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Master, which is the great commandment in the law?

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  • Discussion Master, which is the great commandment in the law?

    There have been a few discussions about Christians, having to keep the law. Some argue there are different laws. Some we should be expected to keep, and some we are not expected to keep.

    I guess I may get stoned by a few, but let us look at and test the first and greatest commandment 'in the law'.

    Are we as 'born of the Spirit' Christians, to keep the first and greatest commandment, as a matter of the law "Thou Shalt" or by the Spirit? (You Will)

    If it is by the law, then it is with 'all' (100%) heart, soul and mind (100% of the time) 'break one part of the law (once) and you break the whole of the law.

    Matt 22:36 Master, which is the great commandment in the law?

    Matt 22:37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
    Matt 22:38 This is the first and great commandment.

    Matt 22:39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself.
    Matt 22:40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

    John 5:42 But I know you, that ye have not the love of God in you.

    John 8:42 Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me: for I proceeded forth and came from God; neither came I of myself, but he sent me.

    Rom 5:5 And hope maketh not ashamed; because the love of God is shed abroad in our hearts by the Holy Ghost which is given unto us.

    1Cor 8:3 But if any man love God, the same is known of him.
    *(I relate this verse with those who did much 'works' in the name of Jesus Christ, but Jesus said "I never knew you")

    2Ti 1:7 For God hath not given us the spirit of fear; but of power, and of love, and of a sound mind.
    *(I believe that 'the spirit' should be 'the Spirit' of power, love, and a sound mind)

    1Jn 4:7 Beloved, let us love one another: for love is of God; and every one that loveth is born of God, and knoweth God.
    1Jn 4:8 He that loveth not knoweth not God; for God is love.
    1Jn 4:9 In this was manifested the love of God toward us, because that God sent his only begotten Son into the world, that we might live through him.
    1Jn 4:10 Herein is love, not that we loved God, (1st commandment) but that he loved us, and sent his Son to be the propitiation for our sins.

    1Jn 4:11 Beloved, if God so loved us, we ought also to love one another.
    1Jn 4:12 No man hath seen God at any time. If we love one another, God dwelleth in us, and his love is perfected in us.

    1Jn 4:13 Hereby know we that we dwell in him, and he in us, because he hath given us of his Spirit.

    I do not need a law to command me to love, if I love. The love of God in me, compels me to love. I do not claim as yet to love Him perfectly, but His love in me is being perfected.

  • #2
    1 John 2:5 - But whoso keepeth his word, in him verily is the love of God perfected: hereby know we that we are in him.
    We are his body, We are his representative, We are the extension of God to the earth. Every action should be a extension of God's love.

    Comment


    • #3
      This is all based on an assumption we know what God's definition of love is. Tell me how would one buld an Boeing 757 without insructions? Love in God's ecomony certainly isn't just emotions. Love is a verb. That doesn't mean you go out and do a bunch of Scriptual hokey-pokey in some vain effort to please God. It means you approach Him as a child with the desire to imitate Him.

      Exactly what does Jesus mean when He says "Love the Lord your God with all your heart, all your soul, and all your strength?" I know exactly what His audience knew about that statement. Jesus quoted straight out of Torah, which most Christians say is 'dead'. Why did Jesus quote Torah? Because HE gave it to us through Moses.

      What is so difficult about loving God the way He asks to be loved? The Jews couldn't do it, even though they knew it, and I honestly don't think most Christians do it, because our translations and commentaries have been infected with Greek pagan philosophy.

      Speaking of commandments, there were 613 commands given through Moese, and over 1000 commands in the Apostolic Writings.
      Those who seek God with all their heart will find Him and be given sight. Those who seek their own agenda will remain blind.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by keck553 View Post
        This is all based on an assumption we know what God's definition of love is, and love in God's ecomony certainly isn't just emotions.

        Tell me how would one buld an Boeing 757 without insructions?
        Of course it isn't just about emotions. Often times it can go against our emotions.

        1Co 13:4 Love is patient, love is kind; love does not envy; love does not boast, is not puffed up;
        1Co 13:5 does not behave disgracefully, does not seek its own, is not provoked to anger, thinks no evil;
        1Co 13:6 does not rejoice over unrighteousness, but rejoices with the truth;
        1Co 13:7 bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things.
        1Co 13:8a Love never fails.

        Comment


        • #5
          If you love me, keep my commandments! Love = Obedience

          partaker, there is one statement you made that might bear some revision on your part, in light of something Jesus said. You write,

          "I do not need a law to command me to love, if I love."
          The truth is, we actually do need a law that commands us to love, otherwise Jesus would not have given us one:

          John 13:34 A new commandment I give unto you, That ye love one another; as I have loved you, that ye also love one another.
          I agree with you that the love of God is shed abroad in our hearts, but as keck noted, "love is a verb"--and that means that the evidence of our love must be in the performance of something, and that is, specifically, obedience to the Word of God. Love ought to be the motivation for our obedience; or you could say that obedience is the expression of God's love from our hearts.

          John 14:15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.

          John 15:14 Ye are my friends, if ye do whatsoever I command you.
          Fellowship with Christ depends on the manifestation of our love in taking heed to all the counsel of God's Word. Jesus said, "keep my commandments." Notice, that word is plural: there is more than one commandment Jesus expects us to keep! Throughout the New Testament, Jesus gave us many commandments (some by the Holy Ghost, through the pens of the writers of the epistles). And to all these, John adds the commandments of God--those commandments under Moses' law which God promised he would someday put into our hearts, and write in our minds (Hebrews 10:16):

          1 John 5:3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Novus Apollos View Post
            partaker, there is one statement you made that might bear some revision on your part, in light of something Jesus said. You write,



            The truth is, we actually do need a law that commands us to love, otherwise Jesus would not have given us one:



            I agree with you that the love of God is shed abroad in our hearts, but as keck noted, "love is a verb"--and that means that the evidence of our love must be in the performance of something, and that is, specifically, obedience to the Word of God. Love ought to be the motivation for our obedience; or you could say that obedience is the expression of God's love from our hearts.
            John 14:15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.

            John 15:14 Ye are my friends, if ye do whatsoever I command you.
            Fellowship with Christ depends on the manifestation of our love in taking heed to all the counsel of God's Word. Jesus said, "keep my commandments." Notice, that word is plural: there is more than one commandment Jesus expects us to keep! Throughout the New Testament, Jesus gave us many commandments (some by the Holy Ghost, through the pens of the writers of the epistles). And to all these, John adds the commandments of God--those commandments under Moses' law which God promised he would someday put into our hearts, and write in our minds (Hebrews 10:16):
            Hi Novus Apollos!

            Thanks for the imput.

            Some translations have:
            John 14:15 "If you love Me, you will keep My commandments.

            I tend to believe that to be correct.

            John 14:24 He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings:

            If we love Him, we will keep. If we do not love Him, we will not keep.

            Love is an action (from the heart) that will (joyfully) keep His sayings.
            We can still have actions that are absent of love, but these are mere lip service. If we 'do' without love, then we have not kept His commandments

            Matt 22:40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

            But again, there is not here a command 'to love Him', but a declaration that we will keep (guard, hold fast, watch over, preserve) His commandments.

            If we love Him, we love the Father. Therefore we are keeping the commandments

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by partaker of Christ View Post
              Hi Novus Apollos!

              Thanks for the imput.

              Some translations have:
              John 14:15 "If you love Me, you will keep My commandments.

              I tend to believe that to be correct.

              John 14:24 He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings:

              If we love Him, we will keep. If we do not love Him, we will not keep.

              Love is an action (from the heart) that will (joyfully) keep His sayings.
              We can still have actions that are absent of love, but these are mere lip service. If we 'do' without love, then we have not kept His commandments

              Matt 22:40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

              But again, there is not here a command 'to love Him', but a declaration that we will keep (guard, hold fast, watch over, preserve) His commandments.

              If we love Him, we love the Father. Therefore we are keeping the commandments

              I am not even going to get into this. I will observed something new. Where people fall into certain new catagories I have recently discovered. The fixed from the unfixed; the theoretical from the practical; the tangible from the untangible.
              Edify the brethren, love the brethren, and forgive the brethren until I have nothing left.

              www.woc-church.org

              Comment


              • #8
                Well a lot of Christians think the 'law' is 'dead' anyway.....and these two commandments are in the 'law of Moses', so is this another pick and choose thing? What did Jesus say? I do as My Father does, If you love Jesus and are motivated out of love to obey His commandments, you will do as He does - which is Love the Father which is the motivation to obey His commandments.
                Those who seek God with all their heart will find Him and be given sight. Those who seek their own agenda will remain blind.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by keck553 View Post
                  Well a lot of Christians think the 'law' is 'dead' anyway.....and these two commandments are in the 'law of Moses', so is this another pick and choose thing? What did Jesus say? I do as My Father does, If you love Jesus and are motivated out of love to obey His commandments, you will do as He does - which is Love the Father which is the motivation to obey His commandments.

                  Hi keck553!

                  Jesus did what the Father did, because that is were His heart was. He was in the Father, and the Father was in Him.

                  Why do people sin?
                  Do they need a command to sin?

                  Because they love sin, they do sin
                  Because they love darkness, they live in darkness.
                  Because they love the flesh, they live by the flesh.
                  Because they love the world, they are of the world.

                  Matt 6:21 For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also.

                  Matt 12:35 A good man out of the good treasure of the heart bringeth forth good things: and an evil man out of the evil treasure bringeth forth evil things.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    There really are only two choices and both are based on trust.

                    1) trust the lies of HaSatan and do his will
                    2) trust the truth of HaShem. and do His will

                    stick 'command' or any other term you want in front of it, but it all boils down to this choice. Does that help define God's meaning of love better?
                    Those who seek God with all their heart will find Him and be given sight. Those who seek their own agenda will remain blind.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Who is HaSatan and who is HaShem?

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Sorry, habit.

                        the devil and The Name (God).

                        Who else do you think hung out with Noah's son....Shem?

                        better?
                        Those who seek God with all their heart will find Him and be given sight. Those who seek their own agenda will remain blind.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by keck553 View Post
                          There really are only two choices and both are based on trust.

                          1) trust the lies of HaSatan and do his will
                          2) trust the truth of HaShem. and do His will

                          stick 'command' or any other term you want in front of it, but it all boils down to this choice. Does that help define God's meaning of love better?
                          Love is a 'fruit'
                          It is a fruit of the 'Spirit'

                          1Co 13:4 Love is patient, love is kind; love does not envy; love does not boast, is not puffed up;
                          1Co 13:5 does not behave disgracefully, does not seek its own, is not provoked to anger, thinks no evil;
                          1Co 13:6 does not rejoice over unrighteousness, but rejoices with the truth;
                          1Co 13:7 bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Paul was speaking to the second greatest commandment to the Corinthians. Too bad we don't have the other side of the conversation! But it stands by itslef.

                            Speaking of fruit, why did Jesus curse the fig tree? What the frult He expected to eat from it 'love'?

                            Think about it.
                            Those who seek God with all their heart will find Him and be given sight. Those who seek their own agenda will remain blind.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by keck553 View Post
                              Paul was speaking to the second greatest commandment to the Corinthians. Too bad we don't have the other side of the conversation! But it stands by itslef.
                              Matt 22:39a And the second is like unto it.

                              Is not the fruit of the Spirit likened to 1Cor 13?

                              Gal 5:22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,
                              Gal 5:23 Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.

                              Speaking of fruit, why did Jesus curse the fig tree? What the frult He expected to eat from it 'love'?

                              Think about it.
                              Well since fig tree cannot bear olive berries, I would say the answer is;

                              Figs!

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