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Job 4:12-21 Need An Explanation, Please

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  • Job 4:12-21 Need An Explanation, Please

    Job 4:12-21 (King James Version)

    12Now a thing was secretly brought to me, and mine ear received a little thereof.

    13In thoughts from the visions of the night, when deep sleep falleth on men,

    14Fear came upon me, and trembling, which made all my bones to shake.

    15Then a spirit passed before my face; the hair of my flesh stood up:

    16It stood still, but I could not discern the form thereof: an image was before mine eyes, there was silence, and I heard a voice, saying,

    17Shall mortal man be more just than God? shall a man be more pure than his maker?

    18Behold, he put no trust in his servants; and his angels he charged with folly:

    19How much less in them that dwell in houses of clay, whose foundation is in the dust, which are crushed before the moth?

    20They are destroyed from morning to evening: they perish for ever without any regarding it.

    21Doth not their excellency which is in them go away? they die, even without wisdom.


    I need someone to explain this passage, please, and I`d also like to know if there is any reference to this passage, in the Bible.

    Thanks in advance.
    Romans 15:30 KJV 30Now I beseech you, brethren, for the Lord Jesus Christ's sake, and for the love of the Spirit, that ye strive together with me in your prayers to God for me;

  • #2
    Greetings...

    This is Eliphaz The first of Job's three friends who come to attempt to explain to him WHY Job has been visited with his tribulations...

    To understand his words, you need to be aware of who Eliphaz is and what he believed...

    Eliphaz was Esau's first born with Adah. An assassin and the father of Amalek the ancestral enemy of Israel - He was bought off by Jacob (the guy he was supposed to assasinate).

    Eliphaz has NO honor. He's trying to convince Job that he is being punished for some sin.

    Eliphaz is basicly saying:

    Oh dude! You've got to believe me! I saw it in a dream! I was SO Scared! It MUST be real!

    But Job is no fool - he aint buying it. Eliphaz is basicly being a false prophet - and a poor one at that...

    Comment


    • #3
      Greetings to you, and thanks for the background information... now I understand...
      Romans 15:30 KJV 30Now I beseech you, brethren, for the Lord Jesus Christ's sake, and for the love of the Spirit, that ye strive together with me in your prayers to God for me;

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by menJesus View Post
        Job 4:12-21 (King James Version)

        12Now a thing was secretly brought to me, and mine ear received a little thereof.

        13In thoughts from the visions of the night, when deep sleep falleth on men,

        14Fear came upon me, and trembling, which made all my bones to shake.

        15Then a spirit passed before my face; the hair of my flesh stood up:

        16It stood still, but I could not discern the form thereof: an image was before mine eyes, there was silence, and I heard a voice, saying,

        17Shall mortal man be more just than God? shall a man be more pure than his maker?

        18Behold, he put no trust in his servants; and his angels he charged with folly:

        19How much less in them that dwell in houses of clay, whose foundation is in the dust, which are crushed before the moth?

        20They are destroyed from morning to evening: they perish for ever without any regarding it.

        21Doth not their excellency which is in them go away? they die, even without wisdom.


        I need someone to explain this passage, please, and I`d also like to know if there is any reference to this passage, in the Bible.

        Thanks in advance.
        menJesus greetings

        Totally disagree with Kandaje.

        This is God's charge against Job. It is also Elihu's charge against Job. Elihu claimed to be speaking in God's place.

        First, the method that God uses to speak to men is just as Eliphaz describes it.

        Job 32:14-18 "For God speaketh once, yea twice, yet man perceiveth it not. In a dream, in a vision of the night, when deep sleep falleth upon men, in slumberings upon the bed: Then he openeth the ears of men, and sealeth their instruction, that he may withdraw man from his purpose, and hide pride from man. He keepeth back his soul from the pit, and his life from perishing by the sword."

        Job said, Job 7:14 "Then thou scarest me with dreams, and terrifiest me through visions:"

        Elihu's charge against Job. Job 35:2 "Thinkest thou this to be right, that thou saidst, My righteousness is more than God's?

        God's charge against Job. Job 40:8 "Wilt thou also disannul my judgment? wilt thou condemn me, that thou mayest be righteous?

        The Spirit's charge through Eliphaz, Job 4:17 "Shall mortal man be more just than God? shall a man be more pure than his maker?

        In Jesus Christ, terrell

        Comment


        • #5
          But, gallison, it was not the Spirit, it was "a spirit"...
          Romans 15:30 KJV 30Now I beseech you, brethren, for the Lord Jesus Christ's sake, and for the love of the Spirit, that ye strive together with me in your prayers to God for me;

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by menJesus View Post
            But, gallison, it was not the Spirit, it was "a spirit"...
            I think it may have been a demon that came on him. "Can a man be just before God?" Yes he can! Yet, the spirit did not qualify that statement. And great fear was on the man. The hair of his head stood up. Abraham was "just" before God as he believed God and God counted it to him as righteousness. Does Satan not still ask that question to many of God's servants? "Does God really accept you? Your sin is great. Can a man such as you be just before a Holy God?"

            God himself said that Job was blameless and a servant of God and that Job was the most unique man in all the world! He was upright. He hated evil. Job was a righteous man and just before God to the point that God bragged on Job to Satan.
            Matt 9:13
            13 "But go and learn what this means: ' I DESIRE COMPASSION,AND NOT SACRIFICE,' for I did not come to call the righteous, but sinners."
            NASU

            Comment


            • #7
              "16It stood still, but I could not discern the form thereof: an image was before mine eyes, there was silence, and I heard a voice, saying,"

              If I saw something like that, I dare say my hair would stand up, too!
              Romans 15:30 KJV 30Now I beseech you, brethren, for the Lord Jesus Christ's sake, and for the love of the Spirit, that ye strive together with me in your prayers to God for me;

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by menJesus View Post
                If I saw something like that, I dare say my hair would stand up, too!
                If you have long hair, then wouldn't that be a sight to see!
                Matt 9:13
                13 "But go and learn what this means: ' I DESIRE COMPASSION,AND NOT SACRIFICE,' for I did not come to call the righteous, but sinners."
                NASU

                Comment


                • #9
                  My hair is not too long - I would look like an angry porcupine!
                  Romans 15:30 KJV 30Now I beseech you, brethren, for the Lord Jesus Christ's sake, and for the love of the Spirit, that ye strive together with me in your prayers to God for me;

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by menJesus View Post
                    But, gallison, it was not the Spirit, it was "a spirit"...
                    menJesus greetings

                    No, Spirit was not capitalized, but then this was Eliphaz speaking. To him it was just a spirit, he did not know God.

                    The same Hebrew word for Spirit, ruwach is used in Genesis 1:2 "And the earth was without form, and void: and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters."

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by tgallison View Post
                      menJesus greetings

                      No, Spirit was not capitalized, but then this was Eliphaz speaking. To him it was just a spirit, he did not know God.

                      The same Hebrew word for Spirit, ruwach is used in Genesis 1:2 "And the earth was without form, and void: and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters."
                      It is also the same Hebrew word used in the following passage.

                      Judg 9:23
                      23 Then God sent an evil spirit between Abimelech and the men of Shechem; and the men of Shechem dealt treacherously with Abimelech,
                      NASB

                      Spirits can be good or evil. This one asked a question that suggested no man can be just before God. The spirit does make very valid points. But we know a man can be just before God as Abraham was righteous and we are righteous. Having said that, I am open to another interpretation if warranted.
                      Matt 9:13
                      13 "But go and learn what this means: ' I DESIRE COMPASSION,AND NOT SACRIFICE,' for I did not come to call the righteous, but sinners."
                      NASU

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Brother Mark View Post
                        It is also the same Hebrew word used in the following passage.

                        Judg 9:23
                        23 Then God sent an evil spirit between Abimelech and the men of Shechem; and the men of Shechem dealt treacherously with Abimelech,
                        NASB

                        Spirits can be good or evil. This one asked a question that suggested no man can be just before God. The spirit does make very valid points. But we know a man can be just before God as Abraham was righteous and we are righteous. Having said that, I am open to another interpretation if warranted.
                        Brother Mark Greetings

                        The Book of Job does not say evil spirit, just a spirit.

                        I do not know what translation you use, but mine says more just than God, more pure than his maker.

                        That is not the same as righteous before God.

                        And it is the same charge that God made of Job. (Wilt thou condemn me, that thou mayest be righteous?)

                        How do you reply to God's charge against Job?

                        In Jesus Christ, terrell

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by menJesus View Post
                          Job 4:12-21 (King James Version)

                          12Now a thing was secretly brought to me, and mine ear received a little thereof.

                          13In thoughts from the visions of the night, when deep sleep falleth on men,

                          14Fear came upon me, and trembling, which made all my bones to shake.

                          15Then a spirit passed before my face; the hair of my flesh stood up:

                          16It stood still, but I could not discern the form thereof: an image was before mine eyes, there was silence, and I heard a voice, saying,

                          17Shall mortal man be more just than God? shall a man be more pure than his maker?

                          18Behold, he put no trust in his servants; and his angels he charged with folly:

                          19How much less in them that dwell in houses of clay, whose foundation is in the dust, which are crushed before the moth?

                          20They are destroyed from morning to evening: they perish for ever without any regarding it.

                          21Doth not their excellency which is in them go away? they die, even without wisdom.


                          I need someone to explain this passage, please, and I`d also like to know if there is any reference to this passage, in the Bible.

                          Thanks in advance.
                          In Chp 4 Eliphaz, in his hypocrisy, begins to mock Job for the very virtues he had been praised for. Christ was mocked and reviled in a similar way (Luke 23:35-37)

                          Eliphaz could not understand why God would allow a righteous man to suffer.

                          Verses 13-21 typify, with Job's friends, teachers of false doctrines. They pretend to hear hidden words from God in order to confuse the weak and to 'cast a veil of reverence' over their preaching.

                          "A false witness shall perish..." Prov. 21:28

                          "For I have not sent them, saith the LORD, yet they prophesy a lie in my name;..." Jer. 27:15

                          "My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge:..." Hosea 4:6

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Teke View Post
                            In Chp 4 Eliphaz, in his hypocrisy, begins to mock Job for the very virtues he had been praised for. Christ was mocked and reviled in a similar way (Luke 23:35-37)

                            Eliphaz could not understand why God would allow a righteous man to suffer.

                            Verses 13-21 typify, with Job's friends, teachers of false doctrines. They pretend to hear hidden words from God in order to confuse the weak and to 'cast a veil of reverence' over their preaching.
                            Teke Greetings

                            You are charging Eliphaz with lying, and you are doing so in order to defend Job.

                            Eliphaz said, a spirit spoke and said, shall mortal man be more just than God? shall a man be more pure than his maker?

                            Is it possible for a mortal man to be more just than God? Was this a lie?

                            terrell

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by menJesus View Post
                              Job 4:12-21 (King James Version)


                              20They are destroyed from morning to evening: they perish for ever without any regarding it.

                              21Doth not their excellency which is in them go away? they die, even without wisdom.


                              I need someone to explain this passage, please, and I`d also like to know if there is any reference to this passage, in the Bible.

                              Thanks in advance.
                              menJesus greetings

                              I believe God spoke to Job regarding verses 20 and 21.

                              Job 38:15 "And from the wicked their light is withholden, and the high arm shall be broken"

                              The Lord asked Job, Job 40:9 "Hast thou an arm like God?--?"

                              Job 40:14 "Then will I also confess unto thee that thine own right hand can save thee."

                              Eliphaz said, the spirit said, "they die even without wisdom".

                              IMO the light is Jesus and wisdom is Jesus or the Spirit.

                              Job said, Job 28:12 "But where shall wisdom be found?--?"

                              Elihu said, Job 33:27-28 "He looketh upon men, and if any say, I have sinned, and perverted that which was right, and it profited me not; he will deliver his soul from going into the pit, and his life shall see the light."

                              Elihu said, Job 33:33 "If not, hearken unto me: hold thy peace, and I shall teach thee wisdom.

                              The Lord said, Job 38:36 "Who hath put wisdom in the inward parts? or who hath given understanding to the heart?"

                              Proverbs 3:18 "She is a tree of life to them that lay hold upon her: and happy is every one that retaineth her."

                              I realize that wisdom is in the feminine gender and I don't know Hebrew. But she founded the earth, and so did the Word. Also Adam was created both male and female in one person.

                              Proverbs 3:19 "The Lord by wisdom hath founded the earth; by understanding he established the heavens."

                              Proverbs 8:4 "Unto you, O men, I call; and my voice is to the sons of man."

                              Proverbs 8:34 "Blessed is the man that heareth me, watching daily at my gates, waiting at the posts of my doors."

                              Revelation 3:20 "Behold I stand at the door and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me."

                              John 10:9 "I am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved, and shall go in and out, and find pasture."

                              The Book of Job is not about a man suffering in patience, it is about God and his dealings with man. Man was created perfect and upright, had a perfect relationship with God until he fell. Job fell and he needed a redeemer to keep his soul from the pit.

                              Job 33:24 "Then he is gracious unto him, and saith, Deliver him from going down to the pit: I have found a ransom."

                              Then in verse 25 we see how man is born again. John 3:4 "Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter a second time into his mother's womb, and be born?"

                              Job 33:25 "His flesh shall be fresher than a child's: he shall return to the days of his youth."

                              How can your flesh be fresher than a child's, except in the mother's womb. A picture of rebirth. Of salvation.

                              terrell

                              Comment

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