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CFJ
Aug 28th 2014, 10:27 AM
Some say it is a gift, some say it is not. Some say there are different types of faith some say faith is just faith...

... what/who gives faith or where/why does faith originate?

mailmandan
Aug 28th 2014, 11:22 AM
Some say it is a gift, some say it is not. Some say there are different types of faith some say faith is just faith...

... what/who gives faith or where/why does faith originate?

Faith originates with God. If God did not draw us (John 6:44) and enable us (John 6:65) then none of us would come to saving faith in Christ, but we choose to have faith in Christ once drawn and enabled. I believe that salvation and not faith is "the gift of God" in Ephesians 2:8. Amplified Bible - For it is by free grace (God's unmerited favor) that you are saved (delivered from judgment and made partakers of Christ's salvation) through [your] faith. And this [salvation] is not of yourselves [of your own doing, it came not through your own striving], but it is the gift of God.

Romans 12:3 - For I say, through the grace given to me, to everyone who is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think, but to think soberly, as God has dealt to each one a measure of faith.

1 Corinthians 12:9 - to another faith by the same Spirit, to another gifts of healings by the same Spirit.

God has granted a differing measure of faith to His children, faith by the same Spirit is listed under spiritual gifts. I don't see this as saving faith that all Christians have in Christ, since Paul implies that some in the body have it and others don't. I see it as a special endowment of faith to accomplish certain tasks in ministry.

awestruckchild
Aug 28th 2014, 01:25 PM
Some say it is a gift, some say it is not. Some say there are different types of faith some say faith is just faith...

... what/who gives faith or where/why does faith originate?

I have never heard anyone say that faith is not a gift. Everything we have is a gift of God. This includes faith: the ability to trust and believe in things, people, ideologies, strength of armies, 401k's, idols, etc.

Even small babies have faith. If they did not have faith that their mothers wouldn't drop them, they would never stop howling and could never be pacified. Their minds would never develop in a healthy way. They would be crazy.

Every human has faith in different things. We all search for heroes that we can put our belief and trust in. We all search for feelings of security. We WANT to feel safe and secure.

All things that men put their faith in are delusions - except for one. Anything a man puts his faith in, other than God, will eventually disappoint him.

But man CAN'T put his faith in God unless and until God draws him and heals his blindness. I could no more put my faith in God than I could put it in the tooth fairy until He healed my blindness and I could see He existed.

And then, even after that, I still struggled to maintain that faith because everyone scoffs at me and tells me I take my faith in God too far. They tell me what a deluded fool I am if I think God will provide for me when I haven't saved any treasure on earth. Then I read again all Jesus told me and I read the Exodus again and I set my forehead against family, friends, the wisdom of the world, and I keep my faith in God. It isn't always easy to be constantly told what a fool I am - and sometimes even by other christians. But the freedom and peace I have gained in Him is much stronger than the derision of the entire world and even the derision of my own mind sometimes.

chisel
Aug 28th 2014, 01:57 PM
I am also not aware of anybody who denies that faith is a gift in a certain sense. The real difference lies, as far as I'm concerned with the nature of faith itself.
Some people perceive it to be a substance that God can dish out and allocate to people, like a vaccine or a serum.

Others believe that faith isn't a thing, but rather a response. Just like pride is a response that a father has when he sees his newborn baby, likewise faith is a response that people have when they countenance the revelation of God. I believe it is precisely for this reason that faith cannot be meritorious, because it isn't something substantive that comes from within, but rather a response because of what God did.

Those who believe that faith is a substance will generally also view it as meritorious, because they see faith as a thing of value.
Those who see faith as a response to goodness, will argue that the goodness that faith responds to is the meritorious thing, and not the faith.

So I too believe that faith is a gift in that God picked it, instead of some meritorious thing, to be the criteria for salvation. Not only that but God alone is the reason why faith is even possible, because for there to be a response (faith) there has to be a object to express that faith towards.

Aijalon
Aug 28th 2014, 02:44 PM
Faith comes from us, it's in our nature to believe in God. However, it's also in our nature to believe lies.

Without a strong influence from God to cultivate our faith and make it grow, it dies. On our own, we're dead to God, and alive to sin.

Let's look at it like this. If no one was knocking on the door of your heart, asking to be let inside, would you open to door to go looking for that person? No.

God knocks, pounds and beats on the door if he has to. He WILL GET IN THERE, he's put his mind to it.

So yeah, faith comes from us, but God is the one that put his spirit in us, renewed us, and grows us.

Paul was a preacher and teacher of the Gospel, just a messenger, he knew full well that God is the one that waters the seed and makes it grow.

petrobb
Aug 28th 2014, 08:31 PM
Jesus clearly taught two levels of faith in Him. The first believed in Him because they saw miracles. Their minds accepted that He was a prophet of God, or even the Messiah. But it was an outward faith. It was a faith about Jesus (see John 2.23-25; 6.14). It was a faith that wanted things from Jesus in return for their acceptance of Him as prophet or Messiah. They listened to what Jesus said and decided for themselves what they would obey. They know that He is. It is the kind of faith religionists have, whether JWs, Mormons, or Muslims. It is faith in an idea or a system of doctrine. Many professing Christians have this type of faith but have no root. They believe 'about' not 'into'

The second believe 'into' Him. Theirs is a faith which responds to Him as a person. It is saving faith. It is a faith that recognises that they must obey Him because He is their Lord and Master. It involves personal relationship. They know that He is a rewarder of those who diligently seek Him. They are committed to Him. Such faith can only be worked in them by the Holy Spirit (1 Peter 1.2)

mailmandan
Aug 28th 2014, 09:46 PM
I am also not aware of anybody who denies that faith is a gift in a certain sense.

I would agree that faith is a gift in a certain sense.


God alone is the reason why faith is even possible, because for there to be a response (faith) there has to be a object to express that faith towards.

Amen! Apart from God, there would be no grace or object to place faith in (Jesus Christ) as the all sufficient means of our salvation.

Noeb
Aug 28th 2014, 11:05 PM
Some say it is a gift, some say it is not. Some say there are different types of faith some say faith is just faith...

... what/who gives faith or where/why does faith originate?Faith is an ability God gave his creation.

percho
Aug 28th 2014, 11:58 PM
I believe faith is what God did through sending his Son into the world. God determined (before the foundation of the world) he would send his Son into the world to be obedient unto death, thus God also (before the foundation of the world) gave the promise of the hope of eternal life, for that Son, for the purpose of destroying the works of Satan the devil.

The Christ, Jesus of Nazareth, born of woman was obedient unto that death and God raised him from the dead, incorruptible and to die no more. The grace of God.

That is the grace through the faith by which man could be saved. Man's salvation is a gift from God.

CFJ
Aug 29th 2014, 08:08 AM
Interesting that all that have replied in this thread, views faith as a gift of some sort. How would you see faith in the following 5 verses/passages and where applicable, could you see faith therein?

God gave each a measure of faith?

For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.
(Rom 12:3)

Faith by the Spirit?

Now there are diversities of gifts, but the same Spirit.... To another faith by the same Spirit; to another the gifts of healing by the same Spirit;
(1Co 12:4 & 9)

A gift, is faith part of this?

For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
(Eph 2:8)

What does it mean, if/when Jesus is the author and finisher of our faith?

Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.
(Heb 12:2)

Could faith be a perfect gift?

Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father of lights, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning.
(Jas 1:17)

Boo
Aug 29th 2014, 08:17 AM
Initially, the faith that we begin our journey on is different from the faith that we end up living with.

The faith to come to Christ is small. It is that spark that says "I want to have the life that God chooses for me."

God nurtures that seed in many ways. For me, He proves the validity of that original faith every day in what God shows me, does for me, and grants to me. He gives me purpose and then empowers me to fulfill that purpose. He blesses me - and sometimes - it is the recognition that my life is blessed that grows my faith. Yes, in that way, my faith is a gift from God.

It is not a pill, not an injection, not a magic word. It is God involved in my life that grows my faith. The more I draw to Him, the stronger my faith. I know because He does. He does because I believe and trust.

It is difficult to explain that to someone who does not experience it.

mailmandan
Aug 29th 2014, 10:47 AM
Interesting that all that have replied in this thread, views faith as a gift of some sort. How would you see faith in the following 5 verses/passages and where applicable, could you see faith therein?

God gave each a measure of faith?

For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.
(Rom 12:3)


God has granted a differing measure of faith to His children. I see this as the correct proportion of supernatural endowment and ability that God gives each believer.


Faith by the Spirit?

Now there are diversities of gifts, but the same Spirit.... To another faith by the same Spirit; to another the gifts of healing by the same Spirit;
(1Co 12:4 & 9)


I don't see this as faith that all Christians have in Christ, since Paul implies that some in the body have it and others don't. I see it as a special endowment of faith to accomplish certain tasks in ministry.


A gift, is faith part of this?

For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
(Eph 2:8)


We are enabled by God's enabling power, which is His grace to come to faith in Christ. This grace is unmerited. We did nothing to earn it. The impulse to faith comes from God. He draws us in and enables us to place faith in Christ for salvation then we have to choose to place faith in Christ for salvation. If God did not draw us or enable us then NONE of us would come to saving faith in Christ. No one comes to Me unless the Father draws him (John 6:44). This implies that no human being on his own, has the moral or spiritual ability to come to Christ unless the Father draws him, that is, gives him the desire and inclination to come and the ability to trust exclusively in Christ for salvation. In that sense, faith is in some way a gift, but I believe the gift of God here in Ephesians 2:8 is the salvation that is implied by the word "saved." "For by grace you have been saved through faith; and this not of yourselves, it [the salvation] is the gift of God. Some view all of it "saved by grace through faith" as the gift of God. Saving faith in Christ is not a direct gift from God given to some but not others unconditionally.


What does it mean, if/when Jesus is the author and finisher of our faith?

Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.
(Heb 12:2)


Jesus is the author, "originator or creator." The Greek word translated "author" in Hebrews 12:2 can also mean "captain" or "chief leader". Jesus Christ is the beginner of faith, the leader, and the reason behind it all. He is the author or efficient cause of it. The Greek word translated "perfecter" in Hebrews 12:2 appears only this one time in the New Testament. It means literally "completer" or "finisher" and speaks of bringing something to it's conclusion. Putting the two words together, we see that Jesus, both creates and sustains our faith. Faith originates with God, so once again, in that sense, it's a gift.


Could faith be a perfect gift?

Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father of lights, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning.
(Jas 1:17)


Spiritual gifts are from above. 1 Corinthians 12:9 - to another faith by the same Spirit.. I would not exclude that from good and perfect gift.

Christinme
Aug 29th 2014, 10:54 AM
From the heart.

awestruckchild
Aug 29th 2014, 11:21 PM
Interesting that all that have replied in this thread, views faith as a gift of some sort. How would you see faith in the following 5 verses/passages and where applicable, could you see faith therein?

God gave each a measure of faith?

For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.
(Rom 12:3)

Faith by the Spirit?

Now there are diversities of gifts, but the same Spirit.... To another faith by the same Spirit; to another the gifts of healing by the same Spirit;
(1Co 12:4 & 9)

A gift, is faith part of this?

For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
(Eph 2:8)

What does it mean, if/when Jesus is the author and finisher of our faith?

Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.
(Heb 12:2)

Could faith be a perfect gift?

Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father of lights, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning.
(Jas 1:17)

Hello again CFJ!
The last verse you gave here, the Father of lights, reminds me of when John speaks of the light that lights every man coming into the world. :) That makes Him the Author of our faith. It makes me want to go read James when I curl up in bed tonight.:)

percho
Aug 30th 2014, 07:33 PM
I think, Christ in you the hope of glory, brings within you, the faith of Christ, who has been glorified by the Father. A couple of verses relative to this thought.

Who by him do believe in God, that raised him up from the dead, and gave him glory; that your faith and hope might be in God. 1 Peter 1:21
And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together. (with him?) Romans 8:17

Concerning that hope of glory. Hope?

For we are saved by hope: but hope that is seen is not hope: for what a man seeth, why doth he yet hope for? But if we hope for that we see not, then do we with patience wait for it. Romans 8:24,25

What does this saved by hope concern? Verse 23 And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body.

Without the obedience of faith, Jesus becoming obedient unto death even the death of the cross there would be no glory by the resurrection of the dead.

EarlyCall
Aug 31st 2014, 02:25 PM
Faith comes from God by our knowing Him. Hebrews 11:1 says, Now faith is confidence in what we hope for and assurance about what we do not see.

Ah, so our faith must be in a something, and that something is what we hope for. Therefore our faith, which is really just another word for confidence, is in what we hope for. What we hope for is what we have faith in.

Cool, I think I will hope for a million dollars. Now that I know what I hope for, I can have faith, or confidence in it. This means I can also have the assurance in what I hope for, because what I hope for is what I have faith in.

Or maybe not.

I dunno, but it seems really simple to me. Faith isn't in us and it isn't a thing and it isn't about something, but rather faith is in God alone and we can only have that faith in Him because of who He is. Of course who He is means nothing to us unless we know Him. And the more we know Him, the more we can have faith in Him.

God isn't the only thing we have faith in. Do we go to work thinking, I can't have faith that my company will pay me next pay day? Well, I trust they will, I certainly plan on it, and therefore to some degree I hope they will pay me, and I have a pretty strong assurance they will pay me.

So where is that faith? In us? No, that faith is in the company we work for. How did we come by that faith? By working for them and seeing them pay us each payday over a period of time. And with time, we came to know the company better, we came to trust them more and our faith in the company paying us on time and as scheduled grew until our faith in that became as natural as other things in our lives.

Perhaps not the greatest analogy, but I think it may make my point. I see faith as something we have because we come to know the One whom we have faith in.

Maybe I'm wrong. I'm not a theologian, but I need to break things down so they are simple and easy for me to understand... and hope I get it right.

Noeb
Aug 31st 2014, 03:45 PM
A gift, is faith part of this?

For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
(Eph 2:8)

No. "For"......referring to what was just said
"by grace"
refers to verse 5 "Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;)"

"through faith"
adding to verse 5

"and that"
Greek neuter, not feminine, refers to the act of salvation by grace on the condition of our faith.
Salvation is a gift and of God and not of men
Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;)
God gave His Son
when we were yet without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly, etc.
it is God that shows mercy, for salvation, not men




What does it mean, if/when Jesus is the author and finisher of our faith?

Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.
(Heb 12:2)

Greek "of the faith" -Christianity
Shown by what follows -death, burial, resurrection, ascension
"who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God."

percho
Aug 31st 2014, 05:37 PM
Does the noun faith and or the faith always have the meaning used in Hebrews 11:1?

If yes please explain the meaning of, "the faith," in Gal 3:23 And before the coming of the faith, (the substance of things hoped for the evidence of things not seen) and in Gal 3:25 and the faith (the substance of things hoped for the evidence of things not seen) having come, Before coming? After having come? Just what was hoped for?

The promise of God, made before the foundation of the world was, the hope of eternal life.

Who and who only of man born of woman has inherited the promised hope?

CFJ
Sep 2nd 2014, 08:39 AM
No. "For"......referring to what was just said
"by grace"
refers to verse 5 "Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;)"

"through faith"
adding to verse 5

"and that"
Greek neuter, not feminine, refers to the act of salvation by grace on the condition of our faith.
Salvation is a gift and of God and not of men
Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;)
God gave His Son
when we were yet without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly, etc.
it is God that shows mercy, for salvation, not men




Hi Noeb,

In the thread, 'Can the Gift of Grace be forfeited?' post #449 you've said the following,


The gift here is salvation. The innate gift of faith is used to receive the gift of salvation.

You agree that faith is a gift, right? Is it a real gift or as some say, a gift in a certain sense only? It could either be a gift as an absolute or not a gift at all, as I believe it should be. Is the innate gift of faith a gift from God too? If it is, how can it not be applicable to Efe 2:8? It is not of yourself as Efe 2:8 says, would this includes something innate out of the self or out of a gift given by God? How can the gift of salvation be separate from the gift of faith, if both are from God and if both needs to be present to be saved??

What is given in the next passage?

And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father.
(Joh 6:65)

How can anyone come unto Christ, without faith and more so, without given faith?

Also, can we restrict God giving gifts as He wishes? Can faith really be only an innate gift and nothing else? I don't think so...

percho
Sep 2nd 2014, 12:32 PM
Hi Noeb,

In the thread, 'Can the Gift of Grace be forfeited?' post #449 you've said the following,



You agree that faith is a gift, right? Is it a real gift or as some say, a gift in a certain sense only? It could either a gift as an absolute or not a gift at all, as I believe it should be. Is the innate gift of faith a gift from God too? If it is, how can it not be applicable to Efe 2:8? It is not of yourself as Efe 2:8 says, would this includes something innate out of the self or out of a gift given by God? How can the gift of salvation be separate from the gift of faith, if both are from God and if both needs to be present to be saved??

What is given in the next passage?

And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father.
(Joh 6:65)

How can anyone come unto Christ, without faith and more so, without given faith?

Also, can we restrict God giving gifts as He wishes? Can faith really be only an innate gift and nothing else? I don't think so...

That can also be stated this way.

which is Christ in you, the hope of glory: Col 1:27 Now Christ by being the firstborn from the dead V18 has become the faith of God, the substance of things hoped for the evidence of things not seen. Because Jesus has received the promised hope, eternal life and he received of the Father the promise of the Holy Spirit Acts 2:33 which he shed on us, we having Christ in us have the hope of eternal life. Titus 3:7 That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.

Titus 3:5 is what Jesus received by which we could be saved.

Noeb
Sep 2nd 2014, 11:52 PM
Hi Noeb,Hi CFJ!


In the thread, 'Can the Gift of Grace be forfeited?' post #449 you've said the following,

You agree that faith is a gift, right?Yes.



Is it a real gift or as some say, a gift in a certain sense only?I don't know what this means.



It could either be a gift as an absolute or not a gift at all, as I believe it should be.I really don't know what you are talking about -real, absolute, certain sense gift?



Is the innate gift of faith a gift from God too?Well, I said, "The innate gift of faith is used to receive the gift of salvation"



If it is, how can it not be applicable to Efe 2:8?I believe that's explained.

""For"......referring to what was just said
"by grace"
refers to verse 5 "Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved"

"and that"
Greek neuter, not feminine, refers to the act of salvation by grace on the condition of our faith."

It is "by grace" "Even when we were dead in sins" "that" we were saved and it was obtained by the means, "through" faith.



It is not of yourself as Efe 2:8 says.....that we were given grace and salvation



would this includes something innate out of the self or out of a gift given by God?Both, but don't throw self out there as if evil, since we are created in his image with spirit from him and are a living soul. We were created to know and worship him. We are given 'talents' to use or lose. Faith, the ability to believe God, is given us to use not bury or hide. Jesus didn't run around asking people if the Father had given them faith. Rather he wondered why they doubted, always expecting faith.



How can the gift of salvation be separate from the gift of faith,How can they be the same?



if both are from God and if both needs to be present to be saved??The ability to believe God is originally present in every human, so it's a given it could present, they just need salvation presented to them for the possibility of both being present.



What is given in the next passage?

And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father.
(Joh 6:65)the ability to come to Jesus, and as Jesus said, that is determined by whether or not one hears and learns of the Father, and all are taught of God -Joh 6:45.



Can faith really be only an innate gift and nothing else? I don't think so...No one said that, so why do you ask? We already know a gift of the Spirit is faith also, but that is for believers for ministry.

randy marshall
Sep 3rd 2014, 01:19 PM
Some say it is a gift, some say it is not. Some say there are different types of faith some say faith is just faith...

... what/who gives faith or where/why does faith originate?
Faith comes from God.

CFJ
Sep 3rd 2014, 02:02 PM
Faith comes from God.

To have faith is to have life and more so, spiritual life. There is no other source for life than God...

What is it like to be spiritually dead? It can only be due to no faith in God... No-one can have faith in God if you are not born again.

Glorious
Sep 4th 2014, 02:52 PM
Re: Where does faith comes from?


Faith comes by hearing the Word of God through the Spirit. It is a gift of God (see Rom. 10:17). The Lord Jesus Christ authors and finishes (completes) faith.

Therefore, faith is made of the words of God that frame and begin a world/age/generation/era of things of God, bearing both the promise of such things and being the very power by which they come pass (See Hebrews 11:3).

The measure of faith received by every man is that measure of the word of God promising all or certain things of God (see Romans 12:3).


Believe is a work authored and done by the man. It is not a gift, but a work of man; the means by which spiritual things are (or can be) received (see John 6:29).




Interesting that all that have replied in this thread, views faith as a gift of some sort. How would you see faith in the following 5 verses/passages and where applicable, could you see faith therein?

God gave each a measure of faith?

For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.
(Rom 12:3)


The measure of promise bearing words of God I receive can be greater or lesser than that of another believer; the measure of my faith can be greater or lesser than that of another believer.




Faith by the Spirit?

Now there are diversities of gifts, but the same Spirit.... To another faith by the same Spirit; to another the gifts of healing by the same Spirit;
(1Co 12:4 & 9)


Yes, faith is a gift. Even the gifts of healing root in righteousness that faith (by the Spirit) gives; there is healing in the wings of all forms righteousness imputed by the faith of God.




A gift, is faith part of this?

For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
(Eph 2:8)


Yes! Both faith and grace are gifts from God. While faith comes first in order to frame/begin the world/era, grace comes second in order to save (help, preserve, remember covenant and restore heritages earlier made desolate).




What does it mean, if/when Jesus is the author and finisher of our faith?

Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.
(Heb 12:2)


In the Spirit of Joy, Jesus finishes (completes) every promise of faith and when finished (completed) is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.




Could faith be a perfect gift?

Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father of lights, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning.
(Jas 1:17)


Faith that is gift of the Spirit is yet perfect. There is the perfect (fulness of) faith of God. It comes with the kingdom of Heaven and brings about the hope of glory. In its perfection, faith NOW becomes "the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen (see Hebrews 11:1)".

percho
Sep 4th 2014, 05:53 PM
Re: Where does faith comes from?


Faith comes by hearing the Word of God through the Spirit. It is a gift of God (see Rom. 10:17). The Lord Jesus Christ authors and finishes (completes) faith.

Therefore, faith is made of the words of God that frame and begin a world/age/generation/era of things of God, bearing both the promise of such things and being the very power by which they come pass (See Hebrews 11:3).

The measure of faith received by every man is that measure of the word of God promising all or certain things of God (see Romans 12:3).


Believe is a work authored and done by the man. It is not a gift, but a work of man; the means by which spiritual things are (or can be) received (see John 6:29).





The measure of promise bearing words of God I receive can be greater or lesser than that of another believer; the measure of my faith can be greater or lesser than that of another believer.





Yes, faith is a gift. Even the gifts of healing root in righteousness that faith (by the Spirit) gives; there is healing in the wings of all forms righteousness imputed by the faith of God.





Yes! Both faith and grace are gifts from God. While faith comes first in order to frame/begin the world/era, grace comes second in order to save (help, preserve, remember covenant and restore heritages earlier made desolate).





In the Spirit of Joy, Jesus finishes (completes) every promise of faith and when finished (completed) is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.





Faith that is gift of the Spirit is yet perfect. There is the perfect (fulness of) faith of God. It comes with the kingdom of Heaven and brings about the hope of glory. In its perfection, faith NOW becomes "the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen (see Hebrews 11:1)".

Best post I have seen.

In other words, the raised from the dead, Jesus, who has received from the Father the promise of the Holy Spirit is our faith which now gives us the hope of eternal life through the shedding of the Holy Spirit upon us. See Titus 3:6,7

2 Tim 1:10 Darby; but has been made manifest now by the appearing of our Saviour Jesus Christ, who has annulled death, and brought to light life and incorruptibility by the glad tidings;


YLT Hebrews 12:2 looking to the author and perfecter of (*) faith -- Jesus, who, over-against the joy set before him -- did endure a cross, shame having despised, on the right hand also of the throne of God did sit down; Brought to light, not actually to have given. In other words we are heirs thereof not yet inheritors.


(*) the, author and finisher of the faith. When and how? By dying on the cross and being raised from the dead unto glory.

CFJ
Sep 25th 2014, 10:03 AM
God work in mysterious ways, is this the reason Paul said...?, 'They must have clear consciences about possessing the mystery of the Christian faith.' (1Ti 3:9)

Is faith God at work, we just need to discover it or is it man at work or is it both and can we solve this mystery? Where does faith comes from (?), is the question in this thread...

Scooby_Snacks
Sep 25th 2014, 11:17 AM
God work in mysterious ways, is this the reason Paul said...?, 'They must have clear consciences about possessing the mystery of the Christian faith.' (1Ti 3:9)

Is faith God at work, we just need to discover it or is it man at work or is it both and can we solve this mystery? Where does faith comes from (?), is the question in this thread...

I have always connected the origin of my Faith in Christ to God.
Everyone has different experiences, and that is what my experience has lead me to believe, but also, If Faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the Word of God, then Faith originates from God.
His Word does not return void, it does what He purposes it to do.
His Word, which is spiritual can harden hearts, and it can break up the stoney ground of others...and more...

Faith is more than just belief though.
God may have given men the ability to believe or not believe in things being true or real, but having confidence comes by something tested through experience.
If I apply experiences to chance or myself, I may be missing out on actually seeing God's Sovereign hand.
I experienced somethings that gave Faith this dimension, more than mere belief---compelling me to take action.

To me Faith is a confident active belief and hope and I would not have Faith in Christ if it were not for Him. (The I Am)