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poochie
Aug 17th 2008, 04:37 AM
Who here thinks that Animals will be in Heaven? If so whats your support?

matthew94
Aug 17th 2008, 04:45 AM
What do you mean by 'heaven'?

If you mean the intermediate state, where our disembodied souls/spirits await the resurrection, then I'd speculate that there won't be animals there.

Upon resurrection, we'll inhabit the new Earth with our new bodies and I'd be VERY surprised if the new Earth didn't contain animals, just like it did before sin stained it.

poochie
Aug 17th 2008, 04:46 AM
What do you mean by 'heaven'?

If you mean the intermediate state, where our disembodied souls/spirits await the resurrection, then I'd speculate that there won't be animals there.

Upon resurrection, we'll inhabit the new Earth with our new bodies and I'd be VERY surprised if the new Earth didn't contain animals, just like it did before sin stained it.

I believe that to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord.

Ethnikos
Aug 17th 2008, 05:01 AM
Who here thinks that Animals will be in Heaven? If so whats your support?
The lamb will lie down with the lion.

matthew94
Aug 17th 2008, 05:02 AM
I believe that to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord.

Yes, I also believe that each believer's 'soul' goes to be with the Lord upon death. But this is not the final resting place. Our disembodied soul awaits the future resurrection day.

So do I expect animals to be present in the period of time between my death and judgment day...when I am simply a disembodied soul? No. But do I expect animals to be present when I get my body back and spend eternity on the new earth? Sure! Why wouldn't they?

scourge39
Aug 17th 2008, 06:29 AM
Genesis mentions an interesting detail pertinent to this topic:

And to all the beasts of the earth and all the birds of the air and all the creatures that move on the ground—everything that has the breath of life in it—I give every green plant for food." And it was so. (Genesis 1:30, NIV)

This is the account of the heavens and the earth when they were created.
When the LORD God made the earth and the heavens- and no shrub of the field had yet appeared on the earth and no plant of the field had yet sprung up, for the LORD God had not sent rain on the earth and there was no man to work the ground, but streams came up from the earth and watered the whole surface of the ground- the LORD God formed the man The Hebrew for man (adam) sounds like and may be related to the Hebrew for ground it is also the name Adam. from the dust of the ground and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man became a living being. (Genesis 2:4-7, NIV)

I am going to bring floodwaters on the earth to destroy all life under the heavens, every creature that has the breath of life in it. Everything on earth will perish. (Genesis 6:16-17, NIV)

Pairs of all creatures that have the breath of life in them came to Noah and entered the ark. (Genesis 7:15, NIV)

Everything on dry land that had the breath of life in its nostrils died. (Genesis 7:22, NIV)

Based on this shared description of both humans and animals having the breath of life breathed into them, even some ancient Jewish interpreters believed that it's very possible that animals do indeed have souls. I'm not saying dogmatically that that's absolutely correct, but I wouldn't dismiss it too quickly either. Jews had and interpreted the OT long before Christians did, so I believe that their interpretative insights are at least worth considering. Whether having the breath of life breathed into you is the same as, or in some way coincides with, being endowed with a soul is the million dollar question. Genesis 2:4-7 seems to relate them, but there's not enough evidence to warrant dying on a hill for either perspective. I believe that an agnostic 'wait and see' position is a better response to the issue, given the information that Scripture gives concerning it. There's nothing explicit that either absolutely confirms or denies it in Scripture. That souls are mentioned in relation to people may simply have more to do with Scripture's primary focus on the relationship between God and humanity than with a silent polemic that animals absolutely do not have souls. Perhaps the Levitical teaching that both people and animals who kill other humans deserve the same penalty of capital punishment is related to this issue.

TexasBeliever
Aug 17th 2008, 01:17 PM
Poochie

Yes! I fully expect animals to be there, especially the ones we have loved in life.

Here's why I think that: The Lord Himself comes down OUT OF HEAVEN with His armies, and HE and all of them are riding upon white horses.

So, we already know that there are now, currently in heaven, white horses.

Very cool.

poochie
Aug 17th 2008, 06:03 PM
Amen to that! There are probably animal species we do not know about in Heaven as well.

I hope that the insects will also be there.



Poochie

Yes! I fully expect animals to be there, especially the ones we have loved in life.

Here's why I think that: The Lord Himself comes down OUT OF HEAVEN with His armies, and HE and all of them are riding upon white horses.

So, we already know that there are now, currently in heaven, white horses.

Very cool.

Marc2x
Aug 18th 2008, 01:09 AM
Poochie

Yes! I fully expect animals to be there, especially the ones we have loved in life.

Here's why I think that: The Lord Himself comes down OUT OF HEAVEN with His armies, and HE and all of them are riding upon white horses.

So, we already know that there are now, currently in heaven, white horses.

Very cool.



Amen to that! There are probably animal species we do not know about in Heaven as well.

I hope that the insects will also be there.





I believe they go to heaven too!

God has every living soul and he can bring it back to life
Job 12:7-10-Even birds and animals have much they could teach you; ask the creatures of the earth and sea for their wisdom. All of them know that Yahweh's hand made them. In His hand are the souls of all His creatures and the breath of all humanity.”

Enoch 58-7-“And as every soul of man is according to number, similarly beasts will not perish, nor all souls of beast which the Lord created, till the great judgement, and they will accuse man, if he feed them ill.”

Zechariah 2:4-and said unto him, "Run, speak to this young man, saying, `Jerusalem shall be inhabited as towns without walls, because of the multitude of men and cattle therein.

Psalm 36:6-Your righteousness is like the great mountains; your judgments are a great deep: O LORD, you preserve man and beast.


Check these websites out
http://www.all-creatures.org/discuss/ansouls-jv.html

http://www.ourchurch.com/member/w/w_lasalle/

http://www.eternalanimals.com/question%20and%20answer.htm


I could give you a ton more of scriptures but not right now.
Now excuse me while I hug my Iguana :P

amazzin
Aug 18th 2008, 01:19 AM
I believe that to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord.

That scripture you quoted is out of context. That scripture refers to our spirits. Animals don't got none!

calidog
Aug 18th 2008, 01:23 AM
Who here thinks that Animals will be in Heaven? If so whats your support?
There will be animals in the millennium so we have to ask ourselves "why would'nt there be animal in the new earth?"

Isa 65:25 The wolf and the lamb shall feed together, and the lion shall eat straw like the bullock: and dust shall be the serpent's meat. They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain, saith the LORD.

Ron Brown
Aug 18th 2008, 01:31 AM
If you mean the intermediate state, where our disembodied souls/spirits await the resurrection, then I'd speculate that there won't be animals there.



Correct.

When a human being dies there is an unnatural rendering apart of the body and spirit. God did not create mankind's body and soul to exist apart from one another, but when mankind sinned, the body and spirit are unnaturally rendered apart upon a human being's death.

If we die today, we do not get our transfigured everlasting body/spirit union like Christ has right now. We don't get it till Christ returns for his Church in 1 Thes 4:16-18. Those who are dead in Christ today are in paradise(Abraham's bosom), not heaven where God is. Christ told the thief on the cross that when he died he would be in Paradise with Christ, not in Heaven. There are no animals in Paradise, because they do not have Adamic souls like mankind does, and they are not created in the image of God with an everlasting spirit.

In Revelation chapter's 21 and 22, when it speaks about the new Heaven, new Earth, and New Jerusalem, it does not mention animals living there either. Not saying they don't, just that the Bible does not mention animals being there.

poochie
Aug 18th 2008, 01:47 AM
My mistake. yes it was Out of Context,


That scripture you quoted is out of context. That scripture refers to our spirits. Animals don't got none!

Joe King
Aug 18th 2008, 05:53 AM
Isaiah 11:7 (http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?book_id=29&chapter=11&verse=7&version=31&context=verse)
The cow will feed with the bear, their young will lie down together, and the lion will eat straw like the ox.
Isaiah 11:6-8 (http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?book_id=29&chapter=11&verse=6&end_verse=8&version=31&context=context) (in Context) Isaiah 11 (http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?book_id=29&chapter=11&version=31&context=chapter) (Whole Chapter)
Isaiah 65:25 (http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?book_id=29&chapter=65&verse=25&version=31&context=verse)
The wolf and the lamb will feed together, and the lion will eat straw like the ox, but dust will be the serpent's food. They will neither harm nor destroy on all my holy mountain," says the LORD.
I believe animals will be in heaven with us with spiritual bodies. Heaven is a perfect place with no death. Why wouldn't animals be there. God loves them too.

scourge39
Aug 18th 2008, 06:47 AM
That scripture you quoted is out of context. That scripture refers to our spirits. Animals don't got none!

Nothing in Scripture explicitly says that animals do or don't have souls (Read my earlier post on this thread very carefully). That's simply a popular conjecture that serves as a knee-jerk reaction to our secular culture that believes in preserving animal life and destroying human life.

Mike CP King
Aug 18th 2008, 10:37 PM
Nothing in Scripture explicitly says that animals do or don't have souls (Read my earlier post on this thread very carefully). That's simply a popular conjecture that serves as a knee-jerk reaction to our secular culture that believes in preserving animal life and destroying human life.


Hi,
Genses 2:19 calls animals 'nephesh' which is sometimes translated as 'souls'.

There is nothing in scripture to suggest that 'souls' are separate from the body as the Hebrews used the word 'nepesh' to mean the 'whole' or 'life', but not the Greek idea of a 'soul' that survives death which has no place in the bible.