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  • Old Testament salvation

    Jesus tells us in His word that He is the Way, the Truth, and the Life and that no one comes to the Father except through Him. Under the Old Testament covenant, salvation was based upon man's ability to keep the law and maintain the sacrifices of atonement for sin.

    My question is this... Most of us would agree that obtaining salvation through works and following the rituals of the law is not obtainable. If one must accept the atoning sacrifice of Jesus to be saved, what is the salvation status of those who died under the old covenant? Furthermore, how are they brought under the sacrifice of Christ?

  • #2
    Those in the OT who were servants of God and who believed in His promise were preserved in Abraham's Bosom until Christ's sacrifice could atone for their sins and allow them to be with the Lord.
    Jeremy, a bondservant of the Lord.

    Today is a good day to die for Christ.

    Comment


    • #3
      Read Hebrews 11. There we find that those that lived before the reality of Christ were saved by faith just as we are. The only advantage we have is that we KNOW that Christ came. They had to trust that He would. The sacrifices were an outward expression of faith, saying that they believed He would come.

      Comment


      • #4
        OT Saints are saved in the same manner as all men are saved, because of the person and work of Jesus Christ. There is only one way of salvation and works of the Law is not it.

        The OT Saints looked forward to the Messiah and His atoning work. We look backward to the Messiah and His atoning work. We are all saved in the same manner, through simple faith in Him and His work.

        No flesh is justified by the works of the Law (Galatians 2:16). The OT Saints were justified by faith in the promise of the Messiah to come (Hebrews 11:13).

        Hebrews 11:13,39-40 - These all died in faith, not having received the promises, but having seen them afar off were assured of them, embraced them and confessed that they were strangers and pilgrims on the earth.
        And all these, having obtained a good testimony through faith, did not receive the promise, God having provided something better for us, that they should not be made perfect apart from us.
        WDJD - what DID Jesus do

        He died on a cross for our sin and rose from the dead,
        securing, for all who believe, eternal life and forgiveness of sin

        Toolman

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Hburgpreacher View Post
          Under the Old Testament covenant, salvation was based upon man's ability to keep the law and maintain the sacrifices of atonement for sin.
          Sorry, but no.

          What then shall we say was gained by Abraham, our forefather according to the flesh? For if Abraham was justified by works, he has something to boast about, but not before God. For what does the Scripture say? "Abraham believed God, and it was counted to him as righteousness."
          (Romans 4:1-3)
          What is thy only comfort in life and death?

          That I with body and soul, both in life and death, am not my own, but belong unto my faithful Saviour Jesus Christ; who, with his precious blood, has fully satisfied for all my sins, and delivered me from all the power of the devil; and so preserves me that without the will of my heavenly Father, not a hair can fall from my head; yea, that all things must be subservient to my salvation, and therefore, by his Holy Spirit, He also assures me of eternal life, and makes me sincerely willing and ready, henceforth, to live unto him.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Hburgpreacher View Post
            Jesus tells us in His word that He is the Way, the Truth, and the Life and that no one comes to the Father except through Him. Under the Old Testament covenant, salvation was based upon man's ability to keep the law and maintain the sacrifices of atonement for sin.

            My question is this... Most of us would agree that obtaining salvation through works and following the rituals of the law is not obtainable. If one must accept the atoning sacrifice of Jesus to be saved, what is the salvation status of those who died under the old covenant? Furthermore, how are they brought under the sacrifice of Christ?
            Mans salvation was never about keeping THE LAW, (here goes a thousand posts on why we need to keep the Law.) It has always been about faith and thats it. Their faith made them righteous. And their hope in Jesus.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Hburgpreacher View Post
              Jesus tells us in His word that He is the Way, the Truth, and the Life and that no one comes to the Father except through Him. Under the Old Testament covenant, salvation was based upon man's ability to keep the law and maintain the sacrifices of atonement for sin.
              That premise is wrong.

              Humanity, regardless of when they were born, find salvation in faith and belief in Jesus Christ and His shed blood for the atonement of sin.

              It doesn't matter if they were born 1000 years before Calvary or 1000 years after Calvary....His blood is still the venue for the remission of sin of all people.

              Keeping the law, and maintaining animal sacrifices never atoned for sin.
              • Galatians 6:13 "For neither they themselves who are circumcised keep the law"
              • Hebrews 10:4 "For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins."

              • Acts 13:38 Be it known unto you therefore, men and brethren, that through this man is preached unto you the forgiveness of sins: And by him all that believe are justified from all things, from which ye could not be justified by the law of Moses.

              Comment


              • #8
                Without faith it is impossible to please God.

                We are told Abraham faith was counted unto him as righteousness.

                We are saved in the same manor under the new testiment (Jesus), by faith.

                (Even the law itself is faith based. I mean how can the blood of sacrifices save a person, if the person doesnt believe it will? I mean if you didnt believe it would, then certainly you wouldnt even bother).

                So the same faith, in the same God, is our salvation.

                God Bless
                "Anyone who does the will of my Father in heaven is my brother and sister and mother!"

                ~Matthew 12:50~

                Comment


                • #9
                  Nice question, we are actually having the same discussion on the Afrikaans forum.

                  Would you guys agree, looking at Scriptures such as Heb 11, that the object of Abraham etc's. faith and my faith is the same, i.e. Jesus Christ?

                  That if we look at Scriptures such as Is 53 etc, that they knew that Christ would come as our Saviour?

                  God bless
                  Phil

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Would you guys agree, looking at Scriptures such as Heb 11, that the object of Abraham etc's. faith and my faith is the same, i.e. Jesus Christ?
                    Abraham did what God spoke/commanded Him to do, IOW he followed the Word.
                    We follow the Word in the same way, only difference is, we see a physical example of how that Word is to be lived out.

                    Does that make sense to you Phil ?

                    Shalom,
                    Tanja
                    Jer 6:16 Thus says the Lord: Stand at the crossroads, and look, and ask for the ancient paths, where the good way lies; and walk in it, and find rest for your souls.
                    2Jn 1:9 Everyone who goes on ahead and does not abide in the teaching of Christ, does not have God. Whoever abides in the teaching has both the Father and the Son.
                    If it's not done out of unselfish love, then it's hardly righteous.
                    http://disciple2yeshua.wordpress.com/



                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Jesusinmyheart View Post
                      Abraham did what God spoke/commanded Him to do, IOW he followed the Word.
                      We follow the Word in the same way, only difference is, we see a physical example of how that Word is to be lived out.
                      Romans 4:1-4 - What then shall we say that Abraham our father has found according to the flesh? For if Abraham was justified by works, he has something to boast about, but not before God. For what does the Scripture say? “Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.” Now to him who works, the wages are not counted as grace but as debt. But to him who does not work but believes on Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is accounted for righteousness,
                      WDJD - what DID Jesus do

                      He died on a cross for our sin and rose from the dead,
                      securing, for all who believe, eternal life and forgiveness of sin

                      Toolman

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Jesusinmyheart View Post
                        Abraham did what God spoke/commanded Him to do, IOW he followed the Word.
                        We follow the Word in the same way, only difference is, we see a physical example of how that Word is to be lived out.

                        Does that make sense to you Phil ?

                        Shalom,
                        Tanja
                        Yes, that makes sense thanks

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          “Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.” Now to him who works, the wages are not counted as grace but as debt. But to him who does not work but believes on Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is accounted for righteousness,
                          Toolman, they keyword here is that Abraham believed, and acted on that belief, he still did works, based on belief/Faith....
                          The one that works relying on his own understanding is the one that incurs a debt.

                          Jas 2:21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works when he offered up his son Isaac on the altar?
                          Jas 2:22 You see that faith was active along with his works, and faith was completed by his works;
                          Jas 2:23 and the Scripture was fulfilled that says, "Abraham believed God, and it was counted to him as righteousness"--and he was called a friend of God.


                          Shalom,
                          Tanja
                          Jer 6:16 Thus says the Lord: Stand at the crossroads, and look, and ask for the ancient paths, where the good way lies; and walk in it, and find rest for your souls.
                          2Jn 1:9 Everyone who goes on ahead and does not abide in the teaching of Christ, does not have God. Whoever abides in the teaching has both the Father and the Son.
                          If it's not done out of unselfish love, then it's hardly righteous.
                          http://disciple2yeshua.wordpress.com/



                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Jesusinmyheart View Post
                            Toolman, they keyword here is that Abraham believed, and acted on that belief, he still did works, based on belief/Faith....
                            The one that works relying on his own understanding is the one that incurs a debt.

                            Jas 2:21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works when he offered up his son Isaac on the altar?
                            Jas 2:22 You see that faith was active along with his works, and faith was completed by his works;
                            Jas 2:23 and the Scripture was fulfilled that says, "Abraham believed God, and it was counted to him as righteousness"--and he was called a friend of God.


                            Shalom,
                            Tanja
                            He still did works but those works did not justify him before God. His trust in God and the soon coming Messiah is what justified him before God. His works did nothing to justify him before God.
                            WDJD - what DID Jesus do

                            He died on a cross for our sin and rose from the dead,
                            securing, for all who believe, eternal life and forgiveness of sin

                            Toolman

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Toolman,
                              i think you're missing the point, doing what God commanded Him to do is what justified Abraham, by his Faith.

                              Scripture here says plainly, that he was "justified by works" (these being the works God commanded him to do, these being the only works which will justify a person)..... the only way to reconcile this with other passages saying one is not justified by works, is to separate works that one does by relying on their own understanding, and not following the Spirit, and those works done that God Himself tells you to do, and following the Spirit.

                              Scripture is clear here that there are works that justify you, as long as you have faith, and believe.

                              Anything else is dead works.

                              Shalom,
                              Tanja
                              Jer 6:16 Thus says the Lord: Stand at the crossroads, and look, and ask for the ancient paths, where the good way lies; and walk in it, and find rest for your souls.
                              2Jn 1:9 Everyone who goes on ahead and does not abide in the teaching of Christ, does not have God. Whoever abides in the teaching has both the Father and the Son.
                              If it's not done out of unselfish love, then it's hardly righteous.
                              http://disciple2yeshua.wordpress.com/



                              Comment

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