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View Full Version : 39% of New York city pregnancies end in abortion



Brother Mark
Jan 9th 2011, 03:28 PM
We desperately need a law to protect these children. Can you imagine the outcry if 39% of the 2 year olds in NY city were killed by their mothers and doctors?


NEW YORK (CBSNewYork/AP) – Archbishop Timothy Dolan is calling for efforts to make abortions in New York City “rare.”

Dolan gathered with other religious leaders on Thursday to draw attention to the city’s high abortion rate. The city health department last month released statistics that showed 39 percent of pregnancies ended with induced termination in 2009.

In the Bronx, it's even higher.


In 2009, there were 225,667 pregnancies in the City with 126,774 resulting in live births and 87,273 resulting in abortions. In addition to those abortion numbers, there were 11,620 spontaneous terminations.

Forty-six percent of all births in the Bronx result in abortions—the highest among the five boroughs, according to the report.

Linky (http://newyork.cbslocal.com/2011/01/07/41-percent-of-nyc-pregnancies-result-in-abortion/)

Government was established by God because of such violence in the world. Man's heart is filled with violence so much these days, that we think nothing of killing the most defenseless people in our society.

AndrewBaptistFL
Jan 9th 2011, 04:41 PM
That is a staggering figure. Wow.

RevLogos
Jan 10th 2011, 12:29 AM
We desperately need a law to protect these children.

Man's heart is filled with violence so much these days, that we think nothing of killing the most defenseless people in our society.

Hard to reconcile these two statements though isn't it?

There is already a law against it, written by a much greater authority than any man-made law. We cannot legislate morality. If we try, we could perhaps save a few, but one can always go to another city, county or state, or it's driven underground causing even more problems.

The problem is bigger than abortions. Over 40% of the live births were to unwed mothers, 70-85% in some districts. The report also says the leading cause of death in people aged 15 to 34 is homicide. To me these numbers are symptomatic of entire communities that have lost hope.

We need to reach these people with the Gospel, in truth and love, somehow.

We need to reach out to the babies too. In a book “How Christianity Changed the World” by Alvin J. Schmidt, he described in Roman days instead of abortions, women would throw their newborns off a bridge into a river. Christians would be down there in boats with nets fishing the babies out and adopting them. Is there any equivalent today? I can imagine millions of Christian couples willing to adopt if they could be linked to the mothers considering an abortion. Would that help set the kind of example people need to see? Or do I have a wild imagination?

Brother Mark
Jan 10th 2011, 12:43 AM
Hard to reconcile these two statements though isn't it?

There is already a law against it, written by a much greater authority than any man-made law. We cannot legislate morality. If we try, we could perhaps save a few, but one can always go to another city, county or state, or it's driven underground causing even more problems.

I don't buy that at all. We have laws against murder now and they work pretty good. Before abortion was legal, it protected the vast majority of babies from being killed.

Let me ask you this... should we just get rid of murder laws because we can't legislate morality? God didn't give government the sword in order to change people's hearts. It was to bring vengeance so as to prevent what was in man from getting out of control again.


The problem is bigger than abortions. Over 40% of the live births were to unwed mothers, 70-85% in some districts. The report also says the leading cause of death in people aged 15 to 34 is homicide. To me these numbers are symptomatic of entire communities that have lost hope.

We need to reach these people with the Gospel, in truth and love, somehow.

Of course we do! Let me ask another question.

There is plenty of child abuse going on. Should we legalize it, say child prostitution, until we can get the perpetrator saved and it doesn't happen any more?


We need to reach out to the babies too. In a book “How Christianity Changed the World” by Alvin J. Schmidt, he described in Roman days instead of abortions, women would throw their newborns off a bridge into a river. Christians would be down there in boats with nets fishing the babies out and adopting them. Is there any equivalent today? I can imagine millions of Christian couples willing to adopt if they could be linked to the mothers considering an abortion. Would that help set the kind of example people need to see? Or do I have a wild imagination?

Save a life does that. There are ministries out there now that help with adoptions over abortions.

BirdOfPray
Jan 10th 2011, 02:30 AM
In a book “How Christianity Changed the World” by Alvin J. Schmidt, he described in Roman days instead of abortions, women would throw their newborns off a bridge into a river. Christians would be down there in boats with nets fishing the babies out and adopting them. Is there any equivalent today? I can imagine millions of Christian couples willing to adopt if they could be linked to the mothers considering an abortion. Would that help set the kind of example people need to see? Or do I have a wild imagination?

In theory it would be great. In reality, I read recently that there are more churches in America than there are American children needing families. Meaning that if one family from every church adopted one child domestically, we'd have no more children without families in our country. That doesn't seem like a lot to ask (I know at least three families in my small church who are pursuing domestic adoption, and two are looking for sibling groups), but it hasn't happened. So I wouldn't count too much on saving and finding homes for all the aborted children either, much as I'd love to see it happen.

As a side note: I'm not saying domestic adoptions are better than international; I just recently heard that figure and it struck me as pretty amazing. Don't know what the numbers are internationally.

Jeanne D
Jan 10th 2011, 02:40 AM
I think this thread would be better served in Controversial Issues.

Thanks.
Jeanne :)

-SEEKING-
Jan 10th 2011, 02:41 AM
I think this thread would be better served in Controversial Issues.

Thanks.
Jeanne :)

I agree.....................

RevLogos
Jan 10th 2011, 05:10 AM
I don't buy that at all. We have laws against murder now and they work pretty good. Before abortion was legal, it protected the vast majority of babies from being killed.

Let me ask you this... should we just get rid of murder laws because we can't legislate morality? God didn't give government the sword in order to change people's hearts. It was to bring vengeance so as to prevent what was in man from getting out of control again.



Of course we do! Let me ask another question.

There is plenty of child abuse going on. Should we legalize it, say child prostitution, until we can get the perpetrator saved and it doesn't happen any more?


I would like to think we could have a debate on this without throwing in obvious strawmen like shall we make murder legal, or child abuse. These all fall well into Natural Law. You can do better than that.

The link was to a report that is showing entire dysfunctional communities where the leading cause of death is homicide, where more than 40% of households are single parent and where abortion rates are astronomical. Human life is not particularly precious here. One could try to make abortions less legal but that would be like giving aspirin to a cancer patient. The pathology is much greater than the symptom of abortions.

We live in a country that has rejected the notion that human life exists prior to the point of viability. Or at least the Supreme Court has. Shall we continue to bang our head against that wall or shall we look to the root causes? How did legislating sin from the great Christian temperance movement a century ago work out?

And these pathologies continue to lead this country into other areas of social decline like eliminating marriage as we know it, legalizing pot, legalizing prostitution, expanding gambling, and really decadent TV programming...

The only way people will understand the sanctity of life is through God. The only way to transform people is through Jesus. And even if we do want to make abortion illegal, and stem the tide in these other areas through legislation, we still need to transform people first because it is these people who become the politicians and judges who ultimately write and interpret these laws.

We are not in desperate need of new laws. We are in desperate need of transforming lives through the Gospel of Christ.

Nihil Obstat
Jan 10th 2011, 02:55 PM
We are not in desperate need of new laws. We are in desperate need of transforming lives through the Gospel of Christ.

Actually I think you're both right. It doesn't have to be an 'either / or' thing. We need both, whether one happens before the other or simultaneously.

the rookie
Jan 10th 2011, 07:16 PM
Isn't all law knit inextricably to morality in some form?

Firefighter
Jan 10th 2011, 07:39 PM
Isn't all law knit inextricably to morality in some form?

Two words... "Tax Law". :lol:


That being said, how can these communities be hopeless? I thought that there would be enough hopium to go around. :dunno:

RabbiKnife
Jan 10th 2011, 07:40 PM
Isn't all law knit inextricably to morality in some form?

Or one word....

"Control."

the rookie
Jan 10th 2011, 08:00 PM
If you've been listening to our President, then yes, all tax law is knit to morality... :lol:

Athanasius
Jan 11th 2011, 12:37 AM
Isn't all law knit inextricably to morality in some form?

I would say it's knit into a 'sense of morality' (ambiguous). That is why I can't convince anyone to follow Nietzsche, no matter how hard I try. The problem is that their 'moral sensabilities' are offended - though they don't know why, and can't explain it, and won't forsake it. It just is, and to say otherwise is unheard of (I've been told as much many times here.) The question is, what moral beliefs are 'properly basic', and what find form in particular culture?

baxpack7
Jan 13th 2011, 01:10 AM
Or one word....

"Control."

Which leads to 3 more words:
"Health Care reform"

NHL Fever
Jan 13th 2011, 04:24 AM
Even if people are killing their babies, at the very least we know these lives are innocent and its likely (trying to understand the bible as best I can) 100% of them are going to heaven. That is a far higher percentage than would if they were born. The abortionists and the mothers are guilty in this crime, and will have to deal with the consequences of that, including the earthly consequences of guilt or lack of blessings they might otherwise receive.

RabbiKnife
Jan 13th 2011, 02:23 PM
Hey, now there's an idea.

Let's kill all the babies to insure that everyone goes to heaven.

NHL Fever
Jan 13th 2011, 06:52 PM
Hey, now there's an idea.

Let's kill all the babies to insure that everyone goes to heaven.

I'm just trying to give some hope to the victims in this. Why is is so easy for you to get angry?

RabbiKnife
Jan 13th 2011, 06:58 PM
Why do you think I'm angry?

Oh, that's right. I don't think Sarah Palin is ridiculous or like the KKK or WBC, so therefore, I must be angry. I'm also white and male, so that makes me an angry white male. Oh, and Republican. And conservative. That would make me an angry white conservative Republican male.

Nevermind. You must have been right.

Exactly how does saying, "Oh well, even if 39% of all babies conceived in NYC are aborted, at least they have a 100% chance of going to heaven, because God only knows what percentage would die and go to hell if they got a chance to be born" make any sense whatsoever?

NHL Fever
Jan 14th 2011, 03:39 PM
That would make me an angry white conservative Republican male.


I guess I'll take your word for it, but unless I'm missing something, that doesn't have any bearing on the subject.



Exactly how does saying, "Oh well, even if 39% of all babies conceived in NYC are aborted, at least they have a 100% chance of going to heaven, because God only knows what percentage would die and go to hell if they got a chance to be born" make any sense whatsoever?

I'm not sure how it makes any sense. You put something into quotes which I did not say, so unless its a quote from some third party, that makes it yours. I'm not sure why I would be expected to defend your words.

RabbiKnife
Jan 14th 2011, 04:09 PM
I guess I'll take your word for it, but unless I'm missing something, that doesn't have any bearing on the subject.



I'm not sure how it makes any sense. You put something into quotes which I did not say, so unless its a quote from some third party, that makes it yours. I'm not sure why I would be expected to defend your words.

It is a paraphrase of your post. I just don't see how saying that aborted babies go to heaven is supposed to bring any comfort to anyone.

baxpack7
Jan 14th 2011, 11:51 PM
It is a paraphrase of your post. I just don't see how saying that aborted babies go to heaven is supposed to bring any comfort to anyone.

I'd have to say that's it's a heckuva lot better than telling them:"I regret to inform you that your aborted baby is going to burn in hell"

decrumpit
Jan 15th 2011, 01:26 AM
I'd have to say that's it's a heckuva lot better than telling them:"I regret to inform you that your aborted baby is going to burn in hell" So why not abort all babies if they have a 100% salvation rate? Is this Biblical?

BTW - some churches only consider the children of the elect to be saved before birth. So I guess there is no way to know for them.

NHL Fever
Jan 16th 2011, 12:46 AM
It is a paraphrase of your post. Then it doesn't belong in quotes.



I just don't see how saying that aborted babies go to heaven is supposed to bring any comfort to anyone.Because people are comforted by the idea of the innocent being in heaven rather than hell.


So why not abort all babies if they have a 100% salvation rate?
Because abortion is murder.


Is this Biblical?
The bible says we are born into sin. Therefore it's my opinion that the unborn are innocent of sin.


BTW - some churches only consider the children of the elect to be saved before birth. So I guess there is no way to know for them.I can't speak for some churches, only for what I see in scripture. Some churches believe any imaginable thing.

RevLogos
Jan 16th 2011, 01:43 AM
BTW - some churches only consider the children of the elect to be saved before birth. So I guess there is no way to know for them.

Probably comes from this:

1Co 7:14 For the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified by the husband: else were your children unclean; but now are they holy.

Saved7
Jan 16th 2011, 08:21 PM
Wow...that headline made my stomach turn. :(

AndrewBaptistFL
Jan 16th 2011, 08:35 PM
Wow...that headline made my stomach turn. :(

Yeah. Me too.:hug:

BenThomasFootball
Jan 29th 2013, 07:00 PM
WOW! We are living in horrible times!!

I am so thankful for the WORD OF GOD in scripture, song, and spoken!

I just heard a new song on the radio called "Let Mercy Hold You" by Jason Crabb. I made a video of it:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ab2G3hcxw0Y

I hope you will watch it and let it bless you as much as it did me.

It really gave me comfort that HIS MERCY is holding us!!!