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cchandrus
Feb 15th 2008, 03:54 AM
Give your Thoughts...

militarywife
Feb 15th 2008, 03:59 AM
I am spirtitual.
Spirit= from God
Religion= man made.

VerticalReality
Feb 15th 2008, 04:15 AM
I don't know why so many folks these days want to bash religion. Religion is not necessarily a bad thing. In fact, Scripture says that undefiled and pure religion is a very good thing. Me personally, I am both spiritual and religious. They're both great things.

Athanasius
Feb 15th 2008, 04:30 AM
I'm a religiously spiritual person :P
(Please don't read too much into that line)

Naphal
Feb 15th 2008, 04:34 AM
I don't know why so many folks these days want to bash religion. Religion is not necessarily a bad thing. In fact, Scripture says that undefiled and pure religion is a very good thing. Me personally, I am both spiritual and religious. They're both great things.

I agree. There is bad religion and bad spiritual as well as Holy, biblical versions of each.

HisLeast
Feb 15th 2008, 04:52 AM
I don't know why so many folks these days want to bash religion. Religion is not necessarily a bad thing. In fact, Scripture says that undefiled and pure religion is a very good thing. Me personally, I am both spiritual and religious. They're both great things.

The term has a very negative connotation now amongst non-believers. It reminds them of vast abuses of power by organized religion. As a rule, I avoid using the term to avoid utterly unnecessary forays into those arguments.

I also avoid saying I'm spiritual because I've heard so many 20 something airheads talk about how "spiritual" they are when what they REALLY mean is that they've invented their own religion called "convenience" and "moral flexibility".

Whenever the question comes up, I always tell people "I'm a Christian, but I want you to understand, I'm a Christian because of what I believe about Christ, not because I have vague social connections to a church". Its usually a longer answer than what people expect, but it also sparks a lot of interest (in those not already decidedly hostile to the Word)

Sold Out
Feb 15th 2008, 04:01 PM
Spiritual

Religion says, "Look what I'm doing for Jesus!" (while patting one's self on the back..)

Christianity says, "Look what Jesus did for me!"

Zorgblar
Feb 15th 2008, 04:03 PM
Give your Thoughts...\

I would have to say i am more spiritual.

markedward
Feb 15th 2008, 04:08 PM
1re·li·gious
Pronunciation: \ri-ˈli-jəs\
Function: adjective
Etymology: Middle English, from Anglo-French religius, from Latin religiosus, from religio Date: 13th century
1: relating to or manifesting faithful devotion to an acknowledged ultimate reality or deity <a religious person> <religious attitudes>
2: of, relating to, or devoted to religious beliefs or observances <joined a religious order>
3 a: scrupulously and conscientiously faithful b: fervent, zealous

1spir·i·tu·al
Pronunciation: \ˈspir-i-chə-wəl, -i-chəl, -ich-wəl\
Function: adjective
Etymology: Middle English, from Anglo-French & Late Latin; Anglo-French espirital, spiritual, from Late Latin spiritualis, from Latin, of breathing, of wind, from spiritus Date: 14th century
1: of, relating to, consisting of, or affecting the spirit : incorporeal <spiritual needs>
2 a: of or relating to sacred matters <spiritual songs> b: ecclesiastical rather than lay or temporal <spiritual authority> <lords spiritual>
3: concerned with religious values
4: related or joined in spirit <our spiritual home> <his spiritual heir>
5 a: of or relating to supernatural beings or phenomena b: of, relating to, or involving spiritualism : spiritualisticI'd call myself both.

Christianity is a "religion." It is, by definition, "the service and worship of God" and "commitment or devotion to a religious faith." Christianity is "religious." It is, by definition, "faithful devotion to an acknowledged ultimate deity." Christianity is "spiritual." It is, by definition, "concerned with religious values" and "consisting of the spirit."

VerticalReality
Feb 15th 2008, 04:11 PM
Religion says, "Look what I'm doing for Jesus!" (while patting one's self on the back..)



James 1:27
Pure and undefiled religion before God and the Father is this: to visit orphans and widows in their trouble, and to keep oneself unspotted from the world.

Again, the Word of God says there is nothing wrong with pure and undefiled religion. So, this notion that religion is a bad thing or something that says "Look what I'm doing for Jesus!" or something that's "man-made" is just not true. There can be religion that is this way, but it certainly doesn't mean that all religion is that way. Obviously, according to the Word of God, our Lord has absolutely no problem whatsoever with pure religion.

Sold Out
Feb 15th 2008, 04:35 PM
James 1:27
Pure and undefiled religion before God and the Father is this: to visit orphans and widows in their trouble, and to keep oneself unspotted from the world.

Again, the Word of God says there is nothing wrong with pure and undefiled religion. So, this notion that religion is a bad thing or something that says "Look what I'm doing for Jesus!" or something that's "man-made" is just not true. There can be religion that is this way, but it certainly doesn't mean that all religion is that way. Obviously, according to the Word of God, our Lord has absolutely no problem whatsoever with pure religion.


I was contrasting religion in the sense of 'works' -vs- 'grace'. There are many who claim to have 'religion', but believe their works will save them.

Gentile
Feb 15th 2008, 04:42 PM
Both!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

ProjectPeter
Feb 15th 2008, 05:37 PM
My goodness... even in the body of Christ we are eat up with political correctness (in a sense). I am not at all ashamed to say I am religious because Christianity is a religion by definition as markedward point out. For us to tell the world we're not and yet we are active Christians... makes one look a bit silly and they simply think you're a liar. Spiritual as well... the answer is both and by simple definition.

Folks that think the world cares about your clarification of either of those... it don't matter. If they dislike religion then your explanation ain't going to change their mind. If they are open to religion... then you can get more into explaining what true "religion" is... and yes that term is used in Scripture.

James 1:26 If anyone thinks himself to be religious, and yet does not bridle his tongue but deceives his own heart, this man's religion is worthless.
27 This is pure and undefiled religion in the sight of our God and Father, to visit orphans and widows in their distress, and to keep oneself unstained by the world.

What matters is whether your religion is pure and undefiled... but the word religion ought not be just another bad word among Christians because of its definition. It really does make us look silly.

HisLeast
Feb 15th 2008, 05:59 PM
My goodness... even in the body of Christ we are eat up with political correctness (in a sense). I am not at all ashamed to say I am religious because Christianity is a religion by definition as markedward point out. For us to tell the world we're not and yet we are active Christians... makes one look a bit silly and they simply think you're a liar. Spiritual as well... the answer is both and by simple definition.

Folks that think the world cares about your clarification of either of those... it don't matter. If they dislike religion then your explanation ain't going to change their mind. If they are open to religion... then you can get more into explaining what true "religion" is... and yes that term is used in Scripture.

Actually Peter, in my experience, they do care very much. I've noticed a night and day difference in reaction between saying "I'm a religious" or "My religion is Christianity" and actually explaining to them what I believe and why. People hear the "I'm religious" BS every day from people they believe are hypocritical and phony. But take half a second and tell them what you believe and why... now all of a sudden they're interested because they see (1) honesty (2) assertiveness (3) confidence (4) a level of thought put into your belief.

I'll take the conversations and opportunities I get from that any day over the eye rolls and smirks and INSTANT doubt when I say "I'm religious".

If that makes me "PC", I guess I'll try to live with the shame. :rolleyes:

VerticalReality
Feb 15th 2008, 06:13 PM
Actually Peter, in my experience, they do care very much. I've noticed a night and day difference in reaction between saying "I'm a religious" or "My religion is Christianity" and actually explaining to them what I believe and why. People hear the "I'm religious" BS every day from people they believe are hypocritical and phony. But take half a second and tell them what you believe and why... now all of a sudden they're interested because they see (1) honesty (2) assertiveness (3) confidence (4) a level of thought put into your belief.

I'll take the conversations and opportunities I get from that any day over the eye rolls and smirks and INSTANT doubt when I say "I'm religious".

If that makes me "PC", I guess I'll try to live with the shame. :rolleyes:

However, this topic isn't really about how other folks relate to somebody telling them they are "religious" or "spiritual". The OP simply asked the question are we "religious" or "spiritual", and the biblical answer should be that we are both.

HisLeast
Feb 15th 2008, 06:18 PM
However, this topic isn't really about how other folks relate to somebody telling them they are "religious" or "spiritual". The OP simply asked the question are we "religious" or "spiritual", and the biblical answer should be that we are both.

I'll buy that for a dollar I guess. Sorry if I answered the wrong question.

ProjectPeter
Feb 15th 2008, 06:40 PM
Actually Peter, in my experience, they do care very much. I've noticed a night and day difference in reaction between saying "I'm a religious" or "My religion is Christianity" and actually explaining to them what I believe and why. People hear the "I'm religious" BS every day from people they believe are hypocritical and phony. But take half a second and tell them what you believe and why... now all of a sudden they're interested because they see (1) honesty (2) assertiveness (3) confidence (4) a level of thought put into your belief.

I'll take the conversations and opportunities I get from that any day over the eye rolls and smirks and INSTANT doubt when I say "I'm religious".

If that makes me "PC", I guess I'll try to live with the shame. :rolleyes:Why would you just up and say to a person that "I am religious" anyway? That's my biggest point I guess. It certainly would be an odd conversations starter and the only reason anyone would even ask that would be if they saw you preaching or something of the like. If they see you witnessing and or preaching... then they know you are religious. They might not know what religion but when you say I am a Christian but I am not religious... then that forces an explanation that really shouldn't be necessary.

Whispering Grace
Feb 15th 2008, 06:52 PM
Since someone very close to me often calls me a religious nut job, I guess that makes me....spiritual?

Seeker of truth
Feb 15th 2008, 06:56 PM
I am not the least little bit religious. I am Spiritual :)

ProjectPeter
Feb 15th 2008, 06:58 PM
Since someone very close to me often calls me a religious nut job, I guess that makes me....spiritual?
Ha! But nothing wrong with being a nutjob! He just don't understand it yet. :lol:

VerticalReality
Feb 15th 2008, 07:02 PM
I am not the least little bit religious. I am Spiritual :)

:B

.................

Seeker of truth
Feb 15th 2008, 07:11 PM
:B

.................

Am I missing something here? :dunno:

Studyin'2Show
Feb 15th 2008, 07:13 PM
If they see you witnessing and or preaching... then they know you are religious. They might not know what religion but when you say I am a Christian but I am not religious... then that forces an explanation that really shouldn't be necessary.I wouldn't really use either for myself. Other people may call me one or the other but I ALWAYS qualify it and explain that I am a disciple of Messiah. I may say something like, "Not just religious/spiritual, I have a personal relationship with Yeshua Messiah". It always starts them asking questions and in my experience I've found that questions are good. ;)

God Bless!

VerticalReality
Feb 15th 2008, 07:18 PM
Am I missing something here? :dunno:

According to the Word you better be religious as the Word says that there is a pure and undefiled religion. I don't know where in the world the term "religion" got such a bad reputation. I just don't understand it.

VerticalReality
Feb 15th 2008, 07:19 PM
I may say something like, "Not just religious/spiritual, I have a personal relationship with Yeshua Messiah".

Could you explain to me what the difference is?

Seeker of truth
Feb 15th 2008, 07:20 PM
According to the Word you better be religious as the Word says that there is a pure and undefiled religion. I don't know where in the world the term "religion" got such a bad reputation. I just don't understand it.

Ya know what, I read the OP and answered it. I didn't read all the replies before doing so. I'm sorry I didn't answer the way you wanted me to.

I consider myself to be Spiritual. I won't apologize for that.

HisLeast
Feb 15th 2008, 07:32 PM
Why would you just up and say to a person that "I am religious" anyway? That's my biggest point I guess. It certainly would be an odd conversations starter and the only reason anyone would even ask that would be if they saw you preaching or something of the like. If they see you witnessing and or preaching... then they know you are religious. They might not know what religion but when you say I am a Christian but I am not religious... then that forces an explanation that really shouldn't be necessary.

Well... you're right in that people don't randomly walk up and ask "Hey! Are you religious", but it does come up in a round-about way. I may be engaged in conversation with friends, co-workers, or in other forums I visit and some topic will arise surrounding faith/religion/spirituality.

This inevitably leads to people's assertions that they "aren't religious, they are spiritual". Among non-christians its a total smokescreen which really means "I believe what I want so I can do what I want and not feel guilty". Invariably the conversation will work its way around until I'm asked "What about you Robert"? Thats when I bypass the labelling and categorization and cut to the chase about what and why I believe.

Its just an interesting mechanic I've noticed in conversations with unbelievers. You say "I'm a Christian" and they've already stopped listening because thousands of people say they're Christian because of some vague social connection to the church. Others stop listening because of a popular bias against "organized religion". But start talking about specifics and they're all ears!

Sorry for prattling on like that. Its just the way I've been able to scatter the few seeds that I have. :)

Confused64
Feb 15th 2008, 07:35 PM
I don't know why so many folks these days want to bash religion. Religion is not necessarily a bad thing. In fact, Scripture says that undefiled and pure religion is a very good thing. Me personally, I am both spiritual and religious. They're both great things.

The more I explore my faith and the more I read the scriptures, the more I understand why this is so. They don't know any better. Far too many believers appear to live apart from what Jesus taught us (they judge, they don't show love to their neighbor, they are concerned with things of this world, etc...), I myself am guilty of this. What they don't see (or understand) is that we, being Christians, understanding that we are human and not perfect beings, understand (and I'll give the benefit of the doubt and say most of the time here)that we are wrong and that we have sinned and that we have asked for and been granted absolution for our sins through God's love for us. Non-believers see the outward portion of this, or, worse yet, choose not to understand and consider us hypocrites. They think that, in order to truly be a Christian, we must lead perfect lives and never stumble. I'll tell you that I not only stumble, but fall flat on my face...often. However, I know that the Lord is there, and that He is watching over my development, and will lead me to where He wants me to go.:bounce:

VerticalReality
Feb 15th 2008, 07:43 PM
Ya know what, I read the OP and answered it. I didn't read all the replies before doing so. I'm sorry I didn't answer the way you wanted me to.

I consider myself to be Spiritual. I won't apologize for that.

I didn't say you should apologize for it. I'm just telling you this comment is unbiblical and really, just as ProjectPeter stated, just a silly concept that people keep buying into. Any true Christian according to the Word of God, not VerticalReality, is both religious and spiritual. That's just biblical.

Studyin'2Show
Feb 15th 2008, 08:52 PM
Could you explain to me what the difference is?Not a difference, but a qualification. It's really not a big issue for me but since I was born again a little more than 9 years ago I've been led to do that. There's so much misconception amongst unbelievers as to what true religion is that my response tends to give me an opportunity to witness to them. Most of them have a preconceived idea of what religious means and when I respond this way it usually gives them pause and more often than not it spurs questions. And like I said before, them asking questions is good. ;)

God Bless!

ProjectPeter
Feb 15th 2008, 09:04 PM
Well... you're right in that people don't randomly walk up and ask "Hey! Are you religious", but it does come up in a round-about way. I may be engaged in conversation with friends, co-workers, or in other forums I visit and some topic will arise surrounding faith/religion/spirituality.

This inevitably leads to people's assertions that they "aren't religious, they are spiritual". Among non-christians its a total smokescreen which really means "I believe what I want so I can do what I want and not feel guilty". Invariably the conversation will work its way around until I'm asked "What about you Robert"? Thats when I bypass the labelling and categorization and cut to the chase about what and why I believe.

Its just an interesting mechanic I've noticed in conversations with unbelievers. You say "I'm a Christian" and they've already stopped listening because thousands of people say they're Christian because of some vague social connection to the church. Others stop listening because of a popular bias against "organized religion". But start talking about specifics and they're all ears!

Sorry for prattling on like that. Its just the way I've been able to scatter the few seeds that I have. :)
Styles that work for folks are something that I would never condemn them using as long as they are using it! My point I suppose is this constant way we in the church tend to make words almost as bad as the foulest curse word. Shoot... it's done with words like "deeds or works" or the every unpopular "obey" etc. I am always amazed at the resistance words like this bring among believers. I even know preachers that work very hard at never using those words in the pulpit and in my opinion... much to their shame.

tgallison
Feb 17th 2008, 12:14 PM
Give your Thoughts...

Religion is our spirituality in action. Keep God's commandments. Love the Lord the God with all thy heart, mind, and soul, and thy neighbor as thyself.