PDA

View Full Version : Any ideas about this verse?



Richard H
Nov 9th 2008, 06:51 AM
"We must work the works of Him who sent Me as long as it is day; night is coming when no one can work.
John 9:4

I get the first part.
What or when is the night when no one can work? :dunno:


Context:
As He passed by, He saw a man blind from birth.
And His disciples asked Him, "Rabbi, who sinned, this man or his parents, that he would be born blind?"
Jesus answered, "It was neither that this man sinned, nor his parents; but it was so that the works of God might be displayed in him.
"We must work the works of Him who sent Me as long as it is day; night is coming when no one can work.
"While I am in the world, I am the Light of the world."
When He had said this, He spat on the ground, and made clay of the spittle, and applied the clay to his eyes,
and said to him, "Go, wash in the pool of Siloam" (which is translated, Sent). So he went away and washed, and came back seeing.
John 9:1-7 NASB

brakelite
Nov 9th 2008, 07:04 AM
Ever heard of the dark ages? From the 5th century the true church was forced underground and fled into the wilderness for over a thousand years. The light of God's word was virtually extinguished from a vast portion of the earth and tradition and falsehood was taught in it's place. The reformation brought back the light of God's word and truth again began to be understood. Bible societies increased as did missionary endeavors worldwide. And today, particularly in the third world, it can be truly said again that 'greater works than these ' are being done.

Lamplighter
Nov 9th 2008, 07:11 AM
"We must work the works of Him who sent Me as long as it is day; night is coming when no one can work.
John 9:4

I get the first part.
What or when is the night when no one can work? :dunno:


Context:
As He passed by, He saw a man blind from birth.
And His disciples asked Him, "Rabbi, who sinned, this man or his parents, that he would be born blind?"
Jesus answered, "It was neither that this man sinned, nor his parents; but it was so that the works of God might be displayed in him.
"We must work the works of Him who sent Me as long as it is day; night is coming when no one can work.
"While I am in the world, I am the Light of the world."
When He had said this, He spat on the ground, and made clay of the spittle, and applied the clay to his eyes,
and said to him, "Go, wash in the pool of Siloam" (which is translated, Sent). So he went away and washed, and came back seeing.
John 9:1-7 NASB

Jesus is telling the disciples that he will soon be gone from them, so they must work quickly in the ministry, while he is still alive.

Of course the disciples did not understand Jesus, because they thought he was going to be around until he died as an old man reigning as king.

Richard H
Nov 9th 2008, 07:28 AM
Jesus is telling the disciples that he will soon be gone from them, so they must work quickly in the ministry, while he is still alive.

Of course the disciples did not understand Jesus, because they thought he was going to be around until he died as an old man reigning as king.The next verse does suggest that.
"While I am in the world, I am the Light of the world."

But He said no one could work.

I was thinking this might have something to do with it. But I dunno.
And the city has no need of the sun or of the moon to shine on it, for the glory of God has illumined it, and its lamp is the Lamb.
The nations will walk by its light, and the kings of the earth will bring their glory into it.
In the daytime (for there will be no night there) its gates will never be closed;
Rev 21:23,25

Richard H
Nov 9th 2008, 07:41 AM
Ever heard of the dark ages? From the 5th century the true church was forced underground and fled into the wilderness for over a thousand years. The light of God's word was virtually extinguished from a vast portion of the earth and tradition and falsehood was taught in it's place. The reformation brought back the light of God's word and truth again began to be understood. Bible societies increased as did missionary endeavors worldwide. And today, particularly in the third world, it can be truly said again that 'greater works than these ' are being done.OK. Thanks, brakelight. :)
However, I don't think He was prophesying about the dark ages - as dark as they were indeed.
It was something either about Himself or something longer term or even eternal. (MHO)

Zack702
Nov 9th 2008, 08:41 AM
It was something either about Himself or something longer term or even eternal. (MHO)

Amazing Grace how sweet the sound, that saved a wretch like me.
I once was lost but now am found, was blind but now I see.

What do I see other than the light?
We are all blind like that fellow unless we have light to see and to know righteousness.

Let Jesus in and the light is in you.
That they who are blind might see truth and made aware.

Else our days are fullfilled and night comes.
No one does work at night and there is a reason.
It is because they are asleep.(figuratively speaking. There are people who work at night but usually we sleep at night)

RogerW
Nov 9th 2008, 02:30 PM
"We must work the works of Him who sent Me as long as it is day; night is coming when no one can work.
John 9:4

I get the first part.
What or when is the night when no one can work? :dunno:


Context:
As He passed by, He saw a man blind from birth.
And His disciples asked Him, "Rabbi, who sinned, this man or his parents, that he would be born blind?"
Jesus answered, "It was neither that this man sinned, nor his parents; but it was so that the works of God might be displayed in him.
"We must work the works of Him who sent Me as long as it is day; night is coming when no one can work.
"While I am in the world, I am the Light of the world."
When He had said this, He spat on the ground, and made clay of the spittle, and applied the clay to his eyes,
and said to him, "Go, wash in the pool of Siloam" (which is translated, Sent). So he went away and washed, and came back seeing.
John 9:1-7 NASB

Greetings Richard,

When you read the passage as it is suppose to be translated, along with additional verses does it become apparent what and whose work Christ was speaking of?

Joh 9:4 I must work the works of him that sent me, while it is day: the night cometh, when no man can work.
Joh 9:5 As long as I am in the world, I am the light of the world.

Joh 4:34 Jesus saith unto them, My meat is to do the will of him that sent me, and to finish his work.

Joh 5:19 Then answered Jesus and said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, The Son can do nothing of himself, but what he seeth the Father do: for what things soever he doeth, these also doeth the Son likewise.

Joh 10:32 Jesus answered them, Many good works have I shewed you from my Father; for which of those works do ye stone me?

Joh 17:4 I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do.

2Co 5:19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.

When Christ became fully man He did the work that God had given Him. While He was in the world, He was the light of the world. After the cross there is no man who can do the works that God sent His Son into the world to accomplish. Now the work of salvation comes through the power of the Word and Holy Spirit. Men are in darkness because the true light has left this world, but Christ sent His Spirit so that man can still come to Him, not through their own works, but through the ministry of the Spirit.

Many Blessings,
RW

daughter
Nov 9th 2008, 02:36 PM
"We must work the works of Him who sent Me as long as it is day; night is coming when no one can work.
John 9:4

I get the first part.
What or when is the night when no one can work? :dunno:


I think in the immediate context, it meant that a time was coming, quite soon for the disciples, when Jesus would be crucified, and a greater night would come than ever before. In the garden, Jesus tells the guards "this is your hour, when darkness reigns."

Then, of course, He rose again, and that darkness was banished.

I think there may come a darkness at the end of the world, when "He that restrains" (that's the Holy Spirit) is removed, and in the ensuing panic and horror no-one will be able to work.

RogerW
Nov 9th 2008, 02:40 PM
I think in the immediate context, it meant that a time was coming, quite soon for the disciples, when Jesus would be crucified, and a greater night would come than ever before. In the garden, Jesus tells the guards "this is your hour, when darkness reigns."

Then, of course, He rose again, and that darkness was banished.

I think there may come a darkness at the end of the world, when "He that restrains" (that's the Holy Spirit) is removed, and in the ensuing panic and horror no-one will be able to work.

Greetings Daughter,

I don't want to derail Richard's thread, so if you wish to discuss this further you can start a new thread. I just wanted to give you something to think about regarding the removal of the Holy Spirit. When the Spirit is removed from this earth, wouldn't that mean that all who possess the Spirit are also removed, else how could He actually be removed?

Many Blessings,
RW

daughter
Nov 9th 2008, 02:49 PM
Yes, I was thinking along those lines too...

There's probably already a thread about it somewhere. :hmm:

But no further derailing, promise!

Richard H
Nov 9th 2008, 05:06 PM
Yes, I was thinking along those lines too...

There's probably already a thread about it somewhere. :hmm:

But no further derailing, promise! :) I don't think it's a derailment at all.
Even as a 7th Trump-"tribber" (LOL) who does think the Holy Spirit is "the restrainer" spoken of, there will be a time when the church is out-of-here - as it were. :saint:

I appreciate ALL the great replies.
Whether I'm of the opinion or not - does not matter.
Jesus said it, and I think it means something. :)

Butch5
Nov 9th 2008, 09:00 PM
"We must work the works of Him who sent Me as long as it is day; night is coming when no one can work.
John 9:4

I get the first part.
What or when is the night when no one can work? :dunno:


Context:
As He passed by, He saw a man blind from birth.
And His disciples asked Him, "Rabbi, who sinned, this man or his parents, that he would be born blind?"
Jesus answered, "It was neither that this man sinned, nor his parents; but it was so that the works of God might be displayed in him.
"We must work the works of Him who sent Me as long as it is day; night is coming when no one can work.
"While I am in the world, I am the Light of the world."
When He had said this, He spat on the ground, and made clay of the spittle, and applied the clay to his eyes,
and said to him, "Go, wash in the pool of Siloam" (which is translated, Sent). So he went away and washed, and came back seeing.
John 9:1-7 NASB

Hi Richard,

Here is a link to the Ante-Nicene Fathers where Origen quotes this verse.

http://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/anf09.xv.iii.i.xxiv.html

Richard H
Nov 10th 2008, 03:55 AM
Hi Richard,

Here is a link to the Ante-Nicene Fathers where Origen quotes this verse.


I appreciate the link, Butch :) , but I don’t look to the apocrypha for enlightenment.
I did look through the commentary, though.

‘Lots on the light and the day, but nothing about the night when no one is able to work.

EDIT: Please see my post #15.

Kudo Shinichi
Nov 10th 2008, 10:01 AM
I guess it's the time GOD is doing the work is day time, night time is when he has finished his work at Calvary...;) dead and 3rd day resurrected...


"We must work the works of Him who sent Me as long as it is day; night is coming when no one can work.
John 9:4

I get the first part.
What or when is the night when no one can work? :dunno:


Context:
As He passed by, He saw a man blind from birth.
And His disciples asked Him, "Rabbi, who sinned, this man or his parents, that he would be born blind?"
Jesus answered, "It was neither that this man sinned, nor his parents; but it was so that the works of God might be displayed in him.
"We must work the works of Him who sent Me as long as it is day; night is coming when no one can work.
"While I am in the world, I am the Light of the world."
When He had said this, He spat on the ground, and made clay of the spittle, and applied the clay to his eyes,
and said to him, "Go, wash in the pool of Siloam" (which is translated, Sent). So he went away and washed, and came back seeing.
John 9:1-7 NASB

Richard H
Nov 10th 2008, 04:41 PM
Hi Richard,

Here is a link to the Ante-Nicene Fathers where Origen quotes this verse.

http://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/anf09.xv.iii.i.xxiv.html
Hi Butch,
I stand corrected about the this being part of the apocrypha.
Rather, it turns out to be more of early church history.

Even before I was corrected, I appreciate your input into finding an answer to my question. :)

Richard

Butch5
Nov 10th 2008, 08:15 PM
Hi Butch,
I stand corrected about the this being part of the apocrypha.
Rather, it turns out to be more of early church history.

Even before I was corrected, I appreciate your input into finding an answer to my question. :)

Richard

Hi Rihard,

He doesn't go into detail on the verse but does quote it and I thought the context of the passage might be helpful.

Richard H
Nov 10th 2008, 08:48 PM
Hi Rihard,

He doesn't go into detail on the verse but does quote it and I thought the context of the passage might be helpful.The more perspective - the better! :)

manichunter
Nov 10th 2008, 11:43 PM
"We must work the works of Him who sent Me as long as it is day; night is coming when no one can work.
John 9:4

I get the first part.
What or when is the night when no one can work? :dunno:


Context:
As He passed by, He saw a man blind from birth.
And His disciples asked Him, "Rabbi, who sinned, this man or his parents, that he would be born blind?"
Jesus answered, "It was neither that this man sinned, nor his parents; but it was so that the works of God might be displayed in him.
"We must work the works of Him who sent Me as long as it is day; night is coming when no one can work.
"While I am in the world, I am the Light of the world."
When He had said this, He spat on the ground, and made clay of the spittle, and applied the clay to his eyes,
and said to him, "Go, wash in the pool of Siloam" (which is translated, Sent). So he went away and washed, and came back seeing.
John 9:1-7 NASB


Light refers to the opportunity to grasp revelations when understanding is possible. Darkness is associated with ignorance when the chance to understand is missing and people are no longer capable of obtaining any farther revelations. The time of darkness is approaching when their will be no farther revelations to be given to the corporate body, same few individuals, who prepared before the darkness was introduced. Light has been from the birth of Yeshua until the Anti-Yeshua takes power.

Let's translate the words from the Greek. I do not have time at this time, but would love to study with a partner who does not mind looking it up until I can.

Richard H
Nov 11th 2008, 01:15 AM
Light refers to the opportunity to grasp revelations when understanding is possible. Darkness is associated with ignorance when the chance to understand is missing and people are no longer capable of obtaining any farther revelations. The time of darkness is approaching when their will be no farther revelations to be given to the corporate body, same few individuals, who prepared before the darkness was introduced. Light has been from the birth of Yeshua until the Anti-Yeshua takes power.

Let's translate the words from the Greek. I do not have time at this time, but would love to study with a partner who does not mind looking it up until I can.Ah!
If Jesus is the light of the world (the day).
The night is the opposite! The anti-Christ.

It's starting to dawn on me. :)
Thanks, manichunter!

I haven't seen you around too much lately. It's good to see you again. :)
Richard

manichunter
Nov 11th 2008, 03:31 AM
Ah!
If Jesus is the light of the world (the day).
The night is the opposite! The anti-Christ.

It's starting to dawn on me. :)
Thanks, manichunter!

I haven't seen you around too much lately. It's good to see you again. :)
Richard

One of my Pastors died in the Hurricane that came through Texas and I had to pick up a lot of slack with the seminary session starting as well in Sept. Hence I have to teach a few additional classes as well my continiuing education. Things are sort of normal as of now for a while at least.

My Pastor taught on light and darkness a while back and he translated the words as such from the Greek. light being an environment where you could see and darkness being an environment where you could not see. There will come a time where we will not be able to see, when God, and I said God, will appoint the Anti-light (darkness) to be in complete power, when even the elect could be deceived if they are not prepared.

I am learning and have learned a great deal since my last visit, especially about the divine calender, the messages it convey, and how God meant to ordain all things in regards to our redemption back into the kingdom through His Festivals.

Holla back later.

SIG
Nov 11th 2008, 03:54 AM
Jesus noted a number of times that the period of His incarnation was special (as "the bridegroom with us now," "the poor you will always have, but I...." the light being here now, etc [I'm paraphrasing, of course]).

Jesus refers here to the work He and His disciples do during His ministry. This work is unique because He is present.

Note also the specific miracle--the healing of a man blind from birth. This is specifically a Messianic miracle. Apart from Jesus, Scripture does not report this miracle again. (You may think of Paul's blindness and healing--but it was also Jesus who did those.)

Of course God is the Author of light, and it was the first thing He commanded. But I propose that that light in the form of a man only occurred during Jesus' incarnation, and will not be seen again until His return.

Richard H
Nov 11th 2008, 04:03 AM
One of my Pastors died in the Hurricane that came through Texas and I had to pick up a lot of slack with the seminary session starting as well in Sept. Hence I have to teach a few additional classes as well my continiuing education. Things are sort of normal as of now for a while at least.

My Pastor taught on light and darkness a while back and he translated the words as such from the Greek. light being an environment where you could see and darkness being an environment where you could not see. There will come a time where we will not be able to see, when God, and I said God, will appoint the Anti-light (darkness) to be in complete power, when even the elect could be deceived if they are not prepared.

I am learning and have learned a great deal since my last visit, especially about the divine calender, the messages it convey, and how God meant to ordain all things in regards to our redemption back into the kingdom through His Festivals.

Holla back later.I'm so sorry to hear about the hurricane taking your Pastor's life. :cry:

I took a very quick look at Strongs. the Father's work seems to mean ministry. the same word is used for "no man/no one can work".

So "night" - meaning: spiritual darkeness, even deep deception. :hmm:

As you now know, understanding the feasts and God's calendar, opens up a whole new level for grasping Scripture. :yes:

Thaddaeus
Nov 11th 2008, 04:10 AM
This darkness can't be referring to the time after Jesus left planet earth for Jesus told us to be the light also

Mt 5:14Ye are the light of the world. A city that is set on an hill cannot be hid.Mt 5:15Neither do men light a candle, and put it under a bushel, but on a candlestick; and it giveth light unto all that are in the house.Mt 5:16Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven.


or even after all the disciples left planet earth for there is still labors to do in His fields. because if this were true, then there would be no need for us to labor.

I think it is referring to the time after the anti-christ reveals his true colors, we know that the light is still working during the first part of the tribulation for
Re 7:14And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.


but then joel and peter both tells us about the darkness. just before the great day the Lord cometh.


Joe 2:31The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and the terrible day of the LORD come.

Ac 2:20The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before that great and notable day of the Lord come:

Richard H
Nov 11th 2008, 04:20 AM
Jesus noted a number of times that the period of His incarnation was special (as "the bridegroom with us now," "the poor you will always have, but I...." the light being here now, etc [I'm paraphrasing, of course]).

Jesus refers here to the work He and His disciples do during His ministry. This work is unique because He is present.

Note also the specific miracle--the healing of a man blind from birth. This is specifically a Messianic miracle. Apart from Jesus, Scripture does not report this miracle again. (You may think of Paul's blindness and healing--but it was also Jesus who did those.)

Of course God is the Author of light, and it was the first thing He commanded. But I propose that that light in the form of a man only occurred during Jesus' incarnation, and will not be seen again until His return.
Hi SIG, :)
God’s timing always amazes me (re: “ministry”) J

I suppose we were all born blind, but now we see.

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
The same was in the beginning with God.
All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
In him was life; and the life was the light of men.
And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.
John 1:1-5

Richard H
Nov 11th 2008, 04:43 AM
This darkness can't be referring to the time after Jesus left planet earth for Jesus told us to be the light also

Mt 5:14Ye are the light of the world. A city that is set on an hill cannot be hid.Mt 5:15Neither do men light a candle, and put it under a bushel, but on a candlestick; and it giveth light unto all that are in the house.Mt 5:16Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven.


or even after all the disciples left planet earth for there is still labors to do in His fields. because if this were true, then there would be no need for us to labor.

I think it is referring to the time after the anti-christ reveals his true colors, we know that the light is still working during the first part of the tribulation for
Re 7:14And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.


but then joel and peter both tells us about the darkness. just before the great day the Lord cometh.


Joe 2:31The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and the terrible day of the LORD come.

Ac 2:20The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before that great and notable day of the Lord come:Hi Thaddaeus, :)
Yes.
We're to be shining lights while we're here - bringing the light of His good news.
But is now made manifest by the appearing of our Saviour Jesus Christ, who hath abolished death, and hath brought life and immortality to light through the gospel:
2Timothy 1:10

Because the anti-Christ will show up at some time - casting the shadow of deception and even thinking he has overcome the light - but he will be mistaken.

The darkening of the sun will be symbolic of the times, as well as (IMHO) literal.

Thanks,
Richard

Richard H
Nov 11th 2008, 04:50 AM
I think I've grasped the meaning of "night when no man can minister"...
at least a bit, until God unveils another layer of His Word. :)

I'd like to thank everyone for helping me "get it". :idea:

If anyone has more to add - I'm always listening. :)

May God bless all your endeavors,
Richard

manichunter
Nov 11th 2008, 06:16 AM
I think I've grasped the meaning of "night when no man can minister"...
at least a bit, until God unveils another layer of His Word. :)

I'd like to thank everyone for helping me "get it". :idea:

If anyone has more to add - I'm always listening. :)

May God bless all your endeavors,
Richard

It will also be a time of corporate silence. God has gone silent a few times when His people go astray. He has repeated this same pattern even in this dispensation of the covenant of redemption. He speaks of repentance, judgement, and reconcilation, then goes silent depending on our respond to His message. Well darkness would silence on God's part.

I personaly have a whole lot to get right so my ears stay open and I can go into the darkness unto the wedding feast with oil in my lamp. :idea:

manichunter
Nov 11th 2008, 06:18 AM
I think I've grasped the meaning of "night when no man can minister"...
at least a bit, until God unveils another layer of His Word. :)

I'd like to thank everyone for helping me "get it". :idea:

If anyone has more to add - I'm always listening. :)

May God bless all your endeavors,
Richard

What you speak of is prophetic as in it will actually take place just as Yeshua said. We have the light, hence the ability to receive the revelation necessary to retain oil in the lamp for the upcoming darkness.

Richard H
Nov 11th 2008, 08:29 AM
It will also be a time of corporate silence. God has gone silent a few times when His people go astray. He has repeated this same pattern even in this dispensation of the covenant of redemption. He speaks of repentance, judgement, and reconcilation, then goes silent depending on our respond to His message. Well darkness would silence on God's part.

I personaly have a whole lot to get right so my ears stay open and I can go into the darkness unto the wedding feast with oil in my lamp. :idea:Interesting.
Do you think He would be silent to individuals at those times, as well?

We all need to get better in tune with the leading of the Spirit - darkness or not. Not just hearing but also obeying.
Readily available and easy pouring vessels get more use, and with each use we learn better - the touch of the hand.

Kudo Shinichi
Nov 11th 2008, 12:13 PM
;) Yup, quite interesting perspective, it does apply to the verse.



This darkness can't be referring to the time after Jesus left planet earth for Jesus told us to be the light also

Mt 5:14Ye are the light of the world. A city that is set on an hill cannot be hid.Mt 5:15Neither do men light a candle, and put it under a bushel, but on a candlestick; and it giveth light unto all that are in the house.Mt 5:16Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven.


or even after all the disciples left planet earth for there is still labors to do in His fields. because if this were true, then there would be no need for us to labor.

I think it is referring to the time after the anti-christ reveals his true colors, we know that the light is still working during the first part of the tribulation for
Re 7:14And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.


but then joel and peter both tells us about the darkness. just before the great day the Lord cometh.


Joe 2:31The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and the terrible day of the LORD come.

Ac 2:20The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before that great and notable day of the Lord come:

manichunter
Nov 11th 2008, 02:03 PM
Interesting.
Do you think He would be silent to individuals at those times, as well?

We all need to get better in tune with the leading of the Spirit - darkness or not. Not just hearing but also obeying.
Readily available and easy pouring vessels get more use, and with each use we learn better - the touch of the hand.

No, not according to pattern. God was often silent to the corporate of Israel but kept talking to His prophets after declaring He would remain silent for a period of time.

He spoke to Jacob and then Joseph, annoucing that He would be silent, and He was true to His word as there is no recorded history until Moses. Then He announced a period of silence through Jeremiah, Isaiah, and others prophets, hence we have a gap from the post Babylon captivity to the birth of John the Baptist. Now we have the same thing happening. What we saints often call the new covenant is nothing more than a repeat of the old covenant as far as patterns, human behavior, and the repeating of history. Hence, Yeshua said the end would be like the time of Noah, because the more we think things have change, the more they remain the same. The only thing that has not changed despite technology, convience, and population is human behavior and tendecies. I believe everything regarded as a pattern in the old covenant has and will be repeated in the new covenant. This includes the saints falling away several times, undergoing judgement, and being brought out of spiritua captivity from a Spiritua Babylon.