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Servant89
Mar 26th 2010, 10:34 PM
This thread is about the lessons learned from Palm Sunday. It is about the meaning behind what happened that day. I believe it is a super critical event with paramount applications for the Christian Church today. I wonder how many out there are aware of its importance.

Any thoughts out there?

I will be back tomorrow.

Shalom

crossnote
Mar 27th 2010, 01:01 AM
Without going into all the prophetical implications and the heralding of Jesus as King. I find it very interesting that it shows how fickle a crowd can be. Shouting Hossana to the Highest one Sunday and 'Crucify Him!' less than a week later...all for no good reason. This makes me very nervous about politics and politicians and the art of persuasion. Come quickly Lord Jesus (we've had enough paper kings).

Servant89
Mar 27th 2010, 12:42 PM
The first lesson from Palm Sunday: The importance of keeping up with the signs of his coming. God gave his bride signs of his coming. He expects his bride to take notice and watch for signs of his coming. God is deadly serious about it as Palm Sunday demonstrates. There is something seriously wrong with a bride that is not interested in hearing about signs that indicate the time of arrival of her bridegroom is around the corner.

The Bible says in Luke 12:48 that to whom much is given, much is required. To fully understand the harsh judgment that fell on Israel on Palm Sunday, we need to see all the signs that were given to them (regarding the first coming of Christ). I will present 8 signs, the last one being Palm Sunday.

1st Sign: The Bible says that Messiah is a prophet like Moses (Deu 18:15). Before the arrival of Moses, there were 400 years of prophetic silence. Between the last verse of Genesis and the first verse of Exodus (when Moses was born) there are 400 years of nothing (from the Word of God). Like Moses, Jesus was born after 400 years of prophetic silence. Between the end of the Old Testament and the beginning of the New Testament there are also 400 years of silence (Gen 15:13; Exo 12:40-41).

Shalom

Servant89
Mar 27th 2010, 01:46 PM
2nd Sign: When Moses was born, Pharaoh sent out to kill the male children in Israel when they were born. The male children were killed when Jesus was born too (Exo 1:16 and Mat 2:2-10). What a data point to ignore! I bet people were asking: Why? The answer: Herod heard some wise men proclaimed Messiah was born, and he believed them, and that's why he tried to kill the coming king by killing their children. For the mothers of those children that was a very difficult data point to forget or ignore.

3rd Sign: The shepherds see the angelic host singing during the birth of Jesus and the Scriptures (Luke 2:8-18) say they told all the people around that region. The message from the angels: "Christ (Messiah) the Lord was born today in the city of David!" I bet a lot of Rabbis found out about that.

4th Sign: The star of Bethlehem fulfilled Gen 1:14 (signs in the heavens) and the testimony of the wise men made sure they got the point (Mat 2:2-10). This was a sign in the sky to tell the world that the bright and morning star had arrived. Jesus is the bright and morning star according to Rev 22:16. The pharsees asked Jesus for a sign from heaven in Mat 16:1. They did not get another one, they already got their sign from heaven in the star of Bethlehem.

Shalom

Servant89
Mar 27th 2010, 01:50 PM
5th Sign: When Jesus was about 10 years old, the Romans introduced something new. They called it "human rights". They said no one had the right to kill anyone at the mouth of two or three witnesses like it says in the Word of God (the law of Moses). They stated that the only ones that had power over life and death were the Romans and did not allowed the Jews to exercise the law of Moses. The authority and power (represented by the scepter of a king) was taken from the Jews (by the Romans) when Jesus was about 10 years old. When that happened, the prophecy of Gen 49:10 was fulfilled where it says that the scepter (the authority) of Judah would not be removed until Messiah comes first (Shiloh means "rest" and is a title of Messiah). According to the book “Evidence that Demands a Verdict” by Josh McDowell, the Jewish Talmud recorded that when that happened, the high priest of Israel rent his garments, put ashes on his head and went throughout the streets of Jerusalem crying: "Woe to us, for the scepter departed from Judah and Messiah did not come". They should have believed the data. They should have given God the benefit of the doubt and say to themselves: "Praise God Messiah has arrived, we do not see him but we believe it". Instead, the High Priest went out lamenting that God forgot about His promises to Israel. They should have believed the data, especially after the star of Bethlehem, after the wise men from the east and after the killing of the children took place. We should all trust God with all our heart and lean not in our own understanding.


Shalom

Servant89
Mar 27th 2010, 11:05 PM
6th Sign: The ministry of John the Baptist fulfilled the prophecies of Elijah, the forerunner of Messiah (Mal 4:5-6). This was explained to the parents of John the Baptist (Luke 1:15-22). He even dressed like Elijah. But when they asked him if he was Elijah, and he answered them saying that he was not, all the data (prophecies fulfilled) went down the drain. They were blinded to the historical data matching prophecy because of what one man (John the Baptist) said. When it comes to the signs of the times, God says: Let no man deceive you (Mat 24:4, Luke 21:8, Mark 13:5, 2Th 2:3)… not even the greatest man born of women (Mat 11:11).

7th Sign: Jesus started preaching on the 30th jubilee according to Isa 61:1-2 and history. This prophecy gave us a hint of the year of His coming. No one can preach (according to the law of Moses) until he is 30 years old (Num 4:2). God waited until the 30th jubilee to send His Son to preach. Jesus was over 30 years old when he started preaching. This is also foretold in the Old Testament. Compare Gen 15:13 with Exo 12:40-41. The signs that Jesus did when He walked on this earth were also a very loud indication He was (and is) Messiah (Acts 2:22 and John 10:25,37-38; John 14:11; John 21:25; Luke 7:20-23 and Psalm 78:32).

Sign # 8 is Palm Sunday, coming tomorrow ...

Shalom

Servant89
Mar 28th 2010, 01:11 AM
Israel was supposed to select a king for themselves on a particular day X.

Israel was supposed to select their passover lamb on a particular day Y.

Jesus is our King. Jesus is our passover lamb. When we have Jesus as our king and as our passover lamb, that is the day we enter the promised land of God.

Israel crossed the Jordan river to enter the promise land on a particular day Z.

Yeap, X = Y = Z = Palm Sunday, stay tunned ... all that and more, in detail, on Palm Sunday. And what's with the palm branches?

Shalom

Servant89
Mar 28th 2010, 01:47 PM
8th Sign: Palm Sunday. The Bible says that God’s people are destroyed for lack of knowledge (Hos 4:6). Before God gave Israel the exact day of the arrival of Messiah the king, he told them: Make sure you know and understand this ! When the day came, Jesus said in very modern English: If only you had figured out this prophecy correct, it would have been ok with you. If at least on this day you would have had your act together, things would have been fine. But you blew it. And then he told them in modern English: You blew it, you are all history, because you failed to obtain the knowledge of the timing of my arrival.

The prophecy of Daniel 9:25 precisely declared the day of the arrival of Messiah as King and that day came to be Palm Sunday. This is the only prophecy that indicated the precise day of his arrival as King. In Daniel 9:25 it states that: from the going forth of the commandment to restore Jerusalem until the arrival of Messiah as King it will be 483 years. The commandment is documented in Nehemiah 2. That sets the clock to start counting on 14 March 445 B.C. Four hundred and eighty three years later (7+62) x 7 = 483 yrs = 173,880 days later = Palm Sunday. In John 6:15 the people wanted to make Jesus king but he hid from them because his hour has not yet come. That was the wrong day to start his political career. And Zec 9:9 stated that he had to arrive on a donkey. That is why Jesus made sure a donkey was going to be available that day. When he entered Jerusalem, the whole city cried out that he was king. When the religious leaders wanted that stopped, Jesus answered: If they stop, the stones will cry out. That is because God had prophesied in Zec 9:9 “Rejoice Jerusalem, your king comes to you ridding on a donkey.” It was not optional. They could not help themselves, it had to happen like that. But in spite that on this day everyone is welcoming him as king, he was not impressed with that (God looks at the heart), and he declared judgment over Jerusalem as it is written:

Luke 19:35 And they brought him to Jesus: and they cast their garments upon the colt, and they set Jesus thereon.
36 And as he went, they spread their clothes in the way.
37 And when he was come nigh, even now at the descent of the mount of Olives, the whole multitude of the disciples began to rejoice and praise God with a loud voice for all the mighty works that they had seen;
38 Saying, Blessed be the King that cometh in the name of the Lord: peace in heaven, and glory in the highest.
39 And some of the Pharisees from among the multitude said unto him, Master, rebuke thy disciples.
40 And he answered and said unto them, I tell you that, if these should hold their peace, the stones would immediately cry out.
41 And when he was come near, he beheld the city, and wept over it,
42 Saying, If thou hadst known, even thou, at least in this thy day, the things which belong unto thy peace! but now they are hid from thine eyes.
43 For the days shall come upon thee, that thine enemies shall cast a trench about thee, and compass thee round, and keep thee in on every side,
44 And shall lay thee even with the ground, and thy children within thee; and they shall not leave in thee one stone upon another; BECAUSE thou knewest not THE TIME of thy visitation.

Palm Sunday was the day to select the king of Israel. Israel should have pulled everyone arriving on a donkey that day to select themselves a king. But on that day, no one was aware of the prophecy. That is the reason why judgment was declared on them.
It just so happens, Palm Sunday (the 10th day of the first month) was not only the day of selecting their king, it was also the day of selecting the Passover lamb (Exo 12:3). Jesus is our Passover Lamb and Jesus is our King. Having him as our king and as our Passover lamb gives us free pass to the promised-land in eternity. And Israel crossed the Jordan river to enter the promised land… on Palm Sunday (See Joshua 4:19).

The very next thing that happens after Palm Sunday was Jesus cursing the fig tree. Israel is a type of fig tree (see Hos 9:10) and then the parable of giving the Lord's vineyard to others.,

Shalom

daughter
Mar 28th 2010, 02:58 PM
Hi Servant89.

Thank you very much for this thread, I was in fact pondering some of these very same questions in church this morning. You know that marriage for a Jewish bride was much more exciting in its anticipation than it is in the West. In our culture the bride gets to organise the whole thing, and every detail is pre organised down to the minute.

The Jewish bride knew only that her husband was coming, and that she should be ready for him. Imagine a bride who got bored, or dull, and wasn't ready. That is all too often where we are now.

And yet God models His coming on Jewish rather than Western betrothals... we can't know for sure when He's coming, we can't dictate the terms of it... but He is coming, surely, and we should anticipate that with joy.

Also, I wanted to share the following hymn with you all. It's been haunting me all day. Judging by the fact he won't stop singing it it's been haunting my son as well. Jesus is our God, and our true friend... who shows love to the unlovely, that we may lovely be.

Come soon, Lord Jesus.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WxhHZz4kgDw

Servant89
Mar 28th 2010, 10:40 PM
Hi Servant89.

Thank you very much for this thread, I was in fact pondering some of these very same questions in church this morning. You know that marriage for a Jewish bride was much more exciting in its anticipation than it is in the West. In our culture the bride gets to organise the whole thing, and every detail is pre organised down to the minute.

The Jewish bride knew only that her husband was coming, and that she should be ready for him. Imagine a bride who got bored, or dull, and wasn't ready. That is all too often where we are now.

And yet God models His coming on Jewish rather than Western betrothals... we can't know for sure when He's coming, we can't dictate the terms of it... but He is coming, surely, and we should anticipate that with joy.

Also, I wanted to share the following hymn with you all. It's been haunting me all day. Judging by the fact he won't stop singing it it's been haunting my son as well. Jesus is our God, and our true friend... who shows love to the unlovely, that we may lovely be.

Come soon, Lord Jesus.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WxhHZz4kgDw

Amen sister. I heard the song, it has love written all over it. Thank you.

God made man in his image. Man is not interested in a woman that can vacuum, or do dishes. We are interested in one thing, intimacy with the bride. This is the same message that God left in nature. The # 1 priority for males in nature is to wait for the female to raise that flag that says that she is in the mood. God does not reject anyone, but he is looking for a bride that has the hots for him (spiritually speaking). That is why Jesus prefered what Mary was doing instead of Martha. How the bride reacts to the signs of his coming gets his attention.

Shalom

Servant89
Mar 28th 2010, 10:51 PM
It is a good thing that for the second coming, no one will know the day or the hour, otherwise, we will be just like Israel. But I see God having a short fuse in this subject too. He pleaded with us earnestly to make sure we get the point of his second coming. He warns us strongly about staying in the word of prophecy (the truth) and not listen to lies. When it comes to the subject of the second coming, we see the strongest language from the Lord in the NT. He still has a short fuse about this subject. Notice the pleading ...

2Th 2:1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,
2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.
3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.
5 Remember ye not, that, when I was yet with you, I told you these things?
6 And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.
7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.
8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:
9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,
10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.
11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
12 That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

Rev 2:21 And I gave her space to repent of her fornication; and she repented not.
22 Behold, I will cast her into a bed, and them that commit adultery with her into great tribulation, except they repent of their deeds.
23 And I will kill her children with death; and all the churches shall know that I am he which searcheth the reins and hearts: and I will give unto every one of you according to your works.

The Lord is serious about it. And that thing about coming as a thief in the night... well, it is not supposed to be like that for his bride.

1 Thess 5:4 (http://webnet77.com/cgi-bin/bible/bible.cgi?BIBLE=48&BOOK=52&CHAP=5&SEARCH=jesus king lord&Read=Read&FIRST=OK&HV=4) But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief.

1 Cor 10:11 (http://webnet77.com/cgi-bin/bible/bible.cgi?BIBLE=48&BOOK=46&CHAP=10&SEARCH=jesus king lord&Read=Read&FIRST=OK&HV=11) Now all these things happened unto them for ensamples: and they are written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the world are come.

Shalom

Servant89
Mar 29th 2010, 01:02 AM
Think of this... on the cross, Jesus prayed: Father forgive them, for they know not what they do. And they were forgiven for that. But ...

On Palm Sunday there was no prayer for forgiveness, only a heart-breaking declaration of judgment to come. God's people are not destroyed because we are sinners, we are destroyed for lack of knowledge.

Shalom

PilgrimPastor
Mar 29th 2010, 03:17 AM
Here is the sermon I delivered today about that very thing... Perhaps you need help getting sleepy before bed :)

http://player.sermoncentral.com/swf/SermonCentral.swf?clientid=11563&sermonid=2375639

From my sermon notes:

Reference Ephesians 1:3-8:

"This is what Palm Sunday is all about. It is about our great God and King who loved us according to His sovereign love, before the foundations of the earth, from eternity pat, lavishing us with grace, according to His sovereign plan, His divine authority; we are saved because He saved us; nothing more.

Jesus did not happen to do a good work for us at the Cross. He wasn’t just a good man who chose to die on our behalf. He was not some kind of entrepreneurial religious leader who studied the ancient Hebrew prophecies and then went out of His way to fulfill them, as some academics in the modern era have supposed.

Our salvation was known in the mind of God before the earth of created. God, according to His sovereign will, chose to secure for Himself a people, a remnant, the elect, to lavish with His sovereign love.

How amazing is His grace! How wondrous His Cross! The Father foreknew us, predestined us, not because of us, but in spite of us, to be made alive in Christ Jesus, according to grace alone, by faith alone; mystery of mysteries; why would God save me? Why would He lavish me with His sovereign love?

It is precisely because He is full of grace and that grace has come in the promised faithful servant, the suffering servant of the Lord who atoned for my sin."

PilgrimPastor
Mar 29th 2010, 03:27 AM
Daughter:

Great song. Indeed, we do well to abandon preconceptions regarding how we interpret a great many things in the New Testament. The best "lens" for understanding the Bible is the historical Jewish context, not Western culture.

Servant89
Mar 29th 2010, 09:27 AM
Here is the sermon I delivered today about that very thing... Perhaps you need help getting sleepy before bed :)

http://player.sermoncentral.com/swf/SermonCentral.swf?clientid=11563&sermonid=2375639

From my sermon notes:

Reference Ephesians 1:3-8:

"This is what Palm Sunday is all about. It is about our great God and King who loved us according to His sovereign love, before the foundations of the earth, from eternity pat, lavishing us with grace, according to His sovereign plan, His divine authority; we are saved because He saved us; nothing more.

Jesus did not happen to do a good work for us at the Cross. He wasn’t just a good man who chose to die on our behalf. He was not some kind of entrepreneurial religious leader who studied the ancient Hebrew prophecies and then went out of His way to fulfill them, as some academics in the modern era have supposed.

Our salvation was known in the mind of God before the earth of created. God, according to His sovereign will, chose to secure for Himself a people, a remnant, the elect, to lavish with His sovereign love.

How amazing is His grace! How wondrous His Cross! The Father foreknew us, predestined us, not because of us, but in spite of us, to be made alive in Christ Jesus, according to grace alone, by faith alone; mystery of mysteries; why would God save me? Why would He lavish me with His sovereign love?

It is precisely because He is full of grace and that grace has come in the promised faithful servant, the suffering servant of the Lord who atoned for my sin."

Actually, last night I fell asleep faster than any other night (in about 30 seconds). My wife and I talked about it.

I heard your whole 29 min 10 second sermon. The sermon is about the love of God and how great he is. I agree with everything you said. But you did not talk about Luke 19:39-44.

Israel disappeared as a nation in A.D. 70, they died a terrible death by famine. That which was prophecied in Lev 26:29 came to pass in A.D. 70 as Josephus recorded.

Lev 26:29 And ye shall eat the flesh of your sons, and the flesh of your daughters shall ye eat.

A woman named Mary killed her baby and ate him during the famine in Jerusalem in A.D. 70.

And on Palm Sunday is the only time where Jesus explained why Israel was going to be destroyed within 40 years after his prediction, and the reason was lack of knowledge of the timing of his arrival. The Bible teachers failed to do their job.

Lk 11:52 Woe unto you, lawyers! for ye have taken away the key of knowledge: ye entered not in yourselves, and them that were entering in ye hindered.

But to talk about God declaring judgment for lack of knowlege is not politically correct and for that reason, it is not mentioned from the pulpits as often as it should. The one reason why Israel was destroyed was explained on Palm Sunday. Pastors should share that knowledge with the laity. If there was a particular reason why Israel disappeared as a nation, I believe someone should tell us about it.

You preach from the pulpit, I don't. I have nothing but blessings to you and your family in Jesus' name. Amen.

Shalom

Servant89
Mar 30th 2010, 12:26 AM
I will not be offended if this is rejected ...

Jesus is the sower, and sowers start sowing in spring, we (the church) are now in summer working the field (for the last 1900 years), the last harvest in the fall represents the 2nd coming (Mat 13). Exo 12:2 states that the first month of the Jewish year is the beginning of spring, the month of the passover. But if you ask a Jew when is their new Year, for them (in spite of Exo 12:2) it is the feast of trumpets (Rosh Hossana), which is around Sept/Oct, on the first day of the 7th month. They do that because their behavior reflects their expectation (unkowingly), they expect Messiah to show up for the first time as the second coming. They do not acknowledge the first coming of Christ. Welcoming Jesus with palm branches on palm Sunday falls in the same category. The palm branches are for the feast of Tabenacles which happens two weeks after Rosh Hoshana also in the 7th month, in the fall. Palm Sunday was in the spring.

The feast of Tabenacles
Lev 2:39 Also in the fifteenth day of the seventh month, when ye have gathered in the fruit of the land, ye shall keep a feast unto the LORD seven days: on the first day shall be a sabbath, and on the eighth day shall be a sabbath.
40 And ye shall take you on the first day the boughs of goodly trees, branches of palm trees, and the boughs of thick trees, and willows of the brook; and ye shall rejoice before the LORD your God seven days.
41 And ye shall keep it a feast unto the LORD seven days in the year. It shall be a statute for ever in your generations: ye shall celebrate it in the seventh month.
42 Ye shall dwell in booths seven days; all that are Israelites born shall dwell in booths:

The palm branches reflected their expectations, the second coming, not a suffering Messiah.

Shalom

Servant89
Mar 31st 2010, 11:45 PM
How do we know that the triumphal entrance to Jerusalem happened on a Sunday?

Jn 12:1 Then Jesus six days before the passover came to Bethany, where Lazarus was, which had been dead, whom he raised from the dead.
2 There they made him a supper; and Martha served: but Lazarus was one of them that sat at the table with him.
3 Then took Mary a pound of ointment of spikenard, very costly, and anointed the feet of Jesus, and wiped his feet with her hair: and the house was filled with the odour of the ointment.
12 On the next day much people that were come to the feast, when they heard that Jesus was coming to Jerusalem,
13 Took branches of palm trees, and went forth to meet him, and cried, Hosanna: Blessed is the King of Israel that cometh in the name of the Lord.14 And Jesus, when he had found a young ass, sat thereon; as it is written,
15 Fear not, daughter of Sion: behold, thy King cometh, sitting on an ass's colt.

Day 6 Sabbath, resting with intimate friends before his last dash to the cross (9th day of the first month)
Day 5 Sunday Triumphal entrance to Jerusalem (10th day of the first month, also the day of selecting the passover lamb, Exo 12:3 and the day that Israel entered the promised land, Joshua 4:19)
Day 4 Monday (Curses the fig tree, Mat 21:!9; Mar 11:13; Hos 9:10) This is the 11h day of the month.
Day 3 Tuesday (the 12th day of the month)
Day 2 Wednesday (the 13th day of the month)
Day 1 Thursday (this day really starts on our Wednesday night celebration of passover with disciples, Getsemani, arrest, mocked trial, and then during the day, the passion and death at 3 pm) This is the 14th day of the month and it is always on a full moon, which makes it impossible for a solar eclipse.

Amos 8:9 And it shall come to pass in that day, saith the Lord GOD, that I will cause the sun to go down at noon, and I will darken the earth in the clear day:

Mt 27:45 Now from the sixth hour there was darkness over all the land unto the ninth hour.

Jesus did not die on Friday. That error comes from not knowing the law of Moses concerning the day after passover...

Jn 19:31 The Jews therefore, because it was the preparation, that the bodies should not remain upon the cross on the sabbath day, (for that sabbath day was an high day,) besought Pilate that their legs might be broken, and that they might be taken away.

Lev 23:5 In the fourteenth day of the first month at even is the LORD's passover.
6 And on the fifteenth day of the same month is the feast of unleavened bread unto the LORD: seven days ye must eat unleavened bread.
7 In the first day ye shall have an holy convocation: ye shall do no servile work therein (meaning it is a Sabbath day of rest).

That is the only way that we can have 3 days and 3 nights between his death and resurrection.

Jesus resurrected on the 17th day of the month. Noah's ark rested on mount Ararat on this day (Gen 8:4)

Gen 8:4 And the ark rested in the seventh month, on the seventeenth day of the month, upon the mountains of Ararat.

The 7th month was changed to the first month by God in Exo 12:2.

Shalom

percho
Apr 1st 2010, 03:54 AM
Good post. However it says the the Son of man would be in the earth three days and three nights not dead three days and three nights. Just as Jonas was in the fish so shall.

Servant89
Apr 1st 2010, 11:31 AM
Good post. However it says the the Son of man would be in the earth three days and three nights not dead three days and three nights. Just as Jonas was in the fish so shall.

Thanks for the clarification. You are absolutely correct. I stand corrected (and loving it).

:-)

Shalom

percho
Apr 1st 2010, 10:32 PM
Thanks for the clarification. You are absolutely correct. I stand corrected (and loving it).

:-)

Shalom

You realize this affects some of your other thoughts?

Servant89
Apr 2nd 2010, 09:17 PM
<<You realize this affects some of your other thoughts? >>

That is the only way that we can have 3 days and 3 nights between his burial and his resurrection.

Jesus was buried Thursday afternoon (before sunset). That means he was buried in the earth during the day on Thursday (yeah, not the whole part of the day). He was also buried during the day part of Friday and during the day part of Saturday.

Jesus was in the ground buried during Friday night, Saturday night and Sunday night.

Does it have to be three 24 hours days? Does Jonah records three 24 hours periods? Is that what you are refering to?

Shalom

Servant89
Apr 2nd 2010, 09:20 PM
By the way, did you all realize that if Jesus had remained on the cross during sunset, that his sacrifice would have been nullifed, voided, not valid?

Shalom

percho
Apr 2nd 2010, 10:11 PM
<<You realize this affects some of your other thoughts? >>

That is the only way that we can have 3 days and 3 nights between his burial and his resurrection.

Jesus was buried Thursday afternoon (before sunset). That means he was buried in the earth during the day on Thursday (yeah, not the whole part of the day). He was also buried during the day part of Friday and during the day part of Saturday.

Jesus was in the ground buried during Friday night, Saturday night and Sunday night.

Does it have to be three 24 hours days? Does Jonah records three 24 hours periods? Is that what you are refering to?

Shalom

I just know a few days before Jesus was talking about it being twelve hours of daylight. Please add more about post 22 I would be of interest. I personally think Jesus was entombed on Wednesday just as the 14th ended and the feast day 15th began. Thursday everyone rested account high day sabbath. Friday the women went and bought and prepared spices which must have taken some time because they rested the sabbath day Saturday according to the commanment. The following morning while yet dark they went to annoint him but of course he was gone. This of course was the day that the priest waved the sheaf to be accepted for the people. This was not a feast day however. When Mary first saw him he had not yet been accepted for us and he told her not to touch him because of that. Look closly at John 20:17 and you see acceptance there.

Servant89
Apr 2nd 2010, 11:26 PM
I just know a few days before Jesus was talking about it being twelve hours of daylight. Please add more about post 22 I would be of interest. I personally think Jesus was entombed on Wednesday just as the 14th ended and the feast day 15th began. Thursday everyone rested account high day sabbath. Friday the women went and bought and prepared spices which must have taken some time because they rested the sabbath day Saturday according to the commanment. The following morning while yet dark they went to annoint him but of course he was gone. This of course was the day that the priest waved the sheaf to be accepted for the people. This was not a feast day however. When Mary first saw him he had not yet been accepted for us and he told her not to touch him because of that. Look closly at John 20:17 and you see acceptance there.

In your scenario I count four nights. Thursday, Friday, Saturday and Sunday. Is that right?

Concerning my post # 22.

It is written:

Deu 21:22 And if a man have committed a sin worthy of death, and he be to be put to death, and thou hang him on a tree:
23 His body shall not remain all night upon the tree, but thou shalt in any wise bury him that day; (for he that is hanged is accursed of God, that thy land be not defiled, which the LORD thy God giveth thee for an inheritance.

Josh 8:29 And the king of Ai he hanged on a tree until eventide: and as soon as the sun was down, Joshua commanded that they should take his carcass down from the tree, and cast it at the entering of the gate of the city, and raise thereon a great heap of stones, that remaineth unto this day.

Josh 10:26 And afterward Joshua smote them, and slew them, and hanged them on five trees: and they were hanging upon the trees until the evening.

They had to bring them down before sunset so that the earth would not be defiled. It is written:

Gal 3:13 Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:

The curse fell on him and that is why the earth was clean after that (uncleaned animals are now clean). But the Israelites did not care for that, they cared for their own righteousness and because they wanted to celebrate the feast of unleavened bread, they hurried to bury him. No one that touches the dead can celebrate the feasts. The only feast that has a waiver on this is passover. Read it.

Num9:6 And there were certain men, who were defiled by the dead body of a man, that they could not keep the passover on that day: and they came before Moses and before Aaron on that day:
7 And those men said unto him, We are defiled by the dead body of a man: wherefore are we kept back, that we may not offer an offering of the LORD in his appointed season among the children of Israel?
8 And Moses said unto them, Stand still, and I will hear what the LORD will command concerning you.
9 And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying,
10 Speak unto the children of Israel, saying, If any man of you or of your posterity shall be unclean by reason of a dead body, or be in a journey afar off, yet he shall keep the passover unto the LORD.
11 The fourteenth day of the second month at even they shall keep it, and eat it with unleavened bread and bitter herbs.

Shalom

Servant89
Apr 2nd 2010, 11:41 PM
1Cor 15:1-3 describes the gospel as Jesus had to die for our sins, was burried and that he was raised from the dead on the third day according to the Scriptures. There are four Scriptures in the OT foretelling the 3 days.

1. Since we are his body... it spoke of him too.
Hos 6:2 (http://webnet77.com/cgi-bin/bible/bible.cgi?BIBLE=48&BOOK=28&CHAP=6&SEARCH=jesus king lord&Read=Read&FIRST=OK&HV=2) After two days will he revive us: in the third day he will raise us up, and we shall live in his sight.

2. The next one has to be combined with Hebrews 11:19. It says that when Abraham heard that God told him to sacrifice his son, his son died in his mind. And when the angel stopped his hand from killing the lad, his son came back to life in his mind. This happened after 3 days.

Gen 22:1 And it came to pass after these things, that God did tempt Abraham, and said unto him, Abraham: and he said, Behold, here I am.
2 And he said, Take now thy son, thine only son Isaac, whom thou lovest, and get thee into the land of Moriah; and offer him there for a burnt offering upon one of the mountains which I will tell thee of.
3 And Abraham rose up early in the morning, and saddled his ass, and took two of his young men with him, and Isaac his son, and clave the wood for the burnt offering, and rose up, and went unto the place of which God had told him.
4 Then on the third day Abraham lifted up his eyes, and saw the place afar off.

Heb 11:17 By faith Abraham, when he was tried, offered up Isaac: and he that had received the promises offered up his only begotten son,
18 Of whom it was said, That in Isaac shall thy seed be called:
19 Accounting (http://webnet77.com/cgi-bin/bible/bible.cgi?BIBLE=48&BOOK=58&CHAP=11&SEARCH=jesus king lord&Read=Read&FIRST=OK&HV=17#) that God was able to raise him up, even from the dead; from whence also he received him in a figure.

3. Jesus had to be dead the maximum amount of time without seeing corruption. If he had died for 3 minutes, no one would believe it. The maximum amount is 3 days.

Ps 16:10 (http://webnet77.com/cgi-bin/bible/bible.cgi?BIBLE=48&BOOK=19&CHAP=16&SEARCH=jesus king lord&Read=Read&FIRST=OK&HV=10) For thou wilt not leave my soul in hell; neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption.

Jn 11:39 (http://webnet77.com/cgi-bin/bible/bible.cgi?BIBLE=48&BOOK=43&CHAP=11&SEARCH=jesus king lord&Read=Read&FIRST=OK&HV=39) Jesus said, Take ye away the stone. Martha, the sister of him that was dead, saith unto him, Lord, by this time he stinketh: for he hath been dead four days.

4. The story of Jonah.

Jon 1:17 (http://webnet77.com/cgi-bin/bible/bible.cgi?BIBLE=48&BOOK=32&CHAP=1&SEARCH=jesus king lord&Read=Read&FIRST=OK&HV=17) Now the LORD had prepared a great fish to swallow up Jonah. And Jonah was in the belly of the fish three days and three nights.

Notice that the first three examples do not say AFTER the third day, they say ON (or during) the third day.

Shalom

percho
Apr 3rd 2010, 12:46 AM
From dusk Wednesday to dawn Thursday one night daylight Thursday one day. Dusk Thursday to dawn Friday two nights daylight Friday two days. Dusk Friday to dawn Saturday three nights and daylight Saturday three days. No one to our knowledge saw him come forth from the tomb. All we know is when the women arrived the next morning he was already gone. My three days and three nights do not disagree with any statement of Jesus. Inclusive in it would be after three days, in three days, on the third day, or any other he said. There is one scripture that could present a small problem. I wonder how he was dressed when he came out of the tomb. Yes I think it was very close to three twenty four hour periods. Maybe exactly twenty four hours.

Servant89
Apr 3rd 2010, 02:04 AM
From dusk Wednesday to dawn Thursday one night daylight Thursday one day. Dusk Thursday to dawn Friday two nights daylight Friday two days. Dusk Friday to dawn Saturday three nights and daylight Saturday three days. No one to our knowledge saw him come forth from the tomb. All we know is when the women arrived the next morning he was already gone. My three days and three nights do not disagree with any statement of Jesus. Inclusive in it would be after three days, in three days, on the third day, or any other he said. There is one scripture that could present a small problem. I wonder how he was dressed when he came out of the tomb. Yes I think it was very close to three twenty four hour periods. Maybe exactly twenty four hours.

You forgot to add Wednesday during the day. He was buried before sunset. So, he was burried part of that day. That makes it ~3.1 days. According to you Jesus rose from the dead right after sunset on our Saturday around 6:15 pm? That will end up with 3.1 nights. He was buried from day 14 to day 18 (Sunday, according to your calculations). That is four days. If passover was Wednesday, that causes Palm Sunday to occur on the 11th and the resurrection on the 18 which falls out of sinc with the other Scriptures. Your scenario places the resurrection at night, right after sunset. The Bible tells a different story:

Mat 28:1 In the end of the sabbath, as it began to dawn toward the first day of the week, came Mary Magdalene and the other Mary to see the sepulchre.
2 And, behold, there was a great earthquake: for the angel of the Lord descended from heaven, and came and rolled back the stone from the door, and sat upon it.

But the important thing is that you believe like I do, that he was buried 3 days ad 3 nights and rose again on the third day. AMEN?

I admit, your scenario is indeed closer to three 24 hours days than the way I see it.

Shalom

percho
Apr 3rd 2010, 04:13 AM
I believe he was put in the tomb within minutes before the high day sabbath and departed the tomb on the weekly sabbath within minutes before the first day of the week. Actually in Matt. 28:1 sabbath should be in the plural.

Servant89
Apr 3rd 2010, 07:33 AM
I believe he was put in the tomb within minutes before the high day sabbath and departed the tomb on the weekly sabbath within minutes before the first day of the week. Actually in Matt. 28:1 sabbath should be in the plural.

Your interpretation weights heavy on the 24 hour day concept and there is nothing wrong with that from our western culture. But in the Bible, those minutes count as part of another day. I prefer my view because it falls in sinc with the timing of Palm Sunday, the selection of the passover lamb and Noah's ark resting on mount Ararat. This difference between the way we see it is minor (in my view). God bless you !

Shalom

Servant89
Apr 3rd 2010, 11:31 PM
I am amazed that no church remembers Calvary or teaches Calvary as a day that happened on Thursday. All of them teach Good Friday. God allowed that day to be off. However, he did not allow Palm Sunday to be celebrated in any other day. Since the Church had the day of his death (passover) wrong (on Friday), that should have moved Palm Sunday to Monday but it didn't. Palm Sunday is given in the gospel of John as relative to passover. God used two negatives to ensure Palm Sunday remained a Sunday celebration. The other negative was the western practice of counting day 1 as zero. That is how we ended up celebrating it on the right day. Why is Sunday so important?

The Sabbath was made for man, not for God. Man was not made for the Sabbath, man was made for God (Isa 43:7,21). Man was made to worship God. It is proper that if man has a day (God gave us a day for us to rest on, after we serve our earthly boss and neighbors), that God ought to have a day also as a free will offering from man to God. I chose Sunday as the day of the Lord for in that day and hour Jesus arose from the dead and at that time:

-- Jesus was declared Son of God with power (Rom 1:4) that Sunday morning.
-- We were justified in His sight (Rom 4:25) that Sunday morning.
-- We are saved by believing what happened that wonderful Sunday morning (Rom 10:9)
-- Our faith was confirmed on that Sunday morning (1Co 15:14-18)
-- We were begotten of God on that Sunday morning (1Pe 1:3)
-- God conquered Satan on that Sunday morning (1Co 2:8)
-- That Sunday morning gave us hope of being resurrected.
-- Jesus conquered death on that day and hour (1Co 15:54).
-- That event changed coward people into bold martyrs for God.
-- That event separated Jesus from all the other religious leaders.
-- That event caused us to be dead to the law, free from the letter of the law, and made us righteous before God.
-- Sunday morning is not made after man.

The Sabbath, because it is for man, it is therefore made after the carnal commandment, Sunday on the other hand is made after the power of endless life. It is written:

HEB 7:16 Who is made, not after the law of a carnal commandment, but after the power of an endless life.

GAL 1:11 But I certify you, brethren, that the gospel which was preached of me is not after man.

-- The Lord’s resurrection on Sunday morning is the central point of Christianity (1Co 15:14,17). Sunday morning is far more important than the Sabbath. It is written:

1CO 15:14 And if Christ be not risen, then is our preaching vain, and your faith is also vain. ...
17 And if Christ be not raised, your faith is vain; ye are yet in your sins.

It is the right thing to do, … to lift Him up at the day and hour that He was lifted up from the earth and won for us all our victories. Everything in Christianity was accomplished on that day and hour. Why should it be a surprise to commemorate it? God commanded Israel to make a memorial of the victories He had won for them. No victory is greater and more worthy of remembering that the resurrection from the dead of our Lord and Savior, God Almighty Jesus Christ. On that Sunday morning He won all our victories. Glory and honor, domiion and strength belong to him.

Shalom

percho
Apr 4th 2010, 05:13 AM
Gen. 1:5,8,13 Happy Easter

Servant89
Apr 15th 2010, 01:02 PM
I forgot to document in this thread one sign of his first coming that is definetively biblical. The timing of the arrival of Messiah was given in another way,

Mt 1:17 So all the generations from Abraham to David are fourteen generations; and from David until the carrying away into Babylon are fourteen generations; and from the carrying away into Babylon unto Christ are fourteen generations.

God told Moses:

Exo 2320 Behold, I send an Angel before thee, to keep thee in the way, and to bring thee into the place which I have prepared.
21 Beware of him, and obey his voice, provoke him not; for he will not pardon your transgressions: for my name is in him.

The one that lead Israel into the promised land was Joshua son of Nun. Nun is the letter N (literally) in the Hebrew alphabet. It says, Joshua son of N. N is the letter # 14 in the English, Spanish, Hebrew and Greek alphabets. Joshua son of 14 in a series.

The name Joshua is the same name Jesus in both Hebrew (Yeshua) and Greek (Iesous). In the Bible, they both have the same name (Joshua and Jesus). It is in the English translation and Spanish translation that we split it and give it different names.

So the Bible was saying Jesus sun of N, Jesus son of a 14 in a series. By the way, Jesus son of David is anothe way of saying Jesus son of 14 because the name David adds up to 14 in Hebrew (4+6+4, DVD)

Shalom