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THe Lord Does NOT USE unclean vessels...... yea or nea?

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  • THe Lord Does NOT USE unclean vessels...... yea or nea?

    Over the last several years I have encountered this belief (or at least this statement).

    I know some will argue semantics, but I find the statement can lead to some failrly destructive conclusions.

    I hear this, and I shiver. Believers forever waiting until they are 'good enough' understanding with their head that they can be washed but taking as an excuse their failures and faults.... waiting until they have been made 'clean enough'.

    The saying that the Lord does not use unclean vessels is false on it's face... there are NO other vessels available other then those who are constantly being cleaned BY Him, for His service.


    1 John 1:7 (New King James Version)

    7 But if we walk in the light as He is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanses us from all sin.
    IIRC 'cleanses' is in the Greek 'perfect' tense. It is as thought

    The Blood of Christ Continues to Continue to cleans us from sin..... it is ongoing.

    There are no perfect Christians, just Christians being made perfect. There are no clean vessels, only ones being made clean.

    There is never a reason to wait to submit, and to follow.
    * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * ** * * * * ** * * * ** * *** * * * * ***** * * * * ** * * * * ** ** * *
    ~ * You get 10 'reps' to bless others with each day... don't log off until you have used them up......
    ....Live your life the same way.... ~ *

    Please pray for the 'Persecuted Church'.


    Bible Forums Vision: "To be a community of believers who are actively engaged in pursuing the truth of God as revealed in His Son Jesus Christ by way of studying the Scriptures diligently in order to discover this truth."



  • #2
    I'd need to know a little on the context of the statement to really be able to comment on it.

    Comment


    • #3
      I agree that no one is good except God Himself and that we are all in need of constant cleansing of unrightousness. I have seen God use "unclean vessels" in instances where he has used myself and others. Though not strong on our own, we can be made strong in Christ. We need to keep our ears open to the Holy Spirit and make sure we are ready to "jump" when the Lord says "jump".
      Psalm 19:14
      Let the words of my mouth, and the meditation of my heart, be acceptable in thy sight, O Lord, my strength, and my redeemer.
      sigpic

      Comment


      • #4
        As gringo says, it's hard to comment without any context and without knowing exactly what is meant by "unclean vessels".

        As a forgiven sinner God may use me despite my failings. So on that basis God does use unclean vessels on the basis that if he is using humans then by definition he is using unclean vessels.

        But if the original comment meant to ask whether God will use people who are engaged in ongoing and wilful sin it becomes more of a point of discussion. It seems to me God is unlikely to use non-Christians to further the kingdom and if a Christian falls into wilful and habitual sin it would seem likely that any ministry they had would not experience the same blessed success as it would if they were not engaged in wilful and habitual sin.

        If this is an argument used by Christians who don't feel ready to step out because they aren't perfect yet then it sounds like something the devil is telling them to keep them from being active warriors. Since the devil cannot withstand the sword of truth what better defence than to persuade those who might wield it that they are unworthy to do so, but with that ever-vague "maybe someday" clause to keep them trying to achieve the impossible before standing up to fight, and thereby keeping them constantly disheartened?
        24 August 2013 - I've decided to take a break from a number of internet forums, including this one, for my own reasons.
        I expect to be back at some time in the future, although at present don't know when that will be.
        I've been here just a few days shy of six years, and those six years have been greatly blessed.

        ---

        1Jn 4:1 NKJV Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits, whether they are of God; because many false prophets have gone out into the world.
        1Th 5:21-22 NKJV Test all things; hold fast what is good. (22) Abstain from every form of evil.



        Comment


        • #5
          He uses anyone he wants. Sin or no sin. Sampson was used by God. Nebuchadnezzar is called His servant. He has used me and he can use you!

          Comment


          • #6
            Your post brought to my mind this scripture:

            John 13:
            2The evening meal was being served, and the devil had already prompted Judas Iscariot, son of Simon, to betray Jesus. 3Jesus knew that the Father had put all things under his power, and that he had come from God and was returning to God; 4so he got up from the meal, took off his outer clothing, and wrapped a towel around his waist. 5After that, he poured water into a basin and began to wash his disciples’ feet, drying them with the towel that was wrapped around him.

            6He came to Simon Peter, who said to him, “Lord, are you going to wash my feet?”

            7Jesus replied, “You do not realize now what I am doing, but later you will understand.”

            8“No,” said Peter, “you shall never wash my feet.”

            Jesus answered, “Unless I wash you, you have no part with me.”

            9“Then, Lord,” Simon Peter replied, “not just my feet but my hands and my head as well!”

            10Jesus answered, “A person who has had a bath needs only to wash his feet; his whole body is clean. And you are clean, though not every one of you.” 11For he knew who was going to betray him, and that was why he said not every one was clean.


            God regenerates us, and we are vessels for His use. This regeneration clothes us with Christ's righteousness before God.

            Ephesians 2:
            10For we are God’s workmanship, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do.



            In Christ,
            Jen
            *edited to add: I agree with Arcadia; In God's sovereignty He uses anyone and anything He wills for His purposes; He spoke through Balaam's donkey after all.

            Comment


            • #7
              Look at me, unclean but being cleaned and used by the Lord. I don't let a chain the Lord has allowed to remain, to drag me down to a stop, it's slowed me when I allow it to slow me but God reminds me that He's using it to develop the testimony of His work in my life so His glory, can be seen by others.

              I'll be the first to say I struggle and to some Christians... they look down at me because I struggle... like I'm not good enough for them to be listening to me... well, I'm good enough for God to speak through me, so I keep speaking what He puts on my lips. I see it on this board even but then I also have those with the mercy of God in them offering help (some have even given me Words from God) and the Lord glorifies Himself through them as I receive help that God has given them to give to me. As God works in me and I experience His mercy, I offer words to help as well. I miss all the counseling the Lord enabled me to do behind the scenes when I was a leader here... MODS, no... don't ask, the Lord has me helping elsewhere but I do miss the chance to help here as the Lord led.
              Slug1--out

              ~"In the turmoil of any chaos, all it takes is that whisper that is heard like thunder over all the noise and the chaos seems to go away, focus returns and we are comforted in knowing that God has listened to our cry for help."~

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Amos_with_goats View Post
                THe Lord Does NOT USE unclean vessels...... yea or nea?



                I'd have to say nea. Or else I'd never be used.
                This IGNORE button is by far one of the most useful tools I've used to keep my peace while navigating through some of the madness.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Amos 3:3 says Can two walk together except they be agreed? There seems to be a school of thought in the modern church that we can live any way we want and still serve God. Did not the Lord say be ye holy as I am holy? Lev 20:7, 1 Pet 1:16 Paul wrote in Romans 12:1-2 that we are to present our bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service. Why would this be necessary if God was just going to use anyone He chose any how? 1 Cor 6:19-20 Can we think that the Holy Spirit of God works in a polluted temple? Does not Paul plead with the Corinthian believers to be clean? 2 Cor 6:11-18 Why did Jesus wash the disciples feet? Not because they were not clean but because they were not all clean. John 13:2-14 esp vs 10.

                  The modern church seems to think that it can look like and act like the world and be useful to God. I think this is tragically wrong thinking. The worlds music has gotten into the church. The worlds moral values have gotten into the church. The reasoning of men has replaced the word of God as the basis for doctine and conduct.

                  If the church continues to feed its earthly passions with rock music it will perish. If the church continues to appoint persons to ministry who are not biblically qualified the church will perish. Women pastors, sodomites and men who have multiple marriages or extra-marital affairs are not anointed by God to declare the word of God.

                  Balaam's donkey...well I'm tempted to draw some illustrations from him but I will forego for now.

                  For the cause of Christ
                  Roger

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I will quote a friend on mine that is also a pastor.

                    He had two things to say on this subject.

                    "If we our clean, then we are only clean because He has made us clean through the shedding of His blood.
                    Not by anything we did / can do.
                    100% Him 0% us = CLEAN"


                    and

                    "If He only used clean vessels then nothing would get done,
                    especially in the physical church. Because there are nothing but broken, dirty , 'unclean', ... vessels."
                    "Love is not about you...and it never was"
                    "Selfishness is inwardly focused, but Love is Always outwardly focused!"

                    I am very anti-abortion, anti-murder, and Pro-Love.
                    Gotta stop repeating myself...

                    Stop Marfan - The Silent but deadly killer.
                    It's main weapon is lack of truth.
                    Please learn the truth about the Marfan syndrome
                    by visiting The National Marfan Foundation.
                    Feel free to ask me any questions you may have
                    about the Marfan syndrome and I will answer them
                    the best I can.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Amos_with_goats View Post
                      Over the last several years I have encountered this belief (or at least this statement).

                      I know some will argue semantics, but I find the statement can lead to some failrly destructive conclusions.

                      I hear this, and I shiver. Believers forever waiting until they are 'good enough' understanding with their head that they can be washed but taking as an excuse their failures and faults.... waiting until they have been made 'clean enough'.

                      The saying that the Lord does not use unclean vessels is false on it's face... there are NO other vessels available other then those who are constantly being cleaned BY Him, for His service.


                      1 John 1:7 (New King James Version)

                      7 But if we walk in the light as He is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanses us from all sin.
                      IIRC 'cleanses' is in the Greek 'perfect' tense. It is as thought

                      The Blood of Christ Continues to Continue to cleans us from sin..... it is ongoing.

                      There are no perfect Christians, just Christians being made perfect. There are no clean vessels, only ones being made clean.

                      There is never a reason to wait to submit, and to follow.
                      He can use anything and anybody He wants...

                      He used a donkey in the OT...

                      in the NT.. the Sanhedrin when in Conference about this Carpenter from Nazareth, Jesus.. He who was Claiming to be the Son of God.. which He is... these Jesus Staunchest Enemies... the High Priest 'actually' Prophesied about Jesus Death.. here is one of Jesus Christ's Staunchest enemy and accuser.. 'prophesying'....

                      And one of them, [named] Caiaphas, being the high priest that same year, said unto them, Ye know nothing at all,
                      Nor consider that it is expedient for us, that one man should die for the people, and that the whole nation perish not.
                      And this spake he not of himself: but being high priest that year, he prophesied that Jesus should die for that nation;
                      And not for that nation only, but that also he should gather together in one the children of God that were scattered abroad.



                      Notice that if you go back and read earlier.. Jesus's open rebuke of these leaders... calling them white washed tombs..appearing outwardly to be Righteous, but inwardly 'unclean' and full of corruption...

                      God used one of these 'unclean' vessels.. unclean 'inwardly'............. to prophesy and to make the Scriptures come to pass..

                      thru a clean vessel??? no...

                      God can use anything He wants or anyone He wants.. He is 100% Sovereign
                      Many appear Righteous and Just because they say 'yes' to Jesus Christ , yet they don't do His Will.
                      ------------------------------------------------
                      Verily I say unto thee, the tax collectors and the prostitutes go into the Kingdom of Heaven before you do.
                      ------------------------------------------------
                      The LORD hath appeared of old unto me, saying. YEA, I have loved thee with an everlasting love; therefore with LOVINGKINDESS have I DRAWN THEE.
                      Jeremiah 31:3

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        It's the death and resurrection of the lord Jesus Christ and the indwelling of the Holy Spirit that makes us sad, chipped vessels clean, not our ability to look all shiny on the outside.
                        I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.
                        - Mahatma Gandhi



                        Comment


                        • #13
                          We even read about Rahab in the NT... God uses anyone despite any weakness they may have.
                          Slug1--out

                          ~"In the turmoil of any chaos, all it takes is that whisper that is heard like thunder over all the noise and the chaos seems to go away, focus returns and we are comforted in knowing that God has listened to our cry for help."~

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Slug1 View Post
                            We even read about Rahab in the NT... God uses anyone despite any weakness they may have.
                            God brought Israel out of Egypt God separated Israel from Egypt that they might worship Him. Israel wanted to go back to Egypt and look what happened. Exodus 32

                            Christ saved us out of the world and set us apart that we might worship Him. Many have gone back into the world and serve Him no more. Even worse Christians have brought all the trappings of the world into the church. Worldly music, no moral standards and no desire for the truth. Saved but not willing to be separate and holy unto the Lord. How many blessings has the Lord not been able to bless these with can never be known. If a Christian is not clean or desirous of being clean God will use one who is. Look at Noah. Noah was not like the rest of the people he was living with. So shall it be when the Son of Man comes.

                            God does not have to use dirty vessels. God always has a remnant that is clean and can be blessed.

                            Weak vessels and polluted vessels are not synonymous. Purge your idols from your hearts. Put on Christ and put off the world.

                            For the cause of Christ
                            Roger

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by arcadia View Post
                              He uses anyone he wants. Sin or no sin. Sampson was used by God. Nebuchadnezzar is called His servant. He has used me and he can use you!
                              Amen, my point exactly. I appreciate that fact greatly!.
                              * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * ** * * * * ** * * * ** * *** * * * * ***** * * * * ** * * * * ** ** * *
                              ~ * You get 10 'reps' to bless others with each day... don't log off until you have used them up......
                              ....Live your life the same way.... ~ *

                              Please pray for the 'Persecuted Church'.


                              Bible Forums Vision: "To be a community of believers who are actively engaged in pursuing the truth of God as revealed in His Son Jesus Christ by way of studying the Scriptures diligently in order to discover this truth."


                              Comment

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