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  • Discussion What is Paul Reinforcing?

    When Paul wrote the text do not be unevenly yoked with unbelievers, was he just making a good suggestion or echoing a principle in and from the Torah?


    For me, I personaly trust that he was speaking from the Torah as Paul often did to add proof to his inspirations. He used Torah to established spiritual principles to reinforce proper behaviour of believers in the NT all the time.


    Moses was commanded by God to tell the Israelites not to commune with the heathens. God gave the reasons and consequences for doing so. Then we have Paul saying and conveying the same old message for the same reasons. This is Paul reinforcing a principle founded in Torah. Hence, is Paul not respecting and observing the principles established by the Torah. This means to me, that the spiritual principles of Torah are valid for believers to religously respect and observe if they so choose to learn and honor what could be discover in regards to their understanding and behaviour. This might not be everyone's personal choice, so what, everyone lives and dies to their own Lord.
    Edify the brethren, love the brethren, and forgive the brethren until I have nothing left.

    www.woc-church.org

  • #2
    Mani, I don't think there are many, if any, people here who would disagree with the fact the Law was written as a signpost to Jesus.

    It's the same as being "in" the world but not "of" the world.
    V
    I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.
    - Mahatma Gandhi



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    • #3
      Originally posted by Vhayes View Post
      Mani, I don't think there are many, if any, people here who would disagree with the fact the Law was written as a signpost to Jesus.

      It's the same as being "in" the world but not "of" the world.
      V
      I could not agree you with anymore than two praise the Lord.

      With the exception that it can still keep people pointed towards Jesus (we all have gotten off track and backslided), keep flesh in subjection to the Spirit (who does not find themselves in this bondage at times), and teach people the spiritual principles of love (who does not forget to love and why we should love at times).
      Edify the brethren, love the brethren, and forgive the brethren until I have nothing left.

      www.woc-church.org

      Comment


      • #4
        Paul is reinforcing obedience by honoring your mother (church) and Father (God). Paul isn't speaking from book study, he is speaking from living experience.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Teke View Post
          Paul is reinforcing obedience by honoring your mother (church) and Father (God). Paul isn't speaking from book study, he is speaking from living experience.
          No suprise that we agree slightly, but I see a little more involved. Paul experiences and knowledge did come from a book and lived out around him daily. His life was surrounded by Scriptural principles and examples.

          I personaly do not have a mother Church, for it is not living entity for me.

          However, you admit that the Torah says the same thing and establish the same principles, right.

          You came to answer the question. Thanks for the communion sister. Much love............

          FF want show up........
          Edify the brethren, love the brethren, and forgive the brethren until I have nothing left.

          www.woc-church.org

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by manichunter View Post
            No suprise that we agree slightly, but I see a little more involved. Paul experiences and knowledge did come from a book and lived out around him daily. His life was surrounded by Scriptural principles and examples.

            I personaly do not have a mother Church, for it is not living entity for me.

            However, you admit that the Torah says the same thing and establish the same principles, right.

            You came to answer the question. Thanks for the communion sister. Much love............

            FF want show up........
            Well now, they didn't have books in the 1st century. Paul learned from his parents and then from the Pharisees.

            The bible/book we have is part of the church's tradition. IOW part of what our mother wants us to have. However, the fact that we have it doesn't mean that we can read and understand it without her help.

            I will pray for you. That God will reveal the church to you. I prayed for many years after my revelation of the Son, for God to reveal the Church to me. As until such a time we are at somewhat of a disadvantage. We all must come out of the womb to behold our mother face to face.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Teke View Post
              Well now, they didn't have books in the 1st century. Paul learned from his parents and then from the Pharisees.

              The bible/book we have is part of the church's tradition. IOW part of what our mother wants us to have. However, the fact that we have it doesn't mean that we can read and understand it without her help.

              I will pray for you. That God will reveal the church to you. I prayed for many years after my revelation of the Son, for God to reveal the Church to me. As until such a time we are at somewhat of a disadvantage. We all must come out of the womb to behold our mother face to face.
              He had scrolls, which were books in his day. And he was mentored by Gamaliel, which was a leading Pharisee who highly honored and respect in his day. He was the same one who spared Peter a beating by telling the Sanhedrin to let him go to see if God was working through Peter. He did not know how right he was. I wonder if he ever received Christ.
              Edify the brethren, love the brethren, and forgive the brethren until I have nothing left.

              www.woc-church.org

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by manichunter View Post
                I wonder if he ever received Christ.
                you and me both. I hope to find out someday....
                Those who seek God with all their heart will find Him and be given sight. Those who seek their own agenda will remain blind.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by keck553 View Post
                  you and me both. I hope to find out someday....

                  It says in Scripture that some of the Pharisees and Priests came to believe and got saved. Maybe....... he seemed wise............. and earnest in his religion.

                  Something I just found out doing this Feast of Unleaven Bread is what happened when Jesus went to hell and preached the Gospel to the gentiles in hell............. and took paradise back with him..............
                  Edify the brethren, love the brethren, and forgive the brethren until I have nothing left.

                  www.woc-church.org

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by manichunter View Post
                    It says in Scripture that some of the Pharisees and Priests came to believe and got saved. Maybe....... he seemed wise............. and earnest in his religion.

                    Something I just found out doing this Feast of Unleaven Bread is what happened when Jesus went to hell and preached the Gospel to the gentiles in hell............. and took paradise back with him..............
                    Is it possible to see an outline of that lesson?
                    Those who seek God with all their heart will find Him and be given sight. Those who seek their own agenda will remain blind.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by keck553 View Post
                      Is it possible to see an outline of that lesson?

                      I will have to scan or type it in. My pastor gave me a copy, better yet I can have him email it, if I cannot find my copy.

                      Will work on it.

                      By the way, a lot of people are dodging this NT Torah....... kind of make me go hymn............ going fishing.........
                      Edify the brethren, love the brethren, and forgive the brethren until I have nothing left.

                      www.woc-church.org

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by manichunter View Post
                        When Paul wrote the text do not be unevenly yoked with unbelievers, was he just making a good suggestion or echoing a principle in and from the Torah?


                        For me, I personaly trust that he was speaking from the Torah as Paul often did to add proof to his inspirations. He used Torah to established spiritual principles to reinforce proper behaviour of believers in the NT all the time.


                        Moses was commanded by God to tell the Israelites not to commune with the heathens. God gave the reasons and consequences for doing so. Then we have Paul saying and conveying the same old message for the same reasons. This is Paul reinforcing a principle founded in Torah. Hence, is Paul not respecting and observing the principles established by the Torah. This means to me, that the spiritual principles of Torah are valid for believers to religously respect and observe if they so choose to learn and honor what could be discover in regards to their understanding and behaviour. This might not be everyone's personal choice, so what, everyone lives and dies to their own Lord.
                        The maxim that bulls should not be unequally yoked is widely accepted on its own merits and doesn't need divine revelation as proof.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by manichunter View Post
                          By the way, a lot of people are dodging this NT Torah....... kind of make me go hymn............ going fishing.........
                          Sampson could tell you all about that yolked stuff.

                          Or what harmony has Christ with Belial, or what has a believer in common with an unbeliever? Or what agreement has the temple of God with idols? For we are the temple of the living God; just as God said, "I WILL DWELL IN THEM AND WALK AMONG THEM; AND I WILL BE THEIR GOD, AND THEY SHALL BE MY PEOPLE. "Therefore, COME OUT FROM THEIR MIDST AND BE SEPARATE," says the Lord. "AND DO NOT TOUCH WHAT IS UNCLEAN; And I will welcome you. "And I will be a father to you, And you shall be sons and daughters to Me," Says the Lord Almighty. (2Co 6:15-18 NASB)


                          Next few verses have what, 5 or 6 references to the OT about as direct as you can get and all with deep lessons.

                          The law and the prophets not just the "Torah" brother.

                          Then the creation itself (like uneven oxen, everyday life) witness the precepts recorded in the law and the prophets.

                          I'm not sure what you are fishing for but the general concept that Paul referenced the OT in his writings is pretty much agreed on around here I would think. Not so hot a topic that way.

                          Peace,
                          Joe

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by manichunter View Post
                            When Paul wrote the text do not be unevenly yoked with unbelievers, was he just making a good suggestion or echoing a principle in and from the Torah?


                            For me, I personaly trust that he was speaking from the Torah as Paul often did to add proof to his inspirations. He used Torah to established spiritual principles to reinforce proper behaviour of believers in the NT all the time.


                            Moses was commanded by God to tell the Israelites not to commune with the heathens. God gave the reasons and consequences for doing so. Then we have Paul saying and conveying the same old message for the same reasons. This is Paul reinforcing a principle founded in Torah. Hence, is Paul not respecting and observing the principles established by the Torah. This means to me, that the spiritual principles of Torah are valid for believers to religously respect and observe if they so choose to learn and honor what could be discover in regards to their understanding and behaviour. This might not be everyone's personal choice, so what, everyone lives and dies to their own Lord.
                            Are you saying this in regard to Just Torah or the whole of the Tanakh?
                            Are you advocating observing it all or just parts?

                            Please explain what you mean by your statement
                            "everyone lives and dies to their own Lord."

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by bagofseed View Post
                              Are you saying this in regard to Just Torah or the whole of the Tanakh?
                              Are you advocating observing it all or just parts?

                              Please explain what you mean by your statement
                              "everyone lives and dies to their own Lord."
                              What I mean about everyone lives and dies to their own Lord is that we all stand as individual's as Scripture says it to our Lord we stand or fall. Our little dialogues and disagreements mean nothing in the grand scope of things. It is all about individual growth in maturity, understanding and love with our Lord.

                              Everything else we do is recreational.................. to a degree, at least for me.
                              Edify the brethren, love the brethren, and forgive the brethren until I have nothing left.

                              www.woc-church.org

                              Comment

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