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Love Child
Apr 26th 2008, 05:56 AM
1 John 4:1-4 tells us not believe every spirit, but to test them. It says that every spirit that confesses that jesus Christ has come in the flesh is of God, and every spirit that does not confess that jesus Christ has come in the flesh is not of God (NKJV.) So is the bible telling us that we, including prophets and non-prophets, can ask the voice in our head if Jesus christ is come in the flesh, and if that voice says yes then without a doubt the spirit is good, and if the spirit say no then without a doubt that the spirit is of the devil. I know for a fact that any spirit of God will not say that Jesus Christ is not come in the flesh. But what if the Devil wants to trick a believer. Could not satin say something Dramatic to a believer just to worry him, like: "I am gonna kill soon," and then add "Jesus is come in the flesh?" Or are we only suppose to ask the human with the spirit in them this question like: a prophet, or some kind of leader?

LivingSacrafice
Apr 26th 2008, 09:56 AM
One thing I will say about that is that only God hears our thoughts,like in the bible Jesus knew what they were thinking when they were trying to stone him and trying to kill and set him up.Theirs three voices you hear in your mind,Gods,the devils,and your own voice.So if you ask a question in your head
theirs only two people that can answer you,yourself or God.Now theirs ways to manipulate that by saying it out loud or whatever.But when you speak out loud the Devil can hear you just like anyone else can hear you.

Dan Moran
Apr 26th 2008, 11:24 AM
1 John 4:1-4 tells us not believe every spirit, but to test them. It says that every spirit that confesses that jesus Christ has come in the flesh is of God, and every spirit that does not confess that jesus Christ has come in the flesh is not of God (NKJV.) So is the bible telling us that we, including prophets and non-prophets, can ask the voice in our head if Jesus christ is come in the flesh, and if that voice says yes then without a doubt the spirit is good, and if the spirit say no then without a doubt that the spirit is of the devil. I know for a fact that any spirit of God will not say that Jesus Christ is not come in the flesh. But what if the Devil wants to trick a believer. Could not satin say something Dramatic to a believer just to worry him, like: "I am gonna kill soon," and then add "Jesus is come in the flesh?" Or are we only suppose to ask the human with the spirit in them this question like: a prophet, or some kind of leader?
You test the spirits by learning what is God's Word. What aligns itself with God's Word and those actions as a result of the alignment will produce those things listed in Galatians 5:22-23. This is the biggest problem we have with Christians. So fast to speak and little or no time to really know what they're speaking. In other words, their study of the Word of God. Everyone wants to be a teacher, but one needs to not only know the Word of God or have a good command of it, but they must also show you where they are coming from.

Ask yourself: Is what this person telling me, aligning with the truth in God's Word?

II Corinthians 11:14

And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.

Read the context surrounding this scripture here. You'll see why a Christian needs to be careful to test those spirits.

shine
Apr 26th 2008, 01:29 PM
Hi Love Child

I don't know if you had made up those examples
(Could not satin say something Dramatic to a believer just to worry him, like: "I am gonna kill soon," and then add "Jesus is come in the flesh?")_ in order to communicate your point or if they were indicative of your experience?? One thing I have found useful when learning about this topic (discerning of spirits) is to remember that our overall goal is to stay concious of Jesus and focus on him. A lot harder than it sounds! If we were to make this our aim then we might find some resistance from the enemy and discernment to overcome this resistance might prove neccesrary but the closer you are to Jesus the more clearly you can see.
If your thoughts are focussed on glorifying the Lord or moving into better relationship with him then it will pull up a sharper contrast when thoughts from the enemy enter your mind.
The danger is when practically looking at this topic we can begin to move our gaze from Jesus victory on the cross, and without that in mind we can quickly get swamped!
One last thing, when I have wondered how to tell a true Christian (teacher or otherwise) from a false Christian the Lord has brought to my mind Luke 6:43.

Hope this has helped.
Strengthened in Christ, Si

Romans 12:21 Be not overcome of evil, but overcome evil with good.

Luke 6:43
43"No good tree bears bad fruit, nor does a bad tree bear good fruit.

IamBill
Apr 26th 2008, 04:35 PM
1 John 4:1-4 tells us not believe every spirit, but to test them. It says that every spirit that confesses that jesus Christ has come in the flesh is of God, and every spirit that does not confess that jesus Christ has come in the flesh is not of God (NKJV.) So is the bible telling us that we, including prophets and non-prophets, can ask the voice in our head if Jesus christ is come in the flesh, and if that voice says yes then without a doubt the spirit is good, and if the spirit say no then without a doubt that the spirit is of the devil. I know for a fact that any spirit of God will not say that Jesus Christ is not come in the flesh. But what if the Devil wants to trick a believer. Could not satin say something Dramatic to a believer just to worry him, like: "I am gonna kill soon," and then add "Jesus is come in the flesh?" Or are we only suppose to ask the human with the spirit in them this question like: a prophet, or some kind of leader?

:)
1, Deception? absolutely YES, they can be Extremely deceptive. It is the very reason why we are given this weapon and Told to use it.

2, "that confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh. understand the KEY, "confesses". and ... "does Not confess"
You must Trust in this - Evil cannot do it, evil will not do it.

3, Jesus will smile upon you for NOT accepting anything that does not accept Him.

Again pay close attention to EVERY word, and accept NO response other than the answer to - the - question.

Love Child
Apr 26th 2008, 10:45 PM
Hi Love Child

I don't know if you had made up those examples
(Could not satin say something Dramatic to a believer just to worry him, like: "I am gonna kill soon," and then add "Jesus is come in the flesh?")_ in order to communicate your point or if they were indicative of your experience?? One thing I have found useful when learning about this topic (discerning of spirits) is to remember that our overall goal is to stay concious of Jesus and focus on him. A lot harder than it sounds! If we were to make this our aim then we might find some resistance from the enemy and discernment to overcome this resistance might prove neccesrary but the closer you are to Jesus the more clearly you can see.
If your thoughts are focussed on glorifying the Lord or moving into better relationship with him then it will pull up a sharper contrast when thoughts from the enemy enter your mind.
The danger is when practically looking at this topic we can begin to move our gaze from Jesus victory on the cross, and without that in mind we can quickly get swamped!
One last thing, when I have wondered how to tell a true Christian (teacher or otherwise) from a false Christian the Lord has brought to my mind Luke 6:43.

Hope this has helped.
Strengthened in Christ, Si

Romans 12:21 Be not overcome of evil, but overcome evil with good.

Luke 6:43
43"No good tree bears bad fruit, nor does a bad tree bear good fruit.

Love Child: I use that as an example, but a thought did came into my head that I felt that was not right, but had confessed that jesus christ is come in the flesh.

ARCHER42
Apr 27th 2008, 12:14 AM
quote: (1, Deception? absolutely YES, they can be Extremely deceptive. It is the very reason why we are given this weapon and Told to use it.

2, "that confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh. understand the KEY, "confesses". and ... "does Not confess"
You must Trust in this - Evil cannot do it, evil will not do it.)


Exactly! Listen to what the confession is....you need to be discerning... The Spirit of God will confess that Jesus the Christ is come in the flesh.. He testifies about who Jesus Christ really is and He will reveal that to your heart and your spirit and your spirit will bear witness to the Truth and thus the confession on who Jesus Christ is. Alot of people talk about God.. they even talk about Jesus Christ.. but in their confession do they state and 'confess' that the One they follow is Truely God in the flesh.... Ask Jesus the Christ and He will help you with discernment and give you wisdom...
Evil comes posing as truth.. and the Scripture gives us the 'litmust' test as far as the 'spirit' behind the confession.... its their for a believers protection against deception. Remember Jesus the Christ Loves you!!

Love Child
Apr 27th 2008, 01:43 AM
quote: (1, Deception? absolutely YES, they can be Extremely deceptive. It is the very reason why we are given this weapon and Told to use it.

2, "that confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh. understand the KEY, "confesses". and ... "does Not confess"
You must Trust in this - Evil cannot do it, evil will not do it.)


Exactly! Listen to what the confession is....you need to be discerning... The Spirit of God will confess that Jesus the Christ is come in the flesh.. He testifies about who Jesus Christ really is and He will reveal that to your heart and your spirit and your spirit will bear witness to the Truth and thus the confession on who Jesus Christ is. Alot of people talk about God.. they even talk about Jesus Christ.. but in their confession do they state and 'confess' that the One they follow is Truely God in the flesh.... Ask Jesus the Christ and He will help you with discernment and give you wisdom...
Evil comes posing as truth.. and the Scripture gives us the 'litmust' test as far as the 'spirit' behind the confession.... its their for a believers protection against deception. Remember Jesus the Christ Loves you!!

I heard a thought like voice in my head that was telling me something about my future. I prefer not knowing what was told to me, but rather experience it for my self. the voice told me if I deny what was told to me I would be calling him a... well let me just say it like this, he told me not to call him a liar. So I went to bed trying not to accept what was told to me without calling him a liar. I woke up and I ended up calling him a liar in my mind, but I did not willfully think it. then immediatelly a voice came to my mind telling me that I had blasphemed against... well lets just say in so many words that he said I am not forgiven, not because of what was said in my mind because I had no control of that, but what was said in my heart. I would have paid no attention to the voice because I know I did not I did not blasphemed in any way, but what had disturbed me is that the voice had said to me that The Lord and savior Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. Thus causing me to wonder the source of the conversation.

shine
Apr 27th 2008, 10:21 PM
To Lovechild,

Over the past year the Lord has kindly been showing me discernment and from what I have experienced this spirit does not sound one bit like God.

Remember the fruit of the spirit is love joy peace etc. if this spirit is not bringing you into thoughts that may bear those fruits (ie. bringing these things into your spirit) then I very much doubt it is from God.

What you said about this spirit claiming to be of God and telling you your future and saying that by not believing/listening to it you will be condemned.

A scriptural reference of someone not believing God when he told them something about their future is Peter.
When the Lord said to Peter, "Before the cock crows you will deny me three times" he did not believe Jesus. This shows that the Lord doesn't condemn us if we do not believe him.

I have also witnessed this in my own experiences.

When I was younger I was in a strong place in Christ and was aware of the presence of God. Often at the time I would get thought's which were warning/telling me about something sinful I was to do a few years later.
At the time I just pushed them aside and did not believe them. However in the years to come these things proved true and now that my discernment has improved I truly believe that it was the Lord /Holy Spirit telling me these things.

The point of me telling you this is to highlight that even though I did not listen to him the Lord has forgiven me. What the spirit was saying to you happened to me really except God forgave me. That characteristic in itself shows you that this spirit's nature is not of God.

He truly is a God of mercy and he is slow to condemn. He knows we are weak and he loves us anyway. He died so that we can be forgiven. If you get thoughts/spirits that have this fear/control again I would be very skeptical about where they are from.

I hope this might help to put your mind at rest. He truly has forgiven us don't let anything claim otherwise. He doesn't try and manipulate us or control us through fear where is the love (or free will for that matter) in that?

My advice would be speak the words out loud "Jesus Christ is Lord" and even sing or say a prayer of praise to God.
If this Spirit truly is from God then it will be no problem (God wants us to praise him for his goodness) but if as I suspect it is not from God it will not be able bear the sound of you praising God and you may even feel yourself shudder and it leave. Speaking out loud definately seems to be more effective in these cases.

Hope this Helps
Christ be with you
Si

Love Child
Apr 27th 2008, 11:56 PM
To Lovechild,

Over the past year the Lord has kindly been showing me discernment and from what I have experienced this spirit does not sound one bit like God.

Remember the fruit of the spirit is love joy peace etc. if this spirit is not bringing you into thoughts that may bear those fruits (ie. bringing these things into your spirit) then I very much doubt it is from God.

What you said about this spirit claiming to be of God and telling you your future and saying that by not believing/listening to it you will be condemned.

A scriptural reference of someone not believing God when he told them something about their future is Peter.
When the Lord said to Peter, "Before the cock crows you will deny me three times" he did not believe Jesus. This shows that the Lord doesn't condemn us if we do not believe him.

I have also witnessed this in my own experiences.

When I was younger I was in a strong place in Christ and was aware of the presence of God. Often at the time I would get thought's which were warning/telling me about something sinful I was to do a few years later.
At the time I just pushed them aside and did not believe them. However in the years to come these things proved true and now that my discernment has improved I truly believe that it was the Lord /Holy Spirit telling me these things.

The point of me telling you this is to highlight that even though I did not listen to him the Lord has forgiven me. What the spirit was saying to you happened to me really except God forgave me. That characteristic in itself shows you that this spirit's nature is not of God.

He truly is a God of mercy and he is slow to condemn. He knows we are weak and he loves us anyway. He died so that we can be forgiven. If you get thoughts/spirits that have this fear/control again I would be very skeptical about where they are from.

I hope this might help to put your mind at rest. He truly has forgiven us don't let anything claim otherwise. He doesn't try and manipulate us or control us through fear where is the love (or free will for that matter) in that?

My advice would be speak the words out loud "Jesus Christ is Lord" and even sing or say a prayer of praise to God.
If this Spirit truly is from God then it will be no problem (God wants us to praise him for his goodness) but if as I suspect it is not from God it will not be able bear the sound of you praising God and you may even feel yourself shudder and it leave. Speaking out loud definately seems to be more effective in these cases.

Hope this Helps
Christ be with you
Si

he didn't say that if I didn't believe him I would be calling him a liar, but he said not to call him a liar. the next day while I was trying handle the thing that was told to me about my future I ended up hearing me saying it in my head. immediatly a thought came to me saying I committed the unforgivable sin (not in those words those), not because of the thought that I could not control but for the thought in my heart. I believe the voice was trying to say that my heart agreed with what the thought in my head. I know that in my heart that I did not want what was told to me to definitly come to past, but if there where some kind of emotion in my heart that agreed with the thought... well I don't think I can control an emotion that happenned within a split second in my heart so I naturally would have blown it all off- if the voice did not ended the conversation with the lord and savior Jesus Christ is come in the flesh (something like that.) the point is that if a spirit was to say to me that I am going to hell, I would believe that it is the devil and I would rebuke it, but if the spirit was to end what he is saying with Jesus Christ is come in the flesh, then that would be a completly different scenior for me.

shine
Apr 28th 2008, 11:58 AM
Hi Love Child

Even what you are saying now casts doubts in my mind. I agree with Archer42.

ARCHER42Yes that whole series of words sounded confusing.. I would also say that you have experienced the author of confusion... God, Himself, is not the author of confusion. Pauls first letter to the church at Corinth states this.

I have been in all sorts of places spirituallly that seem far from God's love and have had many thoughts like this trying to convince me of my condemnation. It has taken me a very long time to realise and trust that even convincing sounding thoughts like this are not of God. Luckily we have a God who is the source of all patience.

It makes no sense for God to condemn you for this. Why would God send his son (who already knew what was in the heart of man) to die for you?

Love is the reason. He loves us more than our imperfections and our weaknesses.

God already knows our hearts and when you accepted Christ as saviour he knew all that you had within your heart the bad and the good and he still accepted you.

We all have some bad in our hearts its just how we are, it's part of being human , Jesus knew that and loved us anyway.

John 2:23-2:26

Now when He was in Jerusalem at the Passover, during the feast, many believed in His name, observing His signs which He was doing.
But Jesus, on His part, was not entrusting Himself to them, for He knew all men and because He did not need anyone to testify concerning man, for He Himself knew what was in man.


He went on to die for us despite knowing that we had evil within us all because he loves us all more than that.

I have had thoughts similar to this and you might just have to try your best to trust in God.
I have had evil thoughts in my heart and worried afterwards that I might never change, or that these thoughts had offended God in a way that can never be healed. However I have kept on struggling and praying for help from the Lord and have found that it is simply not true!

It is impossible to make yourself right or good, then go before God because only God has the power to change us or make us right.
Its only by his grace (that he freely gives us) that we can come anywhere near him and his goodness.

Why would God condemn you for something that you cannot change? If you have the desire to change that is enough share that desire prayerfully with God. It is God alone who can perform this feat. and by changing our hearts sets us free.

Please do not feel alone in this kind of attack. I think a fair few Christians go through this as they grow. Do you have a Pastor or anyone else you can talk to who might be able to encourage you?

Strength in Christ

Si

Love Child
Apr 28th 2008, 01:38 PM
Hi Love Child

Even what you are saying now casts doubts in my mind. I agree with Archer42.

ARCHER42Yes that whole series of words sounded confusing.. I would also say that you have experienced the author of confusion... God, Himself, is not the author of confusion. Pauls first letter to the church at Corinth states this.

I have been in all sorts of places spirituallly that seem far from God's love and have had many thoughts like this trying to convince me of my condemnation. It has taken me a very long time to realise and trust that even convincing sounding thoughts like this are not of God. Luckily we have a God who is the source of all patience.

It makes no sense for God to condemn you for this. Why would God send his son (who already knew what was in the heart of man) to die for you?

Love is the reason. He loves us more than our imperfections and our weaknesses.

God already knows our hearts and when you accepted Christ as saviour he knew all that you had within your heart the bad and the good and he still accepted you.

We all have some bad in our hearts its just how we are, it's part of being human , Jesus knew that and loved us anyway.

John 2:23-2:26

Now when He was in Jerusalem at the Passover, during the feast, many believed in His name, observing His signs which He was doing.
But Jesus, on His part, was not entrusting Himself to them, for He knew all men and because He did not need anyone to testify concerning man, for He Himself knew what was in man.


He went on to die for us despite knowing that we had evil within us all because he loves us all more than that.

I have had thoughts similar to this and you might just have to try your best to trust in God.
I have had evil thoughts in my heart and worried afterwards that I might never change, or that these thoughts had offended God in a way that can never be healed. However I have kept on struggling and praying for help from the Lord and have found that it is simply not true!

It is impossible to make yourself right or good, then go before God because only God has the power to change us or make us right.
Its only by his grace (that he freely gives us) that we can come anywhere near him and his goodness.

Why would God condemn you for something that you cannot change? If you have the desire to change that is enough share that desire prayerfully with God. It is God alone who can perform this feat. and by changing our hearts sets us free.

Please do not feel alone in this kind of attack. I think a fair few Christians go through this as they grow. Do you have a Pastor or anyone else you can talk to who might be able to encourage you?

Strength in Christ

Si

Evil can not say that the "Jesus Christ is come in the flesh." A voice in my head told me that I am going to Hell, and ended it with "Jesus Christ is come in the flesh." It is the fact that the sentance was ended with " The Lord and Savior Jesus Christ is come in the flesh" part that is bothering me because the bible says that only good spirits can say that. I don't need to know what spirit was talking to me, but I need to know if bad spirits can say that sentance. If bad spirits can't say that then maybe I am going to hell. If no one can give me their intepetation of what of 1 John 4:1-4 mean then I am just going to say that I am going to Hell. (I rebuke me in the name of jesus for saying that I am going to Hell.)

Brother Mark
Apr 28th 2008, 01:41 PM
Evil can not say that the "Jesus Christ is come in the flesh." A voice in my head told me that I am going to Hell, and ended it with "Jesus Christ is come in the flesh." It is the fact that the sentance was ended with " The Lord and Savior Jesus Christ is come in the flesh" part that is bothering me because the bible says that only good spirits can say that. I don't need to know what spirit was talking to me, but I need to know if bad spirits can say that sentance. If bad spirits can't say that then maybe I am going to hell. If no one can give me their intepetation of what of 1 John 4:1-4 mean then I am just going to say that I am going to Hell. (I rebuke me in the name of jesus for saying that I am going to Hell.)

Mark 1:23-26
23 And just then there was in their synagogue a man with an unclean spirit; and he cried out, 24 saying, "What do we have to do with You, Jesus of Nazareth? Have You come to destroy us? I know who You are the Holy One of God!" 25 And Jesus rebuked him, saying, "Be quiet, and come out of him!" 26 And throwing him into convulsions, the unclean spirit cried out with a loud voice, and came out of him.
NASB

Athanasius
Apr 28th 2008, 01:45 PM
1 John 4:1-4 tells us not believe every spirit, but to test them. It says that every spirit that confesses that jesus Christ has come in the flesh is of God, and every spirit that does not confess that jesus Christ has come in the flesh is not of God (NKJV.) So is the bible telling us that we, including prophets and non-prophets, can ask the voice in our head if Jesus christ is come in the flesh, and if that voice says yes then without a doubt the spirit is good, and if the spirit say no then without a doubt that the spirit is of the devil. I know for a fact that any spirit of God will not say that Jesus Christ is not come in the flesh. But what if the Devil wants to trick a believer. Could not satin say something Dramatic to a believer just to worry him, like: "I am gonna kill soon," and then add "Jesus is come in the flesh?" Or are we only suppose to ask the human with the spirit in them this question like: a prophet, or some kind of leader?

No, you don't go 'asking the voice in your head'. That 'voice' in your head is very unreliable. You may find, as a lot of people do, that the voice likes to 'play tricks'. Aside from playing tricks it often says the things you want to say.

Love Child
Apr 28th 2008, 02:39 PM
What is going on? I can understand that I have been sent to the chat to the moderators because of my question, but does that mean that I will not be able to help other people out with their problems, talk to them, or start up any new threads. Am I in some kind of trouble here because of my question?

Brother Mark
Apr 28th 2008, 02:40 PM
What is going on? I can understand that I have been sent to the chat to the moderators because of my question, but does that mean that I will not be able to help other people out with their problems, talk to them, or start up any new threads. Am I in some kind of trouble here because of my question?

No, you are not in any trouble at all as far as the board rules are concerned. You can still participate fully on the board. Only this thread was moved here. Karen will be with you soon.

karenoka27
Apr 28th 2008, 02:48 PM
Hi, I thought it might be best to have you come in here and discuss your thoughts on this. Sometimes when you get a lot of answers you could end up being more confused than when you started. I would like to try to see that doesn't happen to you.

Tell me a little bit about yourself if you wouldn't mind. I love the people on this board and I love to get to know them so please don't feel threatened or like you did something wrong. We all want God's truth to be shared and we want to encourage others in their walk with the Lord. That is all I want to do with you.

You seem confused. How long have you known the Lord as your personal Savior? I love testimonies and we should always be thrilled to share ours.
Mine is posted in the testimony forum and you are welcome to read it.
Also do you have a church that you go too, and how often do you read God's Word?

karenoka27
Apr 28th 2008, 02:56 PM
I want to help you out, but you need to trust that I am here to encourage you. I need you to help me out in getting to know where you are at. How long have you known the Lord, do you have a church that you attend and how often do you read your Bible?
These are all good questions to answer and one should never feel threatened by them. I just am hoping to see where you are coming from so I can help you understand your question.

You would "never" hear a voice from God that says you are going to hell...absolutely never!
There are many reasons for that...one being that God is not willing that any should perish(2 Peter 3:9) so he would never whisper in someone's ear that they are going to hell...


By the way, no one on the board can read your posts now, only the mods can see it.

Love Child
Apr 28th 2008, 03:08 PM
Hi, I thought it might be best to have you come in here and discuss your thoughts on this. Sometimes when you get a lot of answers you could end up being more confused than when you started. I would like to try to see that doesn't happen to you.

Tell me a little bit about yourself if you wouldn't mind. I love the people on this board and I love to get to know them so please don't feel threatened or like you did something wrong. We all want God's truth to be shared and we want to encourage others in their walk with the Lord. That is all I want to do with you.

You seem confused. How long have you known the Lord as your personal Savior? I love testimonies and we should always be thrilled to share ours.
Mine is posted in the testimony forum and you are welcome to read it.
Also do you have a church that you go too, and how often do you read God's Word?
I first got saved about 8 years ago (to my belife), I ended up backsileding shortly afterwards. I joined the new age moment from about the time I backslided till four years latter. The Lord called me out of it, and called me to be saved. Then in 2007 I learned how to talk to God, and I learned how to disarn the difference between god voice and the devil voice. But when I take liturally what the bible says in 1 john 4:1-4 into account to what I heard a voice say to me in my head saying that I am going to hell then it becomes confusing because to me that just do not sound like God.

Love Child
Apr 28th 2008, 03:11 PM
I want to help you out, but you need to trust that I am here to encourage you. I need you to help me out in getting to know where you are at. How long have you known the Lord, do you have a church that you attend and how often do you read your Bible?
These are all good questions to answer and one should never feel threatened by them. I just am hoping to see where you are coming from so I can help you understand your question.

You would "never" hear a voice from God that says you are going to hell...absolutely never!
There are many reasons for that...one being that God is not willing that any should perish(2 Peter 3:9) so he would never whisper in someone's ear that they are going to hell...


By the way, no one on the board can read your posts now, only the mods can see it.

I love church, I try to go every day, and I worship the too. But I really do not know the bible that much.

dljc
Apr 28th 2008, 03:13 PM
Love Child,

Don't be alarmed by the missing posts in this thread. The purpose of that was so you and Karen could concentrate your conversation between each other. It cuts down on added confusion when you don't feel you have to answer the other members. Also keep in mind that the members that are not on the Staff here can no longer see this thread, it's in a private forum and only you and us Mods and Admin can see it now. So please understand why the posts are now missing. It's just to help cut down on confusion, that's all.

I'll step back out of this thread, I just wanted to let you know what was going on. :)

Love Child
Apr 28th 2008, 03:13 PM
I want to help you out, but you need to trust that I am here to encourage you. I need you to help me out in getting to know where you are at. How long have you known the Lord, do you have a church that you attend and how often do you read your Bible?
These are all good questions to answer and one should never feel threatened by them. I just am hoping to see where you are coming from so I can help you understand your question.

You would "never" hear a voice from God that says you are going to hell...absolutely never!
There are many reasons for that...one being that God is not willing that any should perish(2 Peter 3:9) so he would never whisper in someone's ear that they are going to hell...


By the way, no one on the board can read your posts now, only the mods can see it.
The voice was saying that I blasphemed the Holy Ghost in my heart and ended it with jesus christ is come in the flesh

Love Child
Apr 28th 2008, 03:17 PM
Mark 1:23-26
23 And just then there was in their synagogue a man with an unclean spirit; and he cried out, 24 saying, "What do we have to do with You, Jesus of Nazareth? Have You come to destroy us? I know who You are the Holy One of God!" 25 And Jesus rebuked him, saying, "Be quiet, and come out of him!" 26 And throwing him into convulsions, the unclean spirit cried out with a loud voice, and came out of him.
NASB

I guess that what you are trying to say that demons to can confess that Jesus Christ is come into the flesh, but wouldn't that be contridicting 1 John 4:1-4

dljc
Apr 28th 2008, 03:27 PM
Love Child,

I'm going to step back into this thread, Karen has asked me to for the reason we were under the impression from your username that you are female. I looked at your profile and see that there is a good chance you are a guy instead so there is just a little confusion on our end. It's better that we know this for accountability reasons ok.

So without sounding rude, are you a guy or a gal?

Love Child
Apr 28th 2008, 03:32 PM
Love Child,

I'm going to step back into this thread, Karen has asked me to for the reason we were under the impression from your username that you are female. I looked at your profile and see that there is a good chance you are a guy instead so there is just a little confusion on our end. It's better that we know this for accountability reasons ok.

So without sounding rude, are you a guy or a gal?

I am a guy, why does that matter.

dljc
Apr 28th 2008, 03:40 PM
I would also like to show you something.

1 John 4:1-4 KJV

1 Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.

2 Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God:

3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.

4 Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.


Matthew 7:
15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.

16 Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?

17 Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.

18 A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.

19 Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.

20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.

These verses from Matthew 7 are Jesus' words warning us of false prophets. The verses from 1 John also speak of false prophets gone out into the world.

Jesus told us how to discern the differences between the good fruit and the evil/corrupt fruit. We will know them by their fruit. Is it good fruit or corrupt?

You also have to recognize the spiritual warfare aspect of all of this. Paul tells us in Ephesians 6:10-20 about spiritual warfare. The enemy doesn't want to let you go, you were blind from birth. If God has opened your eyes to Him, the enemy is trying to confuse you to keep you on his side. Even mature Christians fight these battles. Because the enemy doesn't want us doing God's Will. The enemy would rather we do his will. Put on the armor!

Ephesians 6:10-20
10 Finally, my brethren, be strong in the Lord, and in the power of his might.

11 Put on the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil.

12 For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.

13 Wherefore take unto you the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand.

14 Stand therefore, having your loins girt about with truth, and having on the breastplate of righteousness;

15 And your feet shod with the preparation of the gospel of peace;

16 Above all, taking the shield of faith, wherewith ye shall be able to quench all the fiery darts of the wicked.

17 And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God:

18 Praying always with all prayer and supplication in the Spirit, and watching thereunto with all perseverance and supplication for all saints;

19 And for me, that utterance may be given unto me, that I may open my mouth boldly, to make known the mystery of the gospel,

20 For which I am an ambassador in bonds: that therein I may speak boldly, as I ought to speak.


Pray and ask God to protect you from the voice that isn't from Him. He can and will silence any voice that is not of Him. Just as Jesus silenced the demons He encountered in His earthly ministry.

dljc
Apr 28th 2008, 03:43 PM
I am a guy, why does that matter.Love Child,

I assure you, otherwise it doesn't make any difference. But for accountability purposes, since this is in a private forum, it is better that you talk to another guy. Which is why I was asked to step in. My name is Cliff, it's nice to meet you. :pp And I'm sorry about all of this added conversation to this thread. :D

Love Child
Apr 28th 2008, 03:51 PM
I would also like to show you something.

1 John 4:1-4 KJV

1 Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.

2 Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God:

3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.

4 Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.


Matthew 7:
15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.

16 Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?

17 Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.

18 A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.

19 Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.

20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.

These verses from Matthew 7 are Jesus' words warning us of false prophets. The verses from 1 John also speak of false prophets gone out into the world.

Jesus told us how to discern the differences between the good fruit and the evil/corrupt fruit. We will know them by their fruit. Is it good fruit or corrupt?

You also have to recognize the spiritual warfare aspect of all of this. Paul tells us in Ephesians 6:10-20 about spiritual warfare. The enemy doesn't want to let you go, you were blind from birth. If God has opened your eyes to Him, the enemy is trying to confuse you to keep you on his side. Even mature Christians fight these battles. Because the enemy doesn't want us doing God's Will. The enemy would rather we do his will. Put on the armor!

Ephesians 6:10-20
10 Finally, my brethren, be strong in the Lord, and in the power of his might.

11 Put on the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil.

12 For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.

13 Wherefore take unto you the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand.

14 Stand therefore, having your loins girt about with truth, and having on the breastplate of righteousness;

15 And your feet shod with the preparation of the gospel of peace;

16 Above all, taking the shield of faith, wherewith ye shall be able to quench all the fiery darts of the wicked.

17 And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God:

18 Praying always with all prayer and supplication in the Spirit, and watching thereunto with all perseverance and supplication for all saints;

19 And for me, that utterance may be given unto me, that I may open my mouth boldly, to make known the mystery of the gospel,

20 For which I am an ambassador in bonds: that therein I may speak boldly, as I ought to speak.


Pray and ask God to protect you from the voice that isn't from Him. He can and will silence any voice that is not of Him. Just as Jesus silenced the demons He encountered in His earthly ministry.

Well thankyou for that message. I heard that it was only attended for prophets only, but when I read test the spirits for there are many false prophets that gone out into the world. Well what I concluded that he was talking to people who are potential prophets, so if a spirit comes to some one and tell them to prophetsigh about something to the church, well the prophet is suppose to ask the spirit if Jesus christ is come in the flesh and if the spirit say no then don't share the prophetcy, but if the spirit say yes then tell it to everyone like it was God himself who told you.

dljc
Apr 28th 2008, 04:09 PM
LC,

It's good to read the whole passage in context.

1 John 4:1-6

1 Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.

2 Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God:

3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.

4 Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

5 They are of the world: therefore speak they of the world, and the world heareth them.

6 We are of God: he that knoweth God heareth us; he that is not of God heareth not us. Hereby know we the spirit of truth, and the spirit of error.

The verses from Matthew 7 that I referenced to speaks of wolves in sheep's clothing. We are warned often in the New Testament to be aware that they are out there. Observe the fruit and test it against God's Word. Is it good fruit or corrupt fruit? Does it line up with God's Word? If it does, then it's good fruit, if it doesn't, it's corrupt fruit. This is why it's important for you yourself to read the Bible, spend time with the Lord, and look for the good fruit.

John 10:14 I am the good shepherd, and know my sheep, and am known of mine.

27 My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow me:

When you know His voice, you know the truth. And you will recognize the strangers voice for what it is, the corrupt fruit.

Look at what I've said, is it good fruit, or is it corrupt? Am I leading you toward Him, or leading you away from Him?

Love Child
Apr 28th 2008, 04:29 PM
Mark 1:23-26
23 And just then there was in their synagogue a man with an unclean spirit; and he cried out, 24 saying, "What do we have to do with You, Jesus of Nazareth? Have You come to destroy us? I know who You are the Holy One of God!" 25 And Jesus rebuked him, saying, "Be quiet, and come out of him!" 26 And throwing him into convulsions, the unclean spirit cried out with a loud voice, and came out of him.
NASB
They had acknowledge him, but they still did not confessed that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. I will totally appricate it if y'all would tell me if satin can directly say that Jesus Christ is come into the flesh by messaging: "yes a demon can directly make that exact statement," or "A demon can not make that exact statement," but I would like to know how it would not contridict 1 john 4:1-4 if you say that a demon can directly make that statement.

Love Child
Apr 28th 2008, 06:20 PM
They had acknowledge him, but they still did not confessed that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. I will totally appricate it if y'all would tell me if satin can directly say that Jesus Christ is come into the flesh by messaging: "yes a demon can directly make that exact statement," or "A demon can not make that exact statement," but I would like to know how it would not contridict 1 john 4:1-4 if you say that a demon can directly make that statement.

Would someone please respond to me?

dljc
Apr 28th 2008, 07:23 PM
I apologize for the delay LC, I had something that came up that I had to go take care of. (Car insurance).


As has been pointed out earlier in the thread the word confess is the key.

Confess -

1. to acknowledge or avow (a fault, crime, misdeed, weakness, etc.) by way of revelation.
2. to own or admit as true: I must confess that I haven't read the book.
3. to declare or acknowledge (one's sins), esp. to God or a priest in order to obtain absolution.
4. (of a priest) to hear the confession of (a person).
5. to acknowledge one's belief or faith in; declare adherence to.
6. to reveal by circumstances.

Anyone can call themselves a Christian can't they?

dljc
Apr 28th 2008, 07:54 PM
LC,

Brother Mark looked this up for me to pass on to you. :)

NT:3670

NT:3670
<START GREEK>o(mologe/w
<END GREEK> homologeo (hom-ol-og-eh'-o); from a compound of the base of NT:3674 and NT:3056; to assent, i.e. covenant, acknowledge:


KJV - con- (pro-) fess, confession is made, give thanks, promise.
(Biblesoft's New Exhaustive Strong's Numbers and Concordance with Expanded Greek-Hebrew Dictionary. Copyright 1994, 2003, 2006 Biblesoft, Inc. and International Bible Translators, Inc.)

As you can see, it is a covenant term. It means more than simply saying "Jesus is God and came in the flesh".

Love Child
Apr 28th 2008, 08:29 PM
LC,

Brother Mark looked this up for me to pass on to you. :)

NT:3670

NT:3670
<START GREEK>o(mologe/w
<END GREEK> homologeo (hom-ol-og-eh'-o); from a compound of the base of NT:3674 and NT:3056; to assent, i.e. covenant, acknowledge:


KJV - con- (pro-) fess, confession is made, give thanks, promise.
(Biblesoft's New Exhaustive Strong's Numbers and Concordance with Expanded Greek-Hebrew Dictionary. Copyright 1994, 2003, 2006 Biblesoft, Inc. and International Bible Translators, Inc.)

As you can see, it is a covenant term. It means more than simply saying "Jesus is God and came in the flesh".

I really do not understand what NT3670, <START GREEK>, and the rest of the stuff that you have up their mean.

dljc
Apr 28th 2008, 11:59 PM
I really do not understand what NT3670, <START GREEK>, and the rest of the stuff that you have up their mean.Ok let me ask you this. Do you profess that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh? (Do you believe without a shadow of a doubt that Jesus lived, died on the cross and was resurrected 3 days later, for you, me and everyone that will come to Him)?

Love Child
Apr 29th 2008, 02:09 AM
Ok let me ask you this. Do you profess that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh? (Do you believe without a shadow of a doubt that Jesus lived, died on the cross and was resurrected 3 days later, for you, me and everyone that will come to Him)?
Yes I profes that jesus has come in the flesh, and to every thing else you said above.

dljc
Apr 29th 2008, 02:57 PM
LC,

I apologize for the long delays and will be out for a while today as well. To respond to your post above.

You are saying the Jesus Christ is your Lord and Savior. The difference between you and a demon saying Christ has come in the flesh is, you profess that not only do you believe this, but also that you are a sinner in need of a Savior. The demons don't want a Savior, and that's why they are trying to throw this in whenever they can to trip you up.

Look at Matthew 4:1-11, look at how satan when tempting Jesus used parts of scripture, but not all of it. You see, satan knows scripture as well as you and me, actually better. Satan will try to trip us up with only half of the truth not all of it. The best lie that can be told has 95-99% truth to it. It's that 1-5% that is the lie, but you have to be able to recognize it from the rest. That's why it's important to know God's Word, and do as we've been instructed; test the spirit, search the scriptures daily. (Acts 17:11 These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so. )

I'll be back later today ok. Please be patient if this doesn't answer your question. :)

Love Child
Apr 29th 2008, 03:18 PM
LC,

I apologize for the long delays and will be out for a while today as well. To respond to your post above.

You are saying the Jesus Christ is your Lord and Savior. The difference between you and a demon saying Christ has come in the flesh is, you profess that not only do you believe this, but also that you are a sinner in need of a Savior. The demons don't want a Savior, and that's why they are trying to throw this in whenever they can to trip you up.

Look at Matthew 4:1-11, look at how satan when tempting Jesus used parts of scripture, but not all of it. You see, satan knows scripture as well as you and me, actually better. Satan will try to trip us up with only half of the truth not all of it. The best lie that can be told has 95-99% truth to it. It's that 1-5% that is the lie, but you have to be able to recognize it from the rest. That's why it's important to know God's Word, and do as we've been instructed; test the spirit, search the scriptures daily. (Acts 17:11 These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so. )

I'll be back later today ok. Please be patient if this doesn't answer your question. :)

So what you are saying is what 1 john 4:1-4 ment by confesseth mean professeth because of it's greek, or hebrew interpretation? My only question is that why did the bible use the word confesseth instead of professeth?

dljc
Apr 30th 2008, 02:20 AM
So what you are saying is what 1 john 4:1-4 ment by confesseth mean professeth because of it's greek, or hebrew interpretation? My only question is that why did the bible use the word confesseth instead of professeth?They both have a similar meaning.

Confess -

1. to acknowledge or avow (a fault, crime, misdeed, weakness, etc.) by way of revelation.
2. to own or admit as true: I must confess that I haven't read the book.
3. to declare or acknowledge (one's sins), esp. to God or a priest in order to obtain absolution.
4. (of a priest) to hear the confession of (a person).
5. to acknowledge one's belief or faith in; declare adherence to.
6. to reveal by circumstances.

Anyone can call themselves a Christian can't they?

Profess -
1.to lay claim to, often insincerely; pretend to: He professed extreme regret.
2.to declare openly; announce or affirm; avow or acknowledge: to profess one's satisfaction.
3.to affirm faith in or allegiance to (a religion, God, etc.).
4.to declare oneself skilled or expert in; claim to have knowledge of; make (a thing) one's profession or business.
5.to teach as a professor: She professes comparative literature.
6.to receive or admit into a religious order. –verb (used without object)
7.to make a profession, avowal, or declaration.
8.to take the vows of a religious order.

Love Child
May 1st 2008, 02:59 AM
OK I see where you are coming from 100% but I am still confussed because I just don't see how satin can say jesus is come in the flesh (even if he is saying it to convince me of a lie), and not call 1 John 4:1-4 a lie. I am sorry if I seem to be a complicated individual, and I am also sorry if I am getting on your nerves.

dljc
May 1st 2008, 02:21 PM
LC,

You're not getting on my nerves, :hug: as I've said, I've just been a little busy of late, and I apologize for the delayed responses due to that factor.

Lets look at Matthew 4:
1 Then was Jesus led up of the spirit into the wilderness to be tempted of the devil.

2 And when he had fasted forty days and forty nights, he was afterward an hungred.

3 And when the tempter came to him, he said, If thou be the Son of God, command that these stones be made bread.

4 But he answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God.

5 Then the devil taketh him up into the holy city, and setteth him on a pinnacle of the temple,

6 And saith unto him, If thou be the Son of God, cast thyself down: for it is written, He shall give his angels charge concerning thee: and in their hands they shall bear thee up, lest at any time thou dash thy foot against a stone.

7 Jesus said unto him, It is written again, Thou shalt not tempt the Lord thy God.

8 Again, the devil taketh him up into an exceeding high mountain, and sheweth him all the kingdoms of the world, and the glory of them;

9 And saith unto him, All these things will I give thee, if thou wilt fall down and worship me.

10 Then saith Jesus unto him, Get thee hence, Satan: for it is written, Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God, and him only shalt thou serve.

11 Then the devil leaveth him, and, behold, angels came and ministered unto him.

Notice the two bold sections or words/phrases. In the first one we see satan as the tempter. In the second one, satan quotes Psalm 91:11 and 12 here it is.

11 For he shall give his angels charge over thee, to keep thee in all thy ways.

12 They shall bear thee up in their hands, lest thou dash thy foot against a stone.

What satan was doing was tempting Jesus and trying to trip him up in doing so by quoting Scripture. Compare what you said even as an example. Do something bad, and then quotes Scripture or a piece of Scripture to tempt you into thinking that it's ok. Take note of what is missing above I underlined it in the passage from Psalms. Also look at how satan twisted the words, to not be an actual quote of scripture.

The enemy (satan) will throw Scriptures out to confuse you. Recognize that you are in a spiritual battle with him and his agents (demons/minions). That's why we are instructed in Ephesians 6:10-20 to put on the Armor of God. The offensive weapon we have is illustrated in Matthew 4 (the verses above), and that's God's Word. Discernment comes from knowing and understanding His Word. Knowing what is good, (from God) and knowing what is evil (from satan).

Does this help?

Love Child
May 1st 2008, 03:56 PM
LC,

You're not getting on my nerves, :hug: as I've said, I've just been a little busy of late, and I apologize for the delayed responses due to that factor.

Lets look at Matthew 4:
1 Then was Jesus led up of the spirit into the wilderness to be tempted of the devil.

2 And when he had fasted forty days and forty nights, he was afterward an hungred.

3 And when the tempter came to him, he said, If thou be the Son of God, command that these stones be made bread.

4 But he answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God.

5 Then the devil taketh him up into the holy city, and setteth him on a pinnacle of the temple,

6 And saith unto him, If thou be the Son of God, cast thyself down: for it is written, He shall give his angels charge concerning thee: and in their hands they shall bear thee up, lest at any time thou dash thy foot against a stone.

7 Jesus said unto him, It is written again, Thou shalt not tempt the Lord thy God.

8 Again, the devil taketh him up into an exceeding high mountain, and sheweth him all the kingdoms of the world, and the glory of them;

9 And saith unto him, All these things will I give thee, if thou wilt fall down and worship me.

10 Then saith Jesus unto him, Get thee hence, Satan: for it is written, Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God, and him only shalt thou serve.

11 Then the devil leaveth him, and, behold, angels came and ministered unto him.

Notice the two bold sections or words/phrases. In the first one we see satan as the tempter. In the second one, satan quotes Psalm 91:11 and 12 here it is.

11 For he shall give his angels charge over thee, to keep thee in all thy ways.

12 They shall bear thee up in their hands, lest thou dash thy foot against a stone.

What satan was doing was tempting Jesus and trying to trip him up in doing so by quoting Scripture. Compare what you said even as an example. Do something bad, and then quotes Scripture or a piece of Scripture to tempt you into thinking that it's ok. Take note of what is missing above I underlined it in the passage from Psalms. Also look at how satan twisted the words, to not be an actual quote of scripture.

The enemy (satan) will throw Scriptures out to confuse you. Recognize that you are in a spiritual battle with him and his agents (demons/minions). That's why we are instructed in Ephesians 6:10-20 to put on the Armor of God. The offensive weapon we have is illustrated in Matthew 4 (the verses above), and that's God's Word. Discernment comes from knowing and understanding His Word. Knowing what is good, (from God) and knowing what is evil (from satan).

Does this help?

Sorry no that really don't help because I already know how Satin can twist scriptures and come as an angel of light, and I also know that satin CAN hear people thoughts both in heart, mind, and spirit. And I also know that he can make his voice sound like the thoughts of the individual that he is talking to. I have been tormented by Satin for many years, so I am well up on his game. A voice came to me claiming to be the spirit of God (Yes I know that the scirptures says that, according to my memory for I could be wrong, the spirit does not speak of himself but of Jesus). It told me about a desicion that I was going to make in the future. I rather not know what my desicion is because if that spirit was of the Lord telling me then I am offically Ordained to make that desicion, and it shall and will come to past for God is not a lier. So what I am saying is that I just want the power for myself to choose for myself on what it is I am going to do with my life. The voice is just saying what I am going to choose with my free will. But if that be of God talking then it will be impossible to choose differ to what has been told to me, So it bothers me, universally speaking, that I don't have the power to choose which desicion that I will choose. So after the voice had told me what my desicion in life is going to be, I sorta disagreed. the voice told me not to call him a lier. I knew I didn't call him a lier, and the voice confirmed that I didn't call him a lier, but what he is saying is don't up and say that it is a lie that is being told to me or that would be calling him a lier. So I went to bed that night trying not to accept what was told to me without calling him a lier. I woke the next day and I just up and said it in my head, but I had no control of it. the voice immediatly came to my head and told me that I blasphemed the Holy Spirit; not by the thoughts in my head for I could not control them, but the thoughts in my heart because my heart has agreed with the thoughts in my head then he ended with his statement the lord and savior Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. To me my heart just did not want what was told to me come to pass so it might had agreed with the thought in my head out of confussion. Either way I know that it is not blaspheming the Holy Spirit because the thoughts was not premeditated, and that it is the things that comes out of a man that defiles him not the things that comes in him. So when the spirit said that the Lord and savior jesus Christ is come in the flesh it dified all my logic. I read on people interpetations of the bible on how that 1 John 4:1-4 was talking to prophets alone, and I read how that demons acknowledge chist name and that he is the son of God when he was about to cast them out. But I just don't believe that interpetation because The bible say not to believe every SPIRIT, and it did not use the term everyone! and when I read on how there are many false prophets that gone out into the world, I believe judging from its context that a prophet of God should test a spirit that is prophising in his ear to see if he is to confess that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh, and that goes to any christian that talks to spirits. And it should work to test to see what kind of spirit a leader has that is out leading. I hope someone will address the spicific issues that I had mentioned it this paper because, not to be rude, the stuff that y'all already mentioned to me I already know.

dljc
May 2nd 2008, 02:34 PM
I also know that satin CAN hear people thoughts both in heart, mind, and spirit.Do me a favor LC, show me in Scripture where it says that satan can do this. I've heard this, but don't recall ever seeing it.

dljc
May 2nd 2008, 02:57 PM
Sorry no that really don't help because I already know how Satin can twist scriptures and come as an angel of light, and I also know that satin CAN hear people thoughts both in heart, mind, and spirit. And I also know that he can make his voice sound like the thoughts of the individual that he is talking to. I have been tormented by Satin for many years, so I am well up on his game. A voice came to me claiming to be the spirit of God (Yes I know that the scirptures says that, according to my memory for I could be wrong, the spirit does not speak of himself but of Jesus). It told me about a desicion that I was going to make in the future. I rather not know what my desicion is because if that spirit was of the Lord telling me then I am offically Ordained to make that desicion, and it shall and will come to past for God is not a lier. So what I am saying is that I just want the power for myself to choose for myself on what it is I am going to do with my life. The voice is just saying what I am going to choose with my free will. But if that be of God talking then it will be impossible to choose differ to what has been told to me, So it bothers me, universally speaking, that I don't have the power to choose which desicion that I will choose. So after the voice had told me what my desicion in life is going to be, I sorta disagreed. the voice told me not to call him a lier. I knew I didn't call him a lier, and the voice confirmed that I didn't call him a lier, but what he is saying is don't up and say that it is a lie that is being told to me or that would be calling him a lier. So I went to bed that night trying not to accept what was told to me without calling him a lier. I woke the next day and I just up and said it in my head, but I had no control of it. the voice immediatly came to my head and told me that I blasphemed the Holy Spirit; not by the thoughts in my head for I could not control them, but the thoughts in my heart because my heart has agreed with the thoughts in my head then he ended with his statement the lord and savior Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. To me my heart just did not want what was told to me come to pass so it might had agreed with the thought in my head out of confussion. Either way I know that it is not blaspheming the Holy Spirit because the thoughts was not premeditated, and that it is the things that comes out of a man that defiles him not the things that comes in him. So when the spirit said that the Lord and savior jesus Christ is come in the flesh it dified all my logic. I read on people interpetations of the bible on how that 1 John 4:1-4 was talking to prophets alone, and I read how that demons acknowledge chist name and that he is the son of God when he was about to cast them out. But I just don't believe that interpetation because The bible say not to believe every SPIRIT, and it did not use the term everyone! and when I read on how there are many false prophets that gone out into the world, I believe judging from its context that a prophet of God should test a spirit that is prophising in his ear to see if he is to confess that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh, and that goes to any christian that talks to spirits. And it should work to test to see what kind of spirit a leader has that is out leading. I hope someone will address the spicific issues that I had mentioned it this paper because, not to be rude, the stuff that y'all already mentioned to me I already know.LC,

Look back over this thread and look at what you've been asking. You've been asking for "discernment". That's what I've been showing you, how to discern good from evil.

Here's the thing. If I tell you an answer, you will need to test the spirit, correct? If for some reason what this voice has told you doesn't line up with what I say, which one of us are you going to believe? Testing the spirit involves God's Word, testing what it said against God's Word. One thing you have to keep in mind is this. Is what this spirit is telling me drawing me closer to God, or drawing me away from God. The only way you will know is to test it against God's Word. Not against another person's opinion, but God's Word.

Would God tell you that you will blaspheme the Holy Spirit and that you will have no choice? I don't believe that He would. Free will is knowing right from wrong, and choosing right over wrong. If you don't know right from wrong, guess which one you'll pick? Your sinful nature will cause you to pick wrong, because that's the easiest path. You don't see the consequences ahead. Jesus will lead you if you let Him. He is the way the truth and the life, remember? (John 14:6) Do you honestly think He would tell you to blaspheme the Holy Spirit? (Keep in mind I'm only going on what you've told me, I don't know all the details as you do).

Show me from Scriptures what I've asked in the previous post.

Love Child
May 2nd 2008, 04:47 PM
LC,

Look back over this thread and look at what you've been asking. You've been asking for "discernment". That's what I've been showing you, how to discern good from evil.

Here's the thing. If I tell you an answer, you will need to test the spirit, correct? If for some reason what this voice has told you doesn't line up with what I say, which one of us are you going to believe? Testing the spirit involves God's Word, testing what it said against God's Word. One thing you have to keep in mind is this. Is what this spirit is telling me drawing me closer to God, or drawing me away from God. The only way you will know is to test it against God's Word. Not against another person's opinion, but God's Word.

Would God tell you that you will blaspheme the Holy Spirit and that you will have no choice? I don't believe that He would. Free will is knowing right from wrong, and choosing right over wrong. If you don't know right from wrong, guess which one you'll pick? Your sinful nature will cause you to pick wrong, because that's the easiest path. You don't see the consequences ahead. Jesus will lead you if you let Him. He is the way the truth and the life, remember? (John 14:6) Do you honestly think He would tell you to blaspheme the Holy Spirit? (Keep in mind I'm only going on what you've told me, I don't know all the details as you do).
Show me from Scriptures what I've asked in the previous post.

No the voice did not tell me that I was going to blaspheme, but it told me a goal in life that I will not fofill by choice because, by what I believe, I will choose to go in the ministry instead. It is a possiblility that it may happen, I just don't want to know ahead of time. I looked up the definition of confession and it means to asknowledge something often inscenser. How do you know that a spirit cannot asknowledge something inscenserly, how do you know that a spirit has to confess it with his heart, how do you know that the bible just don't mean that a spirit cannot just up and say that sentance unless he is of God. I know that it has to line up with the word of god, but I just don't see how I can compare my scercumstance to the bible.

Love Child
May 2nd 2008, 05:29 PM
Yes to me the voice is questionable. Yes I know to test the spirit by the bible, I also know that God do not rush things, I also know that if I hear a voice and I have to wonder if it is God then much more then likely it's not God, if I hear a voice when my heart is not fully tune in to the lord or I am not 100% focuse then more than likely it's not God, if I feel uncomfortable, I guess depending on the scecumstance, it might not be God (maybe), if the voice contridict it self then it is not God, God is not going to say anything to me that abusultly make no sence like "I don't want you to go to the lakers game this year because you are grounded with me."

When I compare my experience to the way I use to do I would not wonder if the spirit is good or evil, but lately I been trying to find another way to test a spirit because satin can sometimes come to me and fool me and cause me to believe that I am talking to God, and I ended up finding out the next day that the voice that i was talking to was not of God because God himself would confirm it to me. So I wanted to find a way I can test the spirit without ever being decieved by satin So I tried 1 John 4:1-4. I trust what the bible say more the my own enstincs and logic. So to my logic no spirit of God would say something to me like that for tha t scercomstance, but the bible says that only the spirits of God can make that statement like only the virgins of revelations can sing the song that God will give them to sing, like how we might be able to sing a song in heaven that not even the angels can sing. What you are telling me to do is to compare what the voice say to the word of God, but the bible say to test the spirit to see if it will confess that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. For there are many false prophets in the world who been decieved by the antichrist.

I just want to know how can a demon make that statement, without contridicting 1John 4:1-4.

Lord Forgive me for all of my sins:pray:

Love Child
May 2nd 2008, 05:35 PM
Again I am saying that the voice did not say that I was going to blasphem, but that I would choose not to acomplish something, I personally choose not to say, in my life because, by what I believe, I would choose to forsake it for the ministry. Like this one guy that my grandma told me that was a top football player who quit football to become a minister.

dljc
May 2nd 2008, 06:04 PM
Answer this question I asked.
Do me a favor LC, show me in Scripture where it says that satan can do this. I've heard this, but don't recall ever seeing it.And keep something in mind, you are all over the place here. If you don't want to share what the voice revealed to you, that's ok. But remember I'm on the outside looking in. I know it can be frustrating for you, but I only have limited information ok.

You can pray and ask God to guide you on this. Prayer is our greatest weapon against the attacks of satan. Look at Gideon, he asked God to confirm what He wanted him to do by using a piece of fleece. God doesn't mind if we ask Him to confirm something for us.

Love Child
May 3rd 2008, 01:37 AM
Do me a favor LC, show me in Scripture where it says that satan can do this. I've heard this, but don't recall ever seeing it.

I know through personal exsperiances.

dljc
May 3rd 2008, 02:49 PM
I know through personal exsperiances.LC,

If I were you I'd test the spirit on that. If you can't find it in God's Word that satan can read your mind, then you're giving him more power than he really has.

Think about this for a minute. Satan has been around for a long time, he's watched man all that time, and made observations of how man reacts in certain situations and especially concerning temptation. Basically speaking, he knows our weaknesses. This can give the appearance of reading someone's mind.

Think about going to a carnival and you are walking through the "midway" section where all the games are that are basically designed to take your money. The carny running the booth will watch the crowd and anyone who makes eye contact with them, they will address that person. If they don't have anyone at their booth and they want to attract a crowd. The first person who makes eye contact with them, they will lure them in and let them win a prize, to attract the other people around. Once the crowd is there nobody is winning anymore.

The enemy, watches what we do. If we make eye contact with a temptation of ours, it doesn't matter what it is, we give ourselves away, simply by lingering on that thing. It can be a billboard of a half dressed woman, it can be a picture of a chocolate cake. It doesn't matter. The enemy sees our hesitation and acts on it. Satan knows we have weaknesses and he exploits them. When they've caught our eye, he knows exactly what our weakness is. And much like the dishonest carny he lures us in with that temptation, and it can give the impression of reading our mind.

So if you think he can read your mind, you're giving him more power than he really has. I have heard this too as I've said, but I've never seen anything on it in His Word that satan can read our mind. Only God can. Also keep something else in mind, satan has known you all of your life here on this planet. So consider it like this, he's been watching you all your life. He knows your weaknesses just as he knows mine and everyone else's. But I don't believe he can read my mind.

Love Child
May 3rd 2008, 10:07 PM
You have a point, but what about people who know how to send their thoughts out to other people that know how to recieve their sent thoughts. I know that there is alot of liers and magians in the world, but I am talking about the one's who actually can send and recieve thoughts- Telepathes. They had to recieve there powers from somewhere. So if telepathes can hear other people thoughts then how come satin can't? And if Satin can speak in our thoughts then how come he can't hear them. Now my personal exsperiences where the devil could hear my thoughts is when I thought I was talking to God, but the devil would come at me desguised as God.

Love Child
May 4th 2008, 11:02 PM
Ok I see, I think I understand now.

dljc
May 5th 2008, 02:00 PM
Ok I see, I think I understand now.LC,

I've been a little busy the last couple of days. Could you expand on this a little? What is it that has made sense about this? I'm asking because sometimes it helps to put it all down and see it, so to speak. Then sometimes it's becomes more clear.

dljc
May 5th 2008, 03:43 PM
LC,


I want to share something with you. Back in the early and through the 80's I worked in a job in Animal Control. I went to a class on how to read animal body language. There are many factors that come into play in reading a animal's body language, everything from the position of the ears, the position of the tail and whether it is wagging slowly or quickly. As well as the pupil of the eye. You can tell a lot about what the animal is "thinking" by these actions and factors. Does that mean I can read their mind? In a way yes, I can, I'm looking at the patterns that have been observed by others. Now, if I could mimic that body language or come up with a body language that presented myself as either the dominant one of the two, or a friendly posture that allowed me to diffuse the aggression of this animal and make friends with it. Would that mean I could talk to that animal? In a manner of speaking the answer would be yes.

If you look at what I just wrote, you can see that I am looking at the body language of that animal, I can't really read it's mind, but based on it's behavior I can know a little more about what it's thinking. If I can mimic behavior to either show dominance or kindness I can control this animal through fear or kindness.

In this way, people are no different. That's what psychology is all about. Understanding how the mind works and how we communicate what is going on inside, that we may not be willing to share with someone. It can come through in our body language and in our words. Jesus said out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks. (Matthew 12:34)

Now, what if our body language is speaking from the heart as well? Think about it for a minute. Lets say a person is an alcoholic and has quit drinking and turned their life over to the Lord. Their body language is going to be something like, lingering on the isle where alcohol is sold. Or a advertisement for such things catches their eye, but an ad for a singles phone connection doesn't really concern them at all. (keep in mind these are just examples).

There is a spiritual realm that we don't see. Now, if satan and the demons are watching us from in this realm, they have been watching every man and woman since Adam and Eve. If they have picked up on our body language, and I have no reason to believe they haven't. They pick up on these little hesitations we have concerning something we may be struggling with. Sin begins in the heart, if our body language reflects what's in our heart too, then they know what we struggle with.

I have been studying psychology since the days of learning how to read animal body language. I can in fact talk to animals in such a way I mimic behavior that speaks to them and become friends with even vicious dogs no one else can get near but the owner. I have been studying human body language too since the late 80's. I once had a court case that I had never seen the defendant in person because I wasn't the one who got the citation signed. The day of court I was there by myself in a courtroom of about 75 people. I scanned the crowd wondering who the defendant was. I picked out two guys based on their behavior. You want to know something? I was exactly right, they were together and both were responsible for the offense, of cutting the ears off of a pit bull puppy for dog fight bait. I had no idea what they looked like, but I picked them out of a crowd of about 75 people. Was I able to read their mind, or did I just pick up on their body language that suggested they were the ones?

You want to know something even more astounding? I listen to the words, and I watch the body language when talking to someone in person. If they don't match, I go with my gut feeling on the person, but I continue to watch them. I've been right 99.9% of the time. Based on body language and words, not the thoughts of the person. But then again, it's what's in their heart, so, maybe I am reading their mind.

Love Child
May 5th 2008, 04:34 PM
LC,


I want to share something with you. Back in the early and through the 80's I worked in a job in Animal Control. I went to a class on how to read animal body language. There are many factors that come into play in reading a animal's body language, everything from the position of the ears, the position of the tail and whether it is wagging slowly or quickly. As well as the pupil of the eye. You can tell a lot about what the animal is "thinking" by these actions and factors. Does that mean I can read their mind? In a way yes, I can, I'm looking at the patterns that have been observed by others. Now, if I could mimic that body language or come up with a body language that presented myself as either the dominant one of the two, or a friendly posture that allowed me to diffuse the aggression of this animal and make friends with it. Would that mean I could talk to that animal? In a manner of speaking the answer would be yes.

If you look at what I just wrote, you can see that I am looking at the body language of that animal, I can't really read it's mind, but based on it's behavior I can know a little more about what it's thinking. If I can mimic behavior to either show dominance or kindness I can control this animal through fear or kindness.

In this way, people are no different. That's what psychology is all about. Understanding how the mind works and how we communicate what is going on inside, that we may not be willing to share with someone. It can come through in our body language and in our words. Jesus said out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks. (Matthew 12:34)

Now, what if our body language is speaking from the heart as well? Think about it for a minute. Lets say a person is an alcoholic and has quit drinking and turned their life over to the Lord. Their body language is going to be something like, lingering on the isle where alcohol is sold. Or a advertisement for such things catches their eye, but an ad for a singles phone connection doesn't really concern them at all. (keep in mind these are just examples).

There is a spiritual realm that we don't see. Now, if satan and the demons are watching us from in this realm, they have been watching every man and woman since Adam and Eve. If they have picked up on our body language, and I have no reason to believe they haven't. They pick up on these little hesitations we have concerning something we may be struggling with. Sin begins in the heart, if our body language reflects what's in our heart too, then they know what we struggle with.

I have been studying psychology since the days of learning how to read animal body language. I can in fact talk to animals in such a way I mimic behavior that speaks to them and become friends with even vicious dogs no one else can get near but the owner. I have been studying human body language too since the late 80's. I once had a court case that I had never seen the defendant in person because I wasn't the one who got the citation signed. The day of court I was there by myself in a courtroom of about 75 people. I scanned the crowd wondering who the defendant was. I picked out two guys based on their behavior. You want to know something? I was exactly right, they were together and both were responsible for the offense, of cutting the ears off of a pit bull puppy for dog fight bait. I had no idea what they looked like, but I picked them out of a crowd of about 75 people. Was I able to read their mind, or did I just pick up on their body language that suggested they were the ones?

You want to know something even more astounding? I listen to the words, and I watch the body language when talking to someone in person. If they don't match, I go with my gut feeling on the person, but I continue to watch them. I've been right 99.9% of the time. Based on body language and words, not the thoughts of the person. But then again, it's what's in their heart, so, maybe I am reading their mind.

I don't think the bible say or don't say if satin can read minds, so I guess for those times when I thought I was talking to God I was really talking to my imagination when it wasn't the Lord at all... But who knows- maybe satin could read my silent libs, or I might have been praying with my mounth. Maybe Satin can read certain musicle of my body. But I remember
trying to talk to God in my mind a few times in the past, but the devil ended up responding- maybe he was just using some kind of great illusion to make it seem like he was reading my mind?

Love Child
May 5th 2008, 04:44 PM
Ok I see, I think I understand now.
I was talking about 1 John 4:1-4. I went to church last sunday, and I talked to someone. This person told me that it was refering to prophets. And that I need to combine certain scriptures in order to understand a passage, Hermanutics. I still don't understand how it can not be refered to spirits, but after talking to you, reading a book, and talking to her I dicided just to take it as fact. y'all all said the same thing, so I guess that I interpet the scriptures wrong, even though it can be interpreted in different ways, I guess the interpretation that the majority of people I talked to has is the correct interpretation.

Love Child
May 5th 2008, 04:45 PM
I read a book on how to talk to dogs once:)

Love Child
May 7th 2008, 03:40 PM
There was this one time a voice came posed as God, and I ask him if Jesus Christ is come in the flesh, and he did not answer. Maybe it was some kind of an extremly clever set-up to decive me. What is your thoughts?

Love Child
May 7th 2008, 07:09 PM
I know that you are busy and all, and I am not trying to rush anybody, but since my thread will exspire by tomorrow I would like for someone to comment on my last post before it exspires- thankyou:)

dljc
May 8th 2008, 02:03 PM
There was this one time a voice came posed as God, and I ask him if Jesus Christ is come in the flesh, and he did not answer. Maybe it was some kind of an extremly clever set-up to decive me. What is your thoughts?It's hard to say, but I would think God would have answered appropriately.

LC, can I ask a question without malice or any derogatory intent behind it. Do you hear voices? (Meaning more than one). The reason I ask this is because it seems to me you do hear more than God's voice. Are you on any kind of medication that might cause this?

Love Child
May 8th 2008, 04:49 PM
It's hard to say, but I would think God would have answered appropriately.

LC, can I ask a question without malice or any derogatory intent behind it. Do you hear voices? (Meaning more than one). The reason I ask this is because it seems to me you do hear more than God's voice. Are you on any kind of medication that might cause this?

No I am not crazy and I don't hear them kind of voices, I actually can talk to God and I know it because I be recievinig conformation from him. And I can talk to demons to, and I know I am talking to a demon because... trust me I know when I am talking to a demon, and I know when the thought are mine.

Love Child
May 8th 2008, 05:19 PM
You see I learned how to talk to God in 2007, throughout that year satin tried to step in to try to fool me, but throughout the year I learned to tell the difference between God's voice, the devil's, and my own. in the begining of 2008 I stop talkin to God for four months. Earlyer this year I was just out sinning, nothing too bad mainly cusing all day. At the end of the day I could sense six or seven dark orbs in my mind (I believe they were demon spirits, but it definitly came from me willfully sinning) I repent and while I was reading the bible I heard a clear voice say something to me. when the voice said what it said I told him that I know my fathers voice, and you are not him, he did not say something bad but it was grivious for me. As he was talking his voice became more and more convincing- so much so to I started to believe that it was God talking to me- either it was God or the darkness inside my mind caused me to believe that it was God. My grandma, who I was with at the time, was concerned because I was very greved. I would not tell her why I was so down so she called the pastor. I told the pastor what was told to me and he told me that was not God, and not to lisin to any more voices. The thing is I would have found out my self if that was God or not the next day by praying to God and he would have literally told me, but the pastor told me not to lisin to any more voices. So instead of leaning on God I started leaning on the pastor, BIG MISTAKE. four to five months later I realized that I needed to go to God for my self, So I am hoping I can communicate with him like I use to.

Love Child
May 8th 2008, 05:25 PM
No I am not crazy and I don't hear them kind of voices, I actually can talk to God and I know it because I be recievinig conformation from him. And I can talk to demons to, and I know I am talking to a demon because... trust me I know when I am talking to a demon, and I know when the thought are mine.

You see I know when it is my thoughts, either from my heart or from my head, because I can feel the thought forming in my head and I know the desires from my heart. When I am talking to a spirit the voice seems to be outside my body. even right now I can disarn the difference, it just became tricky when 1 John 4:1-4 was involeced.

Love Child
May 8th 2008, 05:27 PM
It's hard to say, but I would think God would have answered appropriately.

LC, can I ask a question without malice or any derogatory intent behind it. Do you hear voices? (Meaning more than one). The reason I ask this is because it seems to me you do hear more than God's voice. Are you on any kind of medication that might cause this?

By pose as God I ment a demon

dljc
May 8th 2008, 05:38 PM
You see I learned how to talk to God in 2007, throughout that year satin tried to step in to try to fool me, but throughout the year I learned to tell the difference between God's voice, the devil's, and my own. in the begining of 2008 I stop talkin to God for four months. Earlyer this year I was just out sinning, nothing too bad mainly cusing all day. At the end of the day I could sense six or seven dark orbs in my mind (I believe they were demon spirits, but it definitly came from me willfully sinning) I repent and while I was reading the bible I heard a clear voice say something to me. when the voice said what it said I told him that I know my fathers voice, and you are not him, he did not say something bad but it was grivious for me. As he was talking his voice became more and more convincing- so much so to I started to believe that it was God talking to me- either it was God or the darkness inside my mind caused me to believe that it was God. My grandma, who I was with at the time, was concerned because I was very greved. I would not tell her why I was so down so she called the pastor. I told the pastor what was told to me and he told me that was not God, and not to lisin to any more voices. The thing is I would have found out my self if that was God or not the next day by praying to God and he would have literally told me, but the pastor told me not to lisin to any more voices. So instead of leaning on God I started leaning on the pastor, BIG MISTAKE. four to five months later I realized that I needed to go to God for my self, So I am hoping I can communicate with him like I use to.LC,

Thank you, and I hope I didn't offend you, that wasn't the intent when I asked about the voices. What you just posted helped to explain things a little better.

Yes, I agree it was a big mistake to trust solely in the pastor. Through an analogy someone in Bible Study used last night, they compared a relationship with God to that of a pastor for example. I don't remember all of how they described it, but my answer was this when I was asked "would you consider a relationship with the pastor like that with God?", I said., "No the pastor is just a man and he will pass away". I should have, but didn't add, "A pastor is fallible, God isn't". I know this, I just didn't include that in my comment.

LC, testing the spirit is a little more complicated than just asking the question you are asking at the time. As we have discussed, even satan can masquerade as an angel of light. Testing the spirit also includes searching through Scriptures on what was said. This is where discernment comes into the picture. Through God's Word we learn what is good is from Him, what is evil is from satan. It has been said that the best lie that can be told has 95-99% truth to it. There's just that 1-5% that is a lie. This is where trusting Him to show you the Truth is the key.

The way I know it's from Him is either through Scriptures He leads me to, or if I've prayed about something that no one else knows about, and I hear a sermon from a pastor I don't know personally for example, that gives me the answer to the question I may have asked. I know it's from Him. How else could that pastor know that I asked that question? And it's usually a trusted pastor someone like Chuck Swindoll or Charles Stanley, or even a pastor I like to listen to too Paul Washer. I have never met any of these men, so how could they know what I've asked, or may need to hear.

There is nothing wrong with trusting a pastor, don't get me wrong. Just keep in mind that he can be mislead. Ask the Lord to reveal to you what you need to know about this situation or that. Then listen and test it against His Word.

dljc
May 8th 2008, 05:46 PM
You see I know when it is my thoughts, either from my heart or from my head, because I can feel the thought forming in my head and I know the desires from my heart. When I am talking to a spirit the voice seems to be outside my body. even right now I can disarn the difference, it just became tricky when 1 John 4:1-4 was involeced.Look at the bold text in your post. If satan could read minds, wouldn't he have to be able to access your thoughts? If he or the demon is outside the body it's not accessing your thoughts. If the Holy Spirit is in you, then He is. See the difference?

dljc
May 8th 2008, 05:47 PM
By pose as God I ment a demonI understand. :)

dljc
May 8th 2008, 05:51 PM
LC,

I'll be back in a little while ok. I need to go clean up my chainsaws from this morning. I had a tree to cut down and cut up. I'll be back in about an hour ok. :)

Love Child
May 8th 2008, 07:30 PM
Sorry I just lost my internete for a minute, but it is back on:)

Love Child
May 8th 2008, 08:23 PM
Look at the bold text in your post. If satan could read minds, wouldn't he have to be able to access your thoughts? If he or the demon is outside the body it's not accessing your thoughts. If the Holy Spirit is in you, then He is. See the difference?

Then How do you explain psychics who claim to have a visison in there dream, or just a vision? Deut 18:10-12 speaks against people who can see in the future- So it has to be real if the Bible speaks against it. So how is it that Satin can't access your thoughts- this is very interresting to me:hmm:

And when a spirit is talking to me, even though it seems to be coming from the outside of my body, I can not hear them with my physical ears. sometime the voice can be crystal clear, and almost, but not audible- while other times the spirits voice can sound just like a thought in my mind. have you not concider how people be thinking they are having a monolog (thinking to themself) in their head when it is really a diaolog (talking to a spirit.) An example would be Satin placing a thought in someone's head saying " I am depress," and the individual would respond to it by saying "yeah- I think I am feeling a little depress." Before I got saved satin would put thoughts in my head that he wanted me to say, then he would have me say them. There are alot of things that are not in the bible that we know exist like dinosaurs, not including Leviathan, because of the proven facts. I remember reading from you that the Bible don't mention that Satin can read our minds, but I don't think that it mention that he can not read people's mind, but I did read how demons can enter in someone, put things in people hearts, and the bible don't say if satin was talking to Jesus through his thought process or not when he was on the mountain fasting. So if satin can't see what is in the heart, then that may mean that he can't see the things that he puts in the heart. If satin can bound a man's soul and a full acess to the man's body, then can't he see the struggle of the man's soul when he is bound? (I am talking about a man that is posessed.) And if Satin can put a thought in someone's head, could he not hear himself when he has his voice disguise as the individual thoughts, or could he not hear the individual response towards the thought he put in the individual's mind?

Love Child
May 8th 2008, 08:24 PM
LC,

I'll be back in a little while ok. I need to go clean up my chainsaws from this morning. I had a tree to cut down and cut up. I'll be back in about an hour ok. :)

I'll be back tonight because I got to go into work now.

dljc
May 10th 2008, 05:05 PM
Then How do you explain psychics who claim to have a visison in there dream, or just a vision? Deut 18:10-12 speaks against people who can see in the future- So it has to be real if the Bible speaks against it. So how is it that Satin can't access your thoughts- this is very interresting to me:hmm:

And when a spirit is talking to me, even though it seems to be coming from the outside of my body, I can not hear them with my physical ears. sometime the voice can be crystal clear, and almost, but not audible- while other times the spirits voice can sound just like a thought in my mind. have you not concider how people be thinking they are having a monolog (thinking to themself) in their head when it is really a diaolog (talking to a spirit.) An example would be Satin placing a thought in someone's head saying " I am depress," and the individual would respond to it by saying "yeah- I think I am feeling a little depress." Before I got saved satin would put thoughts in my head that he wanted me to say, then he would have me say them. There are alot of things that are not in the bible that we know exist like dinosaurs, not including Leviathan, because of the proven facts. I remember reading from you that the Bible don't mention that Satin can read our minds, but I don't think that it mention that he can not read people's mind, but I did read how demons can enter in someone, put things in people hearts, and the bible don't say if satin was talking to Jesus through his thought process or not when he was on the mountain fasting. So if satin can't see what is in the heart, then that may mean that he can't see the things that he puts in the heart. If satin can bound a man's soul and a full acess to the man's body, then can't he see the struggle of the man's soul when he is bound? (I am talking about a man that is posessed.) And if Satin can put a thought in someone's head, could he not hear himself when he has his voice disguise as the individual thoughts, or could he not hear the individual response towards the thought he put in the individual's mind?If you look at those verses from Deut 18:10-12 they are saying just what you are saying, but it is a warning not to use this as a means of wizardry or personal gain.

Let me ask you something. Can a demon reside in the same place as the Holy Spirit? If you are a Christian (and I'm not implying you, just generally speaking), the Holy Spirit is in you. A demon cannot be there too. (Light and darkness cannot be in the same place).

Are you going to come under attack by satan or a demon, yes. That's what they do. But this is why Paul stressed we need to walk in the Spirit and not in the flesh. When we walk in the flesh we are susceptible to those "outside" influences. This is why we are reminded in verse 4 of the verses you've been asking about.

1 John 4:4 Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

You say you talk to these demons that you hear. Focus on Him, and not the demons. You have to recognize there is a spirit world we can't see. There is speculation on how all of this works. But wouldn't it make sense if you are talking to demons, you are listening to them to a degree. You are giving them an opening to do what they are doing. They can tell you lack discernment, and they are using it against you. I mean no offense by that.

Now, look back at the verses from Deut. that's what those verses are talking about too, listening to the demons that are an influence in your life. In the case in Deut God is telling the Israelites if anyone is found among them using these practices for gain, they are an abomination and to be dealt with accordingly. Because they are listening to the demons for their information.

Possession: Look at the man that Legion was inside. (Mark 5) He came running up to Jesus to worship Him. The demons didn't want to be there, but the man did. This would be a clear indication of possession, however, at this point the man had control over them through Jesus. Jesus had the ultimate control over them, but the man saw Jesus as the only one who could save him from legion.

Put on the armor Ephesians 6:10-20. Just asking a demon or voice if Christ came in the flesh, isn't enough. The false prophets 1 John 4:1-3 is talking about can say that He has. You have to look at the fruit of their work. The only way to know whether it's good fruit is to know what He has said. The Word of God is our offensive weapon against the enemy.

Possession of a person by a demon or evil spirit: Is it the person that's doing it, or is it the spirit that is residing in that person? If an evil spirit is inside someone, is it the demon that is cutting the flesh or is it the person doing it in their right mind? You see, you're looking at this from a temporal perspective. Our body is temporal, our spirit is eternal. It's a matter of who we are listening to. Now, in the case of a possession, the demon has bound the person, so to speak, and has taken control over the actions of the body. They aren't reading the mind of the person, they are the mind of the person during the possession. The person may have invited them in, and didn't even realize they had.

See if you can find a copy of the movie "Fallen" with Denzel Washington. It's about a fallen angel who possesses people by mere touch or proximity of that person. IMHO this would be a good example of how a demon or even a fallen angel could move about in the spirit realm. And a good example of how possession works as well. You'll be surprised at the ending.

Love Child
May 11th 2008, 04:06 AM
If you look at those verses from Deut 18:10-12 they are saying just what you are saying, but it is a warning not to use this as a means of wizardry or personal gain.

Let me ask you something. Can a demon reside in the same place as the Holy Spirit? If you are a Christian (and I'm not implying you, just generally speaking), the Holy Spirit is in you. A demon cannot be there too. (Light and darkness cannot be in the same place).

Are you going to come under attack by satan or a demon, yes. That's what they do. But this is why Paul stressed we need to walk in the Spirit and not in the flesh. When we walk in the flesh we are susceptible to those "outside" influences. This is why we are reminded in verse 4 of the verses you've been asking about.

1 John 4:4 Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

You say you talk to these demons that you hear. Focus on Him, and not the demons. You have to recognize there is a spirit world we can't see. There is speculation on how all of this works. But wouldn't it make sense if you are talking to demons, you are listening to them to a degree. You are giving them an opening to do what they are doing. They can tell you lack discernment, and they are using it against you. I mean no offense by that.

Now, look back at the verses from Deut. that's what those verses are talking about too, listening to the demons that are an influence in your life. In the case in Deut God is telling the Israelites if anyone is found among them using these practices for gain, they are an abomination and to be dealt with accordingly. Because they are listening to the demons for their information.

Possession: Look at the man that Legion was inside. (Mark 5) He came running up to Jesus to worship Him. The demons didn't want to be there, but the man did. This would be a clear indication of possession, however, at this point the man had control over them through Jesus. Jesus had the ultimate control over them, but the man saw Jesus as the only one who could save him from legion.

Put on the armor Ephesians 6:10-20. Just asking a demon or voice if Christ came in the flesh, isn't enough. The false prophets 1 John 4:1-3 is talking about can say that He has. You have to look at the fruit of their work. The only way to know whether it's good fruit is to know what He has said. The Word of God is our offensive weapon against the enemy.

Possession of a person by a demon or evil spirit: Is it the person that's doing it, or is it the spirit that is residing in that person? If an evil spirit is inside someone, is it the demon that is cutting the flesh or is it the person doing it in their right mind? You see, you're looking at this from a temporal perspective. Our body is temporal, our spirit is eternal. It's a matter of who we are listening to. Now, in the case of a possession, the demon has bound the person, so to speak, and has taken control over the actions of the body. They aren't reading the mind of the person, they are the mind of the person during the possession. The person may have invited them in, and didn't even realize they had.

See if you can find a copy of the movie "Fallen" with Denzel Washington. It's about a fallen angel who possesses people by mere touch or proximity of that person. IMHO this would be a good example of how a demon or even a fallen angel could move about in the spirit realm. And a good example of how possession works as well. You'll be surprised at the ending.
OK, you are not only saying that a demon can form that sentance, but a false prophet as well- So a false prophet can say that Jesus is come in the flesh? I do believe I do have disarnment now- I remember waking up one morning in the past and a spirit was quoting a bible scripture, but what I was sencing from that spirit did not seem Godly. I can disarn spirits to a certain degree, I just got really mixed up when I head that voice quote that scripture. My original way of disarnning spirit is: If I hear a spirit talking to me when my heart, mind and soul is not focus on God, then it proberly not God; If I doubt if it is God then more and likely it's not; God don't lie, nor do he contridict his self; He would not tell me anything that flat out has no meaning; I would have to be completely untroubled; and I have to be open to whatever he got to say. I might have left out something, but I do remember posting something telling y'all how I disarn spirits, and I think I also mentioned that I only got confussed when I heard that voice say that.

dljc
May 11th 2008, 06:37 AM
Look at Matthew 4:6 and compare it to Psalms

Matthew 4:6 And saith unto him, If thou be the Son of God, cast thyself down: for it is written, He shall give his angels charge concerning thee: and in their hands they shall bear thee up, lest at any time thou dash thy foot against a stone.

Psalm 91:12 They shall bear thee up in their hands, lest thou dash thy foot against a stone.

Satan was quoting scripture in a manner of speaking. He changed it up a little, but it's still saying the same thing. Why can't a demon quote scripture? They believe and tremble too.

James 2:19 Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.

This is why it's important for us to know scripture and spend time with Him. He is our protection from harm. The blue text above was the only variation of the scripture. But look at what satan was asking Jesus to do, he was asking Jesus to throw Himself off of this high place that would kill Him unless the angels stepped in and prevented it.

Matthew 4:5 Then the devil taketh him up into the holy city, and setteth him on a pinnacle of the temple,

A pinnacle is considered a high place. Jesus answer satan with more scripture v 7 Jesus said unto him, It is written again, Thou shalt not tempt the Lord thy God.

Deut 6:16 Ye shall not tempt the LORD your God, as ye tempted him in Massah.

Discernment comes from looking at what is being said, and what scripture is used. I think it's safe to say if a spirit was telling you to jump off of a high building you'd probably question that. I hope you would anyway. :) Listen to the scripture being quoted, and what the request is. But remember, satan knows scriptures too, and he will try and use them against you. But as you can see from Matthew 4:6 it won't be an exact quote, and it will be something to get you to do something that goes against God's Word.

Also remember what I said Gideon asked for a confirmation on what he was told. God doesn't mind if we ask for a confirmation. Generally speaking He will probably provide one without you asking. But He doesn't mind if you ask.

Judges 6:36-40
36 And Gideon said unto God, If thou wilt save Israel by mine hand, as thou hast said,

37 Behold, I will put a fleece of wool in the floor; and if the dew be on the fleece only, and it be dry upon all the earth beside, then shall I know that thou wilt save Israel by mine hand, as thou hast said.

38 And it was so: for he rose up early on the morrow, and thrust the fleece together, and wringed the dew out of the fleece, a bowl full of water.

39 And Gideon said unto God, Let not thine anger be hot against me, and I will speak but this once: let me prove, I pray thee, but this once with the fleece; let it now be dry only upon the fleece, and upon all the ground let there be dew.

40 And God did so that night: for it was dry upon the fleece only, and there was dew on all the ground.

Love Child
May 11th 2008, 08:32 PM
I never said that a demon can't quote scriptures- I all ways knew that they can.

dljc
May 12th 2008, 02:38 PM
This response....


Look at Matthew 4:6 and compare it to Psalms

Matthew 4:6 And saith unto him, If thou be the Son of God, cast thyself down: for it is written, He shall give his angels charge concerning thee: and in their hands they shall bear thee up, lest at any time thou dash thy foot against a stone.

Psalm 91:12 They shall bear thee up in their hands, lest thou dash thy foot against a stone.

Satan was quoting scripture in a manner of speaking. He changed it up a little, but it's still saying the same thing. Why can't a demon quote scripture? They believe and tremble too.

James 2:19 Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.

This is why it's important for us to know scripture and spend time with Him. He is our protection from harm. The blue text above was the only variation of the scripture. But look at what satan was asking Jesus to do, he was asking Jesus to throw Himself off of this high place that would kill Him unless the angels stepped in and prevented it.

Matthew 4:5 Then the devil taketh him up into the holy city, and setteth him on a pinnacle of the temple,

A pinnacle is considered a high place. Jesus answer satan with more scripture v 7 Jesus said unto him, It is written again, Thou shalt not tempt the Lord thy God.

Deut 6:16 Ye shall not tempt the LORD your God, as ye tempted him in Massah.

Discernment comes from looking at what is being said, and what scripture is used. I think it's safe to say if a spirit was telling you to jump off of a high building you'd probably question that. I hope you would anyway. :) Listen to the scripture being quoted, and what the request is. But remember, satan knows scriptures too, and he will try and use them against you. But as you can see from Matthew 4:6 it won't be an exact quote, and it will be something to get you to do something that goes against God's Word.

Also remember what I said Gideon asked for a confirmation on what he was told. God doesn't mind if we ask for a confirmation. Generally speaking He will probably provide one without you asking. But He doesn't mind if you ask.

Judges 6:36-40
36 And Gideon said unto God, If thou wilt save Israel by mine hand, as thou hast said,

37 Behold, I will put a fleece of wool in the floor; and if the dew be on the fleece only, and it be dry upon all the earth beside, then shall I know that thou wilt save Israel by mine hand, as thou hast said.

38 And it was so: for he rose up early on the morrow, and thrust the fleece together, and wringed the dew out of the fleece, a bowl full of water.

39 And Gideon said unto God, Let not thine anger be hot against me, and I will speak but this once: let me prove, I pray thee, but this once with the fleece; let it now be dry only upon the fleece, and upon all the ground let there be dew.

40 And God did so that night: for it was dry upon the fleece only, and there was dew on all the ground.was in reference to this part of what you were asking.

OK, you are not only saying that a demon can form that sentance, but a false prophet as well- So a false prophet can say that Jesus is come in the flesh? The point of it is, if satan and a demon can say that Christ has come in the flesh, why can't a false prophet? If satan and a demon can quote scripture, why can't a false prophet?

There are atheists that come to this message board that can quote scripture. There are muslims, hindus, and buddhist that come to this message board than can quote scripture. The point is, anyone can. But what are they saying it means, and/or what are they trying to say using it. Are they saying there is a contradiction, are they placing a heavy burden on folks with it, because they are taking it out of context. Just because someone can quote scripture doesn't mean they are led by the Holy Spirit. It is important to search the Scriptures for yourself, and see if it is being taken out of context. Because anyone can say Jesus Christ has come in the flesh. Confessing that Jesus has come in the flesh means more than just saying it.

A false prophet is going to say and do just about everything a real Christian is going to do. That is why they are a false prophet. There will be one exception. It is for personal gain to lead you away from God instead of to Him. That's the difference between a true prophet and a false prophet. A true prophet will lead you to Jesus Christ, the false prophet will lead you to themselves, which in the end is to satan.

Love Child
May 12th 2008, 03:20 PM
So if any and everybody can quote that sentance, then (IMHO-no offence) I guess that 1 John 4:1-4 is a lie.

Love Child
May 12th 2008, 03:26 PM
I am leaving town tonight, and I will be leaving the state tomorrow morning. I should be back, Lord's willing, this sunday, but for the mean time I will be on vacation. I am going to go see my uncle's child graduate from High School.

dljc
May 12th 2008, 11:43 PM
So if any and everybody can quote that sentance, then (IMHO-no offence) I guess that 1 John 4:1-4 is a lie.No, you are missing the point that was brought up even in the beginning of this thread. "Confessing" and "saying" are two different things.

Are you saying God a liar? Or are you confessing God is a liar?

2 Timothy 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: