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cats_meow
Mar 13th 2008, 08:52 AM
Donít know where to start. This thread is NOT for the people who have questions about their faith. It is only for the ones who are STRONG in their faith. There are 3 main issues: 1) The condition of my marriage 2) Loneliness 3) Health problem/poverty

I am married to who I ďthoughtĒ was my best friend. The problems started about a year into our marriage. I used to get along great with his mom. The relationship between her & I fell apart when we disagreed about how to handle a family problem. She thought I should just be a doormat. When I refused, she started getting nasty. Then I found out where my husbandís loyalty was: with his mom. He defended her brutal attempts at punishing me for not obeying her. He sided with her and allowed her to use him to punish me. Our marriage started to unravel.

Today, several years later, I am depressed and lonely. We live in a tiny community, below poverty level, and have no friends. This community is snobby and cliquish. We have no children. I have no real joy in my life anymore. He makes decisions for the both of us, based on what HE wants, all with no consideration for what I want and need.

I struggle daily with hateful thoughts about his mother and the terrible damage sheís done to our marriage and our lives. I feel no remorse for how I handled things. I will not be anybodyís doormat. She was wrong to try to make that happen. I was right for standing up for myself. My husband was wrong for not standing beside me against her nastiness. He was wrong for siding with her instead of me. These days he admits that she is nasty. But itís too late. The damage has been done. We are no longer close, like we used to be. We have drifted far apart because of what happened.

I struggle daily with the fact that Iíve tried, over and over again, to make friends here in this tiny community. Every single time Iíve tried, Iíve been rejected. After they treat me that way, Iím glad Iím not friends with them. However, Iím still left with bitter loneliness and...no friends. Plus humiliation after trying to make friends and being rejected. Again. (there is no privacy in small communities and everybody knows everything)

The one church here that is of my chosen religion is not right for us. Weíve tried that and we got nothing out of it. When we stopped going, the minister was cold toward us, and at times, actually quite rude. We didnít do anything except stop going, so he had no right to be that way.

I have a major health problem. Iíve prayed daily to God to heal me. He doesnít care. Ask and you shall receive? When? When you die? What good does praying do, if He is just going to ignore you/tell you NO? Why does He want to punish me so severely? I struggle daily (yes, another issue I struggle with daily) with the pain, hateful feelings/thoughts, and anger at the medical field because of how badly theyíve treated me. I hate the fact that they charge SO MUCH for medical care. The doctors and nurses all drive expensive cars and live in mansions. Guess who helps pay for their luxurious lives while we live in poverty? Why does God want me to be miserable? Why wonít He help me? Why is it that so many other people have so much and we have nothing? Why doesnít He punish the greedy people who take advantage of people with major problems? I read another thread on this message board about somebody who God cured of asthma. Why wonít He cure me of my health problem? How can I not be jealous of the person that God cured? Why does He want to force me to be miserable for YEARS (yes, itís been YEARS) with this horrible health problem that costs us so much? He is all-knowing, therefore He knew Iíd acquire this health problem, but yet He forced me into existence anyway. How is that NOT cruel?

I donít think God is fair. Most of the time, I see Him as cruel and unfair. I know thatís wrong, but I canít help how I feel. Iíve tried so many times to NOT feel that way about God, but Iím unable to stop. I canít, no matter how hard I try. I donít know what to do. You canít help how you really feel.

I donít know what to do.

tryinghard
Mar 13th 2008, 07:44 PM
I don't have much good advice, but I will be happy to pray for you, that you are able to find peace and love in this situation.

My experience has been this...my marriage never got any better until I forced myself to think only positive things about my husband. I can guarantee you that if you spend all your time thinking about God as loving, you soon will believe that. Same goes for your husband. You can change your thoughts...it's another gift from God, you just have to put it into practice.

Remember, God loves you and has a plan for you, even if you don't understand it. Hugs to you, sister. :hug:

menJesus
Mar 13th 2008, 10:50 PM
I have to agree. And when you can, pray and pray and pray. Read the Bible until you understand how to fight this battle and thus emerge victorious!

God will show us the way, even in the most difficult situations, if we only seek Him with all our heart.

aliveinchrist
Mar 14th 2008, 12:10 AM
the only answer that popped into my head when I read your post was that maybe God is using this illness to get you to lean on Him and trust Him.

We grow the most in hard times. God will use many different things to try to help people to grow closer to Him.

He wants you to lean on Him and trust Him, despite what you're going through.

God is not punishing you. I think God might be trying to get your attention/tell you something.

All I DO know for 100% certain, is that God DOES love you dearly and all He wants is for you to love Him back and trust Him, no matter what life hands you.

:hug: Just concentrate on loving and praising God and living your life for Him.

cheech
Mar 14th 2008, 01:15 AM
When I read your post, especially the last half, two psalms came to mind and I'd like you to read them:

Psalm 37 (http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=psalm%2037&version=31) and Psalm 73 (http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Psalm%2073;&version=31;)

I can tell you this...all the pent up bitterness and anger you are holding in will make your illness worse. It will make your life worse. When I use to hold in anger because I felt mistreated, my life was not good. I was not happy and I became ill. The symptoms were numerous. The anger and bitterness you hold in does nothing to anyone else...only to you. I'm not saying you are to blame for your family problems, but the fact that it eats at you will do major damage to you physically and spiritually. Believe me when I say I do understand where you are coming from...and I also know the cure.

If you want to feel better (I don't know what illness you have but I do know anger and stress can make illnesses worse), you must renew your mind and rid yourself of this anger. You said you did the right thing years ago by not being a door mat. Good...then be satisfied with your decision. If you truly have done nothing wrong, the problem is everyone elses. You said you have tried to make friends but you keep getting rejected. Why is that? (you don't have to answer here of course but think about it). I don't deny that some of it may be other people, but do you have any responsibility in it? I ask because I went through the same thing. I gave and gave but sometimes rejection hit and soon I began feeling everyone I met would do me wrong and before I knew it I trusted no one and put a perimeter around myself because i feared getting hurt. I felt everyone was the same. I had friends, yes, but I would be their friend but wouldn't allow them to be mine.

God does not want you miserable nor ill:

Ezekiel 18:30-32
30 "Therefore, O house of Israel, I will judge you, each one according to his ways, declares the Sovereign LORD. Repent! Turn away from all your offenses; then sin will not be your downfall. 31 Rid yourselves of all the offenses you have committed, and get a new heart and a new spirit. Why will you die, O house of Israel? 32 For I take no pleasure in the death of anyone, declares the Sovereign LORD. Repent and live!

You must clean out your insides before any healing will come. That means you must renew your mind. As unhappy as you are, you must put your focus on God now. Allow him to be at the center of your life. Once you do this, and it will take time, you will see a difference. You have to turn over your anger, bitterness and unhappiness to the Lord and only then will you find true healing. Many times people are more in need of a spiritual healing than a physical healing. A spiritual healing will save you eternally and that is what God is looking for, but he can't work in you if you do not allow him to. With all of your strength you must put aside your anger and hurt (believe me I know how hard that is), by turning it over to him and then allow him to work in you. Tell him how difficult it is and ask him to help you do this. Most of all, have faith and do not doubt. Seek the spiritual healing before the physical healing. Do not envy what others have for what they have will perish in the end:

Matt 6:19-23
19"Do not store up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moth and rust destroy, and where thieves break in and steal. 20But store up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where moth and rust do not destroy, and where thieves do not break in and steal. 21For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.

22"The eye is the lamp of the body. If your eyes are good, your whole body will be full of light. 23But if your eyes are bad, your whole body will be full of darkness. If then the light within you is darkness, how great is that darkness!

Seek God with all your heart and renew your mind and changes will come.

cats_meow
Mar 14th 2008, 01:43 AM
Contrary to how my post sounds, I love my husband very much and regularly show him and tell him so. The problem I have with him is not how I feel about him; it is with how he has changed towards me. And yes, weíve talked about it many many times. He will promise to change and then doesnít follow through.

I have all but given up now, as far as believing that God loves me and wants what is best for me. He is in charge and this is what I get? I see this as His fault because Iíve done what is required and nothing changes. Iíve been in this predicament for YEARS, praying hard and often, and I still have all these problems. No matter what view I take on it, I still lose.

I have a HUGE problem with the view that God is using the problems I have in my life to get me to lean on Him. After all, Iíve been leaning on Him since this all started happening and all I get is more piled on.

Also, whatever happened to the free will that God gave us all? We supposedly get to choose what we will and will not do. How does free will figure in to the afflictions I have? It isnít free will anymore if you go ahead and torture somebody to get them to do something. Thereís no free will there. Either you do what He wants you to do or else you suffer. That ainít free will. Thatís torturous coersion.

Besides, why would somebody who supposedly loves you, torture you for YEARS in order to force you to do something He wants you to do? Who does that?? I mean, if Iím SOOO dense that, after YEARS of being tortured and I still canít ďgetĒ what He wants me to do, why KEEP ON TORTURING ME??

I donít WANT to feel this way. Iíve tried so hard to think positive and keep having faith, but Iím worn down. I give up. I just donít know what to do.

Iím so frustrated because there never are any answers to the questions I have. I can't figure out what He wants so that there might be a chance He'll cure me and my problems will go away, there never are any answers to my questions, I'm miserable, I don't want to feel like this toward God. One of the biggest fears I have is that somebody who is "on the fence" with their faith, etc, will read this and I'll be a bad influence on them. I don't want that and have always tried very hard to NOT be a negative influence. But where on earth do I turn to prevent that?

aliveinchrist
Mar 14th 2008, 02:11 AM
Contrary to how my post sounds, I love my husband very much and regularly show him and tell him so. The problem I have with him is not how I feel about him; it is with how he has changed towards me. And yes, weíve talked about it many many times. He will promise to change and then doesnít follow through.

I have all but given up now, as far as believing that God loves me and wants what is best for me. He is in charge and this is what I get? I see this as His fault because Iíve done what is required and nothing changes. Iíve been in this predicament for YEARS, praying hard and often, and I still have all these problems. No matter what view I take on it, I still lose.

I have a HUGE problem with the view that God is using the problems I have in my life to get me to lean on Him. After all, Iíve been leaning on Him since this all started happening and all I get is more piled on.

Also, whatever happened to the free will that God gave us all? We supposedly get to choose what we will and will not do. How does free will figure in to the afflictions I have? It isnít free will anymore if you go ahead and torture somebody to get them to do something. Thereís no free will there. Either you do what He wants you to do or else you suffer. That ainít free will. Thatís torturous coersion.

Besides, why would somebody who supposedly loves you, torture you for YEARS in order to force you to do something He wants you to do? Who does that?? I mean, if Iím SOOO dense that, after YEARS of being tortured and I still canít ďgetĒ what He wants me to do, why KEEP ON TORTURING ME??

I donít WANT to feel this way. Iíve tried so hard to think positive and keep having faith, but Iím worn down. I give up. I just donít know what to do.

Iím so frustrated because there never are any answers to the questions I have. I can't figure out what He wants so that there might be a chance He'll cure me and my problems will go away, there never are any answers to my questions, I'm miserable, I don't want to feel like this toward God. One of the biggest fears I have is that somebody who is "on the fence" with their faith, etc, will read this and I'll be a bad influence on them. I don't want that and have always tried very hard to NOT be a negative influence. But where on earth do I turn to prevent that?

Jesus.

He said "Come to me all you who are weary and heavy laden, and I will give you rest". I don't think He was lying.


I'm not going to sit here and pretend I understand completely how you feel. I've never been in your position. But my heart goes out to you.
I DO know what it's like to deal with a husband that is arrogant and can be mean.

I think cheech made a very good point. You have to let your anger and bitterness go. That's what keeping you from realizing that He DOES love you. He loves everybody. You're not any different. He's not torturing you to make you do something. He's not even torturing you. Why would He torture somebody He loves?

I'm sorry you don't feel like He loves you, but God does not make exceptions to who He loves. If He loves a murder, rapist, homosexual, then you're not any different.

:hug:

FaithfulSheep
Mar 14th 2008, 02:36 AM
I must agree with Cheech on this one. When I read your posts, I sense much bitterness and anger. And what do such feeling benefit? It seems as though you feel that the Lord isn't answering your prayers about changing your husband. If so, there are two points I want to make.

1. God doesn't leave prayers unanswered, it's just that sometimes His answer is no. When we pray and pray and pray and it seems the answer never comes, it's not that God is ignoring you or that He doesn't care. It's just that what you desire is not in His will. Sometimes the Lord doesn't take problems away, instead He uses those problem to refine you, to draw you closer to Him. If He always took every trial away from us, we wouldn't grow. When there is no where left to run, our Father is standing in front of you with open arms. Now I know you said you have a problem with this, but you must remember that our timing and God's timing may not be the same. There is a purpose to everything He does... sometimes we just have to have patience.

You keep talking about torture... you used it several times in your last post... Tell me more. Who are you saying is "torturing" you? Your husband? The Lord? And how? You see it seems you are saying the Lord is torturing you. Now the Bible tells us He will never leave us or forsake us. If He will stay by us forever as long as we belong to Him, why oh why would He "torture" us? He wouldn't. You see, it's about perspective. You can look at this from a negative light of how horrible things seem to be or from a positive light of how can I use this situation to grow closer to the Lord. Which brings me to my second, and most important point.

2.You cannot change your husband. You cannot change your in-laws, and you can't change others in your community. As much as you want to, you just can't. But you can change yourself. You asked where you turn to... You turn to the pages in your Bible and you turn to Jesus. A great book I have read (other than the Bible) is "The Power of the Praying Wife." This is the first point of the whole book. You can pray for your husband to change, for your marriage to change, but ultimately, you cannot change them yourself. So focus on what you can change. You can change yourself, your attitudes, your feelings, your thoughts... not necessarily on your own, but with the help of the Lord. Seek first the Kingdom of God... put the Lord first in your life and trust that He knows what is best for you.

Pray to the Lord and then read these verses.
Jeremiah 29:11 tells us "I know the thoughts that I think toward you, says the Lord, thoughts of peace and not of evil, to give you a future and a hope."

Matthew 6:33 - Seek first the kingdom of God and His righteousness, and all these things shall be added to you.

Psalm 71:20-21 - You, who have shown me great and severe troubles, shall revive me again, and bring me up again from the depths of the earth. You shall increase my greatness, and comfort me on every side.

1 Peter 1:6-7 You have been grieved by various trials, that the genuineness of your faith, being much more precious than gold that perishes, though it is tested by fire, may be found to praise, honor, and glory at the revelation of Jesus Christ.

Galatians 6:9 - Let us not grow weary while doing goo, for in due season we shall reap if we do not lose heart.

cats_meow
Mar 14th 2008, 03:22 AM
I believe the reason that I keep getting rejection lies in the clique-ishness of the people in this community. For one thing, if you don't have money, you're nothing here. For another, if one wretch doesn't like you, then her whole clique treats you horribly. It might be that your clothes aren't "good enough", or your hair isn't right, or you smiled wrong, or you....you get the picture. I once had someone tell me I must have bought my clothes at a junk shop. For the record, my clothes are clean and they are fine. I am outgoing and friendly. I honestly can't figure it out.

It's pretty bad when the minister is friendly toward you until you stop going to that church and then treats you like garbage. That ain't my fault; it's his.

I've tried numerous times, over the 8 years I've been suffering, to refocus and put God first, have a happy attitude, etc etc etc. It never works. My illness makes it almost impossible to "have a life". Working is out of the question. I "look" normal, but I'm far from it.

jdarnall, I think God is torturing me:

God, in all His power, can heal me if He wants to. He obviously doesn't want to, because if He did, I would be cured. Therefore, the way I see it, He wants me to suffer. So I do. I think that's incredibly cruel. I think it also flies in the face of that so-called Free Will. I see it as God torturing me in order to force me to do what He wants me to do (come closer to Him???). That ain't free will. It's cruel coersion. How is that loving? It ain't. It's hateful to the core.

Faith comes and goes. I try so hard for so long and, after suffering so long, I get angry and my faith goes bye bye. I can't help it. No matter what you tell me, I can't help it that all this garbage makes me very hurt and angry. He doesn't do this to everybody, so why me? Why make me the Loser in this cruel vicious game? I feel like He is playing with my life. I can't help feeling this way. I don't want to. It makes me afraid. I don't want to make God mad. I don't want to blame Him. I just can't help it.

Aside from the illness, loneliness is a horrible thing to deal with. It's awful. Sometimes I think it's much worse than the physical ailment. It's crippling.

What do you do when God's answer is ALWAYS no and the suffering doesn't ever stop? Who WOULDN'T be bitter and angry? Who wouldn't be hurt?

On top of the physical ailment and the crippling loneliness that never goes away, my mother in law had to do her best to turn my husband against me and ruin my marriage. He was the ONLY friend I had and we were very close. She destroyed that. Yes, I know he had a part in that, but if she just wouldn't have tried to control, manipulate and destroy because I wouldn't obey her, our marriage would still be my sanctuary and my husband still my best friend. Again, who wouldn't be angry?

I'm not going to say what my physical ailment is. I'm not comforable doing that. Believe me when I say that people gasp and immediately feel very grateful that they don't have such a problem. Many people have told me that they've never known anybody with this kind of hell.

Yeah, makes me feel GREAT to be the pawn that is used in order to make other people feel grateful. If God would have given me the choice of either being created to live this hell or else never created, I would have chosen never to be created.

How do I get past this and get God's answer to be Yes to cure me? How? It isn't right for God to keep on torturing somebody who is clueless as to what He wants. I don't "get" it. I've tried everything I can think of. I'm bitter and angry because none of it has worked and I've given up now. After 8 years of this hell, I just give up. What do you do when you've tried everything you can think of?

Maybe I'm at the Point Of No Return, as far as faith is concerned. I just don't know.

Amazedgrace21
Mar 14th 2008, 10:07 AM
:hug: I am genuinely sorry you feel so miserable, , may I suggest you step back here and read your own words?



I don't "get" it. I've tried everything I can think of. I'm bitter and angry because none of it has worked and I've given up now. After 8 years of this hell, I just give up. What do you do when you've tried everything you can think of?


Your answer is in these words..you have been negotiating with God to abide by your terms Sis..perhaps it's time to stop looking outward at your circumstances and give yourself the chance to allow try what God has already thought of...:hmm:

You sound so very angry and bitter about much..this makes you . not Satan and certainly not God your worst enemy when it comes to much but I understand why when it feels like we are drowning in a sea of hurt, and am sure there may be some legitimate reasons for your troubles that are not your fault..but this about how you chose to respond to them opposed to what you feel about them...:hug:

So what if the gals in that circle of women are a bit snobbish, why do you even seek their approval? You are basically agreeing with their errors by allowing them to get to you..Christ has dressed you in a wonderful robe of righteousness..you need to focus on His approval alone, and there you will find your solace and joy..not the dependency upon the temporary, superficial or deceptive facades of what the world calls 'good'..

Have you asked God to change and adjust your attitude and heart or just your circumstnaces?

Anger and bitterness can deeply affect any health condition Sis, the 'filled people', not the fulfilled people are the happy people in life..God does indeed lift them up and thru their circumstances even when it comes to illness and chronic pain...what you seem to need and may not realize it is a calmness of your spirit with all you have shared..

When was the last time you trusted God in spite of everything goin on in your life? Noah lived in the midst of a wicked people and was able to keep close fellowship with God.

Sis it's not the environment or circumstances but the heart, ours, that determines ones walk with God..He has not walked away from you..He never has..this this more about your response to Him..have you considerd this?:hmm:

Jeseph lived in the house of his enemies and yet he never became so concerned with expecting God should remove him from the prison that he missed the lessons that God had for him to learn while in it..

God knows the lessons we need to learn, sometimes patience, submission and even self-denial..our strength comes when it is invested God's faithfulness and a maturity that recognizes if we have doubts , we are the ones who need to adjust, not God..

How can you hear yourself say I don't trust God, so this is why God can't be trusted and not wonder whats wrong with this picture Sis?..

Does it make sense or does this sound like something Satan would try to get you to believe so you give up?..I suggest to you that is the case here, now what do you want to do about it..what will you chose?:pray:

Brother Mark
Mar 14th 2008, 11:58 AM
Sister, you have been deeply wounded and now, the enemy is surrounding you and filling you with many hateful thoughts. I too have felt abandoned by God. It was one of the harshest things I have ever been through in my life. But it worked in me, some of the greatest things God has ever done in me. One thing I have learned, God is not fair.

Was it fair for Christ to die for me? When I look at Jesus life and see what he went through, it is not fair!

May the Lord heal your wounded spirit.

diffangle
Mar 14th 2008, 02:18 PM
I'm not going to ask what your ailment is in order to respect your privacy but do you mind checking out these people and telling me if your ailment is worse than theirs?

http://bibleforums.org/showthread.php?p=1531101#post1531101

http://youtube.com/watch?v=TUSbWQ3rZAs&feature=related

http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Job%201%20;&version=9;

Please don't take this the wrong way(I don't want to downplay your suffering, you're an important child of our Creator who loves you and I'm sad to hear when someone is so hurt, bitter, and angry:hug:) but chances are... that there are many people in worse situations and suffering more than you. Again, I didn't write that to be mean, it truely is out of love and the reason I point that out is b/c it might help you(and others) if you could volunteer some of your time to help those who are less fortunate than you... it would be a way that you could make others happy, yourself happy(and not lonely anymore), and give you opportunity to share our Messiah with others... remember the two greatest Commandments, Love God and love others.

Peace :pray:

moonglow
Mar 14th 2008, 03:05 PM
With the exception of Job and Paul illnesses (or in Paul's case it might have been something else actually) rarely do we see God making someone sick or disabled in the bible. I really don't know why you even got it into your head in the first place that God caused your illness. The bible tells us that ALL of us would go through trials and tribulations. I am disabled myself and suffer from chronic pain related to my back and neck...I also have low blood sugar problems and deal with miserable allergies and an upset stomach (due to the meds I take for my back pain). I lost faith IN doctors...not in God. God didn't magically make some bones in my back not forum. This is a sin fallen world...everyone has some kind of problems they deal with..whether its emotional, mental, spiritual or physical.

I also have a severe learning disability which has caused me terrible grief over the years. I also have no real friends that I can hang out with and go to the movies with, etc...alot of that is because I am not good at picking up social cues. While its painful I accepted 'this is the way I am' years ago. My social life now is on the internet mostly. I am blessed with having a great close family though...which I thank God for many times. I also have a son that has multiple problems...I certainly don't blame God for his issues though.

Now I won't say I don't understand how you feel...I went through a horrible time in my life years ago before I became a born again Christian where I blamed God for what happened and was extremely angry with Him. Eventually though I realized what happened, happened because it was MY fault. My own actions caused this terrible thing...so why in the world would I blame Him? I finally realized that and made my peace with Him.

You obviously believe there is a God...enough to blame Him for everything...but you have no faith in Him. No love, no trust and don't really know who God is. You see Him as a puppet master...and a cruel one at that. Which isn't true! When Adam and Eve gave up their control over to satan in the garden, what would be expect this world to be like? Full of alot of pain and suffering...!

James 2:
19 You say you have faith, for you believe that there is one God. Good for you! Even the demons believe this, and they tremble in terror.

Now we all know demons aren't saved nor will be in Heaven..yet they believe (know) there is a God.

There are many scriptures on healing in the bible...the person has to have FAITH first.

Matthew 9:2
Some people brought to him a paralyzed man on a mat. Seeing their faith, Jesus said to the paralyzed man, “Be encouraged, my child! Your sins are forgiven.”

Matthew 9:22
Jesus turned around, and when he saw her he said, “Daughter, be encouraged! Your faith has made you well.” And the woman was healed at that moment.

I could list many more. It seems you see God sort of like a Santa Claus...IF He fulfills your wishes (prayers) and does what you want, then you will believe...it doesn't work that way. Your anger and bitterness have you bound.. its like you are chained to those feelings about everyone and everything and you cannot break free to reach God...and you seem to only want to reach Him on your terms. Its not about you...its about Him. If you make Him number one in your life and ask Him what He wants you to do...put Him in charge...then things will start to change for you.

I will not say if you have faith you will be healed either...God does not heal everyone...but He does bring peace to those living with terrible illnesses.

We have a lady on this board who suffers from some extreme chronic pain...very disabling yet her faith in God only continues to grow.

Me and my husband need prayers for our hurting bodies2..... (http://bibleforums.org/showthread.php?t=107030)

You CAN ask God to help you with your unbelief and help you to have faith. Until then...nothing is going to change and you will stay stuck, possibly for the rest of your life feeling angry and bitter which WILL make your illness worse. Studies show 80-90% of our illnesses are caused by stress..but bottled up negative emotions. That makes heart disease worse...the risk of strokes go up and on and on...when I get upset and stressed it causes my back to hurt more and messes up my blood sugar more...hate that! So it benefits me to not get stressed out.

At any rate...I agree with the others, by hanging on to all this anger towards everyone and God, you are only hurting yourself. You cannot change anyone...but you can change yourself. When you start acting differently, so will others in response to you. You might think you are being nice to people...but as angry and bitter as you are, more then likely its coming out in some way...people are picking up on it and will respond in kind.

God bless

turtledove
Mar 14th 2008, 04:11 PM
Cats__Meow, You asked in the beginning for those of us who are strong in their faith to respond. You have expressed concern for those who are not strong in faith who may also read this. You are, at heart, concerned for others and this is good. Bless you for that!

Dear one, you may have felt rejected by others as we all have at times, but you are accepted in the Beloved! The enemy of your soul is trying really hard to convince you that this is not true!

As all of us here approach a special remembering of Our Savior's death upon the cross, and given that you have expressed yourself repeatedly as being a victim, repeatedly blaming God and others as I, too, have done at some time or other, it is my hope and prayer that it will help you as it always does me to take a moment to focus on what happened on that Good Friday so long ago and the words spoken by He who showed greater love than anyone for us.

"And at the ninth hour Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eloi, Eloi, lama sabachthani?" ---which means, "My God, my God, why have you fosaken me?" (Mark 15:34)

In faith I believe that Jesus loves you no matter how you feel about Him. Never forget: He died for you! You are His friend! Not only did He die but He rose again from death to give us the hope of New Life in Him.

Praying for you :pray:

Peace and blessings,

wiseoldowl

cheech
Mar 14th 2008, 04:20 PM
Sister, you have been deeply wounded and now, the enemy is surrounding you and filling you with many hateful thoughts. I too have felt abandoned by God. It was one of the harshest things I have ever been through in my life. But it worked in me, some of the greatest things God has ever done in me. One thing I have learned, God is not fair.

Was it fair for Christ to die for me? When I look at Jesus life and see what he went through, it is not fair!

May the Lord heal your wounded spirit.

I agree with this. When we are wounded as you are, it's hard to see any good. I spoke what I did out of experience because I was the same way. No, it's not fair that you try and try and it seems like you just get beat back down. When I read your post it's alot like how I felt in many ways and what I went through as far as rejection. The hurt is so deep.

As for the towns people...if they are cliquish then you have to rise above that. I know I talk about YOU changing because many times we have to change our own outlooks before we can expect others to change. I'm sure you do love your husband but you are just very frustrated and I do know frustration. It hurts and that is where I really feel for you.

I want to address this more but can't right now due to work. I will address this more later...don't give up hope though.

cats_meow
Mar 14th 2008, 07:18 PM
There are so many things in your posts I'd like to address. However, my post would be about 2 miles long. I'm condensing this post into what I believe is "my problem" in a nutshell. I really, super-need the help of all of you with strong faith. I did read all the posts and appreciate all the advice so far, so please if I don't quote your particular post, don't think I didn't read it. I did.

I'm afraid of the way I feel. I'm also afraid of being this way for the duration.

Issue One:

ďIf you make Him number one in your life and ask Him what He wants you to do...put Him in charge...then things will start to change for you.Ē

This is something Iíve done through these 8 years of hell (in fact, long before the afflictions). Thatís one of the biggest reasons Iím at the place Iím at now. No, things do NOT change for me, no matter WHAT I do. I live my life the way I feel He wants me to live it, with the exception of going to church every Sunday (which is, in part, because of my health issues). We have a Christian household. We donít allow alcohol in the house, we donít smoke or use drugs, we observe the Golden Rule, witness to people, etc.

Before I EVER make a decision (no matter how small), I ALWAYS think about what God would think of such a thing. ALWAYS. If I think what I plan to do might be a stumbling block for somebody, I DO NOT DO IT. Even if I super-want to do it, I donít. I call all this PUTTING GOD FIRST. (that is why this thread was so hard for me to do...I'm afraid of tipping somebody the wrong way and I feel it will be my fault if that happens. I just didn't know where to turn).

Issue 2:

I said in another of my posts why I came to the conclusion that I blame God. I also said I DO NOT want to feel that way but canít help it. Iím in a very dangerous place right now (in regards to my relationship with God) and Iím very afraid about that. I'm terrified of God and the power He has. I donít want to have the mindset that I have. I just donít know how to get out of it.

It's a "circular reasoning":

We all agree that God is in charge. We all also agree that God is the most powerful being that ever will ďbeĒ. More powerful than everyone and everything put together and multiplied. Since He is that powerful, He can do anything He wants.

Iíve begged Him for 8 years to please heal me. Has He done it? No. Why? I conclude that He doesnít want to. Because He could if He wanted to. He doesnít want to, so I keep suffering. If He is forcing my continued suffering because He wants to draw me nearer to Him, then that negates Free Will. It also is very very cruel. And unfair because He doesnít force EVERYBODY to suffer this bad. Therefore, He isnít fair and He has favorites and Iím not one of them. He doesnít care about me as much as He cares about His favorites. But, according to the Bible, in God's eyes, we're all equal (He has no favorites).

My circular reasoning in a nutshell: God in in charge. I've done all I can think of to please God. I've begged God to heal me for 8 years but it hasn't happened. God is all powerful. God hasn't healed me. God wants me to suffer. God is a cruel bully.

(Upon reading the above paragraph, it sounds almost comical, doesn't it? Maybe I'm losing it...LOL. I think I need a nap)

HOW DO I STOP THE CIRCULAR REASONING??

I don't know what more I could possibly do in my life. Before anybody goes there, I certainly don't believe I'm perfect. Far from it. But I TRY MY HARDEST to be what I believe God wants me to be. I try so hard to put Him first, even in the smallest of things. I deny myself regularly (and I don't feel upset because I've denied myself of what I want) because I don't want to be a negative influence on anybody. I do all this (and the stuff mentioned in the above paragraphs) with the faith and joy that I'm pleasing God by trying my hardest to live the way He wants me to (based on what the Bible says).

What more can I do??

moonglow
Mar 14th 2008, 10:28 PM
I am going to answer you throughout your post in bold letters so you can find them easily. I am glad you came here...yes I know its hard.


There are so many things in your posts I'd like to address. However, my post would be about 2 miles long. I'm condensing this post into what I believe is "my problem" in a nutshell. I really, super-need the help of all of you with strong faith. I did read all the posts and appreciate all the advice so far, so please if I don't quote your particular post, don't think I didn't read it. I did.

I'm afraid of the way I feel. I'm also afraid of being this way for the duration.

Issue One:

“If you make Him number one in your life and ask Him what He wants you to do...put Him in charge...then things will start to change for you.”

This is something I’ve done through these 8 years of hell (in fact, long before the afflictions). That’s one of the biggest reasons I’m at the place I’m at now. No, things do NOT change for me, no matter WHAT I do. I live my life the way I feel He wants me to live it, with the exception of going to church every Sunday (which is, in part, because of my health issues). We have a Christian household. We don’t allow alcohol in the house, we don’t smoke or use drugs, we observe the Golden Rule, witness to people, etc.

Ok it sounds like to me...(and please don't take anything the wrong way...not trying to offend you but trying to hopefully help)...it seems like to me you are first trying to 'guess' at what God wants and earn something with Him by doing what you think is right...most people call this 'trying to work your way to Heaven'...there is no real relationship there.

How much of the bible do you really know? While good 'works' are a reflection of our faith..works alone mean nothing...especially in light of this verse:

Matthew 7:21-23
21 “Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’ 23 And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’



Before I EVER make a decision (no matter how small), I ALWAYS think about what God would think of such a thing. ALWAYS. If I think what I plan to do might be a stumbling block for somebody, I DO NOT DO IT. Even if I super-want to do it, I don’t. I call all this PUTTING GOD FIRST. (that is why this thread was so hard for me to do...I'm afraid of tipping somebody the wrong way and I feel it will be my fault if that happens. I just didn't know where to turn).

I understand...but still it seems like to me...from what I am reading you aren't actually asking Him what He wants you to do...you are guessing....which can be a dangerous thing as the scriptures tell us:

Isaiah 55:8
"For My thoughts are not your thoughts,Nor are your ways My ways," declares the LORD.

I am glad you came to us...and realized your faith is seriously struggling here! That is a very positive step for sure! Have you ever read the story of Joseph in the bible? He was very favored by his father Jacob as he was the youngest son. the other sons grew jealous and wanted to kill him...they set up a trap and push him into a dry well..then at the last minute decided to not kill him but instead sell him into slavery. So this poor kid...only a young teenager was sold into slavery. He worked for a rich man who's wife wanted to sleep with him...he said no to her as it would be a sin against God...she finally got angry and accused him of raping her...her husband could have had him killed...instead he was thrown into jail for many years. All of these events went on for YEARS. It would seem God had abandoned him, yet God was with him the whole time as he went through these horrible things and eventually God lifted him up and made him Pharaoh right hand man.

King David...as a young man he was chosen by God to lead His people...yet before this could happen David needed to be tested by trials and fire (as the bible expresses such things). He was chased around the country side for many, many years by King Saul who wanted to kill him. This taught David to learn to lean on God...for everything! And taught him to grow up and learn how to be a leader...the kind of leader the Jews needed.

There are countless stories like these in the bible. Its never promised to us that we would not suffer in anyway at all.


Issue 2:

I said in another of my posts why I came to the conclusion that I blame God. I also said I DO NOT want to feel that way but can’t help it. I’m in a very dangerous place right now (in regards to my relationship with God) and I’m very afraid about that. I'm terrified of God and the power He has. I don’t want to have the mindset that I have. I just don’t know how to get out of it.

It's a "circular reasoning":

We all agree that God is in charge. We all also agree that God is the most powerful being that ever will “be”. More powerful than everyone and everything put together and multiplied. Since He is that powerful, He can do anything He wants.

I’ve begged Him for 8 years to please heal me. Has He done it? No. Why? I conclude that He doesn’t want to. Because He could if He wanted to. He doesn’t want to, so I keep suffering. If He is forcing my continued suffering because He wants to draw me nearer to Him, then that negates Free Will. It also is very very cruel. And unfair because He doesn’t force EVERYBODY to suffer this bad. Therefore, He isn’t fair and He has favorites and I’m not one of them. He doesn’t care about me as much as He cares about His favorites. But, according to the Bible, in God's eyes, we're all equal (He has no favorites).


There are people suffering much worse then you are....there are people currently dying horrible deaths around the world..in fact I just attended a funeral yesterday of an 11 year old boy that died of cancer. From the letter read at the service by his dad, this poor child suffered horribly due to the treatments for the cancer he was getting. He suffered extremely before he died and this was just a child! I am sure you realize there are people in much worse shape then you are...if you ever watch the news you have to realize this. While I have no doubt you are suffering..I am thinking of those too weak to sit up, let alone type on a computer. That could care less as their bodies wither away from diseases. Many years ago I used to think like you did...God could just stop it instead of letting this pain go on. I guess somewhere along the way I learned that first, God didn't cause my problems...second WHY should He stop it? God is NOT making your illness continue either. This is not correct thinking at all. I have prayed and prayed for healing also...and still do sometimes when I am feeling sorry for myself but I cannot ignore this passage in the bible:

2 Corinthians 12
Paul’s Vision and His Thorn in the Flesh
1 This boasting will do no good, but I must go on. I will reluctantly tell about visions and revelations from the Lord. 2 I[a] was caught up to the third heaven fourteen years ago. Whether I was in my body or out of my body, I don’t know—only God knows. 3 Yes, only God knows whether I was in my body or outside my body. But I do know 4 that I was caught up[b] to paradise and heard things so astounding that they cannot be expressed in words, things no human is allowed to tell.

5 That experience is worth boasting about, but I’m not going to do it. I will boast only about my weaknesses. 6 If I wanted to boast, I would be no fool in doing so, because I would be telling the truth. But I won’t do it, because I don’t want anyone to give me credit beyond what they can see in my life or hear in my message, 7 even though I have received such wonderful revelations from God. So to keep me from becoming proud, I was given a thorn in my flesh, a messenger from Satan to torment me and keep me from becoming proud.

8 Three different times I begged the Lord to take it away. 9 Each time he said, “My grace is all you need. My power works best in weakness.” So now I am glad to boast about my weaknesses, so that the power of Christ can work through me. 10 That’s why I take pleasure in my weaknesses, and in the insults, hardships, persecutions, and troubles that I suffer for Christ. For when I am weak, then I am strong.


My circular reasoning in a nutshell: God in in charge. I've done all I can think of to please God. I've begged God to heal me for 8 years but it hasn't happened. God is all powerful. God hasn't healed me. God wants me to suffer. God is a cruel bully.

(Upon reading the above paragraph, it sounds almost comical, doesn't it? Maybe I'm losing it...LOL. I think I need a nap)

HOW DO I STOP THE CIRCULAR REASONING??

I don't know what more I could possibly do in my life. Before anybody goes there, I certainly don't believe I'm perfect. Far from it. But I TRY MY HARDEST to be what I believe God wants me to be. I try so hard to put Him first, even in the smallest of things. I deny myself regularly (and I don't feel upset because I've denied myself of what I want) because I don't want to be a negative influence on anybody. I do all this (and the stuff mentioned in the above paragraphs) with the faith and joy that I'm pleasing God by trying my hardest to live the way He wants me to (based on what the Bible says).

What more can I do??



What else can you do..is start listen to God, Himself. Put aside your ideas of what you think He wants you to be and do and first just have a relationship with Him. You are trying too hard. I see people burn out on God, so to speak because they think they have to do it all by themselves! They have this list in their heads..."I have to do this and that..and I can't do this and that' and they get so hyper over these things...they are doing what the religious leaders in Jesus day did...trying to follow the laws. While you aren't following the Old Testament laws...you have made up laws for yourself to follow. (yes I realize you are following the teachings of Jesus, but the ONLY commandments He gave us were to one, love the Lord your God with all your heart, mind, soul and strength. And two..love your neighbor as yourself. Don't make everything into a 'law' in your mind.

IF you simply fall in Love with Jesus all these things will naturally happen. You won't have to keep some mental list in your head all the time. I sure don't! Now when I mess up (sin) I am convicted of it right away and I ask for forgiveness right away and its over and done with. Now on sins that keep popping up...something I may be struggling with...I realize I need help and I call on Him to help me. I don't try to do it on my own because I know I can't.

Luke 18
Parable of the Pharisee and Tax Collector

9 Then Jesus told this story to some who had great confidence in their own righteousness and scorned everyone else: 10 “Two men went to the Temple to pray. One was a Pharisee, and the other was a despised tax collector. 11 The Pharisee stood by himself and prayed this prayer: ‘I thank you, God, that I am not a sinner like everyone else. For I don’t cheat, I don’t sin, and I don’t commit adultery. I’m certainly not like that tax collector! 12 I fast twice a week, and I give you a tenth of my income.’

13 “But the tax collector stood at a distance and dared not even lift his eyes to heaven as he prayed. Instead, he beat his chest in sorrow, saying, ‘O God, be merciful to me, for I am a sinner.’ 14 I tell you, this sinner, not the Pharisee, returned home justified before God. For those who exalt themselves will be humbled, and those who humble themselves will be exalted.”

God bless

cats_meow
Mar 15th 2008, 12:15 AM
"Ok it sounds like to me...(and please don't take anything the wrong way...not trying to offend you but trying to hopefully help)...it seems like to me you are first trying to 'guess' at what God wants and earn something with Him by doing what you think is right...most people call this 'trying to work your way to Heaven'...there is no real relationship there"

Um, not exactly. I'm fully aware that you can't earn a place in Heaven. But, I AM trying to guess what He wants. I have no clue.

"I understand...but still it seems like to me...from what I am reading you aren't actually asking Him what He wants you to do...you are guessing....which can be a dangerous thing as the scriptures tell us:"

Nope. I'm living my life, using Jesus as a guide, in the hopes of pleasing God (and to keep from sinning even more and having less of a reward at the end) and in the hopes that He will reveal what it is He wants of me. I know I'm going to Heaven because I'm saved. Jesus paid for all of my sins (Thanks Jesus!!) and I know I could never hope to earn my way to Heaven.

"There are countless stories like these in the bible. Its never promised to us that we would not suffer in anyway at all."

If I gave the impression that I expected to never suffer in life, that was not correct. But, I have always been taught/believed that if you have faith, God will help you. Otherwise, why should you ask Him anything at all?

"There are people suffering much worse then you are..."

Never did I claim there weren't. I am fully aware of that. On the other hand, I can see so many people who are MUCH better off and who could care less about pleasing God.

"I guess somewhere along the way I learned that first, God didn't cause my problems...second WHY should He stop it? God is NOT making your illness continue either."

How do you know that? Besides, that's where my circular reasoning comes in. God can cure me. God chooses not to cure me. God wants me to suffer, etc etc etc.

"What else can you do..is start listen to God, Himself. Put aside your ideas of what you think He wants you to be and do and first just have a relationship with Him."

What, pray tell, makes you think I don't already have a relationship with God? I've been saved since I was very very young. I'm not trying to be a smart alec here, I'm sincere, so don't take offense. I just don't understand some of your reasoning. I hope I'm wrong here, but it sounds like you think I shouldn't try to live as Jesus taught...to just let that go. I can't. It's a huge part of my life. It may seem to you like I'm "hyper" and may burn out, but that just isn't so.

Later on, you say something about a mental list. I don't have any mental list. I live like this because it is my chosen way of life. I know right from wrong and I choose right. That's just who I am. Most of the time, I don't even think about it, I just DO it. I struggle sometimes, and sometimes I fail, but most of my life isn't a struggle like that. I just accept that there are things we aren't to do, and I don't do them and have no resentment or struggle with it. It's just "me".

You (and regretably many) people are witnessing the problem I have right now. I think it's probably 100 times worse to deal with a mental (thinking) issue than a physical behavioral one (if that makes any sense). Thoughts are terribly hard to conquer.

Why should we pray then? When something terrible happens to us, are we to just accept it and deal with it or are we to ask God to help us? I thought asking God for His help, and having faith that He would help us, was "leaning on God".

By the way, thanks for all the effort you put into that post. That was tons of work and I do appreciate it. (I appreciate everybody else's efforts too!).

moonglow
Mar 15th 2008, 12:37 AM
I forgot to address this:


Iíve begged Him for 8 years to please heal me. Has He done it? No. Why? I conclude that He doesnít want to. Because He could if He wanted to. He doesnít want to, so I keep suffering. If He is forcing my continued suffering because He wants to draw me nearer to Him, then that negates Free Will. It also is very very cruel. And unfair because He doesnít force EVERYBODY to suffer this bad. Therefore, He isnít fair and He has favorites and Iím not one of them. He doesnít care about me as much as He cares about His favorites. But, according to the Bible, in God's eyes, we're all equal (He has no favorites).

I am not sure how you think God is not allowing you to have freewill over you being sick...He didn't cause it and isn't making you continue to have it. As I explained before...the whole world was infected, so to speak, by sin. That means no one has perfect bodies that never get sick. Everyone suffers, some more then others. How does being sick or disabled stop our free will? You are still free to love, to hate, to accept God or reject Him. Many people completely crippled by an illness or handicapped have done great things in this world. Stephen Hawkins has a terrible disease and appear to be smashed down in his wheel chair...he cannot talk, or walk, or dress himself or feed himself. Yet he is well known for his great mind. You seem to have it in your mind God caused this disease or illness you have...He didn't...and that He is forcing you to keep having it. Lets pretend for a second God is not involved at all in your life...has totally nothing to do with you. You would still have this disease, still have the pain...then what would you say was causing it? Who would you blame? I do not believe God inflicts people with illness in most cases...this isn't what the bible says.

Here is a good article to read on this:
http://www.carm.org/evidence/suffering.htm
If God is all powerful and loving, why is there suffering in the world?

It is the result of sin

1. Biblically speaking, pain and suffering are the results of sin in the world. Adam, who represented all humanity as well as creation, rebelled against God and brought suffering into the world (Rom. 5:12). Sin is more than simple rebellion and breaking of God's law. It is permeating throughout all of God's creation bringing imbalance, famine, earthquakes, disease, etc. This does not mean that God created evil. Instead, it is God who is allowing evil and suffering to continue for His divine plan.

Though I can't say I am totally happy with that article but this part I copied onto here pretty much covers it in a nutshell as I said. sin.

God bless

moonglow
Mar 15th 2008, 01:04 AM
"Ok it sounds like to me...(and please don't take anything the wrong way...not trying to offend you but trying to hopefully help)...it seems like to me you are first trying to 'guess' at what God wants and earn something with Him by doing what you think is right...most people call this 'trying to work your way to Heaven'...there is no real relationship there"

Um, not exactly. I'm fully aware that you can't earn a place in Heaven. But, I AM trying to guess what He wants. I have no clue.

"I understand...but still it seems like to me...from what I am reading you aren't actually asking Him what He wants you to do...you are guessing....which can be a dangerous thing as the scriptures tell us:"

Nope. I'm living my life, using Jesus as a guide, in the hopes of pleasing God (and to keep from sinning even more and having less of a reward at the end) and in the hopes that He will reveal what it is He wants of me. I know I'm going to Heaven because I'm saved. Jesus paid for all of my sins (Thanks Jesus!!) and I know I could never hope to earn my way to Heaven.

"There are countless stories like these in the bible. Its never promised to us that we would not suffer in anyway at all."

If I gave the impression that I expected to never suffer in life, that was not correct. But, I have always been taught/believed that if you have faith, God will help you. Otherwise, why should you ask Him anything at all?

"There are people suffering much worse then you are..."

Never did I claim there weren't. I am fully aware of that. On the other hand, I can see so many people who are MUCH better off and who could care less about pleasing God.

"I guess somewhere along the way I learned that first, God didn't cause my problems...second WHY should He stop it? God is NOT making your illness continue either."

How do you know that? Besides, that's where my circular reasoning comes in. God can cure me. God chooses not to cure me. God wants me to suffer, etc etc etc.

"What else can you do..is start listen to God, Himself. Put aside your ideas of what you think He wants you to be and do and first just have a relationship with Him."

What, pray tell, makes you think I don't already have a relationship with God? I've been saved since I was very very young. I'm not trying to be a smart alec here, I'm sincere, so don't take offense. I just don't understand some of your reasoning. I hope I'm wrong here, but it sounds like you think I shouldn't try to live as Jesus taught...to just let that go. I can't. It's a huge part of my life. It may seem to you like I'm "hyper" and may burn out, but that just isn't so.

Later on, you say something about a mental list. I don't have any mental list. I live like this because it is my chosen way of life. I know right from wrong and I choose right. That's just who I am. Most of the time, I don't even think about it, I just DO it. I struggle sometimes, and sometimes I fail, but most of my life isn't a struggle like that. I just accept that there are things we aren't to do, and I don't do them and have no resentment or struggle with it. It's just "me".

You (and regretably many) people are witnessing the problem I have right now. I think it's probably 100 times worse to deal with a mental (thinking) issue than a physical behavioral one (if that makes any sense). Thoughts are terribly hard to conquer.

Why should we pray then? When something terrible happens to us, are we to just accept it and deal with it or are we to ask God to help us? I thought asking God for His help, and having faith that He would help us, was "leaning on God".

By the way, thanks for all the effort you put into that post. That was tons of work and I do appreciate it. (I appreciate everybody else's efforts too!).

While I can't address everything in your posts...yes I see the doubled minded switching you are doing here. First I never said to stop doing right...it just sounded as if you were overly focused on that...

We are having a thunderstorm here and my back is giving me fits so I need to get off but I wanted to offer these for you...have you ever had other Christians pray for you for your infliction?

James 5:

13 Are any of you suffering hardships? You should pray. Are any of you happy? You should sing praises. 14 Are any of you sick? You should call for the elders of the church to come and pray over you, anointing you with oil in the name of the Lord.

You can post a prayer request on this form under prayers...people will pray for you.

Second...you are obviously in a major spiritual battle here and need to rebuke these negative thoughts that you know are wrong...rebuke them in the Name of Jesus. Say it out loud..no need for shouting ...be very quite..a whisper every time you have one.

Ephesians 6
The Whole Armor of God

10 A final word: Be strong in the Lord and in his mighty power. 11 Put on all of Godís armor so that you will be able to stand firm against all strategies of the devil. 12 For we are not fighting against flesh-and-blood enemies, but against evil rulers and authorities of the unseen world, against mighty powers in this dark world, and against evil spirits in the heavenly places.

13 Therefore, put on every piece of Godís armor so you will be able to resist the enemy in the time of evil. Then after the battle you will still be standing firm. 14 Stand your ground, putting on the belt of truth and the body armor of Godís righteousness. 15 For shoes, put on the peace that comes from the Good News so that you will be fully prepared. 16 In addition to all of these, hold up the shield of faith to stop the fiery arrows of the devil. 17 Put on salvation as your helmet, and take the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God.

18 Pray in the Spirit at all times and on every occasion. Stay alert and be persistent in your prayers for all believers everywhere.

19 And pray for me, too. Ask God to give me the right words so I can boldly explain Godís mysterious plan that the Good News is for Jews and Gentiles alike. 20 I am in chains now, still preaching this message as Godís ambassador. So pray that I will keep on speaking boldly for him, as I should.

I have more information on spiritual warfare (including scriptures on it) if you are interested. You need to start fighting back IN the Name of Jesus, instead of being tossed around emotionally and mentally like this. That has got to be miserable.

God bless

diffangle
Mar 15th 2008, 02:03 AM
CM, do you read the Scriptures much?

Also, have you ever volunteered to help others less fortunate than yourself?

diffangle
Mar 15th 2008, 02:21 AM
About your health ailment, He doesn't always heal instantaneously, sometimes He moves in mysterious ways, the key is to listen to what He tells us(He can speak to us through dreams, people, and His Word).

Years ago, I was having some serious health issues(that dr's couldn't figure out), and like you, I was praying like crazy for healing. During that time I had a couple of dreams that my problems were stemming from my teeth, these dreams woke me up but I would ignore them b/c at that time I had never heard of how dangerous dental problems can be to one's health. Since I ignored those signs/dreams from Him, He got my attention through a couple of friends(who had no connection to one another)... come to find out, I had high levels of mercury in my system from amalgam fillings and seafood, so I stopped eating seafood and replaced all the metal in my mouth with porcelain and my health greatly improved... praise Him!


From http://www.epulpit.net/billy93.htm




A. It's the same with signs and proof. The problem with signs is that God does send signs but we have trouble understanding them. Or we're trying to find signs that prove what we want to say and not what God really means. Or we don't see them for what they are.


There's an old story, you've probably heard it, about an area that suffered severe flooding. The owner of this particular home was lucky enough to crawl out on the roof of his two story house. Where he promptly began to pray, "Lord, save me." And in his heart he heard God say, "Be not afraid. I'll save you My son." That really bolstered his faith.

He'd been there about an hour watching the waters rise past the front porch roof, when a boat came by. The guy in the boat hollered, "Hey, you need some help?" To which the stranded man replied, "No, thank you, the Lord is going to save me." The guy left.

About an hour after that, as the water was getting up to the top of the second floor, another boat came by. This time the guy inthe boat said, "Come on, get in, I'm here to rescue you." To which the stranded man replied, "No, thank you, the Lord is going to save me." The guy in the boat shook is head in disbelief and left.

The water continued to rise until just the peak of the roof was visible. This time a helicopter swooped down, dropped a line and the pilot hollered, "Grab on, I'm here to rescue you." And once again, the stranded man replied, "No, thank you, the Lord is going to save me." The pilot argued but the guy persisted and the pilot left to go rescue someone else.

As you can guess, the waters rose and covered the house and this guy was swept away and drowned. He wakes up to find himself in heaven, standing before God. And his mad. He turns to God and says: "How could you let me die like that? You told me you were going to rescue me." And God said, "What more do you want. I sent two boats and a helicopter."

cats_meow
Mar 15th 2008, 03:13 AM
moonglow:

I guess I somehow made you miss the boat on what I meant by Free Will. Somebody (and I don't remember who and I'm too lazy to check LOL) said that maybe God was using my illness and problems to make me draw closer to Him. I was saying that if that was true, then God was taking away my Free Will by using my problems and illness to force me to turn to Him or else suffer even more.

I know that's twisted thinking. I know. But I can't figure out how to get it to stop.

Yes, I have had people pray for me over the years and sometimes I do get a little better, but it never goes away and most times it comes back. My greatest fear is that it will come back as strong as it was in the beginning and existing will be worse hell than it is now. It just seems like an awful lot of really bad things are happening to me and just keep heaping on more and more.

I will look into the prayer section of this board, thanks for pointing that out, as I wasn't aware there was one. Stupid of me not to look, I mean, duhhh this is a Christian forum LOL

"Second...you are obviously in a major spiritual battle here and need to rebuke these negative thoughts that you know are wrong...rebuke them in the Name of Jesus. Say it out loud..no need for shouting ...be very quite..a whisper every time you have one."

This is IT! That's what's happening to me!! It IS a spritual battle. I never thought of it like that. Light bulb is now on LOL

"That has got to be miserable."

It IS. It is some of the worst torment. It is SO hard to fight thoughts.


diffangle (two points):

1) In this area, the people are such control freaks and exclusionist snobs that if you TRY to volunteer, they won't let you. They are a clique and don't want any "outsiders" to clutter up their little groups. I'm not exaggerating. I think if we lived in a metropolitan area where not "everybody knows everybody and 3/4 of the town is related", then I'd have a much better chance. Please pray for us also because my husband is losing his job within this year. Maybe we could go someplace else (this is what I want the praying to be about: where do we go)?

2) What you describe about God talking to us has happened to me. For me, I didn't "hear" anything audible. There also wasn't anything like words. It was a feeling and I just "knew", if you know what I mean. It is a feeling like no other I've ever had, like a total "peace" and a "knowledge" of what He wanted me to know. I know it was God and I know now and knew then what He was telling me and I know why: I had prayed for several years for something and He was telling me that He had finally provided it.

I obeyed and have never looked back. It still brings tears to my eyes. God talked to "me". ME. How cool is that?

3) One more thing for you: I'm so happy for you that God led you to do what you did and that your health problems improved greatly! I hope He will do that for me as well.

Later on tonight, I'm going to look at the prayer forum.

Thanks all!

aliveinchrist
Mar 15th 2008, 01:50 PM
moonglow:

I guess I somehow made you miss the boat on what I meant by Free Will. Somebody (and I don't remember who and I'm too lazy to check LOL) said that maybe God was using my illness and problems to make me draw closer to Him. I was saying that if that was true, then God was taking away my Free Will by using my problems and illness to force me to turn to Him or else suffer even more.

That was me.

And you've got the wrong thinking here.

As people have said before, God doesn't cause illnesses. Sin caused illnesses. But, God will use those illnesses and trials and problems we have, so that we can learn to trust in Him. He isn't forcing you, or anyone else, to do anything. Just because God isn't healing you, doesn't mean He's punishing you, or forcing you to suffer.

Another question for you to think on: Maybe God isn't healing you right now, because of your attitude toward Him......? Maybe change your attitude and start praising God instead. And you can. Only you can change your attitude. I know you've said that you tried............well, to quote the lady in the glass ball in Eddie Murphy's "Haunted Mansion",
"You try, you fail, you try, you fail...........You know what you do then? Try again."


I know that's twisted thinking. I know. But I can't figure out how to get it to stop.

You can get it to stop if you would just stop thinking that God is like Satan, and start praising Him and loving Him.



I'm going to repeat what somebody else has said: You have to stop trying to GUESS what God wants you to do, and start asking Him. Have a conversation with God, asking Him what is HIS will. From what i see, I see that a lot of this anger and resentment stems from you trying to guess, and failing. If you keep trying to guess, you're going to keep failing. Nothing comes of guesswork.

cheech
Mar 15th 2008, 02:57 PM
cats_meow, you are in a very difficult situation and I apologize for not being a bit more understanding. I gave you the answers I found during my similar situation but when you are in the midst of the storm, these answers don't always seem helpful. It took me years to find some of these answers...years of hurt, pain, anger and frustration. Some of these answers I didn't learn until after I passed through the storm and this may be what might happen to you.

I do understand your hurt, pain, confusion and feelings of hopelessness. Nobody knows what you are going through until they walk in your shoes. It can be a terribly lonely feeling when you feel like you have not a friend in the world. You must understand when you come here, we can only go by what you tell us and what has worked for us, but it will be up to you whether you apply anything to yourself or not. Not all things work for all people, but here, we all have one thing in common that we know works...Jesus Christ. For some of us the issues were resolved quickly. For others it took years and yet for others it is still on going. We all admit we don't always know the reasoning for why some things are allowed to happen to certain people, but we do know that God uses every situation to bring strength to us and to bring glory to Him. Anything negative thought you may think about God is a thought from the enemy because that is how he works. He uses our difficulties, our trials and tribulations to make us think that God is a horrible God...one who doesn't care about our pain and suffering. Yet if he was such a horrible God would Christ have died for us? Christ went through horrible suffering for us to the point he was almost unrecognizable, yet he went through it so we could be saved.

I recently went through a difficult time physically and in alot of pain. I wanted to give up at times but words came to me at my worst point...PRAISE AMIDST THE SUFFERING. It's easy to think negative thoughts when we are suffering because we feel God does not care enough about us and we tend to forget all the good things he has done for us during that time. During these turbulent storms in our lives it's easy to focus more on ourselves and our problems then on God and that is where our problem lies. We praise him in the good times but not during the storms. I had focused so much on my pain that I stopped praising God and thanking him for what he did give to me. So, I began praising him. When I'd awake during the night when I was ill and couldn't sleep and was in pain, I went downstairs and listened to some praise and worship music and sang it even though I was in pain. After a few songs, the pain eased up some...not fully but it became more bearable. My mood lifted as well. After a while I was able to get back to sleep...Praise Amidst The Suffering. Read the Psalms. David suffered horribly to the point of physical pain Psalm 22 (http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?book_id=23&chapter=22&version=31&context=chapter) (please read it) but when you read it it was also what Christ went through as well. Yet although he suffered and asked God why he had forsaken him, he praised him as well...Praise Amidst The Suffering.

You see, it takes alot of strength to praise God through the turbulent storms of our lives. This is called Faith.

1 Peter 1:3-9
3Praise be to the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ! In his great mercy he has given us new birth into a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, 4and into an inheritance that can never perish, spoil or fade—kept in heaven for you, 5who through faith are shielded by God's power until the coming of the salvation that is ready to be revealed in the last time. 6In this you greatly rejoice, though now for a little while you may have had to suffer grief in all kinds of trials. 7These have come so that your faith—of greater worth than gold, which perishes even though refined by fire—may be proved genuine and may result in praise, glory and honor when Jesus Christ is revealed. 8Though you have not seen him, you love him; and even though you do not see him now, you believe in him and are filled with an inexpressible and glorious joy, 9for you are receiving the goal of your faith, the salvation of your souls.

Yes, it's hard to have this faith during our most weakest points. And these weakest points can last years as you have seen. There are things we can do to help ourselves and things we can't do which we must leave up to God to take care of. I mentioned before that what you may need the most is a spiritual healing before that physical healing. The spiritual healing will bring peace and comfort to your life, but you don't have this right now. You say you live in a Christian household but in a Christian household there is peace...peace between the husband and wife. This is something you have said you don't have although you do love each other. I love my husband too but there was a time where there wasn't always peace between us and that was not a good thing. It causes division...division is from the enemy, not from God and to receive that inner and outer peace you so desperately want, you must make peace with your husband first and foremost. To go through the actions of a Christian but not have that peace between you two means trouble. There may be nothing you can do between you and your mother in law, but you can offer one final try at peace. If that does not work on her part then that is what you need to leave up to God. Right now you have alot of anger and division surrounding you and that may be the reason you feel the hoplessness in it all.

You may very well not be the cause of everything but you do have a choice in all of this...you can choose to walk the walk of Christ by seeking that internal spiritual healing and peace by turning it all over to him and praising God amidst the storm. It takes alot of faith to do this and alot of strength, I know. You are deeply hurt and it's hard to see any light at the end of the tunnel during this time but that light is there...Christ is that light and you must strive with all of your might to focus on that light because once you take your eyes off that light, you will sink in the turbulent waters in a heart beat. Christ says "Have faith. Do not doubt." There was a time I worried so much about how badly I had been treated by others that I made myself miserable and sick. I had to realize that I was doing just as they were...living in worldly ways. They were acting in the worldly way by treating me badly. I was acting in the worldly way by harboring anger against them, but Christ calls us to remove ourselves from this world and to think more in his world. He is not of this world and neither should we be of this world. The human world hurts others, harbors anger, holds grudges, and knows nothing of forgiveness. Forgiveness is the key to peace. Christ's world loves although hurts, forgives others many times, and although may suffer...continues serving others as we are called to be servants to all. Once you remove yourself and your way of thinking from this world and place it in Christ's world...you will see a difference. But right now you aren't at that point...you are living in your world of hurt both physically and emotionally and for that I do feel for you because I know what rejection is like and it's very painful. :hug:

You don't have to respond...just think about what I said and then pray on it. Ask God to help you see clearly through your pain. He knows your suffering and don't think for a minute he doesn't. But there is something you need to learn but haven't learned it yet. There is something you are doing over and over and over that is hurting you (internally). Ask God to show it to you and then ask him to help you repair it and repair the division in your family.

Believe me when I say I do understand. :hug:

turtledove
Mar 15th 2008, 05:08 PM
Dear Cats__Meow,

1 Jn 3:19 We love because he first loved us.

I am so edified by all the responses you have received on this thread. People have generously poured out their hearts with great understanding and compassion, their stories, their concern, their promises to pray for you, their experiences, and many have shared some wonderful scriptural helps. You must be much blessed and so I am hoping you will read them all (in case you haven't yet) or read again these heartfelt and loving replies and take them to your heart even if that takes a lot of time.

All is a gift from God through others for You, an instrument of God's peace and love!

Peace and blessings, :hug:

owl

ddmor
Mar 15th 2008, 06:10 PM
Solomon actually summed it up in Eccl. 2:23 For all his days are sorrowful, and his work burdensome; even in the night his heart takes no rest. This also is vanity.

Life can suck the joy out of a person.

Here are some verses that speak to the problem of losing our joy:

PROV 15:13 A merry heart makes a cheerful countenance, But by sorrow of the heart the spirit is broken.

PROV 15:15 All the days of the afflicted are evil, But he who is of a merry heart has a continual feast.

PROV 17:22 A merry heart does good, like medicine, But a broken spirit dries the bones.

moonglow
Mar 15th 2008, 08:01 PM
cats_meow

moonglow:

I guess I somehow made you miss the boat on what I meant by Free Will. Somebody (and I don't remember who and I'm too lazy to check LOL) said that maybe God was using my illness and problems to make me draw closer to Him. I was saying that if that was true, then God was taking away my Free Will by using my problems and illness to force me to turn to Him or else suffer even more.

Its doubtful He has caused this illness...but lets say He has...He fully knows this can force someone to turn to Him or away from Him...maybe it is a test, to see where you really stand?

Matthew 13
Parable of the Farmer Scattering Seed
1 Later that same day Jesus left the house and sat beside the lake. 2 A large crowd soon gathered around him, so he got into a boat. Then he sat there and taught as the people stood on the shore. 3 He told many stories in the form of parables, such as this one:

ďListen! A farmer went out to plant some seeds. 4 As he scattered them across his field, some seeds fell on a footpath, and the birds came and ate them. 5 Other seeds fell on shallow soil with underlying rock. The seeds sprouted quickly because the soil was shallow. 6 But the plants soon wilted under the hot sun, and since they didnít have deep roots, they died. 7 Other seeds fell among thorns that grew up and choked out the tender plants. 8 Still other seeds fell on fertile soil, and they produced a crop that was thirty, sixty, and even a hundred times as much as had been planted! 9 Anyone with ears to hear should listen and understand.Ē

10 His disciples came and asked him, ďWhy do you use parables when you talk to the people?Ē

11 He replied, ďYou are permitted to understand the secrets of the Kingdom of Heaven, but others are not. 12 To those who listen to my teaching, more understanding will be given, and they will have an abundance of knowledge. But for those who are not listening, even what little understanding they have will be taken away from them. 13 That is why I use these parables,

For they look, but they donít really see.
They hear, but they donít really listen or understand.

14 This fulfills the prophecy of Isaiah that says,

ĎWhen you hear what I say,
you will not understand.
When you see what I do,
you will not comprehend.
15 For the hearts of these people are hardened,
and their ears cannot hear,
and they have closed their eyesó
so their eyes cannot see,
and their ears cannot hear,
and their hearts cannot understand,
and they cannot turn to me
and let me heal them.í

16 ďBut blessed are your eyes, because they see; and your ears, because they hear. 17 I tell you the truth, many prophets and righteous people longed to see what you see, but they didnít see it. And they longed to hear what you hear, but they didnít hear it.

18 ďNow listen to the explanation of the parable about the farmer planting seeds: 19 The seed that fell on the footpath represents those who hear the message about the Kingdom and donít understand it. Then the evil one comes and snatches away the seed that was planted in their hearts. 20 The seed on the rocky soil represents those who hear the message and immediately receive it with joy. 21 But since they donít have deep roots, they donít last long. They fall away as soon as they have problems or are persecuted for believing Godís word. 22 The seed that fell among the thorns represents those who hear Godís word, but all too quickly the message is crowded out by the worries of this life and the lure of wealth, so no fruit is produced. 23 The seed that fell on good soil represents those who truly hear and understand Godís word and produce a harvest of thirty, sixty, or even a hundred times as much as had been planted!Ē

I know that's twisted thinking. I know. But I can't figure out how to get it to stop.

As I said...rebuke it in the Name of Jesus. I used to suffer from terrible, horrible thoughts of killing myself...deep depression, very twisted thinking...I tried therapy, medication, was in and out of a mental health hospitals...nothing really helped until I started rebuking these thoughts in the Name of Jesus. At the time I knew nothing of spiritual warfare...no one taught me how to do this...or why I should do it...but I was desperate...so tired of this black cloud descending on my mind. It worked! the awful thoughts lifted, just like storm clouds leaving and the sun shinning. :)

Yes, I have had people pray for me over the years and sometimes I do get a little better, but it never goes away and most times it comes back. My greatest fear is that it will come back as strong as it was in the beginning and existing will be worse hell than it is now. It just seems like an awful lot of really bad things are happening to me and just keep heaping on more and more.

I will look into the prayer section of this board, thanks for pointing that out, as I wasn't aware there was one. Stupid of me not to look, I mean, duhhh this is a Christian forum LOL

"Second...you are obviously in a major spiritual battle here and need to rebuke these negative thoughts that you know are wrong...rebuke them in the Name of Jesus. Say it out loud..no need for shouting ...be very quite..a whisper every time you have one."

This is IT! That's what's happening to me!! It IS a spritual battle. I never thought of it like that. Light bulb is now on LOL

"That has got to be miserable."

It IS. It is some of the worst torment. It is SO hard to fight thoughts.

I see everything that is difficult as a trial...like being in a test so to speak to see if I am worthy later in Heaven for a Heavenly job I might be given. It helps ..it keep me from seeing these things as being meaningless...of amounting to nothing at all...that the suffering is for no reason at all. There are so many scriptures on this its hard for me to pick one to show you...

I hope you are doing well today! I feel horrible..my back and neck is out badly causing alot of dizziness...but I will get through this day by the grace of God.

God bless