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  • Role Models

    Hiya folk.

    I've been pondering the Christianity question (again!) and Seeker can't help me with my latest thoughts.

    You see, I'm looking for a role model. I've heard soooo many testimonials from people for whom God/Jesus saved them at the most desperate time of their lives. What I really haven't heard much of are stories of ordinary folk, for whom the biggest trial of their life is getting the laundry dry when it rains, or the toddler has had a bad week of tantrums, who found God when washing carrot puree out of the toddler's hair. Is this because God prioritises the saving of those in real need? Is it because people need to be desperate in order to need a higher power (no such thing as an atheist in a fox-hole!)? Seeker won't mind me sharing that his most powerful experience of God was at a particularly difficult time in his life, and the type of church that he is drawn to tends to pick up a lot of the congregation from our local rehab facility (the two things are not connected!) so most of the other Christians I know have found Christ through the depths of despair. From a psychological point of view, to keep our sanity do we not all turn to some form of "higher power" at those times as a way of making sense of what feels so unfair at the time? A sort of self-preservation instinct?

    I'm still finding the Bible difficult to read - I wish God had produced an autobiographical novel, as opposed to different view points that tell different parts of the story! At least Grisham has a start, a middle and an end, and so yes, the devil is tempting me away from the Good Book, to Grisham's latest good book! The Bible is just not talking to me right now, and I'm wondering if I should wait for God for a few months until my son is born, so that I can hit suicidal desperation point sometime in the wee small hours when it feels as though I've not slept for a month (because I probably won't have done!!!) Thing is, I'd to be honest, I'd rather skip the desperate and suicidal bit, but from the testimonials I've heard it sounds like an inevitability on the road to Him. Is that the case for everyone?

    Help please!

    Wildy.

  • #2
    Not at all! I got saved during one of the best periods of my life! Many people get saved...well, just because...

    Read the "testimonies" section in here. I`m sure there is a wide variety of scenarios for you to ponder, as to when people received salvation. And why.
    Romans 15:30 KJV 30Now I beseech you, brethren, for the Lord Jesus Christ's sake, and for the love of the Spirit, that ye strive together with me in your prayers to God for me;

    Comment


    • #3
      I think most people tend to find Jesus when they are in their desperate times, is because that's when we're REALLY weak and when our spirit is really paying attention and seeking. If that makes sense...?

      You can find Jesus, though, really, at any time you want. You just have to open your heart, and let Him in.

      Jesus will come into your heart, anytime you let Him. Whether it's when you're at the end of your rope, or if it's when your washing carrot puree out of your baby's hair.
      Why are you looking for love
      Why are you still searching as if I'm not enough
      To where will you go child
      Tell me where will you run
      To where will you run


      Comment


      • #4
        I've tried the testimonies page and got bogged down in a whole loada major crises!

        So why did you accept Christ if life was so great? (or is your story one I missed in the testimonies?)

        I'm struggling with the "need" for God in my life thing - if there's not a big enough hole to fill, do I need to fill it? I saw the scariest TV programme of my life last week, profiling three "Baby Bible Bashers" - basically child preachers. The parents of whom were the least Christian beings I have ever seen portrayed, according to my understanding of God and Jesus that is. It was chilling. If that is what a life in Christ means - shoot me now!

        Seriously - I know those portrayals are extreme - but those parents believe themselves to be guided by God. I may have few morals, but if that is what a misled God-shaped moral compass does, I'd be better off raising my kids using my own knowledge and steering clear of all organised religions. And yet I'm still here, drawn to wanting to understand and maybe have a relationship with God....... You're meant to be helping to save us damned (sorry mods, you probably hate me being so blunt about my status with God) - chuck me a line here!

        Wildy.

        Comment


        • #5
          Well GOD will actually forgive anyone. If they are willing to ask for it.

          However one of the reasons that you do not know the BIBLE is because you have to have to be saved. Is GOD then showing partiality? No! It is because learning the BIBLE is a flesh vs. spirit thing. You ask an athiest or non-beliver(flesh) what a certain scripture in the BIBLE is they will miss interpret and ask a follower(spirit) they will anwser to the scripture with a different point of view. Which is the right one.

          Actually my testimony is what I think you are looking for. Ok so my sophmore year.......
          So I started school as an unsaved person. I knew who GOD was but didn't know Him. However I had a great life. I mean it had its ups and downs but it was like whatever I'll heal. However my aunt kept pushing my mom and us to go to her church(our former church) we blew it off from september to about february-march(around there). But I really didn't care if we went I like my life I like whatever I did didn't bother me. Then we went the pastor was talking and he was talking about altercalls for people to go up. I drowned out what he was saying and started thinking....dude if you die rightnow your not gonna go to heaven do you really want that?.... I said no to myself and when he called people up and I just went up and gave my life to the LORD. However my walk isn't peachy it is hard. If you really want to know the challenges that I go through then I will tell you that later if you asks.... But now I am serving the LORD and am glad that I gave my life to Him. I wasn't going crazy or in a deep hole at the time I was a happy kid but I knew what would happen if I died then.

          Help?
          9For zeal for Your house has consumed me,
          And the reproaches of those who reproach You have fallen on me.
          Psalm 69:9

          4 You adulteresses, do you not know that friendship with the world is hostility toward God? Therefore whoever wishes to be a friend of the world makes himself an enemy of God.
          James 4:4

          19 You believe that God is one You do well; the demons also believe, and shudder
          James 2:19

          "5 Then the LORD saw that the wickedness of man was great on the earth, and that every intent of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually." Genesis 6:5

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Wilderness View Post
            I've tried the testimonies page and got bogged down in a whole loada major crises!

            So why did you accept Christ if life was so great? (or is your story one I missed in the testimonies?)



            I'm struggling with the "need" for God in my life thing - if there's not a big enough hole to fill, do I need to fill it? I saw the scariest TV programme of my life last week, profiling three "Baby Bible Bashers" - basically child preachers. The parents of whom were the least Christian beings I have ever seen portrayed, according to my understanding of God and Jesus that is. It was chilling. If that is what a life in Christ means - shoot me now!

            Seriously - I know those portrayals are extreme - but those parents believe themselves to be guided by God. I may have few morals, but if that is what a misled God-shaped moral compass does, I'd be better off raising my kids using my own knowledge and steering clear of all organised religions. And yet I'm still here, drawn to wanting to understand and maybe have a relationship with God....... You're meant to be helping to save us damned (sorry mods, you probably hate me being so blunt about my status with God) - chuck me a line here!

            Wildy.
            Please don't let people like that scare you off. That's what they're meant to do.

            Life in Christ means leading a life of love, giving, serving, compassion, tenderness, etc etc etc. That all comes after you've accepted Jesus as you Lord and Savior, and you decide to abide in Him and the Holy Spirit.

            Whether you feel you need Him or not, you really do. Or you wouldn't be here on this website, talking to us and looking for an answer.

            It's about Christ, not Christianity. In my opinion, just chuck out christianity, and just look at Christ. Look at Jesus and His love for you. Don't think about "Christianity" as a religion, just look at Jesus.

            What's your REAL question here? I'm sensing something deeper than what your saying.
            Why are you looking for love
            Why are you still searching as if I'm not enough
            To where will you go child
            Tell me where will you run
            To where will you run


            Comment


            • #7
              You can find Jesus, though, really, at any time you want. You just have to open your heart, and let Him in.
              Thanks. But who does?! And how?! And why?! It's kind of like Seeker's Uncle giving directions - turn left at the big tree. They were driving through the Forest of Dean surrounded by darned great big trees!!!!!!!

              [QUOTE I think most people tend to find Jesus when they are in their desperate times, is because that's when we're REALLY weak and when our spirit is really paying attention and seeking. If that makes sense...?QUOTE]

              Or they are desperate for an answer, any answer that helps them make sense of their circumstances, and not mentally equipped to analyse what is happening? This is what makes it so difficult. In desperate times we are all so vulnerable. Some folk will choose God, some folk will choose alcohol, some folk will choose pills, and others will sit and wait for the clouds to part and hope like hell that something changes soon before they end it all. Some folk will analyse where they went wrong in their life, critically analyse what they are responsible for and then go about putting the things right that they can control? How do I know that God is the answer in life, and not just a form of solace that some folk use as a crutch in times of need? The Bible tells us. Great. But the Muslims would tell me the only Truth is in the Koran! The human brain is such a complex organ that it can make us hallucinate, remember things that didn't really happen and all kinds of trippy stuff that can explain the "religious" experiences folk have. I was facscinated by the similarities between evangelical churches giving praise, and the local nightclub playing trance music and whipping their own audience into an almost religious state.........

              This is why I could use a role model. I mentioned ages ago, in jest that there should be an "adopt an unbeliever week" on this forum. I've just put myself up for adoption. Patient, grounded parent wanted to offer sane advice (no platitudes, cliches, or unexplained Bible references) from a similar background to troublesome, questioning child........ Apply here.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Wilderness View Post
                Thanks. But who does?! And how?! And why?! It's kind of like Seeker's Uncle giving directions - turn left at the big tree. They were driving through the Forest of Dean surrounded by darned great big trees!!!!!!!

                Who does? Anybody that feels, deep, deep, deep down, that there is something missing, that the world just can't give it.
                How? By getting down on your knees and saying "Lord, I want you in my life. I accept you as my Lord and Savior. Please come into my life and my heart, and take control." Or something along those lines.
                Why? Same as the "who does" question.

                [QUOTE I think most people tend to find Jesus when they are in their desperate times, is because that's when we're REALLY weak and when our spirit is really paying attention and seeking. If that makes sense...?QUOTE]

                Or they are desperate for an answer, any answer that helps them make sense of their circumstances, and not mentally equipped to analyse what is happening? This is what makes it so difficult. In desperate times we are all so vulnerable. Some folk will choose God, some folk will choose alcohol, some folk will choose pills, and others will sit and wait for the clouds to part and hope like hell that something changes soon before they end it all. Some folk will analyse where they went wrong in their life, critically analyse what they are responsible for and then go about putting the things right that they can control? How do I know that God is the answer in life, and not just a form of solace that some folk use as a crutch in times of need?

                Because people can't fake REAL changes in their life. Know what I mean? Somebody that has turned their heart to Jesus, and changed for the better, can't fake that.

                The Bible tells us. Great. But the Muslims would tell me the only Truth is in the Koran! The human brain is such a complex organ that it can make us hallucinate, remember things that didn't really happen and all kinds of trippy stuff that can explain the "religious" experiences folk have. I was facscinated by the similarities between evangelical churches giving praise, and the local nightclub playing trance music and whipping their own audience into an almost religious state.........

                This is why I could use a role model. I mentioned ages ago, in jest that there should be an "adopt an unbeliever week" on this forum. I've just put myself up for adoption. Patient, grounded parent wanted to offer sane advice (no platitudes, cliches, or unexplained Bible references) from a similar background to troublesome, questioning child........ Apply here.

                Well, I will definately help as best I can. And I know others can and will give you some good answers, probably better answers that what I can give you.
                Why are you looking for love
                Why are you still searching as if I'm not enough
                To where will you go child
                Tell me where will you run
                To where will you run


                Comment


                • #9
                  Hi Wildy,

                  When I came to the Lord, it wasn't at a time of crisis or specific 'felt need' per se. I heard the word of God, and it spoke to my heart, and I responded. In retrospect I can see my need for Christ but at the time, I wasn't at some sort of 'bottom' or anything like that.

                  There are a lot of dramatic testimonies but there are as many like me who simply believed the word when they heard it. A crisis is not necessary for a person to come to faith.

                  The Bible does have a beginning, middle, and end. There are many interesting and dramatic stories within the greater Story as well
                  Love In Christ,
                  Tanya






                  Comment


                  • #10
                    In my opinion, just chuck out christianity, and just look at Christ. Look at Jesus and His love for you. Don't think about "Christianity" as a religion, just look at Jesus.
                    Thanks for that. Good point. The only problem is in untangling the two. BUT....

                    However one of the reasons that you do not know the BIBLE is because you have to have to be saved.
                    Hmm. We're heading into circular logic here. To become a Christian I have to accept Christ, in order to understand His Word. To give my life to Christ I kinda want to know the chap first. I never slept with a guy on a first date, I'm not about to hand over the rest of my life to someone I don't know on the basis that I've heard he's a good bloke and will look after me.

                    Whether you feel you need Him or not, you really do. Or you wouldn't be here on this website, talking to us and looking for an answer.
                    Well do I? I keep wondering if I do. I've been hanging around here intermitently for a while having looked elsewhere for answers a few times (Evil Alpha group that nearly caused a stroke through the stress to name but one...) I mean I'd love another Radley handbag. I browse the website from time to time and covet the latest butter-soft leather offerings, but doesn't mean I need one....... It was that pop song from the 90's that ruined everything for me - "If you buy this record your life will be better" - will it? How do you know? What's wrong with my life? I keep coming back, but then I taunt myself with those pictures of handbags I can no-longer afford too......

                    I drowned out what he was saying and started thinking....dude if you die rightnow your not gonna go to heaven do you really want that?.... I said no to myself and when he called people up and I just went up and gave my life to the LORD.
                    DeadtoSelf - this sounds kinda flippant! I give more time to choosing which pair of shoes to buy than that! That was the rest of your life! How could you be so sure you were doing the right thing? I mean picking a lifestyle where you should be radically changing the way you lead your life on almost the toss of a coin? If I were to give my life to God I should:

                    Make time to pray each day
                    Sumit yet more of my life to obeying my hubby
                    Read the Bible every day
                    Live out my faith through deeds not words - so I need to do stuff for other folk for God - no Sunday benchwarmer here!
                    Do what God says I should do - whether I want to or not. If not I risk being drowned at sea like Jonah was threatened with.

                    Or, I can carry on as I am, in a life where some days I don't get to use a toilet on my own because the toddler is clinging to mummy like a limpet............ Taking on more stuff to do sounds like making my life harder for myself not easier. If I die tomorrow (there'e tempting the devil), I get into heaven on my husband's ticket (sorry forget the verse, cos someone is bound to want to flame me for that), so I don't lose on the heaven score either.

                    Also, what if I pick the wrong God? What if right now Allah is laughing at us all on this board?

                    Wildy.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Wilderness View Post
                      Thanks for that. Good point. The only problem is in untangling the two. BUT....

                      Not really, in a sense. Just put your focus on JESUS. Don't worry about what others have to say, just look at what Jesus Himself has to say.



                      Hmm. We're heading into circular logic here. To become a Christian I have to accept Christ, in order to understand His Word. To give my life to Christ I kinda want to know the chap first. I never slept with a guy on a first date, I'm not about to hand over the rest of my life to someone I don't know on the basis that I've heard he's a good bloke and will look after me.

                      Jesus is the only One where you can take that risk. Like I said below, what have you got to lose?

                      You can't equate Jesus to a man. (Yes, in body He became man, but in Spirit, He was still God)

                      You really do have to accept Christ to be able to understand His word.

                      that's why so many atheists can twist what the Bible says to suit their own explanation, because they don't have the Holy Spirit in them to tell them what it REALLY means.



                      Well do I? I keep wondering if I do. I've been hanging around here intermitently for a while having looked elsewhere for answers a few times (Evil Alpha group that nearly caused a stroke through the stress to name but one...) I mean I'd love another Radley handbag. I browse the website from time to time and covet the latest butter-soft leather offerings, but doesn't mean I need one....... It was that pop song from the 90's that ruined everything for me - "If you buy this record your life will be better" - will it? How do you know? What's wrong with my life? I keep coming back, but then I taunt myself with those pictures of handbags I can no-longer afford too......



                      DeadtoSelf - this sounds kinda flippant! I give more time to choosing which pair of shoes to buy than that! That was the rest of your life! How could you be so sure you were doing the right thing? I mean picking a lifestyle where you should be radically changing the way you lead your life on almost the toss of a coin? If I were to give my life to God I should:

                      Make time to pray each day
                      Sumit yet more of my life to obeying my hubby
                      Read the Bible every day
                      Live out my faith through deeds not words - so I need to do stuff for other folk for God - no Sunday benchwarmer here!
                      Do what God says I should do - whether I want to or not. If not I risk being drowned at sea like Jonah was threatened with.

                      Or, I can carry on as I am, in a life where some days I don't get to use a toilet on my own because the toddler is clinging to mummy like a limpet............ Taking on more stuff to do sounds like making my life harder for myself not easier. If I die tomorrow (there'e tempting the devil), I get into heaven on my husband's ticket (sorry forget the verse, cos someone is bound to want to flame me for that), so I don't lose on the heaven score either.

                      Also, what if I pick the wrong God? What if right now Allah is laughing at us all on this board?

                      Wildy.
                      My question is: what do you have to lose by accepting Jesus?

                      Only you can answer the question of if you need Jesus. I believe everybody does. But still, I really can't answer that question for you. You have to come to that decision.

                      Here's something to think about. (I know you said you didn't want scriptures, but Jesus is His scriptures.)

                      Matthew 11:28-29
                      28 Come to Me, all you who labor and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.
                      29 Take my yoke upon you and learn from Me, for I am gentle and lowly in Heart, and you will find rest for your souls

                      I don't know about you, but not even my dad or my husband can offer me that. that right there, if I wasn't already a Christian, would make me accept Jesus.

                      Picking the wrong God? God IS the only God. And those are not my words. Those are God's words. So if you pick Him, you can't choose the wrong God, because He IS the one and only TRUE God.
                      Why are you looking for love
                      Why are you still searching as if I'm not enough
                      To where will you go child
                      Tell me where will you run
                      To where will you run


                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Wilderness View Post
                        I've tried the testimonies page and got bogged down in a whole loada major crises!

                        So why did you accept Christ if life was so great? (or is your story one I missed in the testimonies?)

                        I'm struggling with the "need" for God in my life thing - if there's not a big enough hole to fill, do I need to fill it? I saw the scariest TV programme of my life last week, profiling three "Baby Bible Bashers" - basically child preachers. The parents of whom were the least Christian beings I have ever seen portrayed, according to my understanding of God and Jesus that is. It was chilling. If that is what a life in Christ means - shoot me now!

                        Seriously - I know those portrayals are extreme - but those parents believe themselves to be guided by God. I may have few morals, but if that is what a misled God-shaped moral compass does, I'd be better off raising my kids using my own knowledge and steering clear of all organised religions. And yet I'm still here, drawn to wanting to understand and maybe have a relationship with God....... You're meant to be helping to save us damned (sorry mods, you probably hate me being so blunt about my status with God) - chuck me a line here!

                        Wildy.
                        It is not about accepting Christ to make ones life on earth better. Although it can in a different sense make our lives better, but many christians go through so much more persecution just because they are Christian. Christ made my life better not because of what I got out of it in this world, but because I know that I am free from sin through Jesus and I will spend eternity with God. The things of this world don't matter as much to me anymore. They are only temporary things, but of course I want to still live a happy life.

                        It is not about just giving this 'Jesus thing' a go to get a kick out of it or to see what you can get out of it.

                        Jesus Christ will save us from the wrath to come because God's wrath abides on sinners. The only way we can escape God's wrath is to be washed clean in the blood of Jesus, who shed his blood for mankind. We broke God's law(sinned) and the sinless Jesus Christ paid our fine(ransom) so we could be set free. That is an awesome God showing unfathomable love.

                        Would you sell your eyes for a million dollars? Probably not
                        If you wouldn't sell your eyes for a million dollars and they are only windows of your soul, how much more important must your soul be since your soul lives forever?

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Those are some interesting thoughts. I am answering because I thought of a role model that might be interesting to look at in the Bible. Maybe there will be others more worthy than mine too.

                          Anyway, I offer the account of Philip and the Ethiopian Eunuch. You can read the account in Acts 8:26-39. I don't know what possessed me to offer a Eunuch as a role model for you. Anyway, read it through and I think you will see why I offered it.

                          God Bless!
                          Watchinginawe

                          I Samuel 3:10 And the LORD came, and stood, and called as at other times, Samuel, Samuel. Then Samuel answered, Speak; for thy servant heareth.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Wilderness View Post
                            ...
                            I've been pondering the Christianity question ...
                            You see, I'm looking for a role model. .... most of the other Christians I know have found Christ through the depths of despair. ... The Bible is just not talking to me right now, and I'm wondering if I should wait for God for a few months until my son is born, so that I can hit suicidal desperation point sometime in the wee small hours when it feels as though I've not slept for a month (because I probably won't have done!!!) Thing is, I'd to be honest, I'd rather skip the desperate and suicidal bit, but from the testimonials I've heard it sounds like an inevitability on the road to Him. Is that the case for everyone?

                            Help please!

                            Wildy.
                            Hello Wildy,

                            If you are serious in looking for a Christian role model, go to your library and check out some Christian biographies. Many missionaries were Christians from early in life. Look for the true stories, not novels. You might find some of those more engaging than John Grisham, and certainly they will give you something real to think about.

                            Your neighborhood experience may be coloring your expectations. A high percentage of the Christians I know have been so from early in life, without drama and desperation.

                            There are many good reasons to come to Christ early, and to avoid the suicidal depressions. What kind of life do you plan to offer your baby son? What environment will he live in? What spiritual strength will you build into him, so that he will be able to face the crises in his life? I have unbelieving relatives who have their children in Christian schools because they want the values that are offered only there.

                            I wish you well.
                            Blessings,

                            Road Warrior


                            Proverbs 4:23
                            23 Guard your heart above all else,
                            for it determines the course of your life.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Wilderness View Post
                              Hiya folk.

                              I've been pondering the Christianity question (again!) and Seeker can't help me with my latest thoughts.

                              You see, I'm looking for a role model. I've heard soooo many testimonials from people for whom God/Jesus saved them at the most desperate time of their lives. What I really haven't heard much of are stories of ordinary folk, for whom the biggest trial of their life is getting the laundry dry when it rains, or the toddler has had a bad week of tantrums, who found God when washing carrot puree out of the toddler's hair. Is this because God prioritises the saving of those in real need? Is it because people need to be desperate in order to need a higher power (no such thing as an atheist in a fox-hole!)? Seeker won't mind me sharing that his most powerful experience of God was at a particularly difficult time in his life, and the type of church that he is drawn to tends to pick up a lot of the congregation from our local rehab facility (the two things are not connected!) so most of the other Christians I know have found Christ through the depths of despair. From a psychological point of view, to keep our sanity do we not all turn to some form of "higher power" at those times as a way of making sense of what feels so unfair at the time? A sort of self-preservation instinct?

                              I'm still finding the Bible difficult to read - I wish God had produced an autobiographical novel, as opposed to different view points that tell different parts of the story! At least Grisham has a start, a middle and an end, and so yes, the devil is tempting me away from the Good Book, to Grisham's latest good book! The Bible is just not talking to me right now, and I'm wondering if I should wait for God for a few months until my son is born, so that I can hit suicidal desperation point sometime in the wee small hours when it feels as though I've not slept for a month (because I probably won't have done!!!) Thing is, I'd to be honest, I'd rather skip the desperate and suicidal bit, but from the testimonials I've heard it sounds like an inevitability on the road to Him. Is that the case for everyone?

                              Help please!

                              Wildy.
                              The reason many people find Him in hard times is because they realise how totally lost they are without Him, how utterly and completely they need Him. Hitting a low seems to work pretty well in this respect - but certainly isn't required. Personally - God actually waited until He'd already helped me (although of course, I thought I was doing it on my own) out of my darkest depths and was back on my feet again, before He showed me the Light. Misery isn't a necessity
                              Call to Me and I will answer you, and will tell you great and hidden things that you have not known. Jeremiah 33:3
                              You put the stars in the sky and you know them by name, You see the depths of my heart and You love me the same, You are amazing, God.
                              I do not 'hope' I am saved and I do not 'think' I am saved, I know it with an absolute conviction. I know that I am saved just as I know that I think and I know that I feel. I am purchased and sealed, His possession.

                              Comment

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