PDA

View Full Version : Where are demons from



BRIAN~11
Dec 3rd 2003, 12:11 PM
I have these tapes of Binny Hinn called War in the Heavenlies. I haven't listened to the whole thing but, He claims through scripture that the Earth is millions of years old. He tells the scripture and shows how he comes to the conclusion. He says demons are beings of this world before us. They followed lucifer and were destroyed w/the world and the world laid dormant for years and years. Satan was cast down after that in the garden because he wanted to be GOD. This however throws me off because of things we see at Glenrose where they have proof man walked with Dinosaures and how the bible in the book of Job describes them.

Alot of people say demons are angels...Well angels have bodies and they dont get tired...The bible talks about demons seeking a house and get tired. So I know their not Angels.

I would like to know what other people think about this. It truly confuses me. Binny Hinn has alot of scripture to back up his thoughts. He talks about why scientist have a problem w/ christians...Scientist say the world is millions of years old...Binny agrees w/them. Others like at Glenrose say 6k.... I dunno but I'm gonna pray for the truth!

Nicholo
Dec 3rd 2003, 02:30 PM
Welcome Brian. I would encourage you to think critically about such things. I snipped out a section of your post as an example of what I mean.

- Why do you think angels have bodies (you imply physical)?
- Wouldn't the confluence of bodies and fatigue lead to assumptions opposite of yours? (I.e., beings with bodies don't get tired; beings without bodies do get tired).
- Are you talking about physical fatigue and physical bodies?
- When is a figurative interpretation appropriate? Certainly it is appropriate at times within the Bible (e.g., Revelation, Ecclesiastes)?
- Even if your assumptions are correct (and again, I stress that this would just be by chance), why would these assumptions lead you to so firmly believe that demons are/were not angels? Mightn't some angels get tired while others do not? To me this is a silly question, but for one who believes as you seem to, it is a rational issue that should be addressed before adopting a firm belief.
- The past tense brings up another point -- did the angels that became demons change somehow that would make their characteristics currently different from angels?

Please understand that I am not trying to denigrate your beliefs. I think it is important to think critically about one's beliefs.

Ta-An
Dec 3rd 2003, 02:39 PM
Demons are spiritual beings..... of the Darkness, they used to be Angels, but followed Satan !!!
Physical bodies.... only when they pocess a human being.... manifest in a human being.... what I am saying is, they do not have a physical form, but wehn they pocess a human being... that will be their outer bodily form,,,, (I am not sure I make myself understandable)

Angels do not have a physical form, unless G_d allows them to appear in such a form,,,, they are spirit beings.
The spirit realm is 'unseen' by the physical human eye :)

ViolaSnapdragon
Dec 3rd 2003, 03:01 PM
That's what my mom always taught me, exactly.

Ta-An
Dec 3rd 2003, 03:25 PM
Wisdom comes with age, and seeing that you are as old as my son.... :kiss:

moonglow
Dec 3rd 2003, 04:10 PM
Uh? Well this is the strangest thing I ever heard of...people weren't not around with the large dinasours...with the Wooly Mamoth and sabbare tooth tiger, but not with like T-Rex, ect. The thing you are thinking of in Job I have heard is actually a describition of satan and I have also heard it as being an alligator or hippo...though I don't think it was either...it was God talking about this, not Job, first of all, and I think it was actually satan He was describing.

And no angels do not have physcially bodies as we do. There were many times in the bible where they were allowed to appear before people in physical bodies, yes....but otherwise their bodies are not like ours.

I really don't see how Benny Hinn is coming up with this earth is a million years old then laid doormate for a long time, ect, ect....I would like to see what scriptures he is using to come up with this stuff. :(

God bless
Julie

SoldierofGod
Dec 3rd 2003, 04:30 PM
Well, the way I understand it is there are two very distinct types of demons, and depending on which one your reffering to you get different answers:

Demons, as in "fallen angels"- These are the 1/3 of the Lord's direct angels who rebelled against Him alongside Lucifer (aka Satan), and where cast to the Earth. These beings can in fact take on physical bodies (which explains their mating with the humans in Noah's times), and it is believed that some of them still have physical bodies and are currently bound in the sea or deep in the Earth (i.e Leviathan, Behemoth, Abaddon, etc.).

Demons, as in "evil spirits"- These are spiritual beings of uncleanliness(sp?). No one really knows whether they were created by Satan through imitating God's creation of Angels, or if they were always dwelling here on Earth; but there are now subserviant to the Devil. They have no physical bodies of their own, which is why they constantly seek to inhabit and corrupt any human who will let them in. These are the beings that tempt us with everyday sins, and possess people, NOT "fallen angels".

Of course, these are just my beliefs.

CorpusIslander
Dec 3rd 2003, 05:26 PM
Uh? Well this is the strangest thing I ever heard of...people weren't not around with the large dinasours...with the Wooly Mamoth and sabbare tooth tiger, but not with like T-Rex, ect.

There's a lot of evidence that man and dinosaurs lived together at one time probably up to the time of the flood that Noah's family saw.

CorpusIslander
Dec 3rd 2003, 05:48 PM
There is some debate about where demons came from. Most, including myself, say demons are angels that rebelled with Satan and that 1/3rd of the angels at that time became demons. I believe even unclean spirits are demons that were angels at one time. In the time of the Bible most believed demons were the spirits of Nephilim. Angels that rebelled against God had children with human women as mentioned in Genesis and the children were evil. God sent the flood of Noah's time and killed the Nephilim and the spirits of the Nephilim are the demons. The fallen angels have been imprisoned according to this belief which is an idea supported in the NT in Jude.

The books of the late Presbyterian author Donald Barnhouse is the best source of information for the gap theory which states the earth existed for a long time and it was during this time that Satan rebelled. I believe in the gap theory but I'm not dogmatic and admit I could be wrong. My oversimplified explanation of the theory involves Genesis 1 and the idea Satan deceived Eve. First in Genesis 1 the Bible says created the universe and the Hebrew word for create means to create out of nothing but then it starts talking about God creating earth in 6 days using a Hebrew word meaning to use existing materials to construct something. In other parts of the Bible it says when God created the universe out of nothing it was perfect. Other parts of the Bible also say that when Satan rebelled the world was ruined by the destruction it caused. If Satan was the one who deceived Eve the world was already ruined. Also notice that in Noah's time God was sorry he put man on Earth. I believe God created the universe but Satan's rebellion caused mass destruction. God restored the universe in 6 days. We don't know how long the gap of time between the original creation and the 6 day creation was and it could have been a fraction of a second or millions of years. I don't think dinosaurs come from this era.

Parrish
Dec 3rd 2003, 06:30 PM
The books of Enoch explain this.

As the previous poster wrote, there were giants in the days of Noah who were created by the fallen angels who took wives, and taught them all kinds of wickedness. Those giants began to sin against animals and flesh, and God regretted mans creation. He flooded the earth and punished the angels, fastening them in heaven to await their judgement. When Enoch saw them, he felt pity for them and they pleaded for him to pray to God for their sins. And from those giants who were half human, half angel their spirit went to the earth, and they are known as evil spirits.

Satan is described as being a lion, seeking whomever he can devour. Satan may be bound in heaven along with his companions, but his spirit is on the earth. An evil spirit (or demon) cannot co-habitate with God; if our temple within is full of light as the kingdom of heaven, then a spirit will not enter. That is where we are protected.

BRIAN~11
Dec 3rd 2003, 08:49 PM
Thanks for the replies. I don't really have a belief on the topic, I have however wondered about it due to Binny Hinn, Perry Stone, and others
like the ones who are in Glenrose. Sorry if I lead some of you into a silly question but I feel if someone can help clear things up for you=when you have heard too many teaching's....I don't feel it silly at all.

The name of the study for Binny Hinn is War in the Heavenlies= take a look and see what you think. He may have some of it online. Not sure!

WtheWildthingsR
Dec 3rd 2003, 09:17 PM
Benny Hinn is a false teacher and is one of many that are of the word faith movement. Here is a page of thread links in this forum to alot of good information about him and the word faith movement.

http://bibleforums.org/search.php?searchid=5368

BRIAN~11
Dec 4th 2003, 12:06 AM
I do know this about Binny Hinn. Alot of people get saved/healed at his services. And he gives all glory to GOD and tells the people he didn't do
it....GOD DID! So what is wrong w/that? Nothing IMO

Sky
Dec 8th 2003, 03:44 AM
There's a lot of evidence that man and dinosaurs lived together at one time probably up to the time of the flood that Noah's family saw.
That the Nephilim existed up to the Flood and after is one thing; I question if in "the world that then was" there was another, prior, irruption of Nephilim, or, even creations of Satan, at the same time as the dinosaurs and, if so, are those prehistoric (pre-Adamite) pseudo-human remains of the Nephilim or Satanic creations?

WtheWildthingsR
Dec 8th 2003, 12:55 PM
Anything satan creats would be using something that God created to create it, because God created all things.

I think that if satan and his demons wanted to create life of any kind that they would have to do it thru human or animals already created by God [possesion, or mutation thru what sin does to all things living]. I dont believe satan has the breath of life to give to any form he may create. Only the breath of death so to speak. There is no life or life giving in satan at all, it is all take................. Just my thoughts, Jeannine

Owen
Dec 8th 2003, 03:35 PM
I do know this about Binny Hinn. Alot of people get saved/healed at his services. And he gives all glory to GOD and tells the people he didn't do
it....GOD DID! So what is wrong w/that? Nothing IMO

The ends do not justifiy the means, especially with the Lord. He can save who he desires without us, so when we are leading people to be saved, we should do so in a Christian-like manner. Beyond the fact that Benny Hinn is part of the word-faith movement, he has also pronounced curses upon those who disagree with him. I am not going to judge whether he is saved or not, but I will say his methods are not right, no matter what the results are.

Thankfully the Lord can use even the bad for the good of His kingdam. That doesn't give one an excuse though to do as they wish though.

Suzannah
Dec 8th 2003, 03:55 PM
The ends do not justifiy the means, especially with the Lord. He can save who he desires without us, so when we are leading people to be saved, we should do so in a Christian-like manner. Beyond the fact that Benny Hinn is part of the word-faith movement, he has also pronounced curses upon those who disagree with him. I am not going to judge whether he is saved or not, but I will say his methods are not right, no matter what the results are.

Thankfully the Lord can use even the bad for the good of His kingdam. That doesn't give one an excuse though to do as they wish though.
Aint' dat da troot!

In my opinion, Benny Hinn has used scripture in a very haphazard manner to back up this stuff. I didn't read all of it, but a friend gave me a booklet about the demonology stuff. It seems very mixed up. I agree with Corpus Islander about where to go for info on this....Anyway, I haven't been very helpful in my comments, but I do want to tell you that we are always to "test the spirits" and that includes people who come in the name of Jesus. Best wishes to you!!!!

Deep_MindQuest
Nov 13th 2005, 10:27 AM
Please review the rules regarding posting links (http://tbm.org/origindemons.htm)

Deep_MindQuest
Nov 13th 2005, 10:33 AM
The fourth theory has been held from Enoch down to Yeshua and the Early Church. It teaches that the evil spirits are connected to the death of the Nephilim. .................................................. ..... PART III
Originally posted by Lord Knowledge of Secta7 Forums:

Shalom,

Just recently, I had completed the last 2 lessons on “The B`nai Ha Elohim & The Nephilim” showing the connection of who they are and what the scriptures taught about them. In this lesson I am going to be focusing on the origin of “Evil Spirits.” This topic over many years has possessed theories, controversy, and depth to those seeking to understand it more better for their belief and how to handle the subject when confronted about it or teaching on it. As I explore into this topic on the origins of evil spirits, I will show the theories, and the views held in the Bible as well as a little extra Biblical material that supports the Bible on this topic.



Now there have been 4 theories over the years on the existence and origin of evil spirits.

1. The first theory is that there was a race of Pre-Adamic people before Adam. And when the Pre-Adamic race died by a natural disaster their spirits roamed the earth and became demons.

There has been no solid evidence that supports this theory.

2.The second theory is that the evil spirits are the fallen angels in Genesis 6.

This cannot work out because these angels are bound in Tartarus as recorded in the scriptures.

(2 Peter 2:4 “For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast [them] down to hell, and delivered [them] into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment;”)

(Jude 1:6 “And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day.”)

3. The third theory claims that God created evil spirits after the fall of men.

This does not hold because God made all perfect, and none evil.

(Genesis 1:31 “And God saw every thing that he had made, and, behold, very good.”)

4. The fourth theory has been held from Enoch down to Yeshua and the Early Church. It teaches that the evil spirits are connected to the death of the Nephilim.



1 Enoch 19 also gives a variation to the origin of demons. It implies that demons were already in existence during the time of the fall of the angels. According to 1 Enoch 10-16, the demons are the spirits which go forth from these angels.

(1 Enoch 19:1 "Here shall stand in many different appearances the spirits of the angels which have united themselves with women. They have defiled the people and will lead them into error so that they will offer sacrifices to the demons as unto gods, until the great day of judgment in which they shall be judged till they are finished.")



The Encyclopedia of Judacia V. 10 Pg 962 speaks in this issue by saying:

“A race of giants said to have dwelt in the pre-Israelite Canaan (Numbers 13:33). Genesis 6:1-2 relares the Sons of God, divine, angelic beings, took mortal wives. Verse 4 continues, “It was then, and later too, that the Nephilim appeared and were on the earth when divine beings cohabitated with the daughters of men, who bore them offspring. They were heros of old, the men of renowned.” In the apocryphal writings of the 2nd Temple period the ideas were elaborated on and reinterpreted. One version asserts that the evil spirits originally issued forth from the bodies of the slain giants, or their offspring are identified as Nephilim.”



In Josephus book Legends of the Jews P 124-132 he records:

“The depravity of mankind, which began to show itself in the time of Enosh, had increased monstrously in the time of his grandson Jared by reason of the fallen angels. When the angels saw the beautiful, attractive daughters of men they lusted after them begat children with them. Giants begotten by the flesh and spirits will be called “evil spirits” on earth, and on earth will be their dwelling place. Evil spirits will proceed from their bodies, because they were created from above, and from the holy watchers is their beginning primal origin; they will be evil spirits on the earth, and evil spirits they will be named. And the spirits of heaven have their dwelling in heaven, but the spirits of earth, which were born upon the earth have their dwelling upon the earth. And the spirits of the giants will devour, oppress, destroy, attack, and do battle and cause destruction on the earth and work affliction. They will be invisible, and these spirits shall raise up against the children of men and against women, because they have proceeded from them, thus they will destroy until the day when the consummation of the great world will be consumed.”


From the “B`nai HaElohim” lesson I quoted Early Church Father Justin Martyr about the fallen angels, from the same quote he makes mentioned of the origins of evil spirits proceeding forth from the Nephilim.



(The Writings of Justin Martyr. Book 1 Pg 190)

“God committed the care of men, and all things under heaven to angels who He appointed over them. But the angels transgressed this appointment, and were captivated by the love of women, and begot children who were of those that are called Demons; and besides, they afterwards subdued the human race to themselves, partly by teaching them to offer sacrifices, and incense, and libations, of which they stood in need after they were enslaved by lustful passions; and among them they sowed murders, wars, adulteries, intemperate deeds, and all wickedness. Whence also the poets and mythologist not knowing that it was the angels and those demons whom had been begotten by them did these things to men, and women, and cities, and nations which they related ascribed them to God himself, and to the offspring of those who were called brothers, Neptune and Pluto, and to the children again of these their offspring. For whatever name each of the angels had given himself, and his children, by that name they were called.”


Before the flood of Noah there was no recorded name of evil, unclean, familiar, and foul spirit mentioned. It was only after the flood that these names were mentioned to describe demons. The first reference to a familiar spirit is found in :

(Leviticus 19:31 “Regard not them that have familiar spirits, neither seek after wizards, to be defiled by them: I [am] the LORD your God.”)

The first reference to a evil spirit is mentioned in:

(Judges 9:23 “Then God sent an evil spirit between Abimelech and the men of Shechem; and the men of Shechem dealt treacherously with Abimelech:”)

The first reference to a unclean spirit is mentioned in:

(Zechariah 13:2 “And it shall come to pass in that day, saith the LORD of hosts, [that] I will cut off the names of the idols out of the land, and they shall no more be remembered: and also I will cause the prophets and the unclean spirit to pass out of the land.”)

The first reference to a foul spirit is mentioned in:

(Mark 9:25 “When Jesus saw that the people came running together, he rebuked the foul spirit, saying unto him, [Thou] dumb and deaf spirit, I charge thee, come out of him, and enter no more into him.”)


In the gospels, Yeshua taught:

(Matthew 12:43 “When the unclean spirit is gone out of a man, he walketh through dry places, seeking rest, and findeth none.”)

As evidence given above, it has been taught and held that these evil spirits are to roam the earth seeking to oppress man. This is just as Yeshua taught. At the end of my last lesson I gave the scripture where Satan provoked King David to number Israel after all the Nephilim were destroyed from the promise land. King David destroyed the physical seeds of these evil spirits. But Yeshua came and gave His people power and dominion over these invisible evil, unclean, foul, and familiar spirits.

(Mark 16:17 “And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out demons; they shall speak with new tongues;”)

(“Matthew 10:8 “Heal the sick, cleanse the lepers, raise the dead, cast out demons: freely ye have received, freely give.”)

So what happens to these evil spirits then? Surely if the Bible speaks about death, it also speaks about a resurrection as well. True it does, but only for humans who shall either be raised to eternal life or eternal damnation.

(John 5:28 “Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.”)

But for the Nephilim there is no resurrection at all. They are to be cast into the lake of fire along with the antichrist, false prophet, evil nations, Satan, and the fallen angels. The book of Isaiah says that the Nephilim and their descendants will not participate in a resurrection as it the portion of ordinary mortals.

(Isaiah 26:14 “[They are] dead, they shall not live; [they are] deceased, they shall not rise: therefore hast thou visited and destroyed them, and made all their memory to perish.”)

Isaiah 26 is Israel 's kingdom song. The song is speaking about God's victory for Israel and deliverance, and how God has blessed Israel by given them the land promised to Abraham as explained in verse 15. From verse 16-21 Isaiah proclaims that God's dead will live and rise bodily as Isaiah included in verse 19.Isaiah is speaking about how God destroyed the Nephilim in verse 14. In verse 15 it shows how God then extended Israel's borders. This is speaking about how God delivered Israel to the promise land and destroyed the Nephilim. Now the two main words to focus on here is "Dead & Deceased" to understand who Isaiah is speaking about in this song.



The Hebrew word for dead in verse 14 is: "[I]Muwth" pronounced "Mooth" meaning worthy of death, to be destroyed. It's different then the Hebrew word for dead in verse 19 which is: "Nebalah" pronounced "Nebaylaw" meaning carcass, dead human body. And the other word Dead in verse 19 is also different it is: "Rapha"pronounced "Rawfaw" mean dead ghost. The word in verse 14 "Deceased" in Hebrew it means : "Rephaim" The Rephaim were one of the branches of the Nephilim in the scripture whom Israel fought against to gain the land of Israel promised to them.

The race of giants produced from this union gave way to a brood of evil spirits. The evil spirits most likely are the departed spirits of the giants, themselves. These spirits are not material or corporeal beings, but they torment mankind because they have proceeded from them. According to 1 Enoch, these spirits will not be punished until the day of judgment, in contrast to the Watchers, who are punished both before and on the day of judgment.

(1 Enoch 15 "But now the giants who are born from the (union of) the spirits and the flesh shall be called evil spirits upon the earth, because their dwelling shall be upon the earth and inside the earth. Evil spirits have come out of their bodies. Because from the day that they were created from the holy ones they became the Watchers; their first origin is the spiritual foundation. They will become evil upon the earth and shall be called evil spirits. The dwelling of the spiritual beings of heaven is heaven; but the dwelling of the spirits of the earth, which are born upon the earth, is in the earth. The spirits of the giants oppress each other, they will corrupt, fall, be excited, and fall upon the earth, and cause sorrow. They eat no food, nor become thirsty, nor find obstacles. And these spirits shall rise up against the children of the people and against the women, because they have proceeded forth from them.”)


Though the physical form of the Nephilim were destroyed by King David and his army in the Old Testament. The remnants of their spirits still exist seeking to oppress people who do not have power over them. Yeshua came in power over these evil spirits, casting them out and binding them. And blessing the Apostles with this same power, and to those who believe in His name. These evil spirit are under the control of Satan the high priest and god of all evil. As the Apostle Paul wrote in Ephesians 6:

(Ephesians 6:10-12 “Finally, my brethren, be strong in the Lord, and in the power of his might. Put on the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil. For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high [places].”)

And there is a final war between God and Satan to happen, and it takes place in the book of Revelation to unfold. And at the end of the war Satan and all evil shall be cast into the lake of fire forever separated from God.

(Revelation 12:7 “And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels, And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven. And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.”)


This concludes the end of this 3 part lesson on the “B`nai HaElohim, The Nephilim, & The Origin Of Evil Spirits.”

Stefen
Jun 9th 2007, 11:31 AM
That is what I believe about the origin of demons as well, regarding the post before mine.

steadfastfaith
Jun 9th 2007, 03:22 PM
I do not know where demons come from, but I would not be using Benny Hinn's teachings as my spiritual guide (or ANY evangelist for that matter). Evangelists are farther from God than the people who do not know him at all. They use people's faith to gainly earthly riches. I'm sure Dante has a special placed reserved in his Inferno for them *winks*

~ CA