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vinsight4u8
Mar 3rd 2009, 03:42 PM
If you want to understand the order of events in Rev. - go read the beginning of Rev. 15.


then look at the words at the end of the chapter

vinsight4u8
Mar 6th 2009, 03:15 PM
Please stop - put aside things you have been taught or the order you thought events happen in Revelation...

for just a bit and see what actually is to unfold.

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Could John see "the seven angels" if he had not yet seen "seven angels"?


such as in Rev. 1-3 - what does John tell us about first -

seven stars
or - the seven stars

seven candlesticks
or - the seven

So what comes first - where was John first writing to the church?

Rev. 8:2
the seven angels

or

Rev. 15:1
seven angels


John has to be jotting down Rev. 15's verse part first.
Since this is noted as seeing "another sign", we know that we are to begin with 12:1.

"And there appeared a great wonder in heaven..."

John is not doing the seals - John has yet to even see the sealed book get opened.

John was caught up to see things that are "hereafter"

So start with John being in Rev 12 - and let the wonders begin.

John wrote Rev. 12 - in a way that shows us - here is when he first started to see end-time stuff.

wonders

Rev. 15:1
"And I saw another sign in heaven...seven angels..."

John never saw that group before this verse.

John did not write - chapters 1-3
then 4, 5, 6, 7, and 8

John wrote chapters 1-3
after that
chapter 4 - as to lasted till the 24 elders cast their crowns - left their seats
they cast their crowns to the sealed book throne

Those 24 elders can't leave their seats till the 7th trumpet has started to sound.
So they can't cast their crowns and John see the sealed book where the crowns land - unless the 7th trumpet has started to sound.

John saw the trumpets - 1-6 and the start of the 7th one, while he was still in chapter 4.

That is why in Rev. 8 he can then speak of the angels as
"the seven angels".

As in - John knew if we look diligently - carefully put the events in the book together correctly - we would find out that when the seated elders get up - to fall down - they are doing a 7th trumpet task.

vinsight4u8
Mar 8th 2009, 12:49 PM
John wrote ch 12 - - gets to the start of ch 15 and sees what for the first time?

"seven angels"