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The free (?) gift of salvation

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  • The free (?) gift of salvation

    I've always wondered where this idea came from. Maybe there's a passage I'm not remembering.

    Seems to me that nothing is free, even Jesus. Especially Jesus! He want's everything you are. How is that free? It seems to be a big disservice to tell non-believers about the free gift of salvation.

    The Antichrist will be taught and raised by the christian church. He will come from your own, not from the "outsiders". "Thus saith the Eternal, Behold, I will raise up evil against thee out of thine own house. . . ."

  • #2
    It's free because we couldn't pay for it. He paid it for us.
    This IGNORE button is by far one of the most useful tools I've used to keep my peace while navigating through some of the madness.

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    • #3
      Originally posted by -SEEKING- View Post
      It's free because we couldn't pay for it. He paid it for us.
      Just because someone else paid our debts didn't make salvation free. Nor does it imply that it costs us nothing.

      The Antichrist will be taught and raised by the christian church. He will come from your own, not from the "outsiders". "Thus saith the Eternal, Behold, I will raise up evil against thee out of thine own house. . . ."

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      • #4
        Originally posted by Scubadude View Post
        Just because someone else paid our debts didn't make salvation free. Nor does it imply that it costs us nothing.
        Well it's not free, it cost Jesus His life. But yes it absolutely does imply that is cost us nothing. Did you pay for your salvation? Or was it given to you?
        This IGNORE button is by far one of the most useful tools I've used to keep my peace while navigating through some of the madness.

        Comment


        • #5
          Salvation though faith is a free gift from God. We as believers did not pay the price it cost for us to obtain this salvation, Jesus paid the cost owed to God for our benefit. Had Jesus not bore the cup of inequity for us we would all fail at the task the same way we all have failed at the task of living sinless lives. Salvation is a free gift because we deserve eternal damnation, not eternal life. We failed, but Jesus succeeded and we get the reward. Sounds like a free gift to me.
          I am a Christian man in the Devil's land, spreading the gospel man to man.
          Have you laid your burdens down?

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          • #6
            Originally posted by -SEEKING- View Post
            Well it's not free, it cost Jesus His life. But yes it absolutely does imply that is cost us nothing. Did you pay for your salvation? Or was it given to you?
            Both. It was given to me because I couldn't die for myself. And it cost me everything because it did. I gave him everything. The last time that happened I declared bankruptcy. Not spiritual, though that analogy would work here.

            Did you make your commitment to Jesus without thought of the cost?

            The Antichrist will be taught and raised by the christian church. He will come from your own, not from the "outsiders". "Thus saith the Eternal, Behold, I will raise up evil against thee out of thine own house. . . ."

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Scubadude View Post
              Both. It was given to me because I couldn't die for myself. And it cost me everything because it did. I gave him everything. The last time that happened I declared bankruptcy. Not spiritual, though that analogy would work here.

              Did you make your commitment to Jesus without thought of the cost?
              Yep..............
              This IGNORE button is by far one of the most useful tools I've used to keep my peace while navigating through some of the madness.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by TrustingFollower View Post
                Salvation though faith is a free gift from God. We as believers did not pay the price it cost for us to obtain this salvation, Jesus paid the cost owed to God for our benefit. Had Jesus not bore the cup of inequity for us we would all fail at the task the same way we all have failed at the task of living sinless lives. Salvation is a free gift because we deserve eternal damnation, not eternal life. We failed, but Jesus succeeded and we get the reward.

                It sounds like you are equivocating on the use of the word free. I don't disagree with anything you've written. Very nice.

                No why so many Loto winners can't handle the money, because the incredible wealth and power didn't cost them anything (except a buck). No real personal cost.

                Why are we told to count the cost?

                The Antichrist will be taught and raised by the christian church. He will come from your own, not from the "outsiders". "Thus saith the Eternal, Behold, I will raise up evil against thee out of thine own house. . . ."

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by -SEEKING- View Post
                  Yep..............

                  And...........?

                  The Antichrist will be taught and raised by the christian church. He will come from your own, not from the "outsiders". "Thus saith the Eternal, Behold, I will raise up evil against thee out of thine own house. . . ."

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Scubadude View Post
                    And...........?
                    So far so good........
                    This IGNORE button is by far one of the most useful tools I've used to keep my peace while navigating through some of the madness.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Scubadude View Post
                      It sounds like you are equivocating on the use of the word free. I don't disagree with anything you've written. Very nice.

                      No why so many Loto winners can't handle the money, because the incredible wealth and power didn't cost them anything (except a buck). No real personal cost.

                      Why are we told to count the cost?
                      Once we except the gift it does not relinquish us of any responsibility for what we obtained. Just like the loto winners you mentioned, they have a responsibility to manage the money. If they fail to manage the money it will be gone without them knowing where it went. We to have a responsibility to manage the gift or winnings we receive. It will cost us time, friends, jobs, posessions the same as it costs the loto winner that got a winfall. With great reward comes great responsilibity.
                      I am a Christian man in the Devil's land, spreading the gospel man to man.
                      Have you laid your burdens down?

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Scubadude View Post
                        Just because someone else paid our debts didn't make salvation free. Nor does it imply that it costs us nothing.
                        That's right. It's free for us, but it cost Christ so much. Christ stepped out of eternity and into time, took on human flesh (He had been spirit for all eternity past), and now will pay ETERNALLY for our sins. Some think all of sin was paid for in 6 hours....not so. He gave up certain aspects of his eternality to pay for our sins. He will be confined to a resurrected body for all eternity future (I John 3:2). He will subject Himself to the Father when all things have been accomplished (I Cor 15:24-28). This word 'subject' is a military term, which means 'to rank under'. Christ will voluntarily 'rank himself under' the Father. Don't you now appreciate more the price that was paid for you?

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Scubadude View Post
                          Both. It was given to me because I couldn't die for myself. And it cost me everything because it did. I gave him everything. The last time that happened I declared bankruptcy. Not spiritual, though that analogy would work here.

                          Did you make your commitment to Jesus without thought of the cost?
                          The offer of the gift of salvation is free. Jesus paid the price in full so we can't pay for it. But accepting the gift comes at a cost: our lives. I think that's what you're saying as well. We have to deny ourselves and give our lives to Him in order to receive the gift He freely offers.

                          Rev 22:17 And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that heareth say, Come. And let him that is athirst come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely.

                          Matt 10
                          38And he that taketh not his cross, and followeth after me, is not worthy of me.
                          39He that findeth his life shall lose it: and he that loseth his life for my sake shall find it.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Scubadude View Post
                            I've always wondered where this idea came from. Maybe there's a passage I'm not remembering.

                            Seems to me that nothing is free, even Jesus. Especially Jesus! He want's everything you are. How is that free? It seems to be a big disservice to tell non-believers about the free gift of salvation.
                            It seems to me that salvation is both free and infinitely expensive, kind of like zero divided by zero yields all sorts of mathematical quirks.

                            It's free in the sense we don't have to do anything to earn it, it's given to us as a gift by grace. The thief on the cross beside Jesus did nothing more than ask for it, and received it.

                            At the same time you're right that following Jesus can cost us everything, but even then we might regard it as a trade rather than a simple surrender. It's a surrender in human terms but in eternal terms it's trading something that passes for something that never passes.

                            Mat 13:44-46 NKJV "Again, the kingdom of heaven is like treasure hidden in a field, which a man found and hid; and for joy over it he goes and sells all that he has and buys that field. (45) "Again, the kingdom of heaven is like a merchant seeking beautiful pearls, (46) who, when he had found one pearl of great price, went and sold all that he had and bought it.

                            If we liken salvation to that pearl of great price then to give up everything we own in order to acquire it isn't a big sacrifice to make.


                            We might also argue that it's possible to accept Jesus as our Saviour but then not walk the walk if it starts to get difficult. Without wishing to go into the subject of OSAS/NOSAS, Paul suggests in 1 Corinthians that our works will be tested and that if our work is burned we will lose, but still be saved.

                            1Co 3:11-15 NKJV For no other foundation can anyone lay than that which is laid, which is Jesus Christ. (12) Now if anyone builds on this foundation with gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, straw, (13) each one's work will become clear; for the Day will declare it, because it will be revealed by fire; and the fire will test each one's work, of what sort it is. (14) If anyone's work which he has built on it endures, he will receive a reward. (15) If anyone's work is burned, he will suffer loss; but he himself will be saved, yet so as through fire.

                            We could interpret this as saying that we might "just make it" into heaven as if fleeing a fire with nothing but the clothes on our backs, if our works aren't "up to standard".
                            24 August 2013 - I've decided to take a break from a number of internet forums, including this one, for my own reasons.
                            I expect to be back at some time in the future, although at present don't know when that will be.
                            I've been here just a few days shy of six years, and those six years have been greatly blessed.

                            ---

                            1Jn 4:1 NKJV Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits, whether they are of God; because many false prophets have gone out into the world.
                            1Th 5:21-22 NKJV Test all things; hold fast what is good. (22) Abstain from every form of evil.



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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Scubadude View Post
                              Both. It was given to me because I couldn't die for myself. And it cost me everything because it did. I gave him everything. The last time that happened I declared bankruptcy. Not spiritual, though that analogy would work here.

                              Did you make your commitment to Jesus without thought of the cost?

                              Jesus the Christ accomplished what we could never do.. and that was to walk perfectly in the flesh.. and fulfill everything that we couldn't fulfill because the 'flesh' is weak.. and thats why God the Father nailed His body to that Tree.. out of Love.. for His Own... so that they thru Faith in what He completed can have eternal life.. Those who are His Own.. did not work for their salvation, didn't pay for it.. It was and is Freely Granted to them.. It Cost Jesus Christ everything.. but to those who are Granted Salvation.. it's Free..

                              this is why those who are His.. dont love God because we loved Him first and made Him turn His Head and say 'hey'..look how good that person is.. I'll save him.....

                              .. but we Love God because He FIRST loved Us.. and sent His Son to be the Propitiation for our sins... and what He did cost HIm .. but for Us its free.. and thats why its By Grace that ye are saved.. not works...

                              when He Saved Me in 1994, Set me Free.. Revealed His Unmerited Goodness to me .. at the Revelation of that.. He took this hard hearted sinner and thru His Revelation of His Goodness.. had me broke down and crying and asking for Him to take control of my whole Life.. If you call that a committment then thats what it is.. I had no other choice at the Revelation of His Love towards me.. and this unmerited.. than to ask HIm to take control of my life.. and forgive me....

                              I realize that It Cost HIm everything.. and I Marvel at His Love for me.. why He chose Me and Saved Me.. and has Granted me Eternal Life.. I don't know why He chose me.. it was In His Plan and Foreknowledge... I was a lost sinner, I was a person who was despised by others, rejected by others, drank excessivly, cussed , swore, blasphemed.. why would Somebody like God love me.. what did I do to deserve His Mercy and Love??? NOTHING... It was in His Plan and Foreknowledge.... thats what His Word tells me.. and His Spirit bears witness to it...

                              Who am I to say 'no' to God.. does not the Master Potter have control over the 'clay vessel'?

                              all I 'know' today is 'What' I have today.. and this inlcudes Eternal Life.. is Freely Given to me.. it by His Grace and Favor... not my merits or works no matter how religious or pious they appear....... and it all flows thru what He Acccomplished at the Tree.. when they nailed His Body to it....... when He said.. It is Finished...

                              the carnal man cannot understand this.. for these things are foolishness to him/her..

                              but he/she that is spiritual will understand and perceive.. because those things are revealed to His Children.. this thru the Spirit .. His Spirit bearing witness with our spirit.. that we may 'know' the things that are 'freely' given to us.. this is right from the Scripture..

                              and this starts with Eternal Life.. freely granted...

                              not worked for or earned by those who promote a works salvation..

                              Does God owe us anything? NO, not one bit.. men women and chidlren are dead in trespasses and sins and lost.. children of wrath and destined to Eternal Separation.. the LAKE OF FIRE..... until God steps in and Saves them.. thru His Grace and Favour.. not works.. thru Faith....it is the Gift of God..

                              lest any man should boast..

                              because a person commits their lives to Christ and gives Him everything... is this what Causes God to save Us? Does God owe us anything because we commit our lives to HIm?

                              a person commits their lives to God because He has revealed His Unmerited Goodness to them... leading them to repentance causing them to commit everything to Him.. because of Who He is and What He does and Has Done at the Bloody tree.. this Freely Granted..

                              When He saved Me in 1994... He Granted Me eternal Life Freely... it cost HIm His Physcial life on that tree.. But His Gift granted to me is Free....... at the Revelation of His Goodness I broke down and Gave My life to Him.. now because I did that.. does this mean God 'owes' me ?? no.. I was there because of Him... and I exist because of Him.. I gave everything to Him.. because of Who He is. and What He has done.. for me.. and the fact that He has Freely Granted me Eternal Life..

                              Does He 'owe' me anything today because of the fact that I responded to His Call and the Revealtion of His Love and Goodness in my life.. NO..

                              He Freely Gives today.. because of His Grace and Mercy..

                              Because He First Loved Me.. and its according to His Will and Foreknowledge..

                              Today I Rest in His Love and Grace and Mercy.. 'knowing' that I"m justified and declared Righteous because I believe in my heart (faith).. that He is the One, Jesus the Christ, God manifest in the flesh, is the Saviour Sent into the World by the Father.. to bear witness to the Truth.. and to Save His People from their sins by being the Propitiation for them.. He is who He says He is...

                              He Truly is the Propitiation for the Sins of His People.. and the sins of this world..

                              this is why He is Revealed from Heaven.. in the Revelation of Jesus the Christ...


                              The Just shall live by Faith..

                              He is Returning.. to this Earth in Power and Glory.. and when the Son of Man returns.. will He find 'faith' on this earth?

                              he that hath ears let him hear..
                              Many appear Righteous and Just because they say 'yes' to Jesus Christ , yet they don't do His Will.
                              ------------------------------------------------
                              Verily I say unto thee, the tax collectors and the prostitutes go into the Kingdom of Heaven before you do.
                              ------------------------------------------------
                              The LORD hath appeared of old unto me, saying. YEA, I have loved thee with an everlasting love; therefore with LOVINGKINDESS have I DRAWN THEE.
                              Jeremiah 31:3

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