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Do you desire what God desires?

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  • Do you desire what God desires?

    "I exhort therefore, that, supplications, prayers, intercessions, -and giving of thanks be made for all men .... this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour, who will have all men to be saved' --1 Timothy 2:14.

    Assuming that you believe that "will" means "desire". do you desire that all men (and women) be saved?

  • #2
    yes i do!
    but admittedly it is sometimes hard to remember that everyone is God's child when you are struggling. even your enemies.
    Trust in the Lord with all your heart and lean not on your own understanding.
    Proverbs 3:5

    My soul yearns for you in the night; in the morning my spirit longs for you. When your judgements come upon the earth, the people of the world learn righteousness.
    Isaiah 26:9

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    • #3
      Assuming that you believe that "will" means "desire". do you desire that all men (and women) be saved?
      Wow, what a great question. Right away my mind went to Osama bin Laden. If I had the chance, would I tell him Christ died for him or tell him to literally go to hell? Then, even if he did accept Christ as his Savior, would I be joyful or be the brother of the prodigal son?

      Really made me think.

      1 John 3:10
      In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.


      Romans 9:8
      That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.

      John 8:44
      Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.

      Not to derail the thread, as it is a good OP, but there are those who are children of God, and then those who are not.

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      • #4
        Originally posted by Yukerboy View Post
        Wow, what a great question. Right away my mind went to Osama bin Laden. If I had the chance, would I tell him Christ died for him or tell him to literally go to hell? Then, even if he did accept Christ as his Savior, would I be joyful or be the brother of the prodigal son?

        Really made me think.

        1 John 3:10
        In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.


        Romans 9:8
        That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.

        John 8:44
        Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.

        Not to derail the thread, as it is a good OP, but there are those who are children of God, and then those who are not.
        I almost put that this verse was a good argument against limited atonement but knew what direction it would go in.

        all means all or it doesn't

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        • #5
          Originally posted by mikebr View Post
          "I exhort therefore, that, supplications, prayers, intercessions, -and giving of thanks be made for all men .... this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour, who will have all men to be saved' --1 Timothy 2:14.

          Assuming that you believe that "will" means "desire". do you desire that all men (and women) be saved?
          Sometimes i wish everyone would just be magically transformed into a Christian lol that would solve all world problems haha but i must admit i am lacking in the witnessing department and i need to step my game up by grace. Yes, i wish everyone would be saved even Hitler. Why would we want anyone to go to hell? But also at the end of the day, for those who have refused to repent and accept Gods free gift, their punishment will be exactly what they deserve, unfortunately. Glory be to the One True and Just God

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          • #6
            Originally posted by mikebr View Post
            I almost put that this verse was a good argument against limited atonement but knew what direction it would go in.

            all means all or it doesn't
            God does indeed will that all be saved. He desires all men to come to repentance

            there is a sense in which everyone is a child of God because He is the Father of creation (the Father of all spirits) even demons were born of God before they rebelled.

            However there is also a sense in which some people are sons of the devil and not sons of God.

            Its a thin line but a line indeed that is drawn between the general(God loved the world, He is the Father of all spirits) and the particular(God hates all evildoers, some are sons of Satan, sons of disobedience)

            but i do indeed think that the word "wills" in that verse means desires. If it meant the active will as in a will that will be accomplished that would be universalism

            just my two pennies in the bucket of knowledge

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            • #7
              Originally posted by reformedct View Post
              Sometimes i wish everyone would just be magically transformed into a Christian lol that would solve all world problems haha but i must admit i am lacking in the witnessing department and i need to step my game up by grace. Yes, i wish everyone would be saved even Hitler. Why would we want anyone to go to hell? But also at the end of the day, for those who have refused to repent and accept Gods free gift, their punishment will be exactly what they deserve, unfortunately. Glory be to the One True and Just God
              If they are getting what they deserve why don't you get what you deserve or I get what I deserve? Is it because Jesus died on Calvary or because you have faith in why He died?

              If God wants people to get what they deserve why did Jesus come in the first place?

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              • #8
                Originally posted by mikebr View Post
                If they are getting what they deserve why don't you get what you deserve or I get what I deserve? Is it because Jesus died on Calvary or because you have faith in why He died?

                If God doesn't want people to get what they deserve why did Jesus come in the first place?
                Jesus came to display the glorious grace and love of God. Grace is getting what we dont deserve. SO those who dont accept Jesus will get what they deserve, and what we all deserve, which is seperation from God forever. When i mentioned Hitler what i was trying to say is that i dont care how evil someone is, i would like to see them saved. Why wouldnt i want someone to be saved? UNfortunately Hitler was not saved. I dont mean that i wish people who have died in unbelief would then be granted salvation in the afterlife, that would be unjust and a mockery of the righteousness of God. None of us deserve it so its not like i am better than Hitler or any other evil person. Maybe their evil is more manifest outwardly but i am just as evil inwardly if not for what God ha done for me and in me.

                So i dont see why we wouldnt want someone to be saved? Now as far as those who died in hard-hearted unbelief, it is just that they suffer eternally to the glorious praise of the righteousness and justice of God

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by reformedct View Post
                  Jesus came to display the glorious grace and love of God. Grace is getting what we dont deserve. SO those who dont accept Jesus will get what they deserve, and what we all deserve, which is seperation from God forever. When i mentioned Hitler what i was trying to say is that i dont care how evil someone is, i would like to see them saved. Why wouldnt i want someone to be saved? UNfortunately Hitler was not saved. I dont mean that i wish people who have died in unbelief would then be granted salvation in the afterlife, that would be unjust and a mockery of the righteousness of God. None of us deserve it so its not like i am better than Hitler or any other evil person. Maybe their evil is more manifest outwardly but i am just as evil inwardly if not for what God ha done for me and in me.

                  So i dont see why we wouldnt want someone to be saved? Now as far as those who died in hard-hearted unbelief, it is just that they suffer eternally to the glorious praise of the righteousness and justice of God

                  But you agree that God doesn't want them to?

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by mikebr View Post
                    But you agree that God doesn't want them to?
                    God does not desire that any should perish and He does not delight in the death of the wicked. Thats all im sayin lol (im not the most educated in Scripture)

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                    • #11
                      I do, but I know that it won't happen.
                      Matthew 10:39
                      He that finds his life shall lose it: and he that loses his life for my sake shall find it.

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                      • #12
                        Yes, God desires that ALL men should come to Him. Will that happen? No. Is it my place to say who will and who won't? Nope.

                        Jesus came to earth the first time as a man, not to judge but to save. He will come again as the King of Kings and Lord of Lords and He will judge at that point, not me and not anyone else.

                        As ghastly as this may sound, I pray that Osama bin Laden comes to know the Lord Jesus Christ as His savior.

                        I think we will all be very surprised by who we will meet in heaven and who will be conspicuously absent.

                        V
                        I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.
                        - Mahatma Gandhi



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                        • #13
                          Being born again and being forgiven does not mean "not reaping what we sow."

                          Just FYI. God is not mocked. What we do will certainly catch up with us, good or bad.

                          David was forgiven by God after what happened with Bathsheeba, but there were still consequences. God is merciful, but He will also judge, and in His judgment, show mercy because the two go hand in hand. In more modern days, Carla Faye Tucker (spelling?) the "ice pick murderer" received salvation but still also the death penalty for what she did before she was saved. That is justice and mercy working together. For some reason we think that salvation means "God lets us off the hook." He does not. He places us into His Kingdom so we can learn to live life under His rules so we can sow better seed and reap better fruit (i.e. the fruit of the Spirit) according to His ways, and not our own.

                          I still reaped what I had sown after I was saved (still am), and God uses that to teach and lead and guide and change me and bring me to repentance, and it happens completely under His control. Am I spared? No. Am I forgiven and made new? Certainly, because God isn't a liar. Has God ever turned His back on me? No, never. Is He still with me during those times of reaping from the non-God seeds? You bet your sweet tooshie.

                          So ... yes. I desire every man, woman and child to come to that place of surrender to Jesus. God is well able to take it from there. It's my job to be obedient and carry the Gospel message to all who would listen and receive it. It's not my job to play God and decide who is worthy, and under what circumstances, and what happens afterwards.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Vhayes View Post
                            Yes, God desires that ALL men should come to Him. Will that happen? No. Is it my place to say who will and who won't? Nope.

                            Jesus came to earth the first time as a man, not to judge but to save. He will come again as the King of Kings and Lord of Lords and He will judge at that point, not me and not anyone else.

                            As ghastly as this may sound, I pray that Osama bin Laden comes to know the Lord Jesus Christ as His savior.

                            I think we will all be very surprised by who we will meet in heaven and who will be conspicuously absent.

                            V

                            The fact that it sounds ghastly to you indicates that something is wrong with our thinking. Why does it sound ghastly? Don't you think that what Jesus did on the cross was big enough to save Him. Will we rejoice more to see Billy Graham or Billy the Kid? I won't be surprised to see Billy Graham but I will be blown away by the power of the Cross if I see Hitler there.

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                            • #15
                              When we intercede for our unsaved friends and relatives we are partnering and identifying with God's desire to see all men saved and come to the knowledge of the truth... All prayer should be is agreeing with who God is and what comes from that is a heart that is alive in knowledge of God... Intercession and agreement with God's desires results in Identification with God's heart on the issues that are most dear to his heart..
                              The LORD bless you and keep you; The LORD make His face shine upon you,And be gracious to you; The LORD lift up His countenance upon you,And give you peace. Numbers 6:24-26

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