Discussion Curses in the Old Testament?

[chad]

I was just wanting to know what you all thought regarding the curses mentioned in the OT. There are alot of verses regarding curses in the OT. My question do these curses still apply to us today?

I sort of have an answer already, but I was just wondering what other people thought.



Thanks


Chad.

[VerticalReality]

Paul says that if a person walks according to the flesh then they are under law. Therefore, if they are under law they are indeed subject to curses. The only way to be free of those curses is to walk in the Spirit.

[chad]

Hi Vertical Reality,

Thanks for your reply,

I was reading a book on blessings and cursings, and it referred to alot of curses in the old testament, and I was wondering if they applied to us today.

For Example: Deuteronomy 27:15-26; Deut 28:16-20 lists some of the curses. One of them is.

(Deu 27:15 NIV) "Cursed is the man who carves an image or casts an idol--a thing detestable to the LORD, the work of the craftsman's hands--and sets it up in secret." Then all the people shall say, "Amen!"

Paul says that if a person walks according to the flesh then they are under law. Therefore, if they are under law they are indeed subject to curses. The only way to be free of those curses is to walk in the Spirit.

[Kahtar]

Chad, if you carve some image (ie buddha), set it on the mantle and begin worshipping it, do you think you will be blessed, or cursed, by such action?

[Benaiah]

The sections of Deuteronomy you are quoting have to do with the blessings and the curses God declared over the children of Israel. if they kept his covenant they would receive the blessings in the covenant, if they broke it, they would instead be subject to the curses of the covenant.

The experiences of the Jewish people for the last 2000 years attests to the validity of those curses.

Deu 28:63 "And it shall be, that just as the LORD rejoiced over you to do you good and multiply you, so the LORD will rejoice over you to destroy you and bring you to nothing; and you shall be plucked from off the land which you go to possess.
Deu 28:64 "Then the LORD will scatter you among all peoples, from one end of the earth to the other, and there you shall serve other gods, which neither you nor your fathers have known; wood and stone.
Deu 28:65 "And among those nations you shall find no rest, nor shall the sole of your foot have a resting place; but there the LORD will give you a trembling heart, failing eyes, and anguish of soul.
Deu 28:66 "Your life shall hang in doubt before you; you shall fear day and night, and have no assurance of life.
Deu 28:67 "In the morning you shall say, 'Oh, that it were evening!' And at evening you shall say, 'Oh, that it were morning!' because of the fear which terrifies your heart, and because of the sight which your eyes see.

[Emanate]

The sections of Deuteronomy you are quoting have to do with the blessings and the curses God declared over the children of Israel. if they kept his covenant they would receive the blessings in the covenant, if they broke it, they would instead be subject to the curses of the covenant.

The experiences of the Jewish people for the last 200 years atessts to the validity of those curses.

I am sure you mean 2000, which is still a conservative timeframe.

[Benaiah]

I am sure you mean 2000, which is still a conservative timeframe.

Thank you, and yes I meant 2000. of course Israel suffered for periods before but I used the last 2000 years as the best example since it represents the longest uninterrupted period they have suffered.

[chad]

They Wouldn'y apply today though, becuase we are under a different covenant

The sections of Deuteronomy you are quoting have to do with the blessings and the curses God declared over the children of Israel. if they kept his covenant they would receive the blessings in the covenant, if they broke it, they would instead be subject to the curses of the covenant.

The experiences of the Jewish people for the last 2000 years attests to the validity of those curses.

[Kahtar]

They Wouldn'y apply today though, becuase we are under a different covenant

I'll ask again. If you made an idol and started worshipping it, today, would God bless you or currse you because of it?

[Benaiah]

They Wouldn'y apply today though, becuase we are under a different covenant

it applies until they repent.

[chad]

I was wondering about this because of what it written in Galatians.


(Gal 3:10 NIV) All who rely on observing the law are under a curse, for it is written: "Cursed is everyone who does not continue to do everything written in the Book of the Law."

(Gal 3:11 NIV) Clearly no one is justified before God by the law, because, "The righteous will live by faith."

(Gal 3:12 NIV) The law is not based on faith; on the contrary, "The man who does these things will live by them."

(Gal 3:13 NIV) Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law by becoming a curse for us, for it is written: "Cursed is everyone who is hung on a tree."

(Gal 3:14 NIV) He redeemed us in order that the blessing given to Abraham might come to the Gentiles through Christ Jesus, so that by faith we might receive the promise of the Spirit.

Chad

[Kahtar]

(Gal 3:10 NIV) All who rely on observing the law are under a curse, for it is written: "Cursed is everyone who does not continue to do everything written in the Book of the Law."

Okay, let's see. 'Love God with all your heart, soul and strength' is part of the law. If we do that, we come under the curse of the law, according to your understanding. So we should not love God with all our heart, soul and strength. Nor should we love our neighbor, etc.
Now of course that doesn't make sense, so look at what the verse says. 'All who rely on.......'. What is the purpose of relying on the law? For righteousness, right? But Paul says not to do that. Why? Because righteousness does not come by obedience to the law, but by faith in Christ. But Paul does not say to not obey the law. He only says don't rely on it for righteousness.
Again I ask, if you make an idol and start worshipping it, is God going to bless you or curse you?

(Gal 3:11 NIV) Clearly no one is justified before God by the law, because, "The righteous will live by faith."

True, no one is justified by the law (made righteous by the law) because righteousness comes through faith in Jesus Christ, not by works. So love God and your neighbor not for justification or righteousness, but because it's the right thing to do, and because the Holy Spirit has written that upon your heart to do.
Be a doer of the Word, and not a hearer only.

(Gal 3:13 NIV) Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law by becoming a curse for us, for it is written: "Cursed is everyone who is hung on a tree."

What is the curse of the law? It is death. Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law that says all who sin must die. He died in our place, thus taking that curse from us. He's not saying that Christ took the law from us, only the curse of the law, which is death.

[chad]

Hi Kahtar,

Mathew 22:37-39 NIV
(37) Jesus replied: "'Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.' (38) This is the first and greatest commandment. (39) And the second is like it: 'Love your neighbor as yourself.'

Regarding Idols - Paul writes

(1 Cor 8:4 NIV) So then, about eating food sacrificed to idols: We know that an idol is nothing at all in the world and that there is no God but one.

(1 Cor 10:19 NIV) Do I mean then that a sacrifice offered to an idol is anything, or that an idol is anything?

(1 Cor 10:20 NIV) No, but the sacrifices of pagans are offered to demons, not to God, and I do not want you to be participants with demons.

(1 Cor 10:21 NIV) You cannot drink the cup of the Lord and the cup of demons too; you cannot have a part in both the Lord's table and the table of demons.


[quote=Kahtar;1956223]Okay, let's see. 'Love God with all your heart, soul and strength' is part of the law. If we do that, we come under the curse of the law, according to your understanding. So we should not love God with all our heart, soul and strength. Nor should we love our neighbor, etc.
Now of course that doesn't make sense, so look at what the verse says. 'All who rely on.......'. What is the purpose of relying on the law? For righteousness, right? But Paul says not to do that. Why? Because righteousness does not come by obedience to the law, but by faith in Christ. But Paul does not say to not obey the law. He only says don't rely on it for righteousness.
Again I ask, if you make an idol and start worshipping it, is God going to bless you or curse you?

[Kahtar]

Thank you for those very familiar scriptures. Didn't quite catch your answer out of that though.

[chad]

Hi Kahtar,

To answer your questions...

[quote=Kahtar;1956223]Okay, let's see. 'Love God with all your heart, soul and strength' is part of the law. If we do that, we come under the curse of the law, according to your understanding.

Answer: No, becuase Jesus commanded us in Mathew 22:37-39 to 'Love God with all your heart, soul and strength' and to 'Love your neighbor as yourself.'

Again I ask, if you make an idol and start worshipping it, is God going to bless you or curse you?

Answer: If you are a born again believer, why would you want to make an idol and start worshipping it? It makes no sense at all.