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Gerhard Ebersoehn
Sep 3rd 2017, 07:53 AM
The Bible never uses the words 'full moon' or even concept per se.

Longsufferer
Sep 3rd 2017, 09:51 AM
"the new moon" (Colossians 2:16) which by itself plainly tells us that there was a full moon prior to it becoming new, which is indeed a concept per se.

TheDivineWatermark
Sep 3rd 2017, 12:09 PM
Psalm 81:3 says (I'll quote the kjv, but see the links),

"Blow up the trumpet in the new moon, in the time appointed [H3677], on our solemn feast day."

http://biblehub.com/psalms/81-3.htm
[list of several versions of Ps81:3 - some use "full moon" here (at the bold [H3677])]

http://biblehub.com/hebrew/3677.htm [H3677 - bakkseh / hakkse - its two usages - Prov7:20 being the other]

http://biblehub.com/text/psalms/81-3.htm [hold cursor over H3677 - see pop-up words]

Gerhard Ebersoehn
Sep 3rd 2017, 02:06 PM
"the new moon" (Colossians 2:16) which by itself plainly tells us that there was a full moon prior to it becoming new, which is indeed a concept per se.

"Don't you let yourselves be judged by anyone in regard to your eating and drinking of Feast, either of month's or of Sabbaths', Christ being the Substance, which things are but the shadow of what imminently must come for you holding to the Head, the Body growing with the growth of God Christ the Nourishment ministered."

Obviously the moon in this text, besides not being called 'full moon' but 'month's' from 'new' plus 'moon's', cannot be the 'full moon per se', "Christ being the Substance of (your / believers') eating and drinking" spiritually as by faith feasting on Christ, and not with food and drink of (unbelievers') feast at 'full moon per se'.

Gerhard Ebersoehn
Sep 3rd 2017, 02:15 PM
Psalm 81:3 says (I'll quote the kjv, but see the links),

"Blow up the trumpet in the new moon, in the time appointed [H3677], on our solemn feast day."

http://biblehub.com/psalms/81-3.htm
[list of several versions of Ps81:3 - some use "full moon" here (at the bold [H3677])]

http://biblehub.com/hebrew/3677.htm [H3677 - bakkseh / hakkse - its two usages - Prov7:20 being the other]

http://biblehub.com/text/psalms/81-3.htm [hold cursor over H3677 - see pop-up words]

Re:
'list of several versions of Ps81:3 - some use "full moon" here'

Please supply us with the following information with regard to these 'versions' that 'use "full moon" in Psalm 81:3,

1) Their number and date;
2) Their 'translators'.

Thanks

TheDivineWatermark
Sep 3rd 2017, 05:26 PM
Re:
'list of several versions of Ps81:3 - some use "full moon" here'

Please supply us with the following information with regard to these 'versions' that 'use "full moon" in Psalm 81:3,

1) Their number and date;
2) Their 'translators'.

Thanks

I'm sorry, I don't have time. I did provide a link to the versions, some of which are listed there (which can be researched further, if you choose).

However, note this point. The last phrase of Ps81:3 (following the bold H3677 phrase) says, "on our solemn feast day"... and the word for "solemn feast" is "H2282 - ḥaggnū / chag" (from "chagag"), used of the pilgrim feasts... two of which begin on the 15th (of the Hebrew month), i.e. the full moon (Unleavened Bread and Tabernacles), for example. They knew what time to "hold" these (and other various feasts and assemblies/gatherings and tasks), based on moon timing. [new moon... full moon... at the appointed time(s)... etc...]

http://biblehub.com/text/psalms/81-3.htm [see H2282 - ḥaggnū / chag ]



[Lev23:2 "Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, Concerning the feasts of the Lord, which ye [Israel] shall proclaim to be holy convocations, even these are my feasts." (italics added by kjv translators; bracket, bold and underline mine :) ), with "H2282 - chag / hag" being used in verses 6,34,39,41; What we, the Church, "proclaim" is found in 1Cor11:26 "ye do shew/proclaim the Lord's DEATH till He come" (that is, come for us)]

Gerhard Ebersoehn
Sep 3rd 2017, 06:32 PM
I'm sorry, I don't have time. I did provide a link to the versions, some of which are listed there (which can be researched further, if you choose).

However, note this point. The last phrase of Ps81:3 (following the bold H3677 phrase) says, "on our solemn feast day"... and the word for "solemn feast" is "H2282 - ḥaggnū / chag" (from "chagag"), used of the pilgrim feasts... two of which begin on the 15th (of the Hebrew month), i.e. the full moon (Unleavened Bread and Tabernacles), for example. They knew what time to "hold" these (and other various feasts and assemblies/gatherings and tasks), based on moon timing. [new moon... full moon... at the appointed time(s)... etc...]

http://biblehub.com/text/psalms/81-3.htm [see H2282 - ḥaggnū / chag ]



[Lev23:2 "Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, Concerning the feasts of the Lord, which ye [Israel] shall proclaim to be holy convocations, even these are my feasts." (italics added by kjv translators; bracket, bold and underline mine :) ), with "H2282 - chag / hag" being used in verses 6,34,39,41; What we, the Church, "proclaim" is found in 1Cor11:26 "ye do shew/proclaim the Lord's DEATH till He come" (that is, come for us)]

The Bible does not start with the full moon, but with the new moon, and by implication determines the full moon from the new moon’s occurrence and not vice versa. Psalm 81:3 does not speak of the full moon; it speaks of the new moon.

Here is the Jewish Online Bible with commentary.
‘Psalms 81:4. “Sound the shofar on the New Moon, on the appointed time for the day of our festival.”
Commentary:
on the New Moon: When the moon renews itself.
on the appointed time: The appointed day for it, and so (Prov. 7:20): “on the appointed day…) he will come home”; to the appointed time that had been fixed.
and I shall fill it: According to whatever you ask I will fill.’

The rabbi commentator speaks of the _NEW_ moon.
... and ...
... a bag of money is not the moon.
By the way, the "goodman took a bag of money and is gone a long journey. The bag had been full. The chances are the goodman would return with an empty bag the story sounds to me ....

Proverbs 7
“19 My husband is not at home. He parted on a long journey. He took a bag of money [‘keseph’ 112 times; “silver” 286 times] with him”—, when the moon – like the man’s bag – was like a “bag of silver”, ‘full’ or ‘filled’.
“He will come home the very day when his silver will be FINISHED at the dark or new moon” [‘kesehg’].
These three words — ‘keseh’ in Psalm 81:3 , and ‘kesehg’ and ‘keseph’ in Proverbs 7:20 — are sounding much the same, but they by “a far journey”, are “apart” and opposite.
‘Keseh’ in Proverbs 7:20 as well as in Psalm 81:3 means the NEW moon and NOT the full moon, no matter WHAT the Christian Judaists might have to say.

The Hebrew word in Ps 81:3, ‘kese’ does not stand for ‘full moon’. ‘TRANSLITERATED BHS HEBREW OLD TESTAMENT 2001’.
v3. Tiq` baHdeš špr BaK Ks lym HaGGn
v4. K cHq lyiSrl h mišP† llh ya`qb
v5. `dt Bhsp Sm Bct `al-erec micryim Spat l-yda`T ešm`
(BHT database Copyright 2001 by Matthew Anstey)

Now look at this fraudulent ‘copying’…
‘From the _New_ King James Version:
Psalm 81:3 Blow the trumpet at the time of the New Moon, at the full moon, on our solemn feast day.
4 For this is a statute for Israel, A law of the God of Jacob. 5 This He established in Joseph as a testimony, When He went throughout the land of Egypt, Where I heard a language I did not understand.’

My 1611 KJV reads, “Blow up the trumpet in the new moon, in the time appointed, on our solemn feast.”

TheDivineWatermark
Sep 3rd 2017, 07:13 PM
The Bible does not start with the full moon, but with the new moon, and by implication determines the full moon from the new moon’s occurrence and not vice versa. Psalm 81:3 does not speak of the full moon; it speaks of the new moon.

Here is the Jewish Online Bible with commentary.
‘Psalms 81:4. “Sound the shofar on the New Moon, on the appointed time for the day of our festival.”
Commentary:
on the New Moon: When the moon renews itself.
on the appointed time: The appointed day for it, and so (Prov. 7:20): “on the appointed day…) he will come home”; to the appointed time that had been fixed.
and I shall fill it: According to whatever you ask I will fill.’

The rabbi commentator speaks of the _NEW_ moon.
... and ...
... a bag of money is not the moon.
By the way, the "goodman took a bag of money and is gone a long journey. The bag had been full. The chances are the goodman would return with an empty bag the story sounds to me ....

Proverbs 7
“19 My husband is not at home. He parted on a long journey. He took a bag of money [‘keseph’ 112 times; “silver” 286 times] with him”—, when the moon – like the man’s bag – was like a “bag of silver”, ‘full’ or ‘filled’.
“He will come home the very day when his silver will be FINISHED at the dark or new moon” [‘kesehg’].
These three words — ‘keseh’ in Psalm 81:3 , and ‘kesehg’ and ‘keseph’ in Proverbs 7:20 — are sounding much the same, but they by “a far journey”, are “apart” and opposite.
‘Keseh’ in Proverbs 7:20 as well as in Psalm 81:3 means the NEW moon and NOT the full moon, no matter WHAT the Christian Judaists might have to say.

The Hebrew word in Ps 81:3, ‘kese’ does not stand for ‘full moon’. ‘TRANSLITERATED BHS HEBREW OLD TESTAMENT 2001’.
v3. Tiq` baHdeš špr BaK Ks lym HaGGn
v4. K cHq lyiSrl h mišP† llh ya`qb
v5. `dt Bhsp Sm Bct `al-erec micryim Spat l-yda`T ešm`
(BHT database Copyright 2001 by Matthew Anstey)

Now look at this fraudulent ‘copying’…
‘From the New King James Version:
Psalm 81:3 Blow the trumpet at the time of the New Moon, At the full moon, on our solemn feast day.
4 For this is a statute for Israel, A law of the God of Jacob.
5 This He established in Joseph as a testimony, When He went throughout the land of Egypt, Where I heard a language I did not understand.’

My 1611 KJV reads, “Blow up the trumpet in the new moon, in the time appointed, on our solemn feast.”

I'm not sure I can find a verse which states that the new moon feast (feast of Trumpets) is ever called a "chag / hag [H2282]," yet Unleavened Bread (on the 15th/full moon), feast of Weeks, and then Tabernacles (on the 15th/full moon) ARE called "chag / hag [H2282]": http://biblehub.com/text/2_chronicles/8-13.htm (for example, these three).

Can you find one (where H2282 is used of the new moon and/or [feast of] Trumpets), maybe?

http://biblehub.com/hebrew/strongs_2282.htm [62 occurrences here]


Ps81:3 "on our solemn feast [H2282 - chag / hag] day"



["at the new" "at the full" http://biblehub.com/text/psalms/81-3.htm ]


Here is the commentary section of this verse (there are more listed at the top, in links): http://biblehub.com/commentaries/psalms/81-3.htm

birdy
Sep 4th 2017, 09:16 AM
The Bible never uses the words 'full moon' or even concept per se.

The sun is a picture of Christ in the Bible. It is the greater light to rule the day, just as Christ is the greater light and as long as he is with us it is called day. The sun runs its course as a bridegroom, meaning as Christ. The moon, however, is a picture of the law (the Bible). It is the Lesser Light to rule the night. The moon is only a reflection of the sun. It does not have its own light, just as the law of God is only a shadow of the real Christ. The Bible speaks of the moon and its ordinances (Jer 31:35). The term 'ordinances' is used interchangeably with the law of God (see Psalm 119, for example). Matthew 24:29 speaks of the sun being darkened and this is a time when Christ is withdrawn from the congregations, such that the people fail to hear Christ in a saving way. The moon also does not give her light at that time meaning the law of God is not available to lead them either. Conversely, when the moon is bright and full, it is a picture of the law of God being available to point people to Christ. I don't know much about whether the full moon is referenced in the Bible much, which is your question, but I think knowing what the moon is a picture of in the Bible helps alot.

Gerhard Ebersoehn
Sep 4th 2017, 11:59 AM
No one could come up with an instance of mention of the 'full moon' in the Bible. That's what I expected; it does not exist in the Bible anywhere. Implication (in the case of the passover), yes, but no direct reference to or derivation from, or, mention, of 'full moon'.

Thanks.

BrianW
Sep 4th 2017, 02:19 PM
I'm curious what the significance is one way or the other? In other words, why would it matter if the words "full moon" are used or not?
Why do some claim the new moon and full moon mean the same thing when, to my understanding, they definitely do not.

TheDivineWatermark
Sep 4th 2017, 03:01 PM
Why do some claim the new moon and full moon mean the same thing when, to my understanding, they definitely do not.

That's what I've wondered. When some read the following verse,

"Blow up the trumpet in the new moon, in the time appointed [H3677], on our solemn feast [H2282] day"

they see the whole sentence as referring to one day [only] in particular, they see this verse as referring to feast of Trumpets [on the new moon/1st of the month].

Yet I'm doubtful that any of the passages where H2282 ['solemn feast'] is used elsewhere, ever refer to feast of Trumpets [new moon], but is used of the feasts held at the 15th of the month (Unleavened Bread and Tabernacles, the 7-day feasts) [full moon/15th].

So it seems that one would either view this verse as referring to:

--events on a singular day (the new moon only / possibly or likely feast of Trumpets [tho I don't see the evidence of this yet, that this verse refers to one day only])

--events on two separate days (the new moon [mentioned first], AND then also the 'solemn feast day' [which could be Unleavened Bread (i.e. sometimes collectively called 'Passover') or Tabernacles; the 7-day feasts which start on the 15th/full moon]... I must add that Psalm 81:4-5 makes it sound like the context is referring to 'UB/Passover')


I can't say I'm 100% sure though.

Numbers 10:10 uses the word for 'silver trumpets' [and also a different word for 'solemn feasts' or I should say 'solemn days'], whereas Psalm 81:3, we are discussing, uses the word for 'rams horns'. Interesting things to think about, anyway. :)


[Num10:10 - "Also in the day of your gladness, and in your solemn days [H4150], and in the beginnings of your months [H7218 H2320], ye shall blow with the trumpets [H8628 H2689] over your burnt offerings, and over the sacrifices of your peace offerings; that they may be to you for a memorial before your God: I am the Lord your God."]

Cool, Psalm 98 uses both the word for 'rams horn' [H7782; shofar] and the word for 'silver trumpets' [H2689; one entry says: ' especially for use by priests'].


[edited this post, in some places]

Gerhard Ebersoehn
Sep 4th 2017, 07:16 PM
... Psalm 98 uses both the word for 'rams horn' [H7782; shofar] and the word for 'silver trumpets' [H2689; one entry says: ' especially for use by priests'].

What is the Hebrew word given at 'H2689', also 'shofar'? No, 'chatsotserah'-'cornet' KJ; just "trumpet" 28 times. "Silver" is a word wrongly supplied. The trumpet in those days was a bit like what nowadays is called a monotonous 'vuvuzela' people blow at soccer matches.

In Judges 'yobel'-'ram's horn'/'trumpet'. There is no Hebrew word for 'horn' near sounding like 'yobel'. A 'ram' is 'ayil', also not sounding like 'yobel' except for the 'y'. Therefore both 'shofar' and 'chatsotserah' appears to be specific words for the same thing, a single tone 'bugle' most probably made of ram's horn.

That the trumpet was blown or that a specific trumpet was used at the 'new', moon, doesn't mean a thing that the full moon instead of the new moon was actually meant. It's not only senseless; it's unnecessary and incorrect. I say it is dishonest and no translation but false and intentional misleading trusting Christians.

keck553
Sep 4th 2017, 07:18 PM
Apparently the full moon has no significance in Scripture.

Cyberseeker
Sep 4th 2017, 07:26 PM
The Bible never uses the words 'full moon' or even concept per se.

Do you realise that full moon occurred every Passover? For example, the moon was at maximum lunation at 9.36 pm on the night Jesus was betrayed. He and his disciples would have been sitting around the table after their meal during full moon.

Gerhard Ebersoehn
Sep 4th 2017, 07:33 PM
I can't say I'm 100% sure though.

Numbers 10:10 uses the word for 'silver trumpets' [and also a different word for 'solemn feasts' or I should say 'solemn days'] :)

Numbers 10:2 :)

TheDivineWatermark
Sep 4th 2017, 08:28 PM
What is the Hebrew word given at 'H2689', also 'shofar'? No, 'chatsotserah'-'cornet' KJ; just "trumpet" 28 times. "Silver" is a word wrongly supplied. The trumpet in those days was a bit like what nowadays is called a monotonous 'vuvuzela' people blow at soccer matches.

In Judges 'yobel'-'ram's horn'/'trumpet'. There is no Hebrew word for 'horn' near sounding like 'yobel'. A 'ram' is 'ayil', also not sounding like 'yobel' except for the 'y'. Therefore both 'shofar' and 'chatsotserah' appears to be specific words for the same thing, a single tone 'bugle' most probably made of ram's horn.

That the trumpet was blown or that a specific trumpet was used at the 'new', moon, doesn't mean a thing that the full moon instead of the new moon was actually meant. It's not only senseless; it's unnecessary and incorrect. I say it is dishonest and no translation but false and intentional misleading trusting Christians.

I'm not sure if you are saying that you agree or disagree that the "trumpets" used in Numbers 10:10 is the "silver trumpets" of Numbers 10:2 ["two trumpets of silver"].




TDW:

Numbers 10:10 uses the word for 'silver trumpets' [and also a different word for 'solemn feasts' or I should say 'solemn days'] http://bibleforums.org/images/smilies/smile.gif

Numbers 10:2 :)


Under "H2689 - chatsotsrah" ['trumpets' in Numbers 10:2,10], it says:

"2 as sacred instr. 2 Kings 12:14 (http://biblehub.com/interlinear/2_kings/12-14.htm) [should say 2Ki12:13], especially for use by priests (only P, Psalm 98 (http://biblehub.com/interlinear/psalms/98.htm) and Chronicles)." --from Bible Hub - http://biblehub.com/hebrew/2689.htm ; bold mine


Whereas "ram's horn - shofar H7782" ['trumpet' in Ps81:3] - http://biblehub.com/hebrew/7782.htm

BrianW
Sep 5th 2017, 01:11 AM
Apparently the full moon has no significance in Scripture.

I thought that in these contexts the moon was being used simply as a way to signify times to do something. I'm honestly not trying to be flippant or sarcastic I just don't understand what the argument is about.

Is it about specific translators adding the words "full moon" to a certain translation? Or do some claim that the new moon and full moon have deeper spiritual connections?

teddyv
Sep 5th 2017, 02:26 AM
I thought that in these contexts the moon was being used simply as a way to signify times to do something. I'm honestly not trying to be flippant or sarcastic I just don't understand what the argument is about.

Is it about specific translators adding the words "full moon" to a certain translation? Or do some claim that the new moon and full moon have deeper spiritual connections?

I agree, the premise is a bit confusing and I'm not sure what the point of dscussion is intended to be.

Gerhard Ebersoehn
Sep 5th 2017, 08:00 PM
I thought that in these contexts the moon was being used simply as a way to signify times to do something. I'm honestly not trying to be flippant or sarcastic I just don't understand what the argument is about.

Is it about specific translators adding the words "full moon" to a certain translation? Or do some claim that the new moon and full moon have deeper spiritual connections?


I'm not sure if you are saying that you agree or disagree that the "trumpets" used in Numbers 10:10 is the "silver trumpets" of Numbers 10:2 ["two trumpets of silver"].

Numbers 10 records a most interesting case of the use of trumpets, found nowhere else in the Scriptures.

The word 'silver' appears only in verse 2. Of course verse 10 refers to the same "two trumpets of silver made for the calling of the assembly and for the journeying of the camps". But verse 10 does not contain the word 'silver'.

These silver trumpets in Numbers were primitive instruments for keeping passover “in the wilderness of Sinai”, but ALSO to start just about every move the people at any time or date had to make, cf., verse 11, over the period of forty years' sojourneying in the desert before they crossed the Jordan “on the tenth day of the First Month”.

After this, the silver trumpets never are being mentioned again and assumedly never were used again.

The blowing of RAM'S HORN 'trumpets' associated with new moon as in Psalm 81:3, must have originated with the “church in the wilderness”. To “observe the First Month for you (Israel)”, was to “observe passover”, “your solemn days in the beginnings of your months.” From Numbers 9 to 10 it’s about the passover! The silver trumpets marked the first day of “THIS the First Month for you”, and every of its “ESSENTIAL”, “days”—each “BONE-day” of “your solemn days”, “the tenth day of the First Month”, “the fourteenth day of the First Month”, “the fifteenth day of the First Month”, and, “the sixteenth day of the First Month”; and: “the Day of your Gladness” when the LORD “brought you up, out of the Red Sea”, and “brought you in”, and “planted you”, “in the land the LORD PROMISED”, “THEN, sang Moses and the children of Israel THIS SONG unto the LORD” --- “the Song of Moses AND OF THE LAMB”.

One cannot see the completion (full moon) has one not seen the “whole” from its very “beginnings”. The beginnings are "ESSENTIAL". Israel saw God’s “beginnings” with their redemption; we, the “children” of Israel, have seen God's essential and whole Salvation through Jesus Christ, from his conception and birth to his death, burial and RESURRECTION. If one has not seen ALL of Christ’s humiliation and suffering as “God with us”, one has as yet seen nothing of Christ’s Life or Salvation.
The trumpet is blown, sounded, on the new moon only, and not on the full moon because it was the full moon. The trumpet was sounded on the “solemn days” of the LORD’S passover which foreshadowed Christ’s Suffering of the Passover of Yahweh, AND OF NO HEATHEN AND PAGAN, FULL MOON FESTIVAL OF ‘EASTER’!

Easter is what the NKJV implies with “full moon” instead of “solemn day” or “appointed time” as per KJAV, and what the NKJV, not accidentally but premeditated, “superstitiously observes”.

TheDivineWatermark
Sep 5th 2017, 08:16 PM
^ I thought the reference I supplied to 2 Kings 12:13 (which connects in some measure to passages like 1 Chron 15:15-24 [2-24], and also [or especially] 2 Chron 5:12-13 and 20:28, as previously hinted at) refers not to ram's horns type of horns/trumpets, but to silver...


[ "trumpet [H2689 - chatsotsrah]...house of the Lord" ]


Adding: the word in Lev23:24 (for the 1st day of the 7th month [commonly called feast of Trumpets]) is "H8643"; also found in Num29:1-6.


Adding this also:


Gerhard Ebersoehn:

The trumpet is blown, sounded, on the new moon only, and not on the full moon because it was the full moon. The trumpet was sounded on the “solemn days” of the LORD’S passover which foreshadowed Christ’s Suffering of the Passover of Yahweh

Based on what you've written above, I can't tell whether you are saying that the trumpet was blown, sounded, ONLY on the new moon [1st] and not on the 15th [Passover/UB--'solemn days'], or if you are saying it was sounded on the new moon [1st] and sounded on the Passover/UB [14th/15th... 'solemn days']

BrianW
Sep 5th 2017, 10:11 PM
NO HEATHEN AND PAGAN, FULL MOON FESTIVAL OF ‘EASTER’!


Ah! Got it. Thanks for clarifying.

keck553
Sep 5th 2017, 10:16 PM
I thought that in these contexts the moon was being used simply as a way to signify times to do something. I'm honestly not trying to be flippant or sarcastic I just don't understand what the argument is about.

Is it about specific translators adding the words "full moon" to a certain translation? Or do some claim that the new moon and full moon have deeper spiritual connections?

The New Moon in the Bible is called "Rosh Chodesh," and it marks the new month in the Hebrew Calendar. It is sanctified with prayer and the blowing of the Shofar. The "midrash" explains the significance below:

When the Sanhedrin sanctified a new month, what blessing did they make? Some Rabbis say that the blessing recited was "Blessed are You Hashem, Who renews the months." Other Rabbis say that the blessing recited was "Blessed are You Hashem, Who makes the months holy." Other Rabbis say that the blessing recited was "Blessed are You Hashem, Who makes the Children of Israel holy."
Because if the Children of Israel do not sanctify the moon, it does not become holy at all!
Don't be surprised by this, because Hashem made Israel holy, as it says "And you shall be holy to Me, for I, Hashem, am holy..." (Leviticus 20:26). And since the Children of Israel are holy and special to heaven, whatever they make holy is truly holy.
Do you want to understand this? Take a lesson from the Serving Vessels in the Holy Sanctuary. Moses sanctified the Tabernacle. Who sanctified all the Tabernacle's Vessels? You might think that Moses did. But actually, what happened was that a priest would bring a simple mundane cup or other vessel, and put something holy in it, and the cup would automatically become holy. It worked the same way as when Moses sprinkled sacrificial blood on the Altar, and it became holy; or when he poured a wine libation, or performed any aspect of the Holy Temple Service with any mundane vessel, and it thereby became holy.
Now, if a simple, mundane cup becomes holy when it is filled with something holy, all the more so the Children of Israel, who are themselves holy, should have the ability to make the month holy!
The Holy One, blessed is He, said, "I am holy. I Myself make things holy. I will make Israel holy, and they will fill the world with holiness by declaring Me holy. Therefore, the Torah says, "And you will be holy to Me, for I, Hashem, am holy...(ibid)," and "I am Hashem Who makes you holy" (Leviticus 20:8).
That is what King David means when he says "You are holy; You are enthroned by the praises of Israel" (Psalms 22:4)
And when did Israel begin to sanctify the months? In Egypt, as it says "This month shall be the first month for you..." (Exodus 12:2).

-- Midrash Shmos Rabbah, 15:24

BrianW
Sep 5th 2017, 11:17 PM
Thanks for that but I'm a sola scriptura guy.
Please don't take this the wrong way but I've just got no use for the Mishnah or the midrash except as a tool to better help me understand Jewish culture and customs.
And I'm only interested in Jewish culture and customs as a way to help me better understand Scripture. I only view it as background information.

keck553
Sep 6th 2017, 03:43 PM
Thanks for that but I'm a sola scriptura guy.
Please don't take this the wrong way but I've just got no use for the Mishnah or the midrash except as a tool to better help me understand Jewish culture and customs.
And I'm only interested in Jewish culture and customs as a way to help me better understand Scripture. I only view it as background information.

I understand and agree with you Brian. I just like history and understanding different cultures, in no way am I agreeing with the rabbi's. This is the kind of thinking that got a lot of them in trouble with Jesus. (remember where the Pharisees asked Jesus 'by what authority' He healed people with?)

It helps me understand the mindset of those who opposed Jesus.

BrianW
Sep 6th 2017, 04:01 PM
I agree completely brother. I've studied these things for the same reasons and was actually pretty shocked at some of it.

Gerhard Ebersoehn
Sep 10th 2017, 08:24 AM
And when did Israel begin to sanctify the months? In Egypt, as it says "This month shall be the first month for you..." (Exodus 12:2).
-- Midrash Shmos Rabbah,

The Jews just do not know or understand. Logically, How can Israel 'begin to sanctify the months In Egypt' WHILE THEY ARE IN BONDAGE? They did not, nor were able to. They first had to be redeemed and have exited Egypt. In this place the modern Jews and Christians all the same confuse the prescription 'to sanctify the months' and Israel having begun observing its INSTITUTIONALISED months.

ewq1938
Oct 21st 2017, 11:11 PM
Isa 3:18 In that day the Lord will take away the bravery of their tinkling ornaments about their feet, and their cauls, and their round tires like the moon,

Obviously the moon would have been seen as fully round and full on certain nights else this verse would not make sense. All one has to do is look at the moon every night to see it become full and round.