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ChangedByHim
Aug 16th 2014, 05:49 PM
What are your thoughts on sanctification?

1 Thessalonians 4:3 - For this is the will of God, even your sanctification.

My simple overview:

My spirit is sanctified instantaneously at the new birth.
My soul (mind, will and emotions) is sanctified progressively.
My body will be sanctified in the future.

1 Thes. 5:23

(I'm not looking for a debate on the difference between spirit and soul.)

How do you see the work of sanctification?

Protective Angel
Aug 16th 2014, 06:25 PM
Love the simpleness. :)


Been looking to learn more in this area.


Sanctification appears to be a 3 step process.

Aviyah
Aug 16th 2014, 06:46 PM
I thought sanctification was just the process of growth - starting at salvation and ending at glorification after death?

ChangedByHim
Aug 16th 2014, 07:10 PM
The word means to be set apart unto God.

Aviyah
Aug 16th 2014, 07:29 PM
In that case we were literally sanctified before we were born.

breadfirst
Aug 16th 2014, 07:36 PM
When I hear the term sanctification I think of Jesus conforming me to be like Him. He is the author and perfecter of our faith (Heb 12:2).

I don't know if there is a specific formula; but usually what I have witnessed is that God first guides you in a loving way in recognizing a specific sin. Then He encourages you to seek His help directly or indirectly (i.e. through church counseling). Once you break free from that bondage there is a period of rejoicing and gratefulness to the Lord (sometimes it may take time). In parallel I also witness the believer spiritually growing. This is not to be considered a series of methodical steps; but generally the cycle.

This is a life long process and its outcome is clearly visible by looking back in life to see the impact. The believer can then witness the wonderful ways he has been transformed to becoming like Christ. This is turn motivates the believer to walk closer with the Lord.

ChangedByHim
Aug 16th 2014, 07:43 PM
In that case we were literally sanctified before we were born.

Called but not set apart in the sense of sanctification.

amazzin
Aug 16th 2014, 07:43 PM
That about sums it up nicely :)


What are your thoughts on sanctification?

1 Thessalonians 4:3 - For this is the will of God, even your sanctification.

My simple overview:

My spirit is sanctified instantaneously at the new birth.
My soul (mind, will and emotions) is sanctified progressively.
My body will be sanctified in the future.

1 Thes. 5:23

(I'm not looking for a debate on the difference between spirit and soul.)

How do you see the work of sanctification?

Aviyah
Aug 16th 2014, 08:08 PM
Called but not set apart in the sense of sanctification.

How is being predestined different from being set apart?

ChangedByHim
Aug 16th 2014, 11:28 PM
How is being predestined different from being set apart?

The setting apart requires my obedience; the predestination does not. At least in my theology.

Glorious
Aug 17th 2014, 03:03 AM
Sanctification means setting apart as holy unto God.

It is done by the Holy Ghost by means of blood, or by offering of the body of the Lord Jesus Christ, or the faith of God, or prayer, and/or the power or glory of God.

awestruckchild
Aug 18th 2014, 02:08 PM
The word means to be set apart unto God.

How strange that I find this thread right after saying in another one that I've never really understood what sanctified means when men say it! :)
So the word "sanctified" and the word "holy" mean the same thing?? Geesh, I was making it harder than it had to be to understand? That's so unlike me...:rolleyes:

watchinginawe
Aug 18th 2014, 03:05 PM
What are your thoughts on sanctification?

1 Thessalonians 4:3 - For this is the will of God, even your sanctification.

My simple overview:

My spirit is sanctified instantaneously at the new birth.
My soul (mind, will and emotions) is sanctified progressively.
My body will be sanctified in the future.

1 Thes. 5:23

(I'm not looking for a debate on the difference between spirit and soul.)

How do you see the work of sanctification?

I see it along these lines. Did you want to discuss and explore it? Or did you want to just leave the simple outline without filling it out?

ChangedByHim
Aug 18th 2014, 03:15 PM
I see it along these lines. Did you want to discuss and explore it? Or did you want to just leave the simple outline without filling it out?

I'm open... It's interesting that some churches see sanctification as a separate and distinct work of grace that happens instantaneously at some point after salvation. They actually count those who were "sanctified" in revival meetings.

mailmandan
Aug 18th 2014, 03:15 PM
I certainly see initial sanctification in which we are "set apart" in standing before God postionally in Christ. 1 Corinthians 6:11 - Such were some of you; but you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and in the Spirit of our God. 1 Corinthians 1:2 - To the church of God which is at Corinth, to those who have been sanctified in Christ Jesus.. Yet I also see progressive ongoing sanctification in which the reality of that holiness becomes more and more evident in our actions, words, thoughts, attitudes, and motives. 1 Thessalonians 4:3-4, - For this is the will of God, your sanctification: that you should abstain from sexual immorality; that each of you should know how to possess his own vessel in sanctification and honor. Hebrews 10:14 - For by one offering He has perfected forever those who are being sanctified. So becoming washed, sanctified and justified in Christ is a one time event, yet abstaining from sexual immorality is not a one time event. Here is how I see it. The believer possess a positional, judicial standing of righteousness in Christ (sanctified, set apart) and, second, a remaining need for practical, progressive holiness to grow and mature in Christ (ongoing sanctification).

ChangedByHim
Aug 18th 2014, 03:16 PM
How is being predestined different from being set apart?


The setting apart requires my obedience; the predestination does not. At least in my theology.

Good morning Aviyah :)

Do you have further dialogue on this?

watchinginawe
Aug 18th 2014, 03:34 PM
I'm open... It's interesting that some churches see sanctification as a separate and distinct work of grace that happens instantaneously at some point after salvation. They actually count those who were "sanctified" in revival meetings.

It is an interesting doctrine to explore. That is actually what led to contemporary Pentecostalism. The "second blessing" "double cure" is the work of grace mentioned. Basically, salvation sets one free from the penalty of sin and sanctification sets one free from the life (desires) of sin. Thus the "double cure". These are taught and preached as separate "works", sometimes seemingly simultaneous. But very similar to how you would see Salvation and Baptism with the Holy Spirit, which in this would be the third and distinct work of grace.

Pentecostal Holiness and Church of God and later variants believe in the second work of Grace to be Sanctification along with the third being baptism with the Holy Spirit. Assemblies of God and variants believe in progressive sanctification, and thus two works. My view is more blended. In contemporary Christianity, as you well know, any subsequent "grace" to salvation has become taboo. You can talk about giftings, but these are natural talents utilized for God. You can talk about healings, but these are through medical means. Etc. We seem to deny the power thereof. It has become an experiential doctrine to "whosoever believes" as far as I can tell, and I am more and more leaving it to that.

awestruckchild
Aug 18th 2014, 03:39 PM
Wouldn't progressive sanctification just mean - the continual renewing of your mind?

mailmandan
Aug 18th 2014, 03:42 PM
Wouldn't progressive sanctification just mean - the continual renewing of your mind?

It's certainly ongoing and not a one time event. ;)

watchinginawe
Aug 18th 2014, 03:47 PM
It's certainly ongoing and not a one time event. ;)

You disagree that salvation is an instantaneous work of sanctification? I don't think that is hard to show. Sanctification is a complex subject. I like the OP's outline.

awestruckchild
Aug 18th 2014, 03:53 PM
I think he was talking about salvation and sanctification being two separate things, with the sanctification being ongoing for us here.

And the op makes more sense out of it than I've ever heard thus far, because we (just plain people who haven't been to seminary or anything) just kind of scoff at the idea that we no longer sin by mistrust and unbelief at all because we can plainly see with the Holy Spirit's help that it just isn't true. The idea that we now never sin just doesn't fly with us for reasons that are obvious to us.

awestruckchild
Aug 18th 2014, 04:01 PM
And also, the op seems to agree with Paul when he says he doesn't do what he wants to do but does the exact opposite.

Noeb
Aug 18th 2014, 04:24 PM
What are your thoughts on sanctification?

1 Thessalonians 4:3 - For this is the will of God, even your sanctification.

My simple overview:

My spirit is sanctified instantaneously at the new birth.
My soul (mind, will and emotions) is sanctified progressively.
My body will be sanctified in the future.

1 Thes. 5:23

(I'm not looking for a debate on the difference between spirit and soul.)

How do you see the work of sanctification?I just say we are sanctified at the new birth. This is a spiritual position and declaration. From there we begin to grow into that one complete position and declaration. This is what we call the process, but the complete position and declaration never changes. In the end the complete position and declaration we started with is the same we end up with.


Wouldn't progressive sanctification just mean - the continual renewing of your mind?renew your mind in scripture (Romans 12) is aligning your mind with the truth of the gospel. You are dead to sin and are now alive for God's use. A sacrifice (dead) that is now alive- living sacrifice. Is it continual? Yes. Is it what people mean by progressive sanctification? I don't think so.

mailmandan
Aug 18th 2014, 06:10 PM
You disagree that salvation is an instantaneous work of sanctification? I don't think that is hard to show. Sanctification is a complex subject. I like the OP's outline.

I agree with the OP. :)


My spirit is sanctified instantaneously at the new birth.

We have been saved from the penalty of sin. We are sanctified "set apart" and justified instantaneously at the new birth.


My soul (mind, will and emotions) is sanctified progressively.

We are being saved from the power of sin. Progressive sanctification, which is ongoing.


My body will be sanctified in the future.

We will be saved from the presence of sin. Final sanctification or glorification.

Protective Angel
Aug 20th 2014, 10:34 PM
I think he was talking about salvation and sanctification being two separate things, with the sanctification being ongoing for us here.

And the op makes more sense out of it than I've ever heard thus far, because we (just plain people who haven't been to seminary or anything) just kind of scoff at the idea that we no longer sin by mistrust and unbelief at all because we can plainly see with the Holy Spirit's help that it just isn't true. The idea that we now never sin just doesn't fly with us for reasons that are obvious to us.


How does the following affect.


1 Pet 1:5 Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.
6 Wherein ye greatly rejoice, though now for a season, if need be, ye are in heaviness through manifold temptations:
7 That the trial of your faith, being much more precious than of gold that perisheth, though it be tried with fire, might be found unto praise and honour and glory at the appearing of Jesus Christ:
8 Whom having not seen, ye love; in whom, though now ye see him not, yet believing, ye rejoice with joy unspeakable and full of glory:
9 Receiving the end of your faith, even the salvation of your souls.

ChangedByHim
Aug 20th 2014, 11:27 PM
How does the following affect.


1 Pet 1:5 Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.
6 Wherein ye greatly rejoice, though now for a season, if need be, ye are in heaviness through manifold temptations:
7 That the trial of your faith, being much more precious than of gold that perisheth, though it be tried with fire, might be found unto praise and honour and glory at the appearing of Jesus Christ:
8 Whom having not seen, ye love; in whom, though now ye see him not, yet believing, ye rejoice with joy unspeakable and full of glory:
9 Receiving the end of your faith, even the salvation of your souls.
The final phase of our salvation is the redemption of our mortal bodies. It does not imply that we become "more saved" as we go.

Protective Angel
Aug 20th 2014, 11:39 PM
The final phase of our salvation is the redemption of our mortal bodies. It does not imply that we become "more saved" as we go.

I'm confused.

You refer to mortal bodies, but scripture says salvation to our souls. I think I see what you mean. The end of life (faith), even the completion (salvation) of our souls.

ChangedByHim
Aug 20th 2014, 11:42 PM
I'm confused.

You refer to mortal bodies, but scripture says salvation to our souls. I think I see what you mean. The end of life (faith), even the completion (salvation) of our souls.
Souls is often used for the total man, in Scripture. The point, once again, is that we do not become "more saved" as we progress. We may (and should) become more sanctified (set apart). We may earn more rewards for works done. But neither of these are increasing our salvation status.

Do you see it different, PA?

Protective Angel
Aug 21st 2014, 12:06 AM
Souls is often used for the total man, in Scripture. The point, once again, is that we do not become "more saved" as we progress. We may (and should) become more sanctified (set apart). We may earn more rewards for works done. But neither of these are increasing our salvation status.

Do you see it different, PA?

This is a word meaning problem on my part. I was using salvation in the place of sanctification.

percho
Aug 21st 2014, 12:37 AM
IMHO we are sanctified, that is our sanctification, is unto salvation. We have been elected and set apart, sanctified, unto salvation.

I do not believe it is a process of anything.


From Blue Letter Bible: Tools specific to 1Co 1:30
1Co 1:30
But of him are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption:
Tools specific to 1Th 4:3
1Th 4:3
For this is the will of God, even your sanctification, that ye should abstain from fornication:
Tools specific to 1Th 4:4
1Th 4:4
That every one of you should know how to possess his vessel in sanctification and honour;
Tools specific to 2Th 2:13
2Th 2:13
But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:
Tools specific to 1Pe 1:2
1Pe 1:2
Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.


How is it used in those five times you find the word in the KJV. As being set apart.

ChangedByHim
Aug 21st 2014, 12:52 AM
So percho, you believe that once you're saved that you're a finished product?

BroRog
Aug 21st 2014, 01:16 AM
What are your thoughts on sanctification?

1 Thessalonians 4:3 - For this is the will of God, even your sanctification.

My simple overview:

My spirit is sanctified instantaneously at the new birth.
My soul (mind, will and emotions) is sanctified progressively.
My body will be sanctified in the future.

1 Thes. 5:23

(I'm not looking for a debate on the difference between spirit and soul.)

How do you see the work of sanctification?I like your outline. The Bible uses the term "glorification" for our future "sanctification" if you will. I'm not picking nits, just hoping to better associate this with other Biblical passages. Good summary though.

If my understanding of the Bible is correct, and it might not be, I believe God is the agent of all three. Those whom he sanctifies with the new birth, he sanctifies the soul. And those whom he has sanctified the soul, he will sanctify the body.

Noeb
Aug 21st 2014, 01:27 AM
So percho, you believe that once you're saved that you're a finished product?

The point, once again, is that we do not become "more saved" as we progress.
I would ask, where do you see more sanctified? You correctly said, "It does not imply that we become "more saved" as we go."

Like I said in my first post we do not become more sanctified. We just grow in the given sanctification. Our sanctification does not change. We are as sanctified the day we are born again as we will be when we are glorified.

1Th 4:4 That every one of you should know how to possess his vessel in sanctification and honour;

2Ti 2:21 If a man therefore purge himself from these, he shall be a vessel unto honour, sanctified, and meet for the master's use, and prepared unto every good work.

Col 2:10 And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power:

Reynolds357
Aug 21st 2014, 02:00 AM
What are your thoughts on sanctification?

1 Thessalonians 4:3 - For this is the will of God, even your sanctification.

My simple overview:

My spirit is sanctified instantaneously at the new birth.
My soul (mind, will and emotions) is sanctified progressively.
My body will be sanctified in the future.

1 Thes. 5:23

(I'm not looking for a debate on the difference between spirit and soul.)

How do you see the work of sanctification?

I would say it more like the Spirit is Justified at Salvation. Sanctification is a never ending process of perfecting the flesh and soul.

percho
Aug 21st 2014, 04:59 AM
So percho, you believe that once you're saved that you're a finished product?

I believe we are set apart, sanctified, by the Holy Spirit, Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession. That being our ultimate salvation. The quickening of the soul with an incorruptible body.

And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, (sanctification) even we ourselves groan within ourselves, (within the soul) waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body. For we are saved by hope: but hope that is seen is not hope: for what a man seeth, why doth he yet hope for? But if we hope for that we see not, then do we with patience wait for it. Romans 8:23-25

For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God. When Christ, who is our life, shall appear, then shall ye also appear with him in glory. Col 3:3,4

Because of this we should: V5 Mortify therefore your members which are upon the earth; fornication, uncleanness, inordinate affection, evil concupiscence, and covetousness, which is idolatry:

Now let me ask do we do v5 in order to sanctify ourselves or because we are sanctified?

watchinginawe
Aug 21st 2014, 01:35 PM
Let's look at some examples.

God sanctifies us instantly at the new birth by His abundant grace:

Condemnation >>>>> Justification
Passed from death >>>>> Unto life
Alienated from God >>>>> Reconciled to God
Separation from God >>>>> Father and Son abide in us by Holy Ghost
Without hope in this world >>>>> Hope of Life Eternal
Old things passed away >>>>> Behold, all things are become new
Bondage >>>>> Liberty


There are many real ways the Bible expresses the above to us. This is done by God. Then comes our part. Sanctification as many have offered is "to set apart" or "to make holy" or "make clean". God sanctifies us in salvation, but in the doing so renders us useful to Him in this life. We were not useful to Him in our prior condition.

So then the "progressive sanctification" is really just the life of the one sanctified by God. Living a sanctified life is how our life is put to use in the Sanctified state that God has rendered us. We mature, we have trials, we bear fruit, we are pruned, we bear more fruit. If things work right, we are rendered more useful as things progress. We become deeply rooted.

1 Peter 1:13 Wherefore gird up the loins of your mind, be sober, and hope to the end for the grace that is to be brought unto you at the revelation of Jesus Christ; 14 As obedient children, not fashioning yourselves according to the former lusts in your ignorance: 15 But as he which hath called you is holy, so be ye holy in all manner of conversation; 16 Because it is written, Be ye holy; for I am holy.

The "Wherefore" in the above is in response to God having sanctified us as we have outlined above. Peter says, seeing that God has done this... and then offers His instruction. Of course this is not the only passage that offers this kind of "wherefore". But we see at least three things about our continuing in a sanctified life (to continue in a life different than our previous one) in the short passage.

First, because God has "called us" out of our ignorance and former lives, we should leave them behind. God has called us "out" of those. Note that Peter says we are to "not fashion ourselves according" to our prior desires and life's ambitions, there is some things we are going to leave off and leave behind, we have been called out of them. I remember when I was saved that the old things came knocking and inviting, they didn't leave me alone. But I consciously left them. Politely, but I left them. A little later in this epistle, Peter says this. It is very true I have found: 1 Peter 4:3 For the time past of our life may suffice us to have wrought the will of the Gentiles, when we walked in lasciviousness, lusts, excess of wine, revellings, banquetings, and abominable idolatries: 4 Wherein they think it strange that ye run not with them to the same excess of riot, speaking evil of you: The folks we used to run with are going to think we are strange! They are not going to attribute our change to something good either. At least not all of them.

Second, because God has "called us" into a life with Him, we are the Children of God! And so we also fashion ourselves "holy in all manner of conversation", where conversation is basically our interactions in this world, our life. We fashion our life according to the new. The new that abides in us is holy, so be ye holy. Children are children, and we grow up. My wife doesn't buy clothes for a fourteen year old for my nine year old boy. But that will come. We fashion ourselves as we know how, according to our maturity.

Third, because verse 13 says we better be prepared for a journey that will culminate at the end. We need to gird up the loins of our minds, wrapping up the loose thoughts and bringing every thought into captivity that might hinder our productiveness and fruit bearing. We remain sober, which means vigilant, on guard, looking forward to our hope, even the "lively hope" of verse 3. To me, this passage reminds me of how God would come to the prophets of the Old Testament when He had a mission for them, telling them to gird up their loins, and get themselves to thus and thus for whatever purpose He stated. God has a purpose for us and our new birth is the starting line and not the finish line.

Noeb
Aug 21st 2014, 01:50 PM
Nicely said watchinginawe!

ChangedByHim
Aug 21st 2014, 11:37 PM
I like your outline. The Bible uses the term "glorification" for our future "sanctification" if you will. I'm not picking nits, just hoping to better associate this with other Biblical passages. Good summary though.


Glorification works, of course. 1 Thes 5:23 mentions the sanctification of the body. I believe that to be one and the same as glorification.

ChangedByHim
Aug 21st 2014, 11:39 PM
I would ask, where do you see more sanctified? You correctly said, "It does not imply that we become "more saved" as we go."

Like I said in my first post we do not become more sanctified. We just grow in the given sanctification. Our sanctification does not change. We are as sanctified the day we are born again as we will be when we are glorified.

1Th 4:4 That every one of you should know how to possess his vessel in sanctification and honour;

2Ti 2:21 If a man therefore purge himself from these, he shall be a vessel unto honour, sanctified, and meet for the master's use, and prepared unto every good work.

Col 2:10 And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power:
You see things from only one perspective. I see renewing our minds as part of the sanctification process. That is a process, not instantaneous.

ChangedByHim
Aug 21st 2014, 11:41 PM
I believe we are set apart, sanctified, by the Holy Spirit, Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession. That being our ultimate salvation. The quickening of the soul with an incorruptible body.

And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, (sanctification) even we ourselves groan within ourselves, (within the soul) waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body. For we are saved by hope: but hope that is seen is not hope: for what a man seeth, why doth he yet hope for? But if we hope for that we see not, then do we with patience wait for it. Romans 8:23-25

For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God. When Christ, who is our life, shall appear, then shall ye also appear with him in glory. Col 3:3,4

Because of this we should: V5 Mortify therefore your members which are upon the earth; fornication, uncleanness, inordinate affection, evil concupiscence, and covetousness, which is idolatry:

None of that answers my direct question to you.



Now let me ask do we do v5 in order to sanctify ourselves or because we are sanctified?

Yes. We are sanctified and we are being sanctified. That is explained in the OP.

percho
Aug 21st 2014, 11:58 PM
So percho, you believe that once you're saved that you're a finished product?

I do not believe we will be a finished product until the return of Jesus.

I believe becaus we have been set apart we should walk in newness of life. I also believe through prayer and confession the Holy Spirit will assist us in that walk.

Noeb
Aug 22nd 2014, 12:34 AM
You see things from only one perspective. I see renewing our minds as part of the sanctification process. That is a process, not instantaneous.You have already acknowledged sanctification is indeed instantaneous. We would not be able to walk in him if we had not already been sanctified. Paul is telling them to step into their sanctified position and be useful to God in Romans 12:1- :idea:. This is as obvious as it can be. Seeing 'renew mind' is only in scripture this one time, the word transformed is the same as the instant transfiguration of Christ on the mount, and Paul is telling them to make an immediate change as opposed to changing slowly throughout their lives, your perspective is lacking while mine nails down every aspect of the plain intended meaning.

BroRog
Aug 22nd 2014, 04:50 AM
Glorification works, of course. 1 Thes 5:23 mentions the sanctification of the body. I believe that to be one and the same as glorification.Hmm. I never thought of it that way, but I can see what you mean. Good call. Thanks.

breadfirst
Aug 22nd 2014, 07:11 AM
It was interesting to go back to the Bible and ponder over this discussion. Sometimes I believe terminology can be mixed up but it's very clear that sanctification occurs now and it is an ongoing process. Salvation is a one time positional status also known as being justified before the Father. So like the thief on the cross who barely got few hours of life after he was saved entered paradise because he was justified instantly.

For the rest of us who have the opportunity to know and serve Christ a longer time frame than the thief; sanctification is essential in that it not only "sets us apart" from the "corrupting" sin in our flesh it also means "sets us apart" for His work because that brings honor (1 Thes 4:4 (https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=1+Thessalonians+4%3A4&version=NASB)). The two are closely intertwined.

Jesus sanctified Himself for this very specific reason (John 17:19 (https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=john+17%3A19&version=NASB)). This does NOT mean that He required cleansing rather He set himself apart so that we can be "sanctified" or "set apart" by the revealed word of God (truth) just like Christ was to bring honor to His Father.

I like the OP as it covers the basics. Last, 1 Thes 5:23 (https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=1+Thessalonians+5%3A23&version=NASB) summarizes the source of the sanctification which is God Himself.

ChangedByHim
Aug 22nd 2014, 03:04 PM
Seeing 'renew mind' is only in scripture this one time, the word transformed is the same as the instant transfiguration of Christ on the mount, and Paul is telling them to make an immediate change as opposed to changing slowly throughout their lives, your perspective is lacking while mine nails down every aspect of the plain intended meaning.

Eph 4:23 also speaks of being renewed in the spirit of our mind. So is twice good enough?

Noeb
Aug 22nd 2014, 03:24 PM
Eph 4:23 also speaks of being renewed in the spirit of our mind. So is twice good enough?Yes. It's not used for sanctification (transformed) but it is further validation. Means the same thing. Neither a life long process, both instant. Instant doesn't mean one time, and no one is sanctified in either passage. It is individuals walking in sanctification, which is part of salvation. You don't get any more sanctified than you do more saved.

ChangedByHim
Aug 22nd 2014, 03:45 PM
Yes. It's not used for sanctification (transformed) but it is further validation. Means the same thing. Neither a life long process, both instant. Instant doesn't mean one time, and no one is sanctified in either passage. It is individuals walking in sanctification, which is part of salvation. You don't get any more sanctified than you do more saved.

Why is Paul writing this to already completely sanctified Christians??

Now may the God of peace himself sanctify you completely, and may your whole spirit and soul and body be kept blameless at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. 1 Thes 5:23

Noeb
Aug 22nd 2014, 04:27 PM
for the same reasons he always did. That they walk in what Christ gave them. You don't think this means we are partially sanctified do ya?

ChangedByHim
Aug 22nd 2014, 07:37 PM
for the same reasons he always did. That they walk in what Christ gave them. You don't think this means we are partially sanctified do ya?

Look bro, it's just semantics and definitions. There's no practical difference in how we see things. I stated what I believe in the OP and nothing has changed for me.

There is a positional aspect of sanctification and a practical application thereof. Call things what you wish, but we still must walk the walk.

Noeb
Aug 22nd 2014, 08:26 PM
Amen bro
.

percho
Aug 22nd 2014, 10:50 PM
I also give amen to both and will say I pray that my walk will be better tomorrow than it was yesterday yet it is still a struggle.

ChangedByHim
Aug 23rd 2014, 07:39 PM
I also give amen to both and will say I pray that my walk will be better tomorrow than it was yesterday yet it is still a struggle.

We are OVERCOMERS percho! That means we've got to come over something...

breadfirst
Aug 24th 2014, 01:41 PM
And Romans 8:37 states "But in all these things we overwhelmingly conquer through Him who loved us."