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  • Discussion The Role of Women in Ministry

    Most if not all of you are Evangelical so in evangelicalism the role of women in ministry is a debate. I personally believe that women cant be pastors or hold spiritual authority over a man. But I believe that a woman can teach a man (mathematics, social skills, history,etc). I also believe women can and should teach children in the church, a woman can give her testimony in church, lead worship, and pray out loud,etc..

    Fundamentalists do not debate this issue because its assumed that women must be completely silent and passive in the church. I was at a Fundamentalist church this past Sunday and there women CANNOT teach children alone or without a man present. I have also run into Fundamentalist females at the school I am attending that do not believe they can pray out loud nor email or talk with a man in private. This means at this school many believe that women cannot tutor a man that needs help in a academic subject. So a woman cannot teach a man in anything according to them.

    In Evangelicalism my views are considered conservative, but in Fundamentalism they may not be.


    CBMW is a conservative evangelical ministry that emphasis a return to the biblical role of men and women. However most Fundamentalists ignore CBMW, CARM or any associations with evangelicals.

    Below is a outline I wrote on the topic.

    The Role of Women in the Ministry
    1 Tim 2:9-14
    Theme- Women in the ministry

    Introduction- This short passage of scripture contains instructions on the role of women in the ministry. This passage is not cultural, but is universal for all churches and all Christians of all times. So many liberal Christians these days have misinterpreted the clear teachings presented in this passage to fit their felt needs or even better their itching ears (2 Tim 4:3). These teachings are not only taught here but also in 1 Cor 14. The teachings are to all churches of all time. The teachings are in no way cultural as liberal proponents commonly argue.

    I. The appropriate dress demeanor of women (v.9-10)
    A. Women are to dress modestly (v.9)
    B. Women are not to dress proudly (v.9)
    C. Women are to be known by their good deeds (v.10).

    II. Women canít teach or preach (v.13-13)
    A. Women should be passive and must fully submit to men (v.13)
    B. Women cant teach/preach or have authority over a man, for she must be silent (v.13)

    (Application) I come from a California contemporary evangelical background and amongst these types itís commonly believed that women can preach, teach and have authority over a man. These types retranslate this "offensive" passage of scripture to itch their already itching ears (2 Tim 4:3). But the bible is quite black and white here and must be proclaimed/followed regardless of whether or not the content is offensive. The teachings that women cant preach or have authority over men is incredibly offensive in liberal areas like California, so the people out there re-interpret the teachings to fit their liberal churches.

    III. God's Biblical Design (v.13-14)
    A. The creation mandate from the beginning was that men were the leaders over women (v.13)
    B. The woman was deceived before the man. Women are not fit as leaders over men (v.14)

    Conclusion- Althoughthese teachings are offensive to those with itching ears (2 Tim 4:3), they are to followed regardless. Serious Bible preaching Christians obey these teachings and strive to follow the clear teachings of the word of God. Liberals retranslate these teachings to fit their traditions, and in doing so are taking away from the Word of God. The teachings are that women canít teach, preach or have authority over a man. These teachings are not "cultural" but are to be followed in the present.
    Last edited by threebigrocks; Aug 21st 2008, 08:41 PM.

  • #2
    Originally posted by poochie View Post
    Most if not all of you are Evangelical so in evangelicalism the role of women in ministry is a debate. I personally believe that women cant be pastors or hold spiritual authority over a man. But I believe that a woman can teach a man (mathematics, social skills, history,etc). I also believe women can and should teach children in the church, a woman can give her testimony in church, lead worship, and pray out loud,etc..
    I agree with you. Paul commended Timothy's mother and grandmother for his spiritual training:

    "when I call to remembrance the genuine faith that is in you, which dwelt first in your grandmother Lois and your mother Eunice, and I am persuaded is in you also." II Tim 1:5

    Comment


    • #3
      So I guess that means you don't want to learn the things that God wants me to show people in the scriptures?

      such as the proper flow to Revelation?
      http://prophecyinsights.com

      Comment


      • #4
        Your mind is made up, what's there to say except you are mislead
        Amazzin

        Obedience to God is more than a soldier obeying his commander. It is our grateful response to the Lover of our souls.

        CHURCH: Where worship is enjoyed, not endured - Grace is preached, not legalism - And Christ is exalted, not religion!



        Comment


        • #5
          If you are preaching then it is not Biblical for you to do so for you must be silent.

          Read 1 Tim 3 and then ask yourself why you are serving in a leadership position over men.

          Originally posted by vinsight4u8 View Post
          So I guess that means you don't want to learn the things that God wants me to show people in the scriptures?

          such as the proper flow to Revelation?

          Comment


          • #6
            Yeah but Fundamentalists may argue that this training was not in the FORMAL church.

            Originally posted by Sold Out View Post
            I agree with you. Paul commended Timothy's mother and grandmother for his spiritual training:

            "when I call to remembrance the genuine faith that is in you, which dwelt first in your grandmother Lois and your mother Eunice, and I am persuaded is in you also." II Tim 1:5

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by poochie View Post
              If you are preaching then it is not Biblical for you to do so for you must be silent.

              Read 1 Tim 3 and then ask yourself why you are serving in a leadership position over men.
              God called me when I was fifteen for the job I do today.

              He called me to intensely learn scripture as one day I would teach it.
              http://prophecyinsights.com

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by amazzin View Post
                Your mind is made up, what's there to say except you are mislead

                Why am I misled? Can you show me chapter and verse that say women can be pastors and have spiritual authority over a man? Please show me where it is so I can improve.

                Comment


                • #9
                  But the Bible is quite clear about this and this is that a Woman shall not teach, preach or have authority over a man, for you must be silent (1 Tim).

                  Show me chapter and verse that says you can be a pastor or have a leadership position over a man (outside of children and womens ministries).

                  My argument is against the Fundamentalists who take it so far. Read my article.

                  Reason #8- Jesus liberated Women


                  Luke 8:1-3
                  After this, Jesus traveled about from one town and village to another, proclaiming the good news of the kingdom of God. The Twelve were with him,and also some women who had been cured of evil spirits and diseases: Mary (called Magdalene) from whom seven demons had come out; Joanna the wife of Cuza, the manager of Herod's household; Susanna; and many others. These women were helping to support them out of their own means.
                  In Jesus' day, women were not looked at with great favor. Women had little if any rights and often were looked at with degradation and as servants. In Jewish culture women were not supposed to learn from rabbis (LAB). But Jesus went right up against the culture and allowed these women to travel with him, once again breaking a culture norm. These women not only traveled with Jesus but they supported him and his ministry out of their own finances. I have met some Fundamentalists who look at women as servants. Once when I was doing street evangelism I asked a woman to pray for the group, but a certain man butted into my request and said that women cant pray out loud. I challenged him, but he never gave me scripture support, so I let him pray for the group. But its abuse of women like this that makes me angry. Also, at another well-known church in the area do women wear head coverings. Women that do not wear head coverings at this church are few in number, and probably are looked at as bearing a bad testimony. The Bible says that a Woman shall not teach, preach or have authority over a man for she must be silent (1 Tim 2:12). This means that women cant be pastors over men, or hold spiritual authority over men. However this does not mean that women cant give their testimony's, cant lead children's ministries, cant lead women's ministries, cant pray out loud, cant lead worship, or even counsel men in some areas. I have personally learned allot from women. In my many years in Evangelicalism have I met many women who have taught me so much about social/people skills, mannerisms, and in other areas that Fundamentalists say that a woman cant teach a man. Of course, there are some areas that it would be wise for a woman not to counsel a man, but these are obvious.


                  Not all Fundamentalists degrade women to servants, but those that do really sicken me. Women in these kinds of churches have never experienced their freedom in Christ, because slavery and degradation is all they know. In my experience at a Fundamentalist university, I can sadly say that I have met few women who would agree with me here. The exception is a former evangelical/Pentecostal woman whom I met at a summer children's ministry. But she thinks the way she does, because God has opened her eyes to the truth and she did not grow up in a Fundamentalist background. I have met others at this university, but they are few in number. I am not arguing in favor of women pastors over men, I am arguing against abuse of women that some Fundamentalists dish out, and unfortunately women that have grown up with this abuse cant see beyond it. The Bible is clear in that a woman shall not teach, preach or have authority over a man (1 Tim 2:12). But besides these roles, women can lead worship, pray publicly, give their testimonies, counsel men and use their gifts to the full in the body of Christ. Praise the Lord for women that are used by the Holy Spirit.


                  Originally posted by vinsight4u8 View Post
                  God called me when I was fifteen for the job I do today.

                  He called me to intensely learn scripture as one day I would teach it.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    So you're saying that I shouldn't use my gift of understanding prophecy - except to show it to women?
                    Last edited by vinsight4u8; Aug 20th 2008, 11:38 AM.
                    http://prophecyinsights.com

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by vinsight4u8 View Post
                      God called me when I was fifteen for the job I do today.

                      He called me to intensely learn scripture as one day I would teach it.



                      So that is who you is.


                      Merton.
                      One can know a lot about the Bible and still not live righteously. Mat ch 23.

                      A little knowledge lived rightly is better that much knowledge lived wrongly.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by vinsight4u8 View Post
                        So you're saying that I shouldn't use my gift of understanding prophecy - except to show it to women?

                        Glad Target and the rest of the stores that I have been to didn't agree with you.

                        Prophecy was a sign gift and is no longer valid in the church.

                        http://www.cerm.info/bible_studies/T...sign_gifts.htm

                        What you can do is this.

                        Pray and teach other women. You can also help and encourage men. But you cannot be a bible teacher over a man for any reason.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Merton View Post
                          So that is who you is.


                          Merton.

                          What do you mean by - that is "who I is"?

                          I'm a girl - a lady - and many men have told me that God would use me one day - I'm called, chosen to serve God

                          women too have told me so
                          http://prophecyinsights.com

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by poochie View Post
                            Prophecy was a sign gift and is no longer valid in the church.

                            http://www.cerm.info/bible_studies/T...sign_gifts.htm

                            What you can do is this.

                            Pray and teach other women. You can also help and encourage men. But you cannot be a bible teacher over a man for any reason.
                            I can't name a man at the moment that knows the bible better than I do. I don't need taught, for I have done the study part mostly already.

                            The job now - is to go forth and warn the church Jesus will come during the 7th trumpet. I hope to meet up with some others someday that have the depth of knowledge like I do.
                            http://prophecyinsights.com

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              I believe you have been called and I praise the Lord for this. But you have not been called to be a pastor. The Bible is clear about this.

                              As yourself this question.

                              Whats your authority? Experience? or Bible?

                              Originally posted by vinsight4u8 View Post
                              What do you mean by - that is "who I is"?

                              I'm a girl - a lady - and many men have told me that God would use me one day - I'm called, chosen to serve God

                              women too have told me so

                              Comment

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