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How many times did satan fall?

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  • How many times did satan fall?

    The question speaks for itself. So, how many times?

  • #2
    Lucifer fell once. We are still counting the bounces.
    Christianity is a leap of faith, not the abandonment of logic.

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    • #3
      Originally posted by 1of7000 View Post
      Lucifer fell once. We are still counting the bounces.


      OK. So when was that one time, according to Scripture?

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      • #4
        Since all creation was viewed as good in Genesis 1:31, I'm going to assume that he fell some time just before the fall of humanity.

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        • #5
          Between Genesis 1:1 and Genesis 1:2.

          In vs 2 "was" should be translated "became" and then describes life after the chaos.
          Christianity is a leap of faith, not the abandonment of logic.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Xel'Naga View Post
            assume

            Can you say that here?
            Christianity is a leap of faith, not the abandonment of logic.

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            • #7
              According to Xel'Naga's view, and 1of7000's view, so far we have satan falling twice, and not just one time.


              1of7000, suppose you pinpoint with Scriptures when this fall occured.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by 1of7000 View Post
                Between Genesis 1:1 and Genesis 1:2.

                In vs 2 "was" should be translated "became" and then describes life after the chaos.
                can't get much pinpointier than that
                Christianity is a leap of faith, not the abandonment of logic.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by 1of7000 View Post
                  can't get much pinpointier than that


                  1of7000, Gen 1:2 makes no mention whatsoever of the fall of satan. Unfortunately you haven't pinpointed anything. Suppose someone new to the Bible were to read that verse, are you telling me that they could pinpoint the fall of satan within that verse? Don't you think that you would need to at least link that verse to the fall of satan somewhere else in the Bible? That's the pinpoint I'm looking for, the link that proves this occured in Gen 1:2. BTW, this thread is not about whether there was a gap or not, that's not the point I'm trying to make. So I'm not planning on arguing that point, because that's not the point I'm trying to make. I realize that it probably doesn't make much sense yet, but it will. We have to determine how many times that satan has fallen, before my point will even begin to make sense. BTW, I believe the Bible teaches satan fell only one time, and if Xel'Naga's view is what I am thinking it is, then I'm pretty much in agreement with Xel'Naga's view, that's assuming that view is what I'm thinking it is.

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                  • #10
                    I stated that it was between the verses. Please read what I wrote not what you think I wrote.

                    Lucifer's fall was the cause of the "becoming without form and void". The "Gap "is a store at the mall.

                    You seem more interested in defending your theology than understanding another point of view.
                    Christianity is a leap of faith, not the abandonment of logic.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by 1of7000 View Post
                      You seem more interested in defending your theology than understanding another point of view.
                      Trust me on this one, I understand your view more that you could ever know. So what you stated is untrue. I'm not trying to prove my theology, I'm simply wanting to see how many different views there are to satan's fall, and if that means that he fell more than once, or if all of these views are talking about one fall, but somehow occuring at different times from one another. And if the latter 2 are true, then which one is the truth?

                      I can see from my recent posts to you, that perhaps I didn't make myself as clear as I had hoped. Do you perhaps base your postion on Ezekiel ch 28? Is that the fall you see in Gen 1:2? Or from perhaps another book and chapter? That's what I'm trying to find out.

                      1of7000, also I was thinking, and I hope you didn't misunderstand me, I don't mind if you want to use Gen 1:2 to show support of your position. I just don't want it to become a gap against no gap type of thread.
                      Last edited by divaD; May 19th 2008, 05:59 AM. Reason: Trying to futher clarify something to a member.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by divaD View Post
                        BTW, I believe the Bible teaches satan fell only one time, and if Xel'Naga's view is what I am thinking it is, then I'm pretty much in agreement with Xel'Naga's view, that's assuming that view is what I'm thinking it is.
                        We're in agreement.

                        The other view is that of the Gap Theory, which has no biblical support whatsoever.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by divaD View Post
                          The question speaks for itself. So, how many times?

                          The question is faulty. It was Lucifer that fell and once he fell, he was fallen. This means to fall from grace, to fall from his position in heaven as a cherub. That occurred once.


                          He continues in his "fall" by compounding his wickedness and sins and he will not stop until God destroys him.


                          And yes, Lucifer fell before God created human beings.
                          1Peter 3:15
                          (BBE) But give honour to Christ in your hearts as your Lord; and be ready at any time when you are questioned about the hope which is in you, to give an answer in the fear of the Lord and without pride;

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Naphal View Post
                            The question is faulty. It was Lucifer that fell and once he fell, he was fallen. This means to fall from grace, to fall from his
                            position in heaven as a cherub. That occurred once.


                            Naphal, technically this is true. So when did that occur and what were the consequences of that fall from grace? What were God's actions concerning this fall from grace concerning lucifer? Also I just noticed the last part of your post. You said he fell before humans were made. How do we know?

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by divaD View Post
                              Naphal, technically this is true. So when did that occur and what were the consequences of that fall from grace?

                              We aren't told specifically when it occurred. We have to study the scriptures and form an opinion based on what we read. Since Satan was the serpent in the garden and that is already a negative stereotyped animal and was tempting Adam and Eve to disobey God, I believe that shows he was already in a fallen state before they fell.

                              The consequences of his fall was a name change and a loss of that position in heaven as well as a death sentence.



                              What were God's actions concerning this fall from grace concerning lucifer?
                              I don't know what literal actions God took. We know that Satan was not barred from heaven as he was there in Job's time and shown there in Rev 12.



                              Also I just noticed the last part of your post. You said he fell before humans were made. How do we know?
                              See my first answer above.
                              1Peter 3:15
                              (BBE) But give honour to Christ in your hearts as your Lord; and be ready at any time when you are questioned about the hope which is in you, to give an answer in the fear of the Lord and without pride;

                              Comment

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