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Pondering Roe versus Wade

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  • #91
    Originally posted by I<3Jesus View Post
    I just noticed that no one addressed what I said earlier:



    Thoughts?
    My friend, there is a major difference in giving your life and taking it.

    1st John 3:14 We know that we have passed from death unto life, because we love the brethren. He that loveth not his brother abideth in death.

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    • #92
      OK, what if she is a single mother of several other kids who rely on her to take care of them?

      Edited to add: I am not trying to be difficult, I am just trying to point out that life is not black or white.

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      • #93
        Originally posted by I<3Jesus View Post
        OK, what if she is a single mother of several other kids who rely on her to take care of them?

        Edited to add: I am not trying to be difficult, I am just trying to point out that life is not black or white.
        You're right. Life is not always black & white. Oh that it were!

        Part of the problem with the "what if" questions that are always floated around, is that there are equal and opposite "what if" questions. For instance, why is said single mother - who has several other kids who rely on her - out getting pregnant?

        Considering that 95+% of all abortions are for the sake of convenience, perhaps we should address those first - and with bluntness. Then, and only then, should we start looking at the "what ifs", and taking them on a case-by-case individual basis.

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        • #94
          Originally posted by jeffreys View Post
          You're right. Life is not always black & white. Oh that it were!

          Part of the problem with the "what if" questions that are always floated around, is that there are equal and opposite "what if" questions. For instance, why is said single mother - who has several other kids who rely on her - out getting pregnant?

          Considering that 95+% of all abortions are for the sake of convenience, perhaps we should address those first - and with bluntness. Then, and only then, should we start looking at the "what ifs", and taking them on a case-by-case individual basis.
          I knew someone would bring that up I guess I just have a hard time with issues like this because I have been in the trenches with the people who felt they had no other options.

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          • #95
            Originally posted by I<3Jesus View Post
            I knew someone would bring that up I guess I just have a hard time with issues like this because I have been in the trenches with the people who felt they had no other options.
            Right.

            I just don't think we can ignore the 95%, while debating the minute percentage.

            Let's propose that the 95+% of abortions - those for convenience sake - are outlawed. Then Christians can, both individually and as churches, take the 5% under our wings and do whatever is necessary to love them through the process. Deal?

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            • #96
              Originally posted by jeffreys View Post
              Right.

              I just don't think we can ignore the 95%, while debating the minute percentage.

              Let's propose that the 95+% of abortions - those for convenience sake - are outlawed. Then Christians can, both individually and as churches, take the 5% under our wings and do whatever is necessary to love them through the process. Deal?
              Yeah, but you know that won't actually happen.

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              • #97
                Originally posted by I<3Jesus View Post
                Yeah, but you know that won't actually happen.
                I know it won't, but it should!

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                • #98
                  Originally posted by jeffreys View Post
                  I know it won't, but it should!
                  I can whole heartedly agree with that. BTW, where did you get the 95% statistic?

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                  • #99
                    I've been in the trenches, too - infact I was one who was given to feel that I had no other choice - which is really ironic since abortion is supposed to give us choices?

                    I have also talked to many others who have had abortions who also said that the only 'choice' they were provided with was abortion.

                    It seems very wrong to get counseling from the very organization that will profit from the counsel. Until women are given all the facts, and shown all their choices in a counseling session before the fact - I will not stop trying to educate what abortion does.

                    Actually - truthfully I will probably continue to tell people that abortion not only kills the babies, but it also kills something in the mothers that have them.

                    Thanks for letting me have a place to get on my soap box again.
                    "He comforts us in all our trouble, so that we may be able to comfort those who are in every trouble, through the comfort with which we ourselves are comforted by God." 2 Cor 1:4

                    "forgetting those things which are behind and reaching forward to those things which are ahead," Phil 3:13


                    "For our citizenship is in heaven, ..." Phil 3:20

                    Click here if you were wounded spiritually after abortion.
                    Click here if you are pregnant and need help.
                    Click here if you have been raped and are looking for help

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                    • Originally posted by ddmor View Post
                      I've been in the trenches, too - infact I was one who was given to feel that I had no other choice - which is really ironic since abortion is supposed to give us choices?

                      I have also talked to many others who have had abortions who also said that the only 'choice' they were provided with was abortion.

                      It seems very wrong to get counseling from the very organization that will profit from the counsel. Until women are given all the facts, and shown all their choices in a counseling session before the fact - I will not stop trying to educate what abortion does.

                      Actually - truthfully I will probably continue to tell people that abortion not only kills the babies, but it also kills something in the mothers that have them.

                      Thanks for letting me have a place to get on my soap box again.
                      Great post hon! I am sorry you felt that you had no other options. This is exactly why Christians need to do more than just picket clinics and cry for change.

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                      • Originally posted by I<3Jesus View Post

                        I just read this sentiment in someone's signature line and it got me thinking. First of all I can acknowledge that abortion is a hot topic on both sides, but do we really want to start trying to push our beliefs on the secular world? What happens when that backfires and they start pushing back? What happens when they start pushing their beliefs on us? When they start taking away our rights? I am a Christian, but I do not support overturning Roe versus Wade. My spiritual beliefs should not govern what a non believer has the right to do or not to do. Once you start making statements like the one above, once you start pushing for laws based on your beliefs, you open a can of worms that none of us our ready to deal with. Thoughts?
                        It's not about Christians forcing beliefs on a secular society, it's about the fact that the Constitution does not give a woman the right to have an abortion. I keep trying to find where it says that women have the right to kill their unborn children but I have yet to find it.

                        Besides, overturning Roe V Wade will allow the individual states to decide.

                        Just like it should be.
                        Ephesians 2:8
                        For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God
                        Romans 11:29
                        for God's gifts and his call are irrevocable.

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                        • Originally posted by I<3Jesus
                          WG - I really think you should just skip this thread. You seem to get far too worked up.
                          With all due respect, all I am doing is addressing posts. I have never directed anything at anyone personally. And I can't find where I have been disrespectful toward anyone.

                          I hate to think there are people who don't get worked up about the lives of millions of innocent babies.

                          That being said, moral reprehensibility is a matter of perspective. What you may find reprehensible the next person may not.
                          Let me ask you a question. With the direction this country is headed morally, what would you think if the majority decided statutory rape was a-ok and changed the laws to permit it. Would you be okay with a "majority rules" law in this case?

                          As I said, when rights are being violated (rights that are plainly stated in documents this country claims to adhere to), majority means nothing.

                          You would be screaming bloody murder if any other faith was trying to limit your options based on their moral barometer.
                          Actually, I am screaming "bloody murder" now (that was an unfortunate choice of phrasing).

                          Since when did murder become an option in this country?
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                          • Originally posted by jeffreys View Post
                            And how do you propose to do that?

                            What, besides protesting outside of Planned Parenthood, should Christians be doing?
                            One of the first and best things we could do is shut down every Planned Parenthood. It is truly one of the most subversive and evil organizations in this country.

                            Making abortion illegal (which, by the way, I believe should be done) is not going to help those in need - those in the midst of crisis pregnancies.
                            The purpose of making abortion illegal is not to meet the needs of the mother. The purpose of making abortion illegal is to protect the lives of defenseless babies.

                            There are many pro-life groups Christians could be supporting. There are also Crisis Pregnancy Centers in most major cities (The Fort Worth Pregnancy Center is absolutely wonderful....not only do they save babies, they have lead numerous women to the Lord).

                            I will say, however, that our potential inability to solve the problem of what to do with the numerous pregnant moms and their babies is NOT a justification for keeping abortion legal.

                            Our prison system is in crisis right now due to overcrowding and lack of sufficient prisons. Does that mean we should make certain crimes legal to alleviate the problem?
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                            • Originally posted by Whispering Grace View Post
                              With all due respect, all I am doing is addressing posts. I have never directed anything at anyone personally. And I can't find where I have been disrespectful toward anyone.

                              I hate to think there are people who don't get worked up about the lives of millions of innocent babies.



                              Let me ask you a question. With the direction this country is headed morally, what would you think if the majority decided statutory rape was a-ok and changed the laws to permit it. Would you be okay with a "majority rules" law in this case?

                              As I said, when rights are being violated (rights that are plainly stated in documents this country claims to adhere to), majority means nothing.



                              Actually, I am screaming "bloody murder" now (that was an unfortunate choice of phrasing).

                              Since when did murder become an option in this country?
                              It is a subject that gets folks worked up and I would dare say it should. I don't see how it could be otherwise really. What saddens me the most... that it doesn't get as many worked up and that should cause us all pause.


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                              • Originally posted by jeffreys View Post
                                Unfortunately, we don't live in that sort of a Utopia. It seems so clear to me that Christians have to get involved in Crisis Pregnancy Centers, in helping women in crisis pregnancies, etc. We can't do everything, but we have to do something.
                                I don't disagree with this at all. If we truly love the lives of the children we want to save, we will get involved in some way.
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