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Equipped_4_Love
Oct 8th 2008, 05:38 AM
Could someone please explain to me what the hidden manna is referenced in Rev. 2:17?

This is my first time reading through Revelations, and the first thought that came to my mind is the manna that disappeared from the ark of the covenant when it was returned to Israel, and placed in the temple.

Is this the hidden manna that is referred to, or is it something different?

Thanks so much

Ethnikos
Oct 8th 2008, 06:08 AM
Could someone please explain to me what the hidden manna is referenced in Rev. 2:17?

I would think it is related toDeuteronomy 8:3
"And he humbled thee, and suffered thee to hunger, and fed thee with manna, which thou knewest not, neither did thy fathers know; that he might make thee know that man doth not live by bread only, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of the LORD doth man live."
The word "manna" in Rev. can also mean secret, so you could use that meaning in both verses. It was something not known until the Israelites went into the desert and the manna in Rev. is symbolic of Christ and was not know of until he appeared and made himself known.

VerticalReality
Oct 8th 2008, 12:37 PM
The truth of the hidden manna lies in John 6 . . .



John 6:22-71

The Bread from Heaven

22 On the following day, when the people who were standing on the other side of the sea saw that there was no other boat there, except that one which His disciples had entered,[c (http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=John%20%206&version=50#fen-NKJV-26274c)] and that Jesus had not entered the boat with His disciples, but His disciples had gone away alone— 23 however, other boats came from Tiberias, near the place where they ate bread after the Lord had given thanks— 24 when the people therefore saw that Jesus was not there, nor His disciples, they also got into boats and came to Capernaum, seeking Jesus. 25 And when they found Him on the other side of the sea, they said to Him, “Rabbi, when did You come here?”
26 Jesus answered them and said, “Most assuredly, I say to you, you seek Me, not because you saw the signs, but because you ate of the loaves and were filled. 27 Do not labor for the food which perishes, but for the food which endures to everlasting life, which the Son of Man will give you, because God the Father has set His seal on Him.”
28 Then they said to Him, “What shall we do, that we may work the works of God?”
29 Jesus answered and said to them, “This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He sent.”
30 Therefore they said to Him, “What sign will You perform then, that we may see it and believe You? What work will You do? 31 Our fathers ate the manna in the desert; as it is written, ‘He gave them bread from heaven to eat.’”[d (http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=John%20%206&version=50#fen-NKJV-26283d)]
32 Then Jesus said to them, “Most assuredly, I say to you, Moses did not give you the bread from heaven, but My Father gives you the true bread from heaven. 33 For the bread of God is He who comes down from heaven and gives life to the world.”
34 Then they said to Him, “Lord, give us this bread always.”
35 And Jesus said to them, “I am the bread of life. He who comes to Me shall never hunger, and he who believes in Me shall never thirst. 36 But I said to you that you have seen Me and yet do not believe. 37 All that the Father gives Me will come to Me, and the one who comes to Me I will by no means cast out. 38 For I have come down from heaven, not to do My own will, but the will of Him who sent Me. 39 This is the will of the Father who sent Me, that of all He has given Me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up at the last day. 40 And this is the will of Him who sent Me, that everyone who sees the Son and believes in Him may have everlasting life; and I will raise him up at the last day.”

Rejected by His Own

41 The Jews then complained about Him, because He said, “I am the bread which came down from heaven.” 42 And they said, “Is not this Jesus, the son of Joseph, whose father and mother we know? How is it then that He says, ‘I have come down from heaven’?”
43 Jesus therefore answered and said to them, “Do not murmur among yourselves. 44 No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him; and I will raise him up at the last day. 45 It is written in the prophets, ‘And they shall all be taught by God.’[e (http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=John%20%206&version=50#fen-NKJV-26297e)]Therefore everyone who has heard and learned[f (http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=John%20%206&version=50#fen-NKJV-26297f)] from the Father comes to Me. 46 Not that anyone has seen the Father, except He who is from God; He has seen the Father. 47 Most assuredly, I say to you, he who believes in Me[g (http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=John%20%206&version=50#fen-NKJV-26299g)] has everlasting life. 48 I am the bread of life. 49 Your fathers ate the manna in the wilderness, and are dead. 50 This is the bread which comes down from heaven, that one may eat of it and not die. 51 I am the living bread which came down from heaven. If anyone eats of this bread, he will live forever; and the bread that I shall give is My flesh, which I shall give for the life of the world.”
52 The Jews therefore quarreled among themselves, saying, “How can this Man give us His flesh to eat?”
53 Then Jesus said to them, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink His blood, you have no life in you. 54 Whoever eats My flesh and drinks My blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day. 55 For My flesh is food indeed,[h (http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=John%20%206&version=50#fen-NKJV-26307h)] and My blood is drink indeed. 56 He who eats My flesh and drinks My blood abides in Me, and I in him. 57 As the living Father sent Me, and I live because of the Father, so he who feeds on Me will live because of Me. 58 This is the bread which came down from heaven—not as your fathers ate the manna, and are dead. He who eats this bread will live forever.”
59 These things He said in the synagogue as He taught in Capernaum.

Many Disciples Turn Away

60 Therefore many of His disciples, when they heard this, said, “This is a hard saying; who can understand it?”
61 When Jesus knew in Himself that His disciples complained about this, He said to them, “Does this offend you? 62 What then if you should see the Son of Man ascend where He was before? 63 It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh profits nothing. The words that I speak to you are spirit, and they are life. 64 But there are some of you who do not believe.” For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were who did not believe, and who would betray Him. 65 And He said, “Therefore I have said to you that no one can come to Me unless it has been granted to him by My Father.”
66 From that time many of His disciples went back and walked with Him no more. 67 Then Jesus said to the twelve, “Do you also want to go away?”
68 But Simon Peter answered Him, “Lord, to whom shall we go? You have the words of eternal life. 69 Also we have come to believe and know that You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.”
70 Jesus answered them, “Did I not choose you, the twelve, and one of you is a devil?” 71 He spoke of Judas Iscariot, [I]the son of Simon, for it was he who would betray Him, being one of the twelve.

Equipped_4_Love
Oct 11th 2008, 11:52 PM
I would think it is related toDeuteronomy 8:3
"And he humbled thee, and suffered thee to hunger, and fed thee with manna, which thou knewest not, neither did thy fathers know; that he might make thee know that man doth not live by bread only, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of the LORD doth man live."
The word "manna" in Rev. can also mean secret, so you could use that meaning in both verses. It was something not known until the Israelites went into the desert and the manna in Rev. is symbolic of Christ and was not know of until he appeared and made himself known.

Thank you. That explains quite a bit. So, then, the manna is symbolic rather than literal?
If it represents Christ, why is then called the hidden manna? The mystery of Christ is no longer hidden, so I am wondering why John refers to it as hidden manna?

AliveinChristDave
Oct 12th 2008, 02:12 AM
Amen to the verses posted by VerticalRealty.

John 14:18 I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you.

John 14:19 Yet a little while, and the world seeth me no more; but ye see me: because I live, ye shall live also.

John 14:20 At that day ye shall know that I [am] in my Father, and ye in me, and I in you.

Vs. 20 is a glorious verse. Our position is being in Christ who is in the Father and in us. Plus, we are in Him.

What we have with Christ cannot be seen nor experienced by anyone who hasn't experienced the reality of the living Christ, therefore it is hidden.

Dani H
Oct 12th 2008, 03:20 PM
Those who overcome ... know what the hidden mana is. :)

“ Rise up, my love, my fair one,
And come away.
11 For lo, the winter is past,
The rain is over and gone.
12 The flowers appear on the earth;
The time of singing has come,
And the voice of the turtledove
Is heard in our land.
13 The fig tree puts forth her green figs,
And the vines with the tender grapes
Give a good smell.
Rise up, my love, my fair one,
And come away!
14 “ O my dove, in the clefts of the rock,
In the secret places of the cliff,
Let me see your face,
Let me hear your voice;
For your voice is sweet,
And your face is lovely.”

Levin
Oct 20th 2008, 04:38 AM
Hey Guys,

While I appreciate your research on the topic and attempts to find out what this means, I must disagree with your position that the hidden manna in some way references Christ. Here's why:

This passage in Revelation was sent to one church. Read the context:

"And to the angel of the church in Pergamum write: 'The words of him who has the sharp two-edged sword. "'I know where you dwell, where Satan’s throne is. Yet you hold fast my name, and you did not deny my faith even in the days of Antipas my faithful witness, who was killed among you, where Satan dwells. But I have a few things against you: you have some there who hold the teaching of Balaam, who taught Balak to put a stumbling block before the sons of Israel, so that they might eat food sacrificed to idols and practice sexual immorality. So also you have some who hold the teaching of the Nicolaitans. Therefore repent. If not, I will come to you soon and war against them with the sword of my mouth. He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. To the one who conquers I will give some of the hidden manna, and I will give him a white stone, with a new name written on the stone that no one knows except the one who receives it.'


This is obviously not referring to the church in general, but to the church located in Pergamum. As in every letter to a church in Revelation, there is an encouragement, a rebuke, and a reward. These are very specific to the original audience. If the ones who held faith in the days of Antipas or held to the teachings of the Nicolaitans are the only ones addressed in the first part of the letter, then surely the second half (rewards) only references these same people.


Therefore, if the hidden manna is only given to those in Pergamum who overcome, then it cannot represent Christ, who has come for all.


I don't have the references at hand to come up with a better explanation, but I will in the next week or so. There's something specific about the people of Pergamum and the hidden manna, so good luck finding out what it is; I'll do my best.


Researching,

Levin

Sold Out
Oct 20th 2008, 01:20 PM
Could someone please explain to me what the hidden manna is referenced in Rev. 2:17?

This is my first time reading through Revelations, and the first thought that came to my mind is the manna that disappeared from the ark of the covenant when it was returned to Israel, and placed in the temple.

Is this the hidden manna that is referred to, or is it something different?

Thanks so much

Christians who “overcome” the Devil, the world, and the flesh and remain faithful to Christ will experience the deep things of God (the meaning behind - “hidden manna” - I Cor 2:9-13, I Jn 5:4-5 and Rev 2:7).

VerticalReality
Oct 20th 2008, 01:28 PM
Hey Guys,

While I appreciate your research on the topic and attempts to find out what this means, I must disagree with your position that the hidden manna in some way references Christ. Here's why:

This passage in Revelation was sent to one church. Read the context:

"And to the angel of the church in Pergamum write: 'The words of him who has the sharp two-edged sword. "'I know where you dwell, where Satan’s throne is. Yet you hold fast my name, and you did not deny my faith even in the days of Antipas my faithful witness, who was killed among you, where Satan dwells. But I have a few things against you: you have some there who hold the teaching of Balaam, who taught Balak to put a stumbling block before the sons of Israel, so that they might eat food sacrificed to idols and practice sexual immorality. So also you have some who hold the teaching of the Nicolaitans. Therefore repent. If not, I will come to you soon and war against them with the sword of my mouth. He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. To the one who conquers I will give some of the hidden manna, and I will give him a white stone, with a new name written on the stone that no one knows except the one who receives it.'


This is obviously not referring to the church in general, but to the church located in Pergamum. As in every letter to a church in Revelation, there is an encouragement, a rebuke, and a reward. These are very specific to the original audience. If the ones who held faith in the days of Antipas or held to the teachings of the Nicolaitans are the only ones addressed in the first part of the letter, then surely the second half (rewards) only references these same people.


Therefore, if the hidden manna is only given to those in Pergamum who overcome, then it cannot represent Christ, who has come for all.


I don't have the references at hand to come up with a better explanation, but I will in the next week or so. There's something specific about the people of Pergamum and the hidden manna, so good luck finding out what it is; I'll do my best.


Researching,

Levin

I understand why you are stating what you are. However, I cannot agree with it. Using the framework for what you are stating here would mean VERY bad news for other churches if this reasoning were true. . .

Let us just have a look at the very first church and the reward they would be given if they repent . . .

Here the Lord informs the church at Ephesus that they have forgotten their first love. He then instructs them to repent. What will they receive if they repent?



Revelation 2:7
“He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. To him who overcomes I will give to eat from the tree of life, which is in the midst of the Paradise of God.”’


However, using the reasoning you stated above, Levin, this would not be applicable to the rest of those churches. That would be very unfortunate. However, we can be assured that this is not true. All believers who are faithful will be given the tree of life to eat from. Just the same, all believers who are faithful will be given the hidden manna as well . . .

Jurell
Oct 20th 2008, 05:01 PM
I don;t know if it's right or not, because I've only recently started dinging deeper into the meaning of what is in the bible...

But the "hidden Manna" in Revelations was the first thing I thought of when I when I was reading through Exodus and came to the part where the lord provides food foe the Israelites.


EXODUS 16:14-16: When the Dew was gone, thin flakes like frost on the ground appeared on the desert floor. 15 When the Israelites saw it, they said to each other, "What is it?" For they did not know what it was. Moses said to them, "It is the bread the Lord has given you to eat. 16 This is what the Lord has Commanded: 'Each one is to gather as much as he needs.Take an omer for each person you have in your tent.'"

EXODUS 16:31 The people of Israel called the bread manna. It was white like coriander seed and tasted like wafers made with honey (NIV)

Somehow, my mind connected those verses to the saying "The bread of life." Only in Revelations, the Hidden Manna is really food for the soul.

The Prodigal Son
Nov 1st 2008, 01:19 PM
He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the hidden manna, and will give him a white stone, and in the stone a new name written, which no man knoweth saving he that receiveth [it].

The bible is the word of God and although we all have it, there are parts that are not understood or parts that are ‘hidden’. Interestingly, the ‘stone’ referred to in Rev 2:17 is Strong’s 5586 and as far as I can tell is only located in one other place Acts 26:10 where it is translated as ‘voice’.

Do you suppose that God reveals truth in his word (hidden manna) and only those whom God elects will hear his voice (Amo 8:11)?