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What made Satan sin?

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  • What made Satan sin?

    The traditional view of Satan says that he was a good angel gone bad. But I've never heard a good answer to the question 'what provoked him to go bad?'

    When we sin, there are 3 provoking factors
    1) The fallen nature (sinful nature)
    2) The fallen world (peer pressure)
    3) The tempter (satan and/or demons)

    When Eve sinned, there was only 1 provoking factor
    1) She had no fallen nature
    2) There was no fallen world
    3) There was a tempter (the serpent, satan)

    So I can understand our sin easily. And I can grasp Eve's sin (Though it is more difficult). But I have a lot of trouble understanding Satan's sin (given the traditional view of Satan). The traditional view says that Satan sinned WITHOUT ANY of the 3 normal provoking factors
    1) He had no fallen nature (he was created good)
    2) There was no fallen world (yet)
    3) There was no tempter (yet)

    Why would an angel, living in the presence of God, rebel without being provoked from within or without? The lackluster answers I've heard in response to this question have caused me to speculate about a non-traditional view of Satan. But I'm all ears if someone has a good answer to this conundrum from the traditional view perspective

    Thanks much,
    matthew
    The Matthew Never Knew
    The Knew Kingdom

  • #2
    Is it possible the answer is so simple it baffles us?

    Pride.
    Those who seek God with all their heart will find Him and be given sight. Those who seek their own agenda will remain blind.

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    • #3
      Originally posted by keck553 View Post
      Is it possible the answer is so simple it baffles us?

      Pride.
      My question is, where did his pride come from?

      The most common answers I've gotten over the years are 'pride' and 'free-will.' But I don't think either answer answers the question. They just re-state the problem.

      When I have pride it comes from my fallen nature, or from worldly influence, or from a tempter. Satan had no source for his pride that I'm aware of.
      The Matthew Never Knew
      The Knew Kingdom

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      • #4
        Originally posted by keck553 View Post
        Is it possible the answer is so simple it baffles us?

        Pride.
        Right, but pride is the sin. What led to the pride?

        For us when we are prideful it is because we are led to that sin by things such as unholy thoughts and the like. What about Satan? How did he get to such a point without any of the factors that we have?

        This is a good question, matthew94. I anticipate the opinions given.
        "What you do does not define who you are; it's who you are that defines what you do."

        -- Dr. Neil T. Anderson

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        • #5
          Originally posted by VerticalReality View Post
          Right, but pride is the sin. What led to the pride?

          For us when we are prideful it is because we are led to that sin by things such as unholy thoughts and the like. What about Satan? How did he get to such a point without any of the factors that we have?

          This is a good question, matthew94. I anticipate the opinions given.

          My view on Scripture is that HaSatan is a messenger of God, with a different purpose, albeit not a pleasant purpose.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Emanate View Post
            My view on Scripture is that HaSatan is a messenger of God, with a different purpose, albeit not a pleasant purpose.
            So your view is that Satan isn't a good angel gone bad, but a being specifically designed by God with a purpose that isn't pleasant? Am I understanding you correctly (just to be clear)?

            Such a theory would, of course, resolve my question. It would also raise some others
            The Matthew Never Knew
            The Knew Kingdom

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            • #7
              You're right. It could be one of those 'mysteries' we can't answer. Maybe when we're risen with God in His domain, we will understand it. I mean the angels are not made in the 'image of God' as we are, so I think that would include attributes such as attitudes, self awareness, etc. It could be totally outside of our experience.

              It's like wondering why God created the universe, presumably after the fall. What exactly is our purpose anyway, I mean as a summation of alpha-omega?

              There are hints in the Bible, like when God glorifies Himself by taking the least, most stiffnecked and intolerable people like the Hebrews and lifting them up above all nations (like Egypt). So we humans are made a little lower than angels, so are the redeemed in Christ another example of God's glory?

              Then there is the blood. God says the wages of sin is death, but God can't die for us in Heaven to fix it the way He did, and besides, angels are eternal. So how does God 'die' to redeem us and put satan under His foot? Through the seed of Eve. Strange by my understanding.

              I totally don't understand God's economy, but here we are, a part of it, redeeemed and separated from satan's grasp by the God's own Right Hand, Jesus.
              Those who seek God with all their heart will find Him and be given sight. Those who seek their own agenda will remain blind.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by matthew94 View Post
                So your view is that Satan isn't a good angel gone bad, but a being specifically designed by God with a purpose that isn't pleasant? Am I understanding you correctly (just to be clear)?

                Such a theory would, of course, resolve my question. It would also raise some others

                That is it in a nutshell.

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                • #9
                  Pride. what does pride say? I can be my own God. I can rule my own life. God does not have my best interest at heart. Only I can know what is good for me. God is holding back on me and not giving me everything I deserve.

                  Pride caused satan to fall. because he was the greatest of ALL gods created beings. Instead of praising God for it. he wanted more. he wanted control of his own life. thus he chose to rebel against God , and take life into his own hands.

                  Eve's sin was not eating the fruit. it was her pride. Satan said God did not really care for her. he was keeping something from her. Thus Eve too did not trust Goid. but took things into her own hands.

                  all sin comes from pride. When we sin, we say we do not trust God. but we will take things in our own hands. god is holding back on me. I know what is better for me. who is God to say what is good and what is bad.

                  Remember. God's thou shalt nots are not because he wants to order us around and tell us what to do.

                  It is for our own protection. All sin is harmfull. God wants what is good for us. and he does not want us to hurt ourselves.
                  not perfect, Just forgiven

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                  • #10
                    Pride. Which is why we all sin.
                    sigpic

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                    • #11
                      Definitely a confusing matter. If there is no force in opposition to God (futile as that would be), where did the demons (ie. "Legion") come form that were cast out? If it weren't for Legion naming himself, one might think "demon possessed" was a synonym for "completely given over to sin". So it seems to me there are clear cases of the supernatural working in seeming opposition to God. On the flip side, I think Satan is given way too much cosmic-voodoo-power by modern Christians. I have great difficulty reconciling what we're taught about Satan with what you see in the Old Testament (Satan and God having a near casual conversation about Job).

                      I don't know. And after much study I'm as ignorant (if not more so) than when I started.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Emanate View Post
                        That is it in a nutshell.
                        Thanks. I'm considering a similar view (though that may be another thread)

                        As for this thread, I'm still eager to here fuller answers to the question than 'free-will' and/or 'pride' (not that I don't appreciate those responses, but I don't feel they really answer the question).

                        Thanks all,
                        matthew
                        The Matthew Never Knew
                        The Knew Kingdom

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          I heard somewhere before that when God was showing the angels his plan for humankind, Satan rebelled and told God, "I will not serve."

                          I think it is from church tradition, i'm sure it can't be difficult to find on the internet.

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                          • #14
                            I was always under the impression that Angels had free will and could be sinful. Satan didn't fall alone. It's just that Angels can't be forgiven because they already know God and therefore can't have "faith". They know God in all his glory.

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                            • #15
                              Do you think the angels fell with satan or do you think satan tempted them, a sort of 'leader of the pack?' The bible shows no redemption at all for fallen angels.
                              Those who seek God with all their heart will find Him and be given sight. Those who seek their own agenda will remain blind.

                              Comment

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