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  • Are there any pre-tribbers who believe this?

    Are there any pre-tribbers who believe that nothing bad can ever happen to them and they will never have to face persecution in this life?

    The reason I am asking this is because I keep hearing post-tribbers say that pre-tribbers believe that. However I have been a Christian for over 20 years. In that time I have yet to find a pre-trib believer who believes or thinks that way. (and being that I had been pre-trib a good portion of my Christian life, I have met ALOT of pre-tribbers). So why do I hear post-tribbers always saying pre-tribbers believe something I have never even once in over 20 years heard a pre-tribber say they believe?

    I was just wondering if there is any pre-tribber in this forum who believes they don't have to face persecution in this life or if they feel they are exempt from anything bad ever happening to them in this life, if they could post that belief here. I am just wondering if there is any pre-tribber around who believes what post-tribbers say they believe.

  • #2
    Originally posted by cwb View Post
    Are there any pre-tribbers who believe that nothing bad can ever happen to them and they will never have to face persecution in this life?

    The reason I am asking this is because I keep hearing post-tribbers say that pre-tribbers believe that. However I have been a Christian for over 20 years. In that time I have yet to find a pre-trib believer who believes or thinks that way. (and being that I had been pre-trib a good portion of my Christian life, I have met ALOT of pre-tribbers). So why do I hear post-tribbers always saying pre-tribbers believe something I have never even once in over 20 years heard a pre-tribber say they believe?

    I was just wondering if there is any pre-tribber in this forum who believes they don't have to face persecution in this life or if they feel they are exempt from anything bad ever happening to them in this life, to post that belief here. I am just wondering if there is any pre-tribber around who believes what post-tribbers say they believe.
    I know a few people like that. Just because you haven't met any doesn't believe there aren't people like that out there. There are. Maybe not many, I don't know.

    Has anyone here actually said that all pre-tribbers are that way? Has anyone here even said that most pre-tribbers are that way? Because you seem to be implying that someone has said something like that.

    Also, if anyone here believed like that their belief in pre-trib has led them to believe they will never face persecution, do you actually think they would admit it? I tend to doubt it.

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    • #3
      Originally posted by cwb View Post
      Are there any pre-tribbers who believe that nothing bad can ever happen to them and they will never have to face persecution in this life?

      The reason I am asking this is because I keep hearing post-tribbers say that pre-tribbers believe that. However I have been a Christian for over 20 years. In that time I have yet to find a pre-trib believer who believes or thinks that way. (and being that I had been pre-trib a good portion of my Christian life, I have met ALOT of pre-tribbers). So why do I hear post-tribbers always saying pre-tribbers believe something I have never even once in over 20 years heard a pre-tribber say they believe?

      I was just wondering if there is any pre-tribber in this forum who believes they don't have to face persecution in this life or if they feel they are exempt from anything bad ever happening to them in this life, if they could post that belief here. I am just wondering if there is any pre-tribber around who believes what post-tribbers say they believe.
      I haven't met any either, and living here in the US, imagine that! It is interesting though to have so many people, on a regular basis, tell me what I believe and describe not only what my views are but why they are what they are... truly remarkable really, if they were not in error the majority of times!


      sigpic

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      • #4
        Originally posted by John146 View Post
        I know a few people like that. Just because you haven't met any doesn't believe there aren't people like that out there. There are. Maybe not many, I don't know.

        Has anyone here actually said that all pre-tribbers are that way? Has anyone here even said that most pre-tribbers are that way? Because you seem to be implying that someone has said something like that.
        I am not implying anything. I have seen quite a few posts in this forum that say this is a huge problem for pre-tribbers. If only a very small minority of pre-tribbers believed this way, it is far from a big problem for pre-tribbers.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by cwb View Post
          I am not implying anything. I have seen quite a few posts in this forum that say this is a huge problem for pre-tribbers. If only a very small minority of pre-tribbers believed this way, it is far from a big problem for pre-tribbers.
          Persecution...Yes
          Wrath...No

          As a anything but post-tribber I believe it based on this scripture...

          9For God did not appoint us to suffer wrath but to receive salvation through our Lord Jesus Christ.

          Comment


          • #6
            I've been pretrib most of my life, since I was nine. 45 years. And in all that time I have not met a single pretribber that believed that.
            And I have read many posts on this board claiming that this what pretribbers believe, making it an all-inclusive statement, stating that for this reason, pretrib is a 'dangerous belief' to be avoided like the plague.
            I have no doubt that there ARE a few out there, but I would submit it is very few, so few that I would in no way call it a 'common belief' among pretribbers.
            But it does make a seemingly good arguement for posttrib.
            I am wondering how many post tribbers are ready, in the event that pretribbers are correct? If they are waiting for the tribulation to begin, they are not expecting the rapture until after the appearance of the anti christ, the 3.5 years of peace, and the wrath of God poured out on the earth. Thus they believe they still have plenty of time. That sounds a little dangerous to me.
            Of course, I am being 'all inclusive' in these statements.........
            I know there are many who ARE ready.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by cwb View Post
              Are there any pre-tribbers who believe that nothing bad can ever happen to them and they will never have to face persecution in this life?
              Not on my end. Actually, just getting one's head cut off is less suffering than what a lot of others have and do suffer, past and present.

              The reason I am asking this is because I keep hearing post-tribbers say that pre-tribbers believe that.
              Well, what do you expect from those into inventions? I would imagine they have simply attempted to defy logic and the News Channels and have distorted the beliefs of others.

              However I have been a Christian for over 20 years. In that time I have yet to find a pre-trib believer who believes or thinks that way. (and being that I had been pre-trib a good portion of my Christian life, I have met ALOT of pre-tribbers).
              And me for nearly 40 years, and I have never heard such a thing. We did have a guy in town that decided that it is "mid-trib" (major fallout here), but the men with the straight jackets would not come pick him up, so, we choked it and spewed it.

              So why do I hear post-tribbers always saying pre-tribbers believe something I have never even once in over 20 years heard a pre-tribber say they believe?
              Uh, you are not referring to one offline and in your community, are you?

              I was just wondering if there is any pre-tribber in this forum who believes they don't have to face persecution in this life or if they feel they are exempt from anything bad ever happening to them in this life, if they could post that belief here. I am just wondering if there is any pre-tribber around who believes what post-tribbers say they believe.
              Well, let's play it cool - perhaps they are just yet to learn better, and will know better as they progress (assuming social circles and religious affiliation has not bound them), I mean, it is not like when we turn our lives to G-d, that a microchip of all the information is put into our heads at once. I mean, the guy I mentioned above ("mid-trib") was bizarre, and I have never heard of "post-trib" until THIS decade, and I spent much time in the different Network Conferences with people across the world in the 1990's. I really did not know much much about "Roman" Catholicism/Protestantism/Etc. until later on, and their influences - sure glad Grandpa does not talk too much.

              Either way, as your context expresses, it is better to be a 'readiest' for anything to happen in this life and world, and ready to meet the L-rd, or be taken at any time, in one way or another.

              Rising.
              Last edited by Clifton; Jul 31st 2008, 02:53 PM. Reason: Changed "in put into our heads at once" to "is put into our heads at once".
              "A text without context is a pretext."

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              • #8
                Originally posted by cwb View Post
                Are there any pre-tribbers who believe that nothing bad can ever happen to them and they will never have to face persecution in this life?
                Let me say that if that was a pre-requisite for a pre-trib belief I'd have to turn in my membership.
                I am just wondering if there is any pre-tribber around who believes what post-tribbers say they believe.
                I'm often taken aback by what I'm suppose to believe as a pre-tribber, when others explain the belief. I often say to myself "who knew"?
                Acts 17:11

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                • #9
                  Well I have to say that I have seen many pre tribbers make very bold comments on other boards dismissing off any thoughts of having to endure any difficult times. I do have to say the pre tribbers on this board are very aware of all circumstances that we face as Christians. However it is hard to believe everyone here has not witnessed some pre tribbers capitalize on the soft sell many in the media make of the events that will happen during the GT. It almost goes with out saying that any major media outlet will take the road that any believers will not have to endure any hard times if they believe in Christ, and it is just not right. Lets just take the third seal…

                  Revelation 6:5-6 5 ¶ When the Lamb broke the third seal, I heard the third living being say, "Come!" I looked up and saw a black horse, and its rider was holding a pair of scales in his hand. 6 And I heard a voice from among the four living beings say, "A loaf of wheat bread or three loaves of barley will cost a day's pay. And don't waste the olive oil and wine."

                  Here is a vivid description of how famine will become the mainstay throughout the world. If I were following the pretrib theory, then this would never happen to me. However as we all know there is famine in this world. And many times there are Christians that suffer hunger in poorer regions of the world. How am I any better of a Christian brother than say the Christian brother who lives in those poverty stricken areas. I am not. The same can be pointed out during great conflicts we have had in history. It just does not stand to reason that this is what we as Christians will be spared from when it has happened over and over throughout history. I understand we are not officially in the GT, but the observation of events throughout history can not be dismissed when trying to understand the word handed down by our Lord and Savior.

                  I am not trying to debate the pretrib or post trib theory, but I am trying to show those here on the board where the media has sold many that if they are believers that they will not have to endure very difficult times brought on by the opening of the 7 seals. From the left behind series to pretty much any of the major Christian programs we see on TV. And it only makes sense. It is hard to sell something that is not positive to people. Most everyone wants to hear how things will be great if they only make a simple prayer (I will say that I believe with all my heart that the Lord hears every word in those simple prayers!), and don’t forget how shortly after their message they will ask for a simple donation! However, I do think sometimes we need to hear the truth even if it is not the most optimistic outcome possible. It is not the most profitable, but I sure am thankful when someone is candid to me. It helps me prepare for what I am up against.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by cwb View Post
                    Are there any pre-tribbers who believe that nothing bad can ever happen to them and they will never have to face persecution in this life?
                    This pre-tribber expects persecution and tribulation and the peace of Christ through it.
                    Christianity, if false, is of no importance, and if true, of infinite importance. The only thing it cannot be is moderately important.
                    C. S. Lewis

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by cwb View Post
                      Are there any pre-tribbers who believe that nothing bad can ever happen to them and they will never have to face persecution in this life?

                      The reason I am asking this is because I keep hearing post-tribbers say that pre-tribbers believe that.
                      Speaking as a Post-Tribber, the vast majority of Pre-Tribbers that I know, either in person or via the internet, are fully aware that there might be a time in which they will face great persecution and other problems. For a Post-Tribber to assume that Pre-Tribbers are unprepared to face persecution is arrogant and naive. Any informed Pre-Tribber is fully aware that there has been a great deal of persecution of believers over the centuries and that there is no reason to assume it will ever stop until the 2nd Coming.
                      Originally posted by cwb View Post
                      However I have been a Christian for over 20 years. In that time I have yet to find a pre-trib believer who believes or thinks that way. (and being that I had been pre-trib a good portion of my Christian life, I have met ALOT of pre-tribbers). So why do I hear post-tribbers always saying pre-tribbers believe something I have never even once in over 20 years heard a pre-tribber say they believe?
                      You won't hear it from this Post-Tribber.
                      Originally posted by cwb View Post
                      I was just wondering if there is any pre-tribber in this forum who believes they don't have to face persecution in this life or if they feel they are exempt from anything bad ever happening to them in this life, if they could post that belief here. I am just wondering if there is any pre-tribber around who believes what post-tribbers say they believe.
                      I would like to clarify something about this discussion. There is indeed a potential problem with Pre-Trib if Post-Trib is correct. (I'm not going to debate between the two positions here, that's been done beyond exhaustion in other threads.)

                      The problem only applies to Christians who are uninformed about their own beliefs. That being said, 99% of the Pre-Tribbers here in this forum are not going to fall into this category, because it's almost impossible to participate in this forum, or another one like it, and to be completely uninformed about what I'm about to say. So for those of you Pre-Tribbers who are reading this, because you are aware of what I'm about to say, that automatically excludes you from this, because you ARE aware of this issue.

                      I’m talking about our current culture of “pop” Christianity. Today (at least in the USA) it’s “cool” to be a “Christian”. Everybody goes around with crosses hanging from their neck (even while they’re in bed with the lover of the week or buying the weekend drug supply from the dealer on the street corner). I’m talking about people who will listen to preachers like John Hagee who thunder to overjoyed congregations about the evil in today’s world and how awful it’s going to be during the Tribulation, the whole time thinking to themselves “at least I don’t have to worry about it”. I’m talking about people who go to Michael W. Smith and Stephen Curtis Chapman concerts only because all their friends are going. I’m talking about people who decided to join the church their wife has been dragging them to because “it’ll probably be a good business decision anyway”. I’m talking about people who advertise in the local Christian Yellow Pages because it’ll get them more business (and if they have to sign some “meaningless confession card” to get in there, then it’s a good business decision anyway). I’m talking about “preachers” who are starting new churches on every street corner because it’s “cool” these days to be a Christian and they want to get in on the glut of tithes while the money is still there. I’m talking about people who listen to the local Christian radio station because it’s “safe for the entire family” (and if it happens to talk about Jesus in the process, then that’s probably OK too). I’m talking about people who get angry when some radical judge wants to take “In God We Trust” off our money or “under God” from the Pledge of Allegiance and yet the same people go around not even knowing if it’s originally from the Bible or not. (It’s not, by the way.)

                      There are more people than I want to have to even think about in this world and even here in the USA who are Christians because it’s “cool” and “everybody does it”. That’s “pop” Christianity. Well, my friends, “pop” Christianity’s days are numbered. And those are the ones who I get frightened for when I think about what’s coming. I’m confident that my faith can stand, because when it starts happening, it’ll only confirm the Truth in the Bible that I’m already familiar with. But I am uniquely blessed with this knowledge, as are most of you who take the time to read up on these issues such as in this forum. What about the others who don’t know any better and whose preachers don’t know any better?

                      Here's what scares me for these people: Most of you who have been following my posts already know that I'm convinced the Antichrist is going to have an Islamic origin. Specifically, he is going to claim to be Islam's 12 Imam, otherwise known as the "Mahdi". At least he will at first, anyway. Later, he will claim to be Allah in the flesh. The most popular notion for a very long time, however, has been that the Antichrist will be a secular humanist from Europe, a la Nicolai Carpathia in the Left Behind books. So a great many Christians are watching Europe for things to start happening, but they’re not too terribly concerned about it, because they’re figuring on being outta here via the Pre-Trib Rapture.

                      So consider this scenario: While the church is still here (and dwindling in numbers as we see happening around the world at this very moment), Islam becomes the dominant religious group on the planet. Suddenly, the Muslims have the upper hand. They start imposing all kinds of restrictions on Christians like they typically do in currently Islamic nations.

                      Then a man appears in the Middle East who appears to be prime for uniting all Muslims around the world, who also offers world peace and order in an otherwise chaotic world. Somehow, he is able to perform miracles similar to the ones that Jesus performed. I’m not talking about Benny-Hinn-type TV fakery here, I’m talking people being raised from the dead, I’m talking lifelong blind people being able to see, I mean miracles that absolutely cannot be explained away, just as Jesus’ miracles absolutely could not be explained away by the Pharisees. The press today is so cynical about that kind of thing that they will do anything they can to disprove such a demonstration of power, but there will be something about this guy’s display of power that they absolutely cannot explain it away. The world will be watching their TVs with their mouths hanging to the floor.

                      He proceeds to establish his plan in the form of a seven-year agreement with leading nations of the west, including Israel. Now put yourself in the position of a believer who has always subscribed to the Left Behind scenario and is unaware that it might not be the right theory. You’re still here, un-Raptured, your religion has been supplanted from its historically dominant position for the first time in well over 1000 years, there’s a world leader who is performing miracles, but it can’t be the Antichrist because otherwise the Rapture would have (supposedly) happened. So what conclusion are you forced to if you don’t know your Bible cover to cover? Or even if you do know your Bible cover to cover, but Left Behind is all you’ve ever been taught and it never occurred to you that it might be wrong? How many of these people who are unaware that the Left Behind scenario might be wrong would wind up being fooled into thinking that they had it all wrong and that Christianity might be one great big lie? (Just like Da Vinci Code author Dan Brown and a lot of others are working very hard to shout from the rooftops, even at this very moment.)

                      Paul talks in II Thessalonians 2 about “the falling away”. When I realized how Post-Trib fits together with the Antichrist/Mahdi/Gog scenario, it was absolutely terrifying to consider the prospect of the “falling away”. I can't help wondering how many people might be fooled into falling for the Antichrist's lies, because they won't even realize that's who he is. Because the Rapture never came, and because he's not a European secular humanist.

                      As I've said, however, 99% of the Pre-Tribbers here are fully aware of such theories, so if it turned out to be true, 99% of the Pre-Tribbers here in this forum would not be fooled. So, to sum it all up, this Post-Tribber does not believe for one second that being Pre-Trib is an automatic setup for being fooled into thinking that you'll never be persecuted. It's just the ones who get into the "pop" Christianity that is part of the Age of Laodicea.

                      OK, end soap box...........
                      ----------------------------------------------
                      When the plain sense of Scripture make sense, seek no other sense.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by 2 Peter 2:20 View Post
                        Persecution...Yes
                        Wrath...No

                        As a anything but post-tribber I believe it based on this scripture...

                        9For God did not appoint us to suffer wrath but to receive salvation through our Lord Jesus Christ.
                        Just FYI, this Post-Tribber says we will not endure one second of God's Wrath.
                        ----------------------------------------------
                        When the plain sense of Scripture make sense, seek no other sense.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          For a Post-Tribber to assume that Pre-Tribbers are unprepared to face persecution is arrogant and naive.

                          Well I know this thread has stemmed from a post that I have made in another thread, and it is my opinion that many pretribbers especially on other boards and in the media feel strongly that they will not face any difficult times brought on by the opening of the seven seals. I can not read their minds nor know exactly what is in anyone’s heart, but from the comments, expressions, and general enthusiasm from disaster that have occurred throughout the world they feel that they are isolated from calamity from falling on them. I do not know any other way to share my thoughts other than to say exactly what I have witnessed. I am surprised people have not witnessed the same because it is very noticeable in our Christian circles. So noticeable we are made fun of on other non Christian boards. Again, I will say that the people here on this board are very in tune to all versions of the end time’s scenario, and do not fall into this category. I assure you it is not out of arrogance that I make these comment, but out of grief from what I have witnessed.

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                          • #14
                            All Christians have or will face persecution since the time of Christ. The mis-understanding comes for the belief that we will not go through the 7 year tribulation and the 3.5 year great tribulation. Pre-tribbes believe in a rapture before that 7 year period.

                            Regardless of one's view of prophecy, today is another day closer......are you witnessing?

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by dworthington View Post
                              All Christians have or will face persecution since the time of Christ. The mis-understanding comes for the belief that we will not go through the 7 year tribulation and the 3.5 year great tribulation. Pre-tribbes believe in a rapture before that 7 year period.

                              Regardless of one's view of prophecy, today is another day closer......are you witnessing?

                              I think it has developed into a bit more dworthington. And yes I am trying to witness when I see an opportunity open up.
                              God Bless!

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