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Freek
Feb 24th 2010, 04:21 PM
One hears the remark that Jesus lives in my heart so often, yet their lives do not testify the same.

Remember when Jesus was someone we comforted our children with when they're afraid of the dark? "There there little Johnny, don't be afraid. Jesus is in your heart. He will take care of you and protect you."

Let's get one thing straight. Jesus ain't no baby no more. Remember how His mom and dad had to flee from Herod. That happened once for all eternity!! It will never happen again!! He will never be crucified again. Moses did not enter the promised land, because he smote the Rock twice!!

Greater is He who is in you, than he who is in the world. I want you to get a picture in your minds people. Who is really in you:

Revelations 1
And in the midst of the seven candlesticks one like unto the Son of man, clothed with a garment down to the foot, and girt about the paps with a golden girdle. His head and his hairs were white like wool, as white as snow; and his eyes were as a flame of fire; And his feet like unto fine brass, as if they burned in a furnace; and his voice as the sound of many waters. And he had in his right hand seven stars: and out of his mouth went a sharp twoedged sword: and his countenance was as the sun shineth in his strength.

Revelations 19
and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war. His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on his head were many crowns; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself. And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God. And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean. And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God. And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS.

...and you really think that the serpents He talked about in Mark 16 will harm the vessel that He dwells in?? Most likely that serpent will bow and ask, "Lord what do you want me to do?"

Let us get that picture of the glorified Christ of Revelations etched into our minds. Let our minds dwell on that AND who we really are!! Covenant siblings of the Anointed One!!!

WE HAVE NO CLUE!!!!

-SEEKING-
Feb 24th 2010, 04:42 PM
Are you ok there Freek?

Freek
Feb 24th 2010, 04:55 PM
Are you ok there Freek?

Seeker, No I'm not OK. :B

Ta-An
Feb 24th 2010, 05:30 PM
Freek actually, Jesus does not live in your heart.... we teach our children wrong, if that is what we teach them.

Christ has sent to us His Holy Spirit who dwells in us. :hug:

But Yes , we have no clue of how blessed we are :)

Butch5
Feb 24th 2010, 05:31 PM
Seeker, No I'm not OK. :B

I understand your frustration my friend!

theBelovedDisciple
Feb 24th 2010, 06:44 PM
Freek actually, Jesus does not live in your heart.... we teach our children wrong, if that is what we teach them.

Christ has sent to us His Holy Spirit who dwells in us. :hug:

But Yes , we have no clue of how blessed we are :)


Yes but those who are Truly His.. will Have His Word Written on their Heart.. this thru the Operation of th Eternal Spirit... that Circumcision done 'without fleshly hands'..... and in the Spirit..

and what is this Word? or may I say Who is this Word? It is Jesus Christ Himself.. the Living Word.. dwells in you and Writes His Word on your heart.. now if He doesnt dwell there.. How can He write His Word there?

He does.. and its thru the Eternal Spirit... and its Jesus Who Does It... and He lives with the Convert and in the Person's Heart... that 'inner man'.. or inward Part.. as the Psalmist puts it....

If God is circumcising your 'heart'... then He is there. and He lives there...

as John put.. For Truth's Sake, which dwelleth 'in us' and shall be with you forever...


God is not like Man.. for man looketh on the 'outward appearance.... but God looketh on the 'heart'.. and for His Own... He 'lives' there...

For Greater is He that is in you , than he that is in the world..

Vhayes
Feb 24th 2010, 06:54 PM
Freek - are you wanting Jesus to not be the Savior that WAS but the Warrior King Who IS?

He is still love.

Freek
Feb 24th 2010, 06:58 PM
Freek - are you wanting Jesus to not be the Savior that WAS but the Warrior King Who IS?

He is still love.

What concerns me is that I'm not walking in the fullness of what He did for me because my mind is not yet renewed to that. For example do we really believe that His blood takes care of the sin problem? Do we really believe that?

Vhayes
Feb 24th 2010, 07:08 PM
What concerns me is that I'm not walking in the fullness of what He did for me because my mind is not yet renewed to that. For example do we really believe that His blood takes care of the sin problem? Do we really believe that?
I would say that depends on what you mean by the sin problem.

Jesus paid the price IN FULL for all the sin that was ever or would ever be committed. Are we perfect and sinless? Not yet - we still have the flesh to deal with and will have until we get our perfect bodies. That doesn't mean He will not work in us to make us the people He wants us to be. But we are not perfect at this point.

Freek
Feb 24th 2010, 07:26 PM
I would say that depends on what you mean by the sin problem.

Jesus paid the price IN FULL for all the sin that was ever or would ever be committed. Are we perfect and sinless? Not yet - we still have the flesh to deal with and will have until we get our perfect bodies. That doesn't mean He will not work in us to make us the people He wants us to be. But we are not perfect at this point.

So where do we draw the line? At what point does truth (as in Thy Word is Truth) become heresy?

Vhayes
Feb 24th 2010, 07:29 PM
So where do we draw the line? At what point does truth (as in Thy Word is Truth) become heresy?
I have no clue what you are asking.

Freek
Feb 24th 2010, 07:31 PM
I have no clue what you are asking.

I'm not sure I know how to express myself properly. Let me think about the wording and rephrase, OK?

Vhayes
Feb 24th 2010, 07:32 PM
I'm not sure I know how to express myself properly. Let me think about the wording and rephrase, OK?
Sure - no problem. Take as long as you want and I will try to be equally clear when I answer.

Peace -
V

Sirus
Feb 25th 2010, 01:13 AM
What concerns me is that I'm not walking in the fullness of what He did for me because my mind is not yet renewed to that. For example do we really believe that His blood takes care of the sin problem? Do we really believe that?Where does the bible say His blood gives us power to walk in the fullness of what He has done for us?
What are you not walking in, that you want to walk in?

Freek
Feb 25th 2010, 05:16 AM
Where does the bible say His blood gives us power to walk in the fullness of what He has done for us?

Have I said that? Please show me so that I can correct the post.

Freek
Feb 25th 2010, 05:19 AM
Where does the bible say His blood gives us power to walk in the fullness of what He has done for us?
What are you not walking in, that you want to walk in?

Does the blood take away sin? How about the consequences of sin?

The only biblical answer to the second question is "because of unbelieve".

Sirus
Feb 25th 2010, 06:03 AM
Have I said that? Please show me so that I can correct the post.

Freek- "What concerns me is that I'm not walking in the fullness of what He did for me because my mind is not yet renewed to that. For example do we really believe that His blood takes care of the sin problem? Do we really believe that?"
you're not walking in what he did for you
does the blood take care of the sin problem
do we believe that

you set the context in a walk
ask if His blood takes care of the sin problem -context, walk
since you are not doing it, ask do we believe it

Sirus
Feb 25th 2010, 06:06 AM
The only biblical answer to the second question is "because of unbelieve".
"because of unbelief" answers what you are not walking in?

chad
Feb 25th 2010, 10:34 AM
Good post. I would have to agree with what you have posted and to add on to it.

In order for Jesus to live in our hearts, we first have to believe that Jesus is lord and believe that God raised him from the dead. It is with our hearts that we believe and are justified and with our mouth that we confess and are saved. And when anyone turns to the lord, the veil is taken away.

(Hebrews 4:12 NIV) writes, The word of God is living and active. Sharper than any double-edged sword, it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart.

We are temples of the Holy Spirt. Gods spirit lives in us. The scripture says 'I will put my laws in their minds and write them on their hearts.'

If we live by the spirit, we are not controlled by the sinful nature and will not gratify the desires of the sinful nature. We are circumcised in him, by putting of the sinful nature.



Yes but those who are Truly His.. will Have His Word Written on their Heart.. this thru the Operation of th Eternal Spirit... that Circumcision done 'without fleshly hands'..... and in the Spirit..

and what is this Word? or may I say Who is this Word? It is Jesus Christ Himself.. the Living Word.. dwells in you and Writes His Word on your heart.. now if He doesnt dwell there.. How can He write His Word there?

He does.. and its thru the Eternal Spirit... and its Jesus Who Does It... and He lives with the Convert and in the Person's Heart... that 'inner man'.. or inward Part.. as the Psalmist puts it....

If God is circumcising your 'heart'... then He is there. and He lives there...

as John put.. For Truth's Sake, which dwelleth 'in us' and shall be with you forever...


God is not like Man.. for man looketh on the 'outward appearance.... but God looketh on the 'heart'.. and for His Own... He 'lives' there...

For Greater is He that is in you , than he that is in the world..

Firstfruits
Feb 25th 2010, 11:24 AM
According to the following scripture Jesus said that the disciples would not always have him. Jesus explains how he will be with us always.

Mt 26:11 For ye have the poor always with you; but me ye have not always.

Mk 14:7 For ye have the poor with you always, and whensoever ye will ye may do them good: but me ye have not always.

Jn 12:8 For the poor always ye have with you; but me ye have not always.

Mt 28:20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

Mt 18:20 For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them.

Jn 16:7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.

Jn 16:10 Of righteousness, because I go to my Father, and ye see me no more;

Jn 16:16 A little while, and ye shall not see me: and again, a little while, and ye shall see me, because I go to the Father.

Now that Jesus is with the Father in heaven our comforter is the Holy Ghost.

Jn 14:16 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;

Jn 14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

Jn 15:26 But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me:

Jn 16:7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.

The Holy Spirit does not get mentioned much even though he has been our comfort in Christs absence.

It is the Holy spirit that is in our heart.

Rom 5:5 And hope maketh not ashamed; because the love of God is shed abroad in our hearts by the Holy Ghost which is given unto us.

Rom 8:27 And he that searcheth the hearts knoweth what is the mind of the Spirit, because he maketh intercession for the saints according to the will of God.

Let us not forget the Holy Spirit the comforter.

Firstfruits

chad
Feb 25th 2010, 06:46 PM
Good points. The Holy Spirit is also our Counselor (Jn 14:16) and Teacher (Jn 14:26).

This is the other work of the Holy Spirit in our lives.




Now that Jesus is with the Father in heaven our comforter is the Holy Ghost.
Firstfruits

Freek
Feb 25th 2010, 07:46 PM
Freek- "What concerns me is that I'm not walking in the fullness of what He did for me because my mind is not yet renewed to that. For example do we really believe that His blood takes care of the sin problem? Do we really believe that?"
you're not walking in what he did for you
does the blood take care of the sin problem
do we believe that

you set the context in a walk
ask if His blood takes care of the sin problem -context, walk
since you are not doing it, ask do we believe it

The first sentence is a complete thought. The second sentence is an example of a problem that I wanted to discuss. They are related, but in another way. Do we really believe that 5 liters of Jesus' blood was enough to take care of the sin of the whole world for all eternity?

Vhayes
Feb 25th 2010, 07:50 PM
The first sentence is a complete thought. The second sentence is an example of a problem that I wanted to discuss. They are related, but in another way. Do we really believe that 5 liters of Jesus' blood was enough to take care of the sin of the whole world for all eternity?

i don't think it was the quantity, it was the quality.

Freek
Feb 25th 2010, 07:57 PM
i don't think it was the quantity, it was the quality.

OK, I will not labour the quantity, because I do not know how it works, yet. I'm still busy on that one. :D Do we really believe that the blood was sufficient to take care of sin?

Freek
Feb 25th 2010, 08:00 PM
Good points. The Holy Spirit is also our Counselor (Jn 14:16) and Teacher (Jn 14:26).

This is the other work of the Holy Spirit in our lives.

If that is the case - and please, I do not dispute it - why did Jesus not do any miracles untill after He was baptised and the Holy Spirit came upon Him?

Vhayes
Feb 25th 2010, 08:03 PM
His resurrection testifies that it WAS sufficient, otherwise He would still be in the grave.

Or at least that's the way I look at it.

Is this what you're asking, Freek? I may be giving you answers that aren't doing you any good.

Freek
Feb 25th 2010, 08:14 PM
His resurrection testifies that it WAS sufficient, otherwise He would still be in the grave.

Or at least that's the way I look at it.

Is this what you're asking, Freek? I may be giving you answers that aren't doing you any good.

If it was sufficient - and I agree that it was - what about the consequences of sin? Have that been taken care of? Yes it has. Now my problem is this, if we can so readily believe that sin has been taken care of, why is it so difficult to believe that the consequences have been taken care of too? And why don't we walk in it? I think it is because we walk by sight and not by faith.

Vhayes
Feb 25th 2010, 11:37 PM
The consequences have been dealt with - we will not spend eternity separated from God.

We ARE however, still in earthly bodies. The flesh fights against the Spirit. And yes, it is because, many times, we walk by sight and not by faith. Just like children who don't trust dad to take care of them. Do we grow progressively "better" as we mature in Christ? Yes, I think so. The more we know Him the more we can trust Him. But we never achieve perfection in this flesh.

I John 1
8 - If we say that we have no sin, we are deceiving ourselves and the truth is not in us.

9 - If we confess our sins, He is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

10 - If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar and His word is not in us.

Sirus
Feb 26th 2010, 01:20 AM
And why don't we walk in it? I think it is because we walk by sight and not by faith.That is exactly why. It says 'free indeed' 'free from sin' 'dead to sin' 'not in the flesh'. We look and we're not so something is wrong. It's not God so it must be us. We don't have faith in the gospel and walk as those alive from the dead. Instead we say 'I don't feel dead' 'in the flesh' 'I don't feel free'. What does what we see or feel have to do with faith? Nothing!

roaring tiger
Feb 26th 2010, 01:22 AM
If that is the case - and please, I do not dispute it - why did Jesus not do any miracles untill after He was baptised and the Holy Spirit came upon Him?

Hi!!!Freek'

How are you?Jesus had done many miracles for you that you did not know.John 9:32 Since the world

began was it not heard that any man opened the eyes of one that was born blind. v.33] If this man

were not of God, he could do nothing.Do you know that all man was born blind?and will count many

days before he can receive his sight,all of this was the work of power of Jesus which was in every

man.Don't you know that before you came to earth he was your creator as written in Is.46:3-4

Hearken unto me,O house of Jacob, and all the remnant of the house of Israel, which are borne of

me from the belly, which are carried from the womb:

v.4] and even to your old age I am he: and even to hoar hairs will I carry you: I have made,and I

will bear; even I will carry, and will deliver you.

Our sin was not clean by blood of Jesus because it was a methaphor for literral blood cannot

clean anything,but the blood of Jesus would teaches us that it was not the death that saves us

but the life that he sacrifices for us, to know the word of Christ when we submitted ourselves

under his feet while he was hung on a tree.If on that moment you hear his voice then your sins

are forgiven for his name's sake. 1John 2:12.

Up to the present he even talk with you by the Spirit of Christ that in dwelt in you together with

the Tempter that also present to every one of us trying to deceive all believer of Christ.

Hope this help.

in love of Christ./RT.

Sirus
Feb 26th 2010, 01:30 AM
The consequences have been dealt with - we will not spend eternity separated from God.

We ARE however, still in earthly bodies. The flesh fights against the Spirit. And yes, it is because, many times, we walk by sight and not by faith. Just like children who don't trust dad to take care of them. Do we grow progressively "better" as we mature in Christ? Yes, I think so. The more we know Him the more we can trust Him. But we never achieve perfection in this flesh. I think I agree, but what bible definition of perfection are you using here? Maturity or complete? We are supposed to be mature. We will never attain the resurrection (future glorification) in this life.


I John 1
8 - If we say that we have no sin, we are deceiving ourselves and the truth is not in us.

9 - If we confess our sins, He is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

10 - If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar and His word is not in us. I get the continued cleansing of the sin of the one that was just born again at the cross having confessed they are a sinner in need of a savior in v9. Is that all you are saying? Because that is all it says. It is not about continued confession but continual cleansing by the blood of our advocate. I don't want to derail the thread. If you do not agree that's fine. I realize most do not. I however know all sin is forgiven not just some.

chad
Feb 26th 2010, 02:39 AM
I don't really understand the question your asking and how it has any relevance to the holy spirit being our counsellor and teacher. Could you please clarify your question.

Thanks.




If that is the case - and please, I do not dispute it - why did Jesus not do any miracles untill after He was baptised and the Holy Spirit came upon Him?

Vhayes
Feb 26th 2010, 02:56 AM
I think I agree, but what bible definition of perfection are you using here? Maturity or complete? We are supposed to be mature. We will never attain the resurrection (future glorification) in this life.

I get the continued cleansing of the sin of the one that was just born again at the cross having confessed they are a sinner in need of a savior in v9. Is that all you are saying? Because that is all it says. It is not about continued confession but continual cleansing by the blood of our advocate. I don't want to derail the thread. If you do not agree that's fine. I realize most do not. I however know all sin is forgiven not just some.
I agree that the price for all sin was paid at the cross. What I do think is when we sin again after salvation, we are to confess our sins (agree with God that the action/thought was wrong) and He will restore us to fellowship with Himself.

Does that make sense?
V

Sirus
Feb 26th 2010, 03:52 AM
No it doesn't make sense but thanks for clarifying. I thought that was what you meant.
Scripture does not teach fellowship is broken when we sin.
The verse says we are forgiven if we confess, so your use of confess is different than the verse.
If we confess -- he forgives
....is what it says....but you said we are forgiven all sin and just confess for the sake of doing so...or that agreeing restores fellowship...which is it? Can't be both. It can only mean what the verses says.
Forgive IF we confess.
So either we are not forgiven until we confess continually throughout our walk, or we are forgiven all sin when we first come to Jesus.

Vhayes
Feb 26th 2010, 02:46 PM
Sirus, the PRICE for sins forgiveness has been paid. When we do things that are displeasing to God, we need to acknowledge it so we can be restored to a close relationship and continue to grow.

It's about an ongoing relationship. I make mistakes in my life. I sin in my life. If i don't acknowledge that sin (confess) then the relationship is strained. If I do talk to God about things, tell Him what has happened, our relationship becomes even stronger. It's about growth.

ClayInHisHands
Feb 26th 2010, 02:58 PM
Freek actually, Jesus does not live in your heart.... we teach our children wrong, if that is what we teach them.

Christ has sent to us His Holy Spirit who dwells in us.




I just don't agree with how this might sound to those outside the Body Of Christ. The Holy Spirit does live in us as Christ.....because it is Christ.

Galatians 2:20


20 I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.


I am not teaching my children wrong when I tell them that Jesus lives inside of them...meaning their heart......not their physical beating heart...but within their spirits, and their minds.


In Christ's Love

Firstfruits
Feb 26th 2010, 03:15 PM
I just don't agree with how this might sound to those outside the Body Of Christ. The Holy Spirit does live in us as Christ.....because it is Christ.

Galatians 2:20


20 I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.


I am not teaching my children wrong when I tell them that Jesus lives inside of them...meaning their heart......not their physical beating heart...but within their spirits, and their minds.


In Christ's Love

With regards to the following, if we are following the Holy Spirit, are we not following Christ?

Gal 5:22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,

Gal 5:25 If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit.

The atributes are the same.

Firstfruits

ClayInHisHands
Feb 26th 2010, 03:36 PM
With regards to the following, if we are following the Holy Spirit, are we not following Christ?

Gal 5:22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,

Gal 5:25 If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit.

The atributes are the same.

Firstfruits

Right.....the same attributes...that is why I said the Holy Spirit does live in us....because it is CHRIST.


I just thought it was innaccurate for Ta-An to say
Freek actually, Jesus does not live in your heart.... we teach our children wrong, if that is what we teach them.


Because that is dangerous and can lead one to believe that Jesus is not alive in Us. Some may even go as far as to use that has a claim that Jesus is in fact dead and not alive. The devil can twist that around and use that to do damage. Kind of like my grandmothers spirit lives in us after she dies(her memory, etc.).....it's not the same AT ALL and people will use it the same way. I know what she meant....I hope that's what she meant....but I thought it was important to make note that IT IS JESUS who LIVES IN US BY HIS HOLY SPIRIT....same attributes because IT IS JESUS CHRIST who sustains me and holds me.


In Christ's Love

Firstfruits
Feb 26th 2010, 04:01 PM
Right.....the same attributes...that is why I said the Holy Spirit does live in us....because it is CHRIST.


I just thought it was innaccurate for Ta-An to say


Because that is dangerous and can lead one to believe that Jesus is not alive in Us. Some may even go as far as to use that has a claim that Jesus is in fact dead and not alive. The devil can twist that around and use that to do damage. Kind of like my grandmothers spirit lives in us after she dies(her memory, etc.).....it's not the same AT ALL and people will use it the same way. I know what she meant....I hope that's what she meant....but I thought it was important to make note that IT IS JESUS who LIVES IN US BY HIS HOLY SPIRIT....same attributes because IT IS JESUS CHRIST who sustains me and holds me.


In Christ's Love

Would you agree that the spirit that is said we have received is that which Jesus said he would send before he went back to the father in heaven?

1 Cor 2:11 For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the spirit of God. 1 Cor 2:12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.
1 Cor 2:13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.
1 Cor 2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are Spiritually discerned.

Firstfruits

ClayInHisHands
Feb 26th 2010, 04:51 PM
Would you agree that the spirit that is said we have received is that which Jesus said he would send before he went back to the father in heaven?

1 Cor 2:11 For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the spirit of God. 1 Cor 2:12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.
1 Cor 2:13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.
1 Cor 2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are Spiritually discerned.

Firstfruits

I think you might be misunderstanding me Firstfruits

Yes it is the Holy Spirit which Jesus said He would send when he went to be seated at the right hand of The Father in Heaven.

Yes, I believe these verses above in 1 Corinthians wholeheartedly!!!! I just meant that it is NOT WRONG for us to tell our children that Jesus lives in their heart...because it is the Holy Spirit of God inside them...thus The Father, The Son and The Holy Spirit together.

That's why I pointed out.....
Galatians 2:20

20 I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.


Christ does live inside us. I just was pointing out that I thought Ta-An was in error for saying....


Originally Posted by Ta-An
Freek actually, Jesus does not live in your heart.... we teach our children wrong, if that is what we teach them.



Originally Posted by Ta-An

Christ has sent to us His Holy Spirit who dwells in us.


Yes, praise God!!! But it is in fact Jesus Christ who lives in us.....do you see what I mean?


I'm not being sarcastic...I really think you misunderstood what I was saying.


In Christ's Love

Freek
Feb 26th 2010, 07:43 PM
Hi!!!Freek'

How are you?Jesus had done many miracles for you that you did not know.John 9:32 Since the world

began was it not heard that any man opened the eyes of one that was born blind. v.33] If this man

were not of God, he could do nothing.Do you know that all man was born blind?and will count many

days before he can receive his sight,all of this was the work of power of Jesus which was in every

man.Don't you know that before you came to earth he was your creator as written in Is.46:3-4

Hearken unto me,O house of Jacob, and all the remnant of the house of Israel, which are borne of

me from the belly, which are carried from the womb:

v.4] and even to your old age I am he: and even to hoar hairs will I carry you: I have made,and I

will bear; even I will carry, and will deliver you.

Our sin was not clean by blood of Jesus because it was a methaphor for literral blood cannot

clean anything,but the blood of Jesus would teaches us that it was not the death that saves us

but the life that he sacrifices for us, to know the word of Christ when we submitted ourselves

under his feet while he was hung on a tree.If on that moment you hear his voice then your sins

are forgiven for his name's sake. 1John 2:12.

Up to the present he even talk with you by the Spirit of Christ that in dwelt in you together with

the Tempter that also present to every one of us trying to deceive all believer of Christ.

Hope this help.

in love of Christ./RT.

Hi RT

Jesus lived on the earth for about 33 years. He was baptised at about 30 years of age and then only did the Holy Spirit come upon Him. That is when He began doing miracles, not before that. What is the difference between Jesus - in His humanity - and a person who has been born again? Not much, yet very much.

Ta-An
Feb 26th 2010, 08:24 PM
I just thought it was innaccurate for Ta-An to say :::: Freek actually, Jesus does not live in your heart.... we teach our children wrong, if that is what we teach them.

Because that is dangerous and can lead one to believe that Jesus is not alive in Us. Some may even go as far as to use that has a claim that Jesus is in fact dead and not alive. The devil can twist that around and use that to do damage. Kind of like my grandmothers spirit lives in us after she dies(her memory, etc.).....it's not the same AT ALL and people will use it the same way. I know what she meant....I hope that's what she meant....but I thought it was important to make note that IT IS JESUS who LIVES IN US BY HIS HOLY SPIRIT....same attributes because IT IS JESUS CHRIST who sustains me and holds me.

How do you then explain Ascension to a child? And any of these verses?
Acts 1:11 who also said, Men of Galilee, why do ye stand looking into heaven? This Jesus who has been taken up from you into heaven, shall thus come in the manner in which ye have beheld him going into heaven.

Mk 14:62 And Jesus said, *I* am, and ye shall see the Son of man sitting at the right hand of power, and coming with the clouds of heaven.

Mt 26:64 Jesus says to him, *Thou* hast said. Moreover, I say to you, From henceforth ye shall see the Son of man sitting at the right hand of power, and coming on the clouds of heaven


Jesus Christ is the Mediator between God and man in heaven

And how would you explain Pentecost?

Jn 14:16 And I will beg the Father, and he will give you another Comforter, that he may be with you for ever,

Christ lives in you through His Holy Spirit.....

Ta-An
Feb 26th 2010, 08:29 PM
.....

Up to the present he even talk with you by the Spirit of Christ that in dwelt in you together with

the Tempter that also present to every one of us trying to deceive all believer of Christ.
.
RT. are you saying that God and the Tempter lives in us at the same time?? :hmm:

Darkeness and Light can not excist at the same time in the same place :)

Freek
Feb 26th 2010, 08:59 PM
How do you then explain Ascension to a child? And any of these verses?
Acts 1:11 who also said, Men of Galilee, why do ye stand looking into heaven? This Jesus who has been taken up from you into heaven, shall thus come in the manner in which ye have beheld him going into heaven.

Mk 14:62 And Jesus said, *I* am, and ye shall see the Son of man sitting at the right hand of power, and coming with the clouds of heaven.

Mt 26:64 Jesus says to him, *Thou* hast said. Moreover, I say to you, From henceforth ye shall see the Son of man sitting at the right hand of power, and coming on the clouds of heaven


Jesus Christ is the Mediator between God and man in heaven

And how would you explain Pentecost?

Jn 14:16 And I will beg the Father, and he will give you another Comforter, that he may be with you for ever,

Christ lives in you through His Holy Spirit.....

The mystery of the gospel is, Christ in you, the hope of glory. (Col 1:27) How He does it is not really my concern. My concern is with the implications thereof. John said: He must increase, but I must decrease. Paul said: Most gladly therefore will I rather glory in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me. Therefore I take pleasure in infirmities, in reproaches, in necessities, in persecutions, in distresses for Christ's sake: for when I am weak, then am I strong.

This ties in perfectly with James when he writes, God resisteth the proud, but giveth grace unto the humble. These sayings fascinate me. There are many other scriptures along the same vein. Why? What is it with God and meekness? What is it about humility that enables Christ to shine through us?

AND what is it with God and run down buildings? Does He not like the huge cathedrals in Europe? Why??? Jesus was even born in a stable.

Firstfruits
Feb 26th 2010, 09:43 PM
I think you might be misunderstanding me Firstfruits

Yes it is the Holy Spirit which Jesus said He would send when he went to be seated at the right hand of The Father in Heaven.

Yes, I believe these verses above in 1 Corinthians wholeheartedly!!!! I just meant that it is NOT WRONG for us to tell our children that Jesus lives in their heart...because it is the Holy Spirit of God inside them...thus The Father, The Son and The Holy Spirit together.

That's why I pointed out.....
Galatians 2:20

20 I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.


Christ does live inside us. I just was pointing out that I thought Ta-An was in error for saying....






Yes, praise God!!! But it is in fact Jesus Christ who lives in us.....do you see what I mean?


I'm not being sarcastic...I really think you misunderstood what I was saying.


In Christ's Love

Thanks Clayinhishands,

I just needed to make sure that we were on the same page.

God bless you!

Firstfruits

roaring tiger
Feb 27th 2010, 03:25 AM
RT. are you saying that God and the Tempter lives in us at the same time?? :hmm:

Darkeness and Light can not excist at the same time in the same place :)

Hi!!!Ta-An/How are you,.....
Yes ,the spirit of God and the tempter are very much alive in us as written in Rev.2:13 I know the works, and where thou dwellest, even where Satan's seat is: and thou holdest fast my name, and hast not denied my faith, even on those days wherein Antipas was my faithful martyr who
was slain among you, where Satan dwelleth.How could it be? Rom.8:6-8 For to be carnally minded is death: but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
V.7]Because the carnal mind is enmity against God, neither indeed can be.
v.8]So then they that are in flesh cannot please God.
So,Paul says in Col.3:5 Mortify therefore your members which are upon earth; fornication,uncleanliness,inordinate affection,evil concupiscence, and covetousness, which is idolatry.
Yes, the Darkness and Light excist at the same time since from the beginning of God creation Gen.1:2 God is Light. In the earth this was being seperated between day and night because of sunrise in the morning and sunset in the evening.
Isaiah 60:19-20 The sun shall be no more thy light by day; neither for brightness shall the moon give light unto thee: but the Lord shall be unto thee an everlasting light, and thy God the glory.
V,20] Thy sun shall no more go down; neither shall thy moon withdraw itself: for the Lord shall be thine everlasting light, and the days of thy mourning shall be ended.
Guideline in learning this,John 6:63 It is the the Spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing:the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.
In love of Christ./RT.

Sirus
Feb 27th 2010, 04:45 AM
Sirus, the PRICE for sins forgiveness has been paid. When we do things that are displeasing to God, we need to acknowledge it so we can be restored to a close relationship and continue to grow.

It's about an ongoing relationship. I make mistakes in my life. I sin in my life. If i don't acknowledge that sin (confess) then the relationship is strained. If I do talk to God about things, tell Him what has happened, our relationship becomes even stronger. It's about growth.You'd have to show relationship needs restored and cannot grow until we simply acknowledge a sin. That cannot be done.

Confession is for forgiveness. Period. You cannot get around this. It says it quite plainly. You'll have to find some other passage to attempt to establish your protestant confession. It's not here.
1Jn 1:9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. I talk with God about things all the time. It's not confession which is for forgiveness. My relationship grew by leaps and bounds when I stopped doubting His sacrifice grace love and mercy and starting walking in what He did for me. If you want growth, stop asking Him to forgive what He already forgave. If all you do is say, that was stupid, I have no excuse, thank you for dying for my sin....
fine, that's what I do, but that's not 1Jn 1:9 confession.
1Jn 1:9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. Sorry. It's just not.

roaring tiger
Feb 27th 2010, 05:13 AM
Hi RT

Jesus lived on the earth for about 33 years. He was baptised at about 30 years of age and then only did the Holy Spirit come upon Him. That is when He began doing miracles, not before that. What is the difference between Jesus - in His humanity - and a person who has been born again? Not much, yet very much.
Hi!!!Freek,

You're right, when you said in your response that Jesus live on earth more or less than 33 years.And while preaching he made many miracles;he was the Jesus that was borne through Mary.But the [John 8:58] Jesus before Abraham was born is "I Am"Alpha and Omega

was the beginning and the ending,saith the Lord which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty.

John 14:19 Yet a little while, and the world seeth me no more: but you see me; because I live, ye shall live also.

1 Cor.15:20 But now Christ is risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of them that slept.

Gal.2:20 I am crusified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I,but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who love me, and gave himself for me.

Is it needed to tell all the miracle that has been done by God since the beginning of the earth, as had been testified already in John 1:3.

You ask, What was the difference between Jesus-in His humanity and a person who has been born again? Not much, yet very much.

The difference:Jesus was conceived in his mother womb through Holy Ghost.We had been conceive through sin with our father and mother,that's why Jesus told us that we must be born again of water and Spirit.

Similarity:Jesus was made flesh Through the Word of God John 1:14--We were born again 1Pet.1:23Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible seed by the word of God, which live and abideth forever.

James 1:21 Wherefore lay apart all filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness, and receive with meekness the engrafted word, which is able to save your soul.

In love of Christ./RT.