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mikebr
Jan 30th 2009, 10:50 PM
And all this is from God, who has reconciled us to himself through Christ and given us the ministry of reconciliation, 19 namely, God was reconciling the world to himself in Christ, not counting their trespasses against them and entrusting to us the message of reconciliation.


Who is the them that God has not counted their trespasses against?

mikebr
Jan 31st 2009, 12:32 AM
Lookers but no takers:cool:?

MacGyver
Jan 31st 2009, 12:47 AM
That would be the children of God. The passage is in 2 Cor. 5:19 for those who are curious.

Gulah Papyrus
Jan 31st 2009, 01:08 AM
Them = the ones who are not here, now
Us = the ones who are here, now

TrustingFollower
Jan 31st 2009, 03:46 AM
Who is the them that God has not counted their trespasses against?
Site the book, chapter and verses you are referencing in your OP.

holyrokker
Jan 31st 2009, 04:46 AM
2 Corinthians 5:18-20 "All this is from God, who through Christ reconciled us to himself and gave us the ministry of reconciliation; that is, in Christ God was reconciling the world to himself, not counting their trespasses against them, and entrusting to us the message of reconciliation. Therefore, we are ambassadors for Christ, God making his appeal through us. We implore you on behalf of Christ, be reconciled to God."

It appears that the antecedent for "their" and "them" is "the world" - as in "God so loved the world".

I think Paul is using it as a genreal term that means God has provided all that is necessary for anyone at any time to be reconciled with Him.

shepherdsword
Jan 31st 2009, 05:24 AM
This item reminds me of an old Pink Floyd tune.

Borean
Jan 31st 2009, 06:38 AM
I like Pink Floyd...is that a good thing?:dunno:

crossnote
Jan 31st 2009, 07:36 AM
And all this is from God, who has reconciled us to himself through Christ and given us the ministry of reconciliation, 19 namely, God was reconciling the world to himself in Christ, not counting their trespasses against them and entrusting to us the message of reconciliation.
Who is the them that God has not counted their trespasses against?

The World. The picture is that the wrath of God has been satisfied (thru the punishment given to the Son) and we are to declare to the world that Justice has been satisfied, the Father is inviting the world back to Himself on account of His Son.

"At the Cross the Fathers hand
swung open the Door,
opening the Way
for rebels to be bathed in Blood,
washing away the enmity."

Walstib
Jan 31st 2009, 02:50 PM
This item reminds me of an old Pink Floyd tune.

"Haven't you heard it's a battle of words, the poster bearer cried......."*



*Edit:
I’m going to get myself in trouble not siting references…. ;) Exert from song Us and Them by Pink Floyd (http://lyricwiki.org/Pink_Floyd)(1973) (http://lyricwiki.org/Pink_Floyd:The_Dark_Side_Of_The_Moon_%281973%29).

mikebr
Feb 1st 2009, 02:27 AM
they hate us
We hate them

what shall we do with all the hate

Can it be that all have been reconciled to God and that's what we should be preaching?

Kudo Shinichi
Feb 1st 2009, 12:41 PM
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?book_id=49&chapter=6&version=31&context=chapter
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?book_id=47&chapter=5&version=31&context=chapter

Borean
Feb 2nd 2009, 07:29 AM
Anime...are you Japanese?
I would love to learn to speak Japanese, but alas my Sensai is too busy to teach it...I know a few phrases, but it sounds so cool! I have some materials, but Rosetta Stone is way too pricey for me.
I want to learn, but it is difficult for me to do by myself and there are no nearby classes.:sad:
Excuse the spelling, but I will have to settle for
Nihong go wa hanasse masen...Ego hanassemaska?
I learned orally, the words are split and mushed together I'm sure...

Oma
Feb 3rd 2009, 06:14 AM
Who is the them that God has not counted their trespasses against?

To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.
2 Cor 5:19

That has to mean the "elect of the whole world" as opposed to just the Jewish nation, otherwise it would be meaningless. God does impute the trespasses to those who are not saved, otherwise they would not be sent to hell.