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Yukerboy
Feb 1st 2009, 05:02 AM
1 Timothy 6:10 (http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?book_id=61&chapter=6&verse=10&version=9&context=verse)
For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows.

Is it?

TrustingFollower
Feb 1st 2009, 05:17 AM
One can not serve two masters at the same time. We are to be in this world, but not of this world so to put all our energy or even a great amount of our energy into making money take our focus off God and His kingdom, where we consider ourselves to be citizens. If we do not keep our focus on the kingdom we are a divided house and then we will fail.

Keep the focus on God and rely on Him to provide the opportunities when needed and things work so much better. We all have needs to live here and God knows what those needs are, but we sometimes get our wants confused for needs. None of us need a big boat in the driveway that we only use 5 times a summer. Some call that a need, but unless that person is a fisherman for a living having a boat is a want and not a need. God will provide the job we need to cover our needs if we have faith in him and rely on his guidance. Money is just a tool to be used in this world.

Yukerboy
Feb 1st 2009, 05:24 AM
One can not serve two masters at the same time. We are to be in this world, but not of this world so to put all our energy or even a great amount of our energy into making money take our focus off God and His kingdom, where we consider ourselves to be citizens. If we do not keep our focus on the kingdom we are a divided house and then we will fail.

Keep the focus on God and rely on Him to provide the opportunities when needed and things work so much better. We all have needs to live here and God knows what those needs are, but we sometimes get our wants confused for needs. None of us need a big boat in the driveway that we only use 5 times a summer. Some call that a need, but unless that person is a fisherman for a living having a boat is a want and not a need. God will provide the job we need to cover our needs if we have faith in him and rely on his guidance. Money is just a tool to be used in this world.

I agree with everything you said here.

My question is whether money is the root of all evil? Or is it mistranslated? Or is Paul wrong?

For instance, sexual lust. What does sexual lust have to do with the love of money?

Or some lies. Telling your child there's a Santa Claus is a lie, yet to do so actually COSTS more money. Now, it may be the love of money by corporations to push the Santa Claus idea, but as for us telling our children there is a Santa Claus, I don't see the love of money being the root of the sin.

Dani H
Feb 1st 2009, 06:23 AM
Money isn't the root of all evil. Money is just money.

The love of riches/covetousness is at the root of all sorts of evil though (which is what that verse is more properly translated into, I think).

James says that we ask amiss so that we may spend it on our pleasures.

Jesus says we cannot serve God and mammon (riches, treasures).

Riches in this world, or riches in the next. We can either be rich in the world, or rich in God. We can either spend our energy chasing after material stuffs or chase after God. We have to make a choice because we cannot live for both. I know people try and think they can, but God's Word says it cannot be done, and so it cannot. And I'm not going to argue with that, or try and get around it.

Coveteousness says "God didn't give me enough and so I better go after more." Covetousness will always step beyond God's allotment for us because it thinks it knows better. At that very moment, you scooch God off the throne and climb on it yourself. Covetousness and unbelief are kissing cousins IMO.

Yukerboy
Feb 1st 2009, 06:27 AM
Money isn't the root of all evil. Money is just money.

The love of riches/covetousness is at the root of all sorts of evil though (which is what that verse is more properly translated into, I think).

James says that we ask amiss so that we may spend it on our pleasures.

Jesus says we cannot serve God and mammon (riches, treasures).

Riches in this world, or riches in the next. We can either be rich in the world, or rich in God. We can either spend our energy chasing after material stuffs or chase after God. We have to make a choice because we cannot live for both. I know people try and think they can, but God's Word says it cannot be done, and so it cannot. And I'm not going to argue with that, or try and get around it.

Coveteousness says "God didn't give me enough and so I better go after more." Covetousness will always step beyond God's allotment for us because it thinks it knows better. At that very moment, you scooch God off the throne and climb on it yourself. Covetousness and unbelief are kissing cousins IMO.

I agree with you 100% when you say "The love of riches/covetousness is at the root of all sorts of evil though (which is what that verse is more properly translated into, I think)."

I said money, I meant love of money, my apologies.

So, we are saying that the KJV mistranslated this verse then, correct?

Dani H
Feb 1st 2009, 06:40 AM
I agree with you 100% when you say "The love of riches/covetousness is at the root of all sorts of evil though (which is what that verse is more properly translated into, I think)."

I said money, I meant love of money, my apologies.

So, we are saying that the KJV mistranslated this verse then, correct?

Well, when you look at Strong's, it goes beyond money and really means riches or shiny things ...
philargyria 5365
1) love of money, avarice

Root word: 5366
argyros

1) silver
a) 1 Cor. 3:12 refers to the silver with which the columns of noble buildings were covered and the rafters adorned
b) things made of silver
1) vessels
2) images of gods

It implies idolatry ... we either use what there is to serve God, or we serve what there is and forget about God ... or, what's worse, use what God has placed in the earth to serve ourselves ...

chad
Feb 1st 2009, 06:55 AM
I kind of like the NIV translation on this one.

(1 Tim 6:10 NIV) For the love of money is a root of all kinds of evil. Some people, eager for money, have wandered from the faith and pierced themselves with many griefs.

Now all kinds of evil - doesn't mean that the love of money is the root of all evil, but all kinds of evil.

Timothy is writing about those in the faith, who have wandered from the fatih for the love of money.

But i'm sure it can apply to non-believers just as much. I'm sure you can look at the world today and see where this would apply in the real world today. Lying, cheating, stealing, back-stabbing, crime, corrupt business practices, dishonesty, unethical behaviour, corporate politics etc...




1 Timothy 6:10 (http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?book_id=61&chapter=6&verse=10&version=9&context=verse)
For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows.

Is it?

RogerW
Feb 1st 2009, 09:14 PM
1 Timothy 6:10 (http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?book_id=61&chapter=6&verse=10&version=9&context=verse)
For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows.

Is it?

Hi Yuke,

The context of the passage seems to be centered on godly contentment with what we have. If we confine this to only money (silver and gold), we miss the message and meaning. The immoderate, insatiable desire for earthly treasure (whatever it may be) and possessions has caused some professors of faith to depart from the fellowship of believers and from the gospel they professed, and they have suffered terrible consquences.

Love is a heart emotion or condition that denotes a craving, desire or concern from the inward person. So that this love for money, or possessions (which I do not have in God's purpose), or position (which I do not occupy in God's will), or power (which I do not possess) is the root of ALL evil. Was this not Adam's sin? (Gen 3:5,6) Did not the wrath of God fall on Israel in the wilderness because of their murmuring against His providence? We come beck to the statement that "Godliness with contentment is great gain!" (1Ti 6:6) It is not just contentment, for the rebellious layabout may be content in his poverty and laziness, but godliness with contentment!

Many Blessings,
RW

bosco
Feb 2nd 2009, 03:31 PM
Hello Yukerboy. I had studied that verse a long time ago, trying to get back into the original languages and uses. I am pretty sure I wrote an article on it, I can check. But from memory we have to realize that "money" wasn't something they had back then. They traded in the weight of gold and silver, and in goods. I remember taking the Greek word translated as money back to the LXX and found that it can also be translated as money, armies, or power. Armies of course makes no sense, so money or power.

I personally came away thinking that the word power actually fit better in that verse. If you love power, you become corrupt. Money may or may not be a factor...but power, greed, always corrupt. There are many with lots and lots of money, but they do good with it. But secular power always corrupts.

That's my nickel. (inflation, you know!)

Bosco

HisLeast
Feb 2nd 2009, 04:12 PM
I agree with everything you said here.

My question is whether money is the root of all evil? Or is it mistranslated? Or is Paul wrong?

For instance, sexual lust. What does sexual lust have to do with the love of money?


Money is an enabler. Those who love money, will naturally love being enabled. The love what money enables them to do, which practically speaking is every other sin imaginable.

bosco
Feb 2nd 2009, 04:53 PM
Money is an enabler. Those who love money, will naturally love being enabled. The love what money enables them to do, which practically speaking is every other sin imaginable.

That is an interesting point His Least. I don't hate money, in fact, I like it VERY much. It buys my children food, it clothes them, it keeps a roof over my head. But my very deep like bordering on love of money doesn't mean I am evil. Heck, I teach my kids to leave insects alone. (unless they bite you or get in the house, then they are fair game! :D)

See, money doesn't buy power...in fact, it might just buy your downfall. I have a sister who LOVES money (I mean this) and all it has gotten her was further in debt. But is she evil....I thought so when I was 12, I know better now.

This is why, if you study the word involved in the translation, when you take it back to the LXX and see how it was translated there, you might see that power over money is the better translation.

Bosco

theBelovedDisciple
Feb 2nd 2009, 07:07 PM
Hi Yuke,

The context of the passage seems to be centered on godly contentment with what we have. If we confine this to only money (silver and gold), we miss the message and meaning. The immoderate, insatiable desire for earthly treasure (whatever it may be) and possessions has caused some professors of faith to depart from the fellowship of believers and from the gospel they professed, and they have suffered terrible consquences.

Love is a heart emotion or condition that denotes a craving, desire or concern from the inward person. So that this love for money, or possessions (which I do not have in God's purpose), or position (which I do not occupy in God's will), or power (which I do not possess) is the root of ALL evil. Was this not Adam's sin? (Gen 3:5,6) Did not the wrath of God fall on Israel in the wilderness because of their murmuring against His providence? We come beck to the statement that "Godliness with contentment is great gain!" (1Ti 6:6) It is not just contentment, for the rebellious layabout may be content in his poverty and laziness, but godliness with contentment!

Many Blessings,
RW

I agree RogerW.... Love is a heart emotion.... or condition that denotes a craving...

Paul stated the Love of Money is the root of all evil... when you place that 'love' condition.. of money.. above your Communion with God Himself.. putting it 1st in your life.. then 'the love' of money has gained a foothold... Money itself is not wicked or evil... the Love of it is..

God will provide you with everything you need.. He 'knows' ahead of time..
He'll provide the financial stability you need to take care of your family, to run the business He has given you.. to take care of all your bills.. everything... You PUT HIM 1st.. and Love HIM 1ST... not the money...

When One comes to the Revelational Knowledge that God is in total control of ones' life.. from his/her family to the job that he/she has.. and realizes that He is the Source of it all.. and this even the financial part of it.. then ONE CANNOT HELP BUT LOVE THE PROVIDER 1st.. God Himself... He will bless you whether it be great or small... and you as the person provided for by God Himself.. then you will Love Him back and put Him 1st... because He first LOVED you...

I will make a note that this type of prosperity is not based on a 'blessing formula'.. that many today cling to.. but its based on Knowing Who your provider is and That He is the One doing all the Providing... and in Turn... you Loving Him... because He 1st loved you... and provides everthing for you.. and this even the financial part of it... money...

from this.. there is no 'love of Money'... but a Love for the One who Provides and Completes you as a Chrisitan.. whether it be large or small...

being prosperous in the Lord.. does not just mean 'monetary gain'... but it includes many things.... God knows the financial situation you are in.. and He will provide the monetary means by which you can live and live in Contentment.. and your Prosperity.. the total content of it ALL.. was Paid in full when He hung on that Tree... cried.. It is Finished....

Thru Him and what He has done... you will live and Prosper...

Psalms Fan
Feb 3rd 2009, 04:51 AM
I'm sure you're getting at the fact that it ought to be translated "the root of all sorts of evil". With that I agree.

I want to give an interesting rendition in a pretty simple language, Haitian Creole (I'll give a rough translation):

Paske, renmen lajan fè moun fè tout kalite bagay ki mal.

Because, money love makes people do all kinds of things that are bad. (italicized words are not in the Creole, but implied)

I just think the simplicity of the language (as in non-complexity) speaks pretty loudly. Which also goes to show that even a language in which it is impossible to give a word-for-word translation (due to the lack of complexity) from the Hebrew, Aramaic and Greek, God gets His message across.

Diolectic
Feb 3rd 2009, 02:30 PM
1 Timothy 6:10 (http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?book_id=61&chapter=6&verse=10&version=9&context=verse)
For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows.

Is it?1Timothy 6:10 should be, "For the love of money is A [not the] root of all evil.
If money is the root of all evil, then Adam sinned in the garden because of his love of money.
Or some are homosexuals because of their love of money...ect...

Yukerboy
Feb 3rd 2009, 02:40 PM
1Timothy 6:10 should be, "For the love of money is A [not the] root of all evil.
If money is the root of all evil, then Adam sinned in the garden because of his love of money.
Or some are homosexuals because of their love of money...ect...


This hurts so much to say that I'm about to vomit, but yes Diolectic, I agree with you. :P

Therefore, the KJV is in very few cases NOT the best translation, or if it is, then I am misunderstanding the verse.

Emanate
Feb 3rd 2009, 02:55 PM
You all are forgetting sometthing very important.

It would depend on what your definition of "is" is.

BroRog
Feb 4th 2009, 02:01 AM
Undoubtedly the KJV was a good translation for its time. But the English language has changed over time and so the English we learned from our parents isn't the English spoken by those in the 1600's.

I'm sure there are websites devoted to this subject and so we could probably multiply examples. But the one that comes to mind at the moment is the verse in 2Thes. 2 in which Paul says,

For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.

During the 1600's the word "let" meant "to prevent". Today, to our ears, the term "let" means "to allow", which is the compete opposite meaning.

The meaning of the original text hasn't changed. But the English of the KJV translation isn't the English of today, and so some of the KJV is not speaking to us in the way the KJV translators expected the reader to understand it.