bit. I really care, Samantha. I know what it's like where you are, and I didn't like it either. I'm just so grateful that Abba didn't leave me there, but revealed Himself to me when I began to seek Him with all my heart.

Hugs, dear :hug: :hug: :hug: :hug: :hug:
Jan (Hoot)

amazzin
Oct 14th 2007, 09:24 PM
Samantha....You're in my prayers, dear. In fact, I'm going to be talking to Abba about you quite a bit. Jan (Hoot)

Abba? I hope you're not referring to the rock group from then 70's

hootinannie
Oct 14th 2007, 09:49 PM
Abba? I hope you're not referring to the rock group from then 70's

ROFLOL!!!!! :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

No!!!! Abba means "Papa" or "Daddy" and refers to God the Father in scripture. The day that God the Father became "Daddy"..."Papa"...to me, He also said, "Call me Abba". So I have called Him that ever since.

Hoot

amazzin
Oct 14th 2007, 10:26 PM
ROFLOL!!!!! :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

No!!!! Abba means "Papa" or "Daddy" and refers to God the Father in scripture. The day that God the Father became "Daddy"..."Papa"...to me, He also said, "Call me Abba". So I have called Him that ever since.

Hoot

Hmmm,...I can't argue against personal revelation but I'd need to her Him say that to me before I would call Him "Abba"

hootinannie
Oct 15th 2007, 12:54 AM
Hi...I looked at your profile. Are you a minister of the word of God and are not familiar with these verses?

Rom 8:14-16
14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.
15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby WE cry, Abba , Father.
16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God: KJV

Gal 4:4-7
4 But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law,
5 To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of sons.
6 And because ye are sons, God hath sent forth the Spirit of his Son into your hearts, crying, (from within your hearts) Abba , Father.
7 Wherefore thou art no more a servant, but a son; and if a son, then an heir of God through Christ. KJV

__________________________________________________ ______

I posted this on another thread, about understanding God as our Father when our own relationship with our earthly father has been disasterous. Here's what happened.


My experience was of a non-existent father, since he died when I was only 6 and my mom never remarried.

I virtually had NO concept of what a father was or should be. The only perception of fatherhood I had resulted from watching my abusive husband with our son, and that was a DISASTER!!!

In my testimony, I recounted how desolate I felt as an eight year old child, so it is no surprise to me that when Jesus felt the time was right for me to get to know my Heavenly Father, the "vision" (mental movie in this case) He gave me reverted me back to being eight years old.

Here's what happened in the "vision". Jesus and I were walking through a beautiful garden and he took me (still an adult) by the hand and grinned real big and said "Today I have a wonderful surprise for you". I asked what it was and He just took me by the hand and began to lead me through the garden, still grinning, but not answering my question. As we walked further, I then saw myself as an eight year old child, holding His hand as we walked.

Suddenly we came around the end of a well-manicured hedge, and there, seated on a golden bench, was Father God. I was terrified, and I hid behind Jesus, unable to speak. Jesus said, "Don't be afraid. You have nothing to fear. You'll see." And He turned and took me by the shoulders and put me in front of Him. At that point, God the Father stood up and approached me, smiling sweetly and gently. He said something to Jesus, which I didn't catch, and Jesus began to walk away, leaving me alone with Father God. The only concept of Him I'd ever had was of a God who was strict and unbending, judgmental, critical, impossible to please, looking for an opportunity to damn my soul to eternal hell.

But Father God took me by the hand and smiled at me, and began to walk me down another path, and then across a meadow. I couldn't BELIEVE where He took me. He took me to a PLAYGROUND, and there He put me on the swings and swung me. He went down the slide with me and pushed me on the merry-go-round. Then we chased each other all over that playground...He'd let me catch Him, and then we'd fall to the ground and roll over and over in the grass, where He would tickle me and I laughed till I cried, and then, sitting on top of Him, I would tickle Him and HE laughed "till He cried". He swung me around and around until we both staggered and fell from dizziness, and He hugged me and kissed me and told me how much He loved me. Then, when I was almost exhausted from fun, He said to me, "Call me Abba" (which means Papa or Daddy).

That day I lost ALL my terror of Abba and He became my wonderful Papa. The hole in my heart that I felt as a little eight year old girl, sitting in the hot Florida sun, in the black dirt, was gone...healed....the desolation of the memory was even gone.

I am very secure in His love for me now. Although I never knew what it was like to have a Father, I do now, because He is constantly nearby and I am aware of His presence. He "implanted" in my heart something that I can't explain, but would never want to be without again. And there is a wonderful Father-daughter relationship there that I never could have known without Him.

In Him
Hoot

amazzin
Oct 15th 2007, 01:01 AM
Hi...I looked at your profile. Are you a minister of the word of God and are not familiar with these verses?

Rom 8:14-16
14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.
15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby WE cry, Abba , Father.
16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God: KJV

Gal 4:4-7
4 But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law,
5 To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of sons.
6 And because ye are sons, God hath sent forth the Spirit of his Son into your hearts, crying, (from within your hearts) Abba , Father.
7 Wherefore thou art no more a servant, but a son; and if a son, then an heir of God through Christ. KJV

__________________________________________________ ______

I posted this on another thread, about understanding God as our Father when our own relationship with our earthly father has been disasterous. Here's what happened.



In Him
Hoot

Oh I know those verses very well. I just can't find MYSELF to come to a palce where I refer to my heavenly Father as "Abba". As I said to you in my previous post, I don't yet have that encounter where He tells me to call him anything else but Father.

amazzin
Oct 15th 2007, 01:02 AM
P.S.

Maybe we should stay on topic. Sorry for leading this thread astray!

hootinannie
Oct 15th 2007, 01:13 AM
Oh I know those verses very well. I just can't find MYSELF to come to a palce where I refer to my heavenly Father as "Abba". As I said to you in my previous post, I don't yet have that encounter where He tells me to call him anything else but Father.

Oh. I'm sorry. I misunderstood you. Please forgive me.

Hoot

Diggindeeper
Oct 15th 2007, 03:24 AM
My goodness, Samatha. You HAVE been through a lot!

Let me explain something, Darlin'...I honestly don't put much confidence in those "personal prophets". I have seen the REAL move of God, and I mean REAL! But, I have lived longer than many on this board, and let me tell you, I have seen a lot of what I call "craziness" enter the church, too! For example, I have seen people who called themselves "prophets" actually follow people into the restrooms, to give them a "word" from outside the stall door! Seen them even chase people down in the church parking lot, to give them "a word from the Lord." (Mean old me...I've given them the name "Parking Lot Prophets"! :rolleyes: This kind was not even around in the "REAL" I referred to earlier, Samantha....)

But, you can ask, "How can we argue with someone saying, "Thus sayeth the Lord..."??
But I did, once.

A woman started coming to the church I went to and she called herself a "prophetess." Was all the time going up to people to "prophesy" to them, and give them a word from the Lord, like she was some great one who had a private pipeline to the Almighty! Saw a lot of demons in folks, too, she claimed. But to me and my husband, our caution light had turned on. (Figure of speech...) We had discussed together, in private, that something just was not right with this woman. But what?

We said that she seemed to be trying "to make a name for herself." This can be a sign from the Lord to use caution when believing someone. After all, that happened at the tower of Babel!

Genesis 11:4
4 And they said, Go to, let us build us a city and a tower, whose top may reach unto heaven; and let us make us a name, lest we be scattered abroad upon the face of the whole earth.

Also, we were remembering that JEZEBEL "called herself a prophetess."!

This is in Revelation 2:20
20 Notwithstanding I have a few things against thee, because thou sufferest that woman Jezebel, which calleth herself a prophetess, to teach and to seduce my servants to commit fornication, and to eat things sacrificed unto idols.

Anyway, my husband and I were just simply very leery of that woman.

Then, one day she showed up at our house, knocking on my door. You see, she had taken notice of one of my sons who was a teenager in High School and a very strong, outspoken witness for his Lord. He had been instrumental in starting a Christian Club at the school and it was growing, and people coming to the Lord...in spite of the druggies who spit in his face, and those who he thought were "friends" who took their lunch trays and left him alone at the lunch table when he would sit down with them. (This hurt me bad, Samatha, when he'd tell me about these things.)

And here she was at my door one Saturday! Wanting "to speak to Bobby." SoI called him to the living room. Then, this woman who called herself a prophetess said to him, "I have a word from the Lord for you. But we need to go to the basement, or somewhere private."

Well Sweetie, the Mom suddenly and furiously rose up in me! I was in my Momma bird protective mode so fast it made my head spin! I said, "My son is not going ANYWHERE alone with you or anyone else to hear a word from the Lord! In this family, we don't have secrets. So, whatever you have to say to him, say it here. Right here! While he and I are both standing here, to hear what you have to say."

Well, her face turned red with rage, and then purple...and daggers came out of her eyes looking at me, and honest...I think she could have killed me, if God had allowed it! She was M A D, and I mean capital letter MAD!
She left without ever giving him her "word." (My son said he was proud of me, and we did laugh about it later as he told his Dad what had happened. He said he was about to tell her the same thing, but that I had spoken up first.) :rofl:

But I've told you all this to let you know that just because someone says "Thus sayeth the Lord", we need to have our gift of discernment working to be able to discern good from evil, and to discern whether or not what they say is in line with scripture! Discernment is the ONLY gift that we must "exercise" to be able to Biblically discern. Please consider this:

Hebrews 5:14
14 But strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age, even those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.

We MUST use this gift, along with the Word of God, and we become able to discern the true from the false, or from the pretenders or the wantabees...like wantabe prophets or wantabees who see a demon behind every bush...or in every person.

Because yes, they walk among us!

Sweetie, I am really praying for you! I don't believe God is through with you. After all, he LED you here, to share this with us! Like I have said earlier, I have seen the real, but I have also seen that which is not real! I don't knoiw the details of your Dad's suicide, but I honestly believe the Holy Spirit within you is gently calling you to leave that church, and to find another one, and to come back to the Father! I believe that with all my heart!


And I don't discern a demon in you either! Please consider all that has been said to you since you posted here. You've been given good advice.

Judy

Sold Out
Oct 15th 2007, 05:33 PM
[quote=Samantha;1410226]so......

did you all enjoy your day, going to church?


Loved it...got to partake of the Lord's Supper and wipe my slate clean!


did you all get the soppy "this will be a good week for you" ?

No...our pastor doesn't 'fluff' the church.


did you remember to smile at all the pastors and to dress your best?

I did smile, but out of graciousness & respect, not obligation. And, I dressed in what I would wear any other day of the week.



did you arrive at least 20 minutes prior to the service?

Nope....actually a few min late to Sunday School


did you give ENOUGH money to the church today?

I gave what God requires.....


did you make sure people saw how much you've put in?

Absolutely not.....it's nobody's business except me & God's

Steve M
Oct 15th 2007, 07:29 PM
so......

did you all enjoy your day, going to church?


I had to endure a business meeting where we had to talk about a difficult situation. I had to listen to a sermon about something that doesn't apply to me at all... but as I picked the sermon subject, you can bet I thought somebody needed to hear it...



did you all get the soppy "this will be a good week for you" ?


Actually, it was suggested to me that this will be a bad week for me.



did you remember to smile at all the pastors and to dress your best?


I frowned and smiled at the preacher, while alternately praising and chastising him. I was dressed moderately well.



did you arrive at least 20 minutes prior to the service?


I strolled in on time, and led the singing since the song leader was running late. (the cad!)



did you give ENOUGH money to the church today?


No.



did you make sure people saw how much you've put in?


Well, no, but two of them saw it anyway. Oh, well. Better luck next time making sure nobody saw it.

So I've come to the end of your list, and scored a zero out of however many.



If not.......... then I'm sorry to say that this is going to be one hell of a rough week :cry:


Actually, I'm looking forward to a pretty good week this week. However, your post brought out a few things... let me go back through your list, and the way I think you meant the questions, and the way I differ.


so......

did you all enjoy your day, going to church?


Your question assumes going to church ought to be fun and uplifting. However, sometimes Sunday is nothing but hard work for me, because my mission is to make it edifying and uplifting for other people.



did you all get the soppy "this will be a good week for you" ?


You assume the preacher will give you an insincere line intended to generally make people feel good.

Hm...


did you remember to smile at all the pastors and to dress your best?


Is it important how I look or act? Or what I believe? My preacher is more concerned with my soul than my shirt.



did you arrive at least 20 minutes prior to the service?





did you give ENOUGH money to the church today?


Money really isn't the most important thing about my walk with God... but some christians would like to make it so. Some people are awfully concerned about it. ...don't listen to them. Giving should come from love and a cheerful spirit. Not obligation.


did you make sure people saw how much you've put in?



I hope that was helpful in some way to you.

threebigrocks
Oct 15th 2007, 07:30 PM
Samantha, if you don't mind asking, how long have you been walking with the Lord? A generalized answer will suffice. :)

Samantha
Oct 16th 2007, 06:26 PM
Samantha, if you don't mind asking, how long have you been walking with the Lord? A generalized answer will suffice. :)


I have been a Christian for as long as I can remember. Between 1995 and 2002, I really had a relationship with God. Now, there is nothing.

hootinannie
Oct 16th 2007, 06:33 PM
Samantha...

When did you start attending that church?

Samantha
Oct 16th 2007, 06:41 PM
Samantha...

When did you start attending that church?

I started attending in 2000

Sold Out
Oct 16th 2007, 06:54 PM
I started attending in 2000

It's ok to shake your fists at all this....it's ok to be mad and disenchanted. It will cause you to break free of all the false teaching and hypocrisy. It's like coming out of a cocoon.

Get back to the basics. Immerse yourself in study of the bible and see what GOD has to say, not what everybody else has to say. This is how I found freedom in my Christianity...I learned to think on my own. I have a pastor that has pushed me and pushed me to think for myself. I have learned from my own personal bible study, bible studies that I've held in my home for 6 yrs, and internet resources like this.

Now I've finally gotten to the point where I put zero faith in people and all my faith in Christ.

hootinannie
Oct 16th 2007, 06:57 PM
In other words, you had a relationship with Jesus before you started attending that church, and now you don't. Do you not see the connection, dear? I know my posts are long, but have you read them? The people in that church have gotten you so confused and frustrated and have gotten your focus so much on what you "should" and "should'nt" be doing according to what THEY believe, and have made themselves the authority on your life and your religion, that you have lost sight of the precious, tender, sweet, gentle, loving, accepting and forgiving relationship that you once HAD with Jesus and you have begun to believe that your salvation depends on what YOU do or do not do and whether or not THEY think it's right.

In Revelation, Jesus said to the church at Ephesus....."you have left your first love....repent and DO THE THINGS YOU DID AT FIRST." In other words, stop what you're doing and go back to doing the things you were doing when you were "in love with Jesus" and He will meet you there again, and you will regain your first love relationship with Him.

I'm praying for you, dear one.
Hugs,
Jan (Hoot)

Samantha
Oct 16th 2007, 06:58 PM
It's ok to shake your fists at all this....it's ok to be mad and disenchanted. It will cause you to break free of all the false teaching and hypocrisy. It's like coming out of a cocoon.

Get back to the basics. Immerse yourself in study of the bible and see what GOD has to say, not what everybody else has to say. This is how I found freedom in my Christianity...I learned to think on my own. I have a pastor that has pushed me and pushed me to think for myself. I have learned from my own personal bible study, bible studies that I've held in my home for 6 yrs, and internet resources like this.

Now I've finally gotten to the point where I put zero faith in people and all my faith in Christ.

I can't hear God's voice anymore. Don't think He wants to speak with me. I have pleaded, I have prayed, I have cried...

hootinannie
Oct 16th 2007, 07:05 PM
It's ok to shake your fists at all this....it's ok to be mad and disenchanted. It will cause you to break free of all the false teaching and hypocrisy. It's like coming out of a cocoon.

Get back to the basics. Immerse yourself in study of the bible and see what GOD has to say, not what everybody else has to say. This is how I found freedom in my Christianity...I learned to think on my own. I have a pastor that has pushed me and pushed me to think for myself. I have learned from my own personal bible study, bible studies that I've held in my home for 6 yrs, and internet resources like this.

Heheheheh...get back to basics....get back to your first love. We were each writing this at the same time.

And yes, Samantha, it IS ok to be mad about all this. You SHOULD be mad at all this, because it's WRONG, WRONG, WRONG. You have every right to be mad at all this. But don't be mad at God...be mad at the devil for using these people who have led you away from the relationship you had with God, and get away from them as fast as you can. Some of satan's best tools are religious people.

Hoot

Samantha
Oct 16th 2007, 07:10 PM
why did God take my dad away?

hootinannie
Oct 16th 2007, 07:18 PM
I can't hear God's voice anymore. Don't think He wants to speak with me. I have pleaded, I have prayed, I have cried...

Samantha, honey, God has not left you and never will. God is NOT mad at you...He loves you with unconditional love. You are in a place where you can't hear Him right now because you've been listening to lying voices. He hears every single word you say and every single thought you think. He not only SEES every tear, but His word says He saves them all in a bottle...they are precious to Him because YOU are precious to Him. When confusion is all around you, first get out of the confusion and get your heart still and quiet before Him.

It is the enemy who is telling you that God doesn't hear you and doesn't want to speak to you. He is a liar and the father of all lies. Don't listen to him. Listen to what God says...."I have loved you with an everlasting love"...."nothing can separate from the love of God which is in Christ Jesus." Begin to go back to the Word of God...let His WORD speak to you about His love. Believe HIS Word, not satan's.

He loves you, Samantha, and so do I. I really care...maybe especially more so since I've been where you are and I know what you are going through.

Hugs,
Hoot

hootinannie
Oct 16th 2007, 07:26 PM
Honey, God did not take your dad away. Your dad took your dad away. Whenever we take matters into our own hands to determine for ourselves what our life will be like, we sin, and the end result of sin is death. For whatever reasons your dad may have had for being in such despair and hopelessness (I know what that's like...I was suicidal nearly all my life), in the end, rather than trusting God to change his life, he took matters into his own hands in the most extreme and final way. Unfortunately, what he did was irreversible.

My dad died when I was six. I used to ask God why He took my dad too, but one day I came to the realization that if my dad had not died when he did, I would not be where I am today....and I would not trade where I am today for all the universes that exist. I know it's hard now...it's hard to be without a father...but if you will let Him, God will be your Father. Your dad was only the man whom God intended to care for you and your needs while you are here on earth. He was never intended to be your true Father. Only God is your true Father, and if you will let Him, He will make Himself very real to you in that role.

Hugs,
Jan

rchivers
Oct 16th 2007, 07:27 PM
why did God take my dad away?

I dont think God would ever cause someone to kill themselves.

Suicide is a very selfish action but sometimes it seems like the only way to end the suffering that people think they can never get over.

As a depressed person I can honestly say I have thought about it, but then I think about how it would effect those around me and I realize that I could never do that to them. The thing with your situtation is though that you were not old enough for your dad to have developed a relationship with you compared to if you had been a few years old or something, so I truely think that he did not realize what long term effects his actions would have on you. He probably thought you would be better off without him and this would definently NOT be a thought from God.

I dont think your ever going to know why your dad did it. You might be able to find out why he thought that was the only way and that might give you some closure though.

Samantha
Oct 16th 2007, 07:29 PM
Honey, God did not take your dad away. Your dad took your dad away. Whenever we take matters into our own hands to determine for ourselves what our life will be like, we sin, and the end result of sin is death. For whatever reasons your dad may have had for being in such despair and hopelessness (I know what that's like...I was suicidal nearly all my life), in the end, rather than trusting God to change his life, he took matters into his own hands in the most extreme and final way. Unfortunately, what he did was irreversible.

My dad died when I was six. I used to ask God why He took my dad too, but one day I came to the realization that if my dad had not died when he did, I would not be where I am today....and I would not trade where I am today for all the universes that exist. I know it's hard now...it's hard to be without a father...but if you will let Him, God will be your Father. Your dad was only the man whom God intended to care for you and your needs while you are here on earth. He was never intended to be your true Father. Only God is your true Father, and if you will let Him, He will make Himself very real to you in that role.

Hugs,
Jan

but God could have stopped him. He could have prevented all this.

Samantha
Oct 16th 2007, 07:34 PM
I dont think God would ever cause someone to kill themselves.

Suicide is a very selfish action but sometimes it seems like the only way to end the suffering that people think they can never get over.

As a depressed person I can honestly say I have thought about it, but then I think about how it would effect those around me and I realize that I could never do that to them. The thing with your situtation is though that you were not old enough for your dad to have developed a relationship with you compared to if you had been a few years old or something, so I truely think that he did not realize what long term effects his actions would have on you. He probably thought you would be better off without him and this would definently NOT be a thought from God.

I dont think your ever going to know why your dad did it. You might be able to find out why he thought that was the only way and that might give you some closure though.


I'm sorry, I didn't read your first post properly. I wasn't 7 months old, it happened 7 months ago

rchivers
Oct 16th 2007, 07:42 PM
I'm sorry, I didn't read your first post properly. I wasn't 7 months old, it happened 7 months ago

Oh ok, well that kinda makes part of my post a mute point.....

Still I can imagine what must be going through your head when you think about it.

I would probably feel a little bit betrayed and that would be hard to get over. Sometimes its easier to blame God than the people we love who cause us hurt.

A lot of times there is a mind altering substance in play when someone does it (alcohol). Was that the case here? If so, once your past a certain point, you are not thinking clearly and anything can happen.

Samantha
Oct 16th 2007, 08:02 PM
yes, maybe people blame God because He has the power to stop it. and my dad thought about the people he left behind. he wrote me a letter.
he just couldn't go on. sometimes I also feel like that

rchivers
Oct 16th 2007, 08:17 PM
yes, maybe people blame God because He has the power to stop it. and my dad thought about the people he left behind. he wrote me a letter.
he just couldn't go on. sometimes I also feel like that

It is still a pretty fresh event so I'm sure you are still going through the classic stages of the grief process.

As far as feeling like you cant go on.... I think we all feel that way from time to time. Therapy can help a lot. Also strengthening your faith will help immensely.

In my case, I feel better when I do go to church and get something out of the message and I also go to therapy weekly and take medication.

One of the biggest things that helped turn my thinking around was having children. Suddenly everything becomes about them and you no longer focus on your life and how miserable you may be feeling.

So between faith, drugs, therapy and having children I would say you do have some options... :)

Samantha
Oct 16th 2007, 08:20 PM
I have been for therapy and I am still on medication

hootinannie
Oct 16th 2007, 08:25 PM
but God could have stopped him. He could have prevented all this.

Yes, God has the power to stop ALL the evil that goes on in the world today, but if He did, He would be taking away from man his free will. It hurts God beyond comprehension when His creations choose to use their free will against Him, and in ways that hurt other people, but He won't take from us our free will. What would you think, how would you feel, if someone continually tried to FORCE you to love them? Love isn't love if it's coerced...it has to be freely given. So God, as much as He DESIRES your love, will not force you to love Him.

There is a law in operation in this world that is far more certain than the law of gravity, or the laws of physics, and it operates equally on every one alike. It does not matter whether you are young or old, rich or poor, tall or short, fat or thin, famous or unknown....and that law is that if we walk in God's ways and love, trust and obey Him, great blessings will be poured out on us...not just material blessings, but spiritual blessings as well. And if we don't walk in His ways, and we don't love Him, trust Him and obey Him, the results will be bad...read the first 8 chapters or so of Deuteronomy. Although we no longer are bound to obey the old testament law, the law BEHIND the law is still in effect. Walking in God's ways has its sure and certain results, and NOT walking in God's ways has ITS sure and certain results. We get to choose what results we will have by choosing whose ways we will walk in. The horrible things that happen in this world happen because men will not walk in God's ways...it's a natural result of this law that is in operation. Unfortunately, many times the results of sin by one person have far-reaching effects that affect the lives of others. Without Christ, we would all be totally hopelessly lost. But when we have turned to Him to save us, He does not promise us that bad things will never happen to us, because we are still within the sphere of influence of people who do bad things, and sometimes what they do comes down on us and hurts us....damages us. But while God did not promise that bad things will not happen to us, He DID promise that if we love Him and walk in His ways and trust Him, that He will make "all things work together for our good". He will take those things that satan intends to destroy us, and God will turn them around and make good come out of them. Who knows? Maybe someday your testimony of what you have been through will bring hope and comfort to millions of people whose lives have been devastated by the suicide of a loved one.

If you will trust Him now, even though you don't understand....if you will trust His eternal wisdom and understanding and His eternal love for you now, in this, one of the hardest things you'll ever face, He WILL bring you through it and He will comfort you, and He will strengthen you. Cling to Him now, in this dark night of your soul, and in time, the morning will break, and the sun will shine again and you will once again know joy. You are grieving right now, and you need to do that....you need to go THROUGH the grief. If you try to avoid the grief, you only delay its resolution and drag it out that much longer. But in all of this, you need to be surrounded by people who love you and who care about you, not by people who tell you your dad was demon possessed and you might be too. You are already confused enough by what has happened without letting voices of confusion make matters worse.

Samantha, if you don't mind, I would like to put you on our church prayer list. The people in our church really know how to reach the ears and the heart of God with their prayers, and I have seen God literally do miracle after miracle after miracle in answer to their prayers. I think it might help too, in the darkest moments to know that over 500 people are praying for you and holding you up before the Father's throne. I'd like to suggest that others on this board also have their churches pray for you. Sometimes when we don't have the strength to do our own battles, it helps to have others come along side of you and battle for you. Would that be ok with you?

Hugs a bunch,
Hoot

Samantha
Oct 16th 2007, 08:34 PM
I suppose it's fine. I don't really care right now.
I'm sorry if my answer offend you :cry:
I really do appreciate everything, I don't know how to explain it

Sold Out
Oct 16th 2007, 08:46 PM
I suppose it's fine. I don't really care right now.
I'm sorry if my answer offend you :cry:
I really do appreciate everything, I don't know how to explain it

Just let it out....we are here to just listen if that's all you need right now.

hootinannie
Oct 16th 2007, 08:47 PM
I suppose it's fine. I don't really care right now.
I'm sorry if my answer offend you :cry:
I really do appreciate everything, I don't know how to explain it

Oh Samantha honey, I wish I could just put my arms around you and give you a big hug. I can feel your pain so much. And no, your answer doesn't offend me. I know what you're feeling, and you don't have to explain anything. I can also feel God's love for you right now, even though you can't. He loves you so much. He is weeping right now, over you, because He so wants to touch you and heal your pain....and He will heal you. It's going to take a little time, because you've been wounded so deeply, but He WILL heal you. His arms are open wide to you, Samantha. If you can, just go crawl up in His lap and cry. Don't try to pray, don't try to make sense of anything at all. Just go crawl up in His lap and cry. He will understand what your HEART is saying....He knows the language of the heart. I wish I could be there right now, but I can't, and He is, and He's better than me a million times over anyway.

Hugs,
Jan

threebigrocks
Oct 17th 2007, 03:04 AM
Samantha, how could you have had the passionate faith you have known and known in your heart with all you are if it were forced on you by God? You chose God by your own decision.

Same reason your father also had a choice, Samantha. God doesn't force a choice for Him on anyone. Even those who hear and know the calling of God can choose to say no to Him. Many will live their lives fully and not choose God. It doesn't mean that God never tried to make Himself known to them. A real relationship is not a forced relationship.

I'm so sorry for the pain you feel in loosing your father. Please, don't be angry at God, but know that every prayer you said for your father was heard by God. God hears the prayers of those who love Him, even if we don't "feel" Him as we wish we could. Some day, we will.

Diggindeeper
Oct 17th 2007, 06:24 AM
yes, maybe people blame God because He has the power to stop it. and my dad thought about the people he left behind. he wrote me a letter.
he just couldn't go on. sometimes I also feel like that

Samatha, had your dad been ill? Or just in deep, deep depression?

I, too, am so sorry you lost your Dad. I thought I was going to cry forever when my Dad died. But he did not take his own life, it was cut short by liver cancer. It was such a fast growing cancer that he was only sick for a couple of weeks before he was hospitalized and they found the cancer. Extremely fast growing, and in fact, it was only days after his diagnosis that he lapsed into a coma, and the cancer made holes in his liver.

It hurt us so bad that he could not have tube feedings. But they did give him IV's with nurishment and liquid till his death. Dad was a Christian.

But you see, Sweetie, I guess I could say that God could have stopped the cancer, too. But, as long as we must live in our body of flesh, things will happen that we have no control over.

I am happy for you that your Dad wrote you that note. That must be a very special piece of paper for you! It sure would for me, if my Dad had been able to write us a note. Your Dad must have really loved you, to write you. I tend to think he didn't want you to hurt because of his actions, when he was gone. But we can't help hurting, can we?

But Oh my, God is so very merciful. Somehow I just think that he KNOWS what people go through, and takes all of that into consideration.

Was your Dad a Christian?

Samantha
Oct 17th 2007, 12:08 PM
no, he wasn't ill.

I suppose he was a christian. not that it would have helped him. according to people he has gone straight to hell because he committed the "unforgiveable sin"

Sold Out
Oct 17th 2007, 01:11 PM
no, he wasn't ill.

I suppose he was a christian. not that it would have helped him. according to people he has gone straight to hell because he committed the "unforgiveable sin"

This is not true. The only unforgiveable sin is blasphemy of the Holy Spirit, which is to reject the Holy Spirits call for salvation. (luke 12)

When we accept Christ and trust in what He did at Calvary to save us from our sins...that means ALL of our sins...past, present, future. All of our sins were future sins when Jesus died on the cross 2000 yrs ago. So if your dad accepted Christ at some point in his life, all of his sins were cared for, even the sin of suicide. The eternal penalty for all of our sins was cared for on the cross. That means if he was a Christian when he took his life, he is in heaven.

Samantha
Oct 17th 2007, 07:55 PM
it sure helps to know that!

HopeFaithLove
Oct 17th 2007, 08:11 PM
Samantha, honey, God has not left you and never will. God is NOT mad at you...He loves you with unconditional love. You are in a place where you can't hear Him right now because you've been listening to lying voices. He hears every single word you say and every single thought you think. He not only SEES every tear, but His word says He saves them all in a bottle...they are precious to Him because YOU are precious to Him. When confusion is all around you, first get out of the confusion and get your heart still and quiet before Him.

It is the enemy who is telling you that God doesn't hear you and doesn't want to speak to you. He is a liar and the father of all lies. Don't listen to him. Listen to what God says...."I have loved you with an everlasting love"...."nothing can separate from the love of God which is in Christ Jesus." Begin to go back to the Word of God...let His WORD speak to you about His love. Believe HIS Word, not satan's.


ooooo, good words, good words!! If I could use my rep & I knew how, I would rep you!!! ;)

HopeFaithLove
Oct 17th 2007, 08:14 PM
Honey, God did not take your dad away. Your dad took your dad away. Whenever we take matters into our own hands to determine for ourselves what our life will be like, we sin, and the end result of sin is death. For whatever reasons your dad may have had for being in such despair and hopelessness, in the end, rather than trusting God to change his life, he took matters into his own hands in the most extreme and final way. Unfortunately, what he did was irreversible.


:amen: I just wanted to highlight more good thoughts!

HopeFaithLove
Oct 17th 2007, 08:16 PM
Yes, God has the power to stop ALL the evil that goes on in the world today, but if He did, He would be taking away from man his free will. It hurts God beyond comprehension when His creations choose to use their free will against Him, and in ways that hurt other people, but He won't take from us our free will. What would you think, how would you feel, if someone continually tried to FORCE you to love them? Love isn't love if it's coerced...it has to be freely given. So God, as much as He DESIRES your love, will not force you to love Him.

If you will trust Him now, even though you don't understand....if you will trust His eternal wisdom and understanding and His eternal love for you now, in this, one of the hardest things you'll ever face, He WILL bring you through it and He will comfort you, and He will strengthen you. Cling to Him now, in this dark night of your soul, and in time, the morning will break, and the sun will shine again and you will once again know joy. You are grieving right now, and you need to do that....you need to go THROUGH the grief. If you try to avoid the grief, you only delay its resolution and drag it out that much longer. But in all of this, you need to be surrounded by people who love you and who care about you, not by people who tell you your dad was demon possessed and you might be too. You are already confused enough by what has happened without letting voices of confusion make matters worse.


And another highlight of words of wisdom! ;)

HopeFaithLove
Oct 17th 2007, 08:19 PM
That means if he was a Christian when he took his life, he is in heaven.

Sorry, I'm 'highlighting' everything......but there are VERY WISE words in these posts!!!! :thumbsup:

Samantha
Oct 17th 2007, 08:19 PM
sometimes I just wish that I could turn back time

hootinannie
Oct 18th 2007, 01:24 AM
sometimes I just wish that I could turn back time

Of course you do, dear....we all do about one thing or another. In situations like yours, there are so many things that you can think of that you wish you could have said to him...you didn't even get to "say goodbye". There are so many regrets, things you said or did that now you wish you hadn't, things that you never got a chance to say or do. I feel so deeply for you, Samantha. I know you must sometimes feel very angry at your dad, and then you feel guilty for feeling that way. There's no closure at this point. So many things are "up in the air", so many things left unfinished. Only the Lord is going to be able to heal these deep wounds, and it's going to take time. But please know that many people are praying for you and care. I care very much. It might help to know that when we are too weak to hold onto Jesus, He holds onto us.

Much love,
Jan

Diggindeeper
Oct 18th 2007, 03:43 AM
I'm still praying for you, too, Samatha. Wish I could do more, but I can't. I do know it hurts so bad to lose someone we love.

Your whole family must be hurting from the loss of your Dad. So, I am praying for all who loved him and miss him. :pray:

Lyndie
Oct 18th 2007, 06:30 PM
Samantha, everyone here has already said what I was going to, so please know I am praying for you! One suggestion that was made to me after my dad died was to write him a letter. It helps us get our pain out in a way. I did that for my dad, it wasn't all nice, believe me, but it helped a great deal. :hug::hug::hug: to you!

Saved7
Oct 18th 2007, 07:44 PM
I suppose it's fine. I don't really care right now.
I'm sorry if my answer offend you :cry:
I really do appreciate everything, I don't know how to explain it


:hug::hug::hug::hug::hug:
I read all of your posts here, and honey, my heart aches for you.
You seem to be in such a state of confusion and anger and hurt that you just can't make heads or tales of your emotions right now.
But you were wise enough to turn to a group of christians to help you. And honey I have seen lots of christians and christian forums, and the best and wisest group is in here, that's why I stay here. Go ahead and run through all of your emotions and confusion, be honest with God about it, and know that He already knows what you are feeling, and has sent comfort to you, by sending you here.
God will help you through this time, just don't make any decisions about God right now, in this condition, our emotions tend to over run us and make us do things we wouldn't normally do. I'm so sorry you are hurting so bad.:hug::hug:

Have you taken the time to read over Hoot's posts??? She has some good insight there for you. The church you attended that gave you such a negative perspective on faith, taught you some very bad things, that have nothing to do with love, the love of God, shed on the cross in Christ.

AliveinChristDave
Oct 18th 2007, 08:45 PM
Samantha, everyone here has already said what I was going to, so please know I am praying for you! One suggestion that was made to me after my dad died was to write him a letter. It helps us get our pain out in a way. I did that for my dad, it wasn't all nice, believe me, but it helped a great deal. :hug::hug::hug: to you!

I don't normally read in this corner of the forum but happened to read this today.
I'd like to second the advice Lindie gave about writing the letter.
There's something about putting your feelings into letters and sentences that seems to cleanse the soul.
Take it a step further and write yourself a letter from your Dad too. Say what you need him to say in that letter. Visualize him as the loving, protecting, wise father you needed him to be and express that to yourself in the letter.
I had a situation I harbored about my Dad for years-even until after his death--that I just couldn't get past. Nothing vile, just what I considered mistreatment.
I performed the exercise of reliving that instance in letters and for the first time in my life I was able to forgive my Father (although at the time I'm sure he was doing what he considered to be the right thing to do) and change what had been a bad thing into something good for me.
I hope that makes sense.
In Christ,
Dave

Samantha
Oct 18th 2007, 08:56 PM
thank you Dave, appreciated

Saved7
Oct 18th 2007, 09:13 PM
Thank you so much to EVERYONE for your kind words and advise. I try to follow the advise, sometimes I manage but other times the "easy way out" just looks so much better and easier. Sometimes I just wish that I could go where my dad is. It might sound stupid but sometimes while I'm driving, I imagine myself driving off a bridge. I actually see the whole scenario play off in my mind. and sometimes I am so tempted to just go ahead and do it.

Don't you see the "easy way out" is not so easy for those left behind???? Look how your dad's actions are hurting you. :hug: It's actually quite selfish. Believe me you can and will get past this. There's a saying, it may even be biblical, it goes..."this too shall pass".:saint:
We all have bad seasons in our lives honey, you just gotta tie a knot and hang on until you get past this. I've been down the suicide road too, and I thank God every day that I didn't do it, I thank God that when I asked God to intervene and prove to me what I needed to know in order to avoid such an awful thing, in His goodness and mercy and grace, He did just that.

Samantha
Oct 19th 2007, 09:19 PM
you are right

:rolleyes:

Diggindeeper
Oct 20th 2007, 04:29 AM
Samatha, I feel like someday the Lord is going to use you to help other people who are hurting after losing a loved one. Perhaps even someone whose loved one took their own life.

You KNOW how bad it hurts the ones left here, and who better to offer comfort than one who can say, "I remember when I felt exactly the way you are feeling now?"

We don't ever get over missing them, and wishing they were still with us, but with time, God does ease our pain. Its just like when we get cut, perhaps even under the knife of a surgeon...but with time, our body heals and we don't hurt any more. Well, Darlin', its the same way with our emotional pains and even with our heartaches!

Time...what a wonderful gift from God!

Just give yourself time. And keep attentive to the needs of others who are hurting, like you are. Some day...SOME DAY...you will be the very one who will be able to help them. Just wait and see. (I really believe that.)

Judy

Sold Out
Oct 22nd 2007, 06:19 PM
Samatha, I feel like someday the Lord is going to use you to help other people who are hurting after losing a loved one. Perhaps even someone whose loved one took their own life.



That's it! God can take something bad and bring something good out of it.

Samantha
Oct 22nd 2007, 08:45 PM
I am sure He can, if He wants too