Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Saw another thread about Suicide - my question is - what does it biblically mean?

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Saw another thread about Suicide - my question is - what does it biblically mean?

    I think people should always look for other ways of course, but speaking strictly from a theoretical point of view:

    Samson could be said to have committed suicide, and one could argue that even Jesus did (He could have stopped his death, but did not). There are other examples to be sure.

    When is dying for something when you could have prevented your death - and knew full well your actions would lead to a quick death - any different than suicide? If we believe people should just try harder, turn to God, etc - then why allow yourself to die when you could run to fight another day, etc?

    As I believe in a loving and understanding God, and given how much science we have about depression, mental illness and the like, I cannot see it being a sin.

    Certainly not something we should ever encourage! And we should always use what God gave us to help others. And I hope no one sees this post as condoning such things - I am merely asking about this from a theological view and based on another thread I saw here (I was interested in the discussion but for some reason could not post at the time, so apologies for posting something new here about it - still learning my way around).

    Thank you for allowing me to post here and I hope I can add to and learn from this board. I apologize ahead of time if this is posted in the wrong area.

    -Chance

  • #2
    The question I would like to present is related to Exodus 20:13 in relationship to suicide. Exodus 20 is where God gave Moses the 10 commandments which we are still to follow. So wouldn't killing oneself be murder of self and thus against what god commanded?

    Exodus 20

    13 ¶"You shall not murder.

    If we break the 10 commandments we are in sin and thus suicide would be sinning without being able to repent of that sin because you would be dead and unable to repent.
    I am a Christian man in the Devil's land, spreading the gospel man to man.
    Have you laid your burdens down?

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by chance45 View Post
      Samson could be said to have committed suicide, and one could argue that even Jesus did (He could have stopped his death, but did not). There are other examples to be sure.
      Suicide is when you, no one else, decide to end your own life. Sometimes someone else is used to accomplish this. Jesus offered himself as a sacrifice which has a purpose to help others. Suicide isn't designed to help others even if in some ways it might.


      As I believe in a loving and understanding God, and given how much science we have about depression, mental illness and the like, I cannot see it being a sin.
      I believe God would judge case by case, not all as the same in his eyes.
      1Peter 3:15
      (BBE) But give honour to Christ in your hearts as your Lord; and be ready at any time when you are questioned about the hope which is in you, to give an answer in the fear of the Lord and without pride;

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by TrustingFollower View Post
        If we break the 10 commandments we are in sin and thus suicide would be sinning without being able to repent of that sin because you would be dead and unable to repent.
        What if you slap your wife and die of a heart attack 2 minutes later? Your logic does not make sense.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Freek View Post
          What if you slap your wife and die of a heart attack 2 minutes later? Your logic does not make sense.
          Slapping your wife would be sinning and thus you would not be walking in the ways of the Lord, so yes the logic still works. We as Christians are to become like Christ and not willfully sin, the wages of sin is death.

          Matthew 22

          37 And He said to him, "`YOU SHALL LOVE THE LORD YOUR GOD WITH ALL YOUR HEART, AND WITH ALL YOUR SOUL, AND WITH ALL YOUR MIND.´
          38 "This is the great and foremost commandment.
          39 "The second is like it, `YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF.´
          40 "On these two commandments depend the whole Law and the Prophets."
          I am a Christian man in the Devil's land, spreading the gospel man to man.
          Have you laid your burdens down?

          Comment


          • #6
            Suicide is an act of intentional (purposeful, pre-meditated) self-murder in which one has no morally exonerating circumstance in which to perform the act (such as covering a grenade). Such an act, I would propose, should be called sacrifice (as was mentioned by a poster above). Suicide is a completely selfish act, whereas sacrifice is completely selfless.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by TrustingFollower View Post
              The question I would like to present is related to Exodus 20:13 in relationship to suicide. Exodus 20 is where God gave Moses the 10 commandments which we are still to follow. So wouldn't killing oneself be murder of self and thus against what god commanded?

              Exodus 20

              13 ¶"You shall not murder.

              If we break the 10 commandments we are in sin and thus suicide would be sinning without being able to repent of that sin because you would be dead and unable to repent.
              Jesus died for our sins once and for all. He died for my sins before I was born. I have accepted the gift of salvation. I have given my life to the Lord (as best I can) and ask him to help me walk in his ways. I have been freed from my signature sins. Yet I still sometimes sin as the Bible says we all do. I can add nothing to the mighty works that Jesus did for me that day. My salvation is not based on the last moment repentence statement for my sins. In fact to God my sins are as far as the east is from the west. While I understand your statement (and agree) that suicide is self murder. In our world it is not as bad as killing someone else. Now we should all counter with the arguement that all sin is the same in the eyes of God (regarding salvation). So therefore suicide and murder are the same and require the same punsihment. I agree than according to my Lord's words gossip, and thoughts of lust, lying, swearing, judging, etc. are exactly the same. We better not die before saying the magic words of repentence. Yet, didn't my Savior want all of us to be saved. Didn't he want us all to be free from guilt and fear as we finish our earthly lives? My soul is saved, I will need a new body to live with him forever. Thank you Jesus that I will get one. He sees me for who I will become not who I am. Let the journey continue. In Jesus name I pray Amen.

              God bless you and yours.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Xel'Naga View Post
                Suicide is a completely selfish act, whereas sacrifice is completely selfless.
                All sin is............

                Comment


                • #9
                  John 15:13
                  Greater love has no one than this, than to lay down one’s life for his friends.


                  If a fireman goes into a home to save people..brings out the family but later dies from injuring he got saving them..did he commit suicide?

                  Of course not.


                  Jesus did not commit suicide..He died to save all of us..the whole world..so we might live. Plus His situation was vastly different from anyone else's as He rose from the dead and His saving us wasn't to physically save us so we could live physically forever, but spiritually live forever. I don't think we can begin to compare what He did to anything any people do actually.

                  Samson died to kill a large group of people who were ruthless and hurting the Hebrews. By their deaths, he saved many. He gave his life for that cause, not just to off himself.

                  Most suicides aren't about saving others..though the person that does this might think they are saving their family from being burdened with them..that is the distorted thinking that usually comes with depressed people. They aren't thinking clearly. Because if they were they would realize their suicide would cause much, much more grief for their families then if they had died naturally. Suicide really, really hurts the family and friends that care about them.

                  Some people kill themselves though out of spite..just TOO hurt their families. Pretty sick isn't it?

                  God bless
                  "People do not drift toward holiness. Apart from grace-driven effort, people do not gravitate toward godliness, prayer, obedience to Scripture, faith, and delight in the Lord. We drift toward compromise and call it tolerance; We drift toward disobedience and call it freedom; We drift toward superstition and call it faith. We cherish the indiscipline of lost self-control and call it relaxation; we slouch toward prayerlessness and delude ourselves into thinking we have escaped legalism; we slide toward godlessness and convince ourselves we have been liberated?" - D A Carson

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Gregg View Post
                    Jesus died for our sins once and for all. He died for my sins before I was born. I have accepted the gift of salvation. I have given my life to the Lord (as best I can) and ask him to help me walk in his ways. I have been freed from my signature sins. Yet I still sometimes sin as the Bible says we all do. I can add nothing to the mighty works that Jesus did for me that day. My salvation is not based on the last moment repentence statement for my sins. In fact to God my sins are as far as the east is from the west. While I understand your statement (and agree) that suicide is self murder. In our world it is not as bad as killing someone else. Now we should all counter with the arguement that all sin is the same in the eyes of God (regarding salvation). So therefore suicide and murder are the same and require the same punsihment. I agree than according to my Lord's words gossip, and thoughts of lust, lying, swearing, judging, etc. are exactly the same. We better not die before saying the magic words of repentence. Yet, didn't my Savior want all of us to be saved. Didn't he want us all to be free from guilt and fear as we finish our earthly lives? My soul is saved, I will need a new body to live with him forever. Thank you Jesus that I will get one. He sees me for who I will become not who I am. Let the journey continue. In Jesus name I pray Amen.

                    God bless you and yours.
                    While I agree with your statement for the most part, the part that is alarming is the underlying tone of having a license to sin. We as Christians are to deny ourselves and to live for God. Does that allow us to do anything we want because Jesus died to cleanse us of our sins, heavens no. Jesus died for me while I was still an enemy towards Him and God the Father, now that I have come into Him and become one with Him, I need to live my life for Him. Does living my life for Him give me the right to do anything I want to do? No it does not. We as Christians have to take on the mindset of being a slave to Christ. A slave has no rights of their own and do what their master wishes them to do. It is by God's grace that we are saved through faith in His promises. The apostle Paul addressed this in his letter to the Romans.

                    Romans 6

                    1 What shall we say then? Are we to continue in sin so that grace may increase?
                    2 May it never be! How shall we who died to sin still live in it?

                    Romans 6

                    11 Even so consider yourselves to be dead to sin, but alive to God in Christ Jesus.
                    12 ¶Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body so that you obey its lusts,
                    13 and do not go on presenting the members of your body to sin as instruments of unrighteousness; but present yourselves to God as those alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness to God.
                    14 For sin shall not be master over you, for you are not under law but under grace.
                    15 ¶What then? Shall we sin because we are not under law but under grace? May it never be!
                    16 Do you not know that when you present yourselves to someone as slaves for obedience, you are slaves of the one whom you obey, either of sin resulting in death, or of obedience resulting in righteousness?
                    17 But thanks be to God that though you were slaves of sin, you became obedient from the heart to that form of teaching to which you were committed,
                    18 and having been freed from sin, you became slaves of righteousness.

                    So you see we as Christians can not just go on with this life with the mindset that we can do anything we want because Jesus paid the price for our sins, we have to strive daily to be like Christ. Become servants to righteousness and sow to the spirit not the flesh.
                    I am a Christian man in the Devil's land, spreading the gospel man to man.
                    Have you laid your burdens down?

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by TrustingFollower View Post
                      Slapping your wife would be sinning and thus you would not be walking in the ways of the Lord, so yes the logic still works. We as Christians are to become like Christ and not willfully sin, the wages of sin is death.

                      Matthew 22

                      37 And He said to him, "`YOU SHALL LOVE THE LORD YOUR GOD WITH ALL YOUR HEART, AND WITH ALL YOUR SOUL, AND WITH ALL YOUR MIND.´
                      38 "This is the great and foremost commandment.
                      39 "The second is like it, `YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF.´
                      40 "On these two commandments depend the whole Law and the Prophets."
                      So if you have unrepented sin in your life the moment you die, you are doomed??? Can you please clarify your point of view.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Gregg View Post
                        All sin is............
                        Perhaps. However my point was to compare and contrast the difference between suicide and sacrifice.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Freek View Post
                          So if you have unrepented sin in your life the moment you die, you are doomed??? Can you please clarify your point of view.
                          There is a big difference between repentance and forgiveness. Can you be repentante if you are willfully sinning? I say no you can not be repentant by living a life of willful sin. Look what Jesus taught on repentance.

                          Luke 13

                          1 Now on the same occasion there were some present who reported to Him about the Galileans whose blood Pilate had mixed with their sacrifices.
                          2 And Jesus said to them, "Do you suppose that these Galileans were greater sinners than all other Galileans because they suffered this fate?
                          3 "I tell you, no, but unless you repent, you will all likewise perish.
                          4 "Or do you suppose that those eighteen on whom the tower in Siloam fell and killed them were worse culprits than all the men who live in Jerusalem?
                          5 "I tell you, no, but unless you repent, you will all likewise perish."

                          So we can see that Jesus expects us to change the ways we live in order to inherit eternal life. Repentance is the act of changing your ways so you do not live a life of willful sin. We all are sinners be nature and all fall short of the goal, but the difference is what the intent of the heart is, willful or not.

                          Matthew 15

                          16 Jesus said, "Are you still lacking in understanding also?
                          17 "Do you not understand that everything that goes into the mouth passes into the stomach, and is eliminated?
                          18 "But the things that proceed out of the mouth come from the heart, and those defile the man.
                          19 "For out of the heart come evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, slanders.
                          20 "These are the things which defile the man; but to eat with unwashed hands does not defile the man."

                          The repentant heart does not live for the desires of the flesh and the things of this world. The repentant heart does all things for Christ and lives for the glory of God. Thus the repentant heart does not willfully sin.
                          I am a Christian man in the Devil's land, spreading the gospel man to man.
                          Have you laid your burdens down?

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by TrustingFollower View Post
                            There is a big difference between repentance and forgiveness. Can you be repentante if you are willfully sinning? I say no you can not be repentant by living a life of willful sin. Look what Jesus taught on repentance.

                            Luke 13

                            1 Now on the same occasion there were some present who reported to Him about the Galileans whose blood Pilate had mixed with their sacrifices.
                            2 And Jesus said to them, "Do you suppose that these Galileans were greater sinners than all other Galileans because they suffered this fate?
                            3 "I tell you, no, but unless you repent, you will all likewise perish.
                            4 "Or do you suppose that those eighteen on whom the tower in Siloam fell and killed them were worse culprits than all the men who live in Jerusalem?
                            5 "I tell you, no, but unless you repent, you will all likewise perish."

                            So we can see that Jesus expects us to change the ways we live in order to inherit eternal life. Repentance is the act of changing your ways so you do not live a life of willful sin. We all are sinners be nature and all fall short of the goal, but the difference is what the intent of the heart is, willful or not.

                            Matthew 15

                            16 Jesus said, "Are you still lacking in understanding also?
                            17 "Do you not understand that everything that goes into the mouth passes into the stomach, and is eliminated?
                            18 "But the things that proceed out of the mouth come from the heart, and those defile the man.
                            19 "For out of the heart come evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, slanders.
                            20 "These are the things which defile the man; but to eat with unwashed hands does not defile the man."

                            The repentant heart does not live for the desires of the flesh and the things of this world. The repentant heart does all things for Christ and lives for the glory of God. Thus the repentant heart does not willfully sin.
                            How does this concern acts of desperation, or acts out of mental illness?

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              How would suicide align with the providence of God? Hmmm??? Especially when we consider that God gives every man an appointed time to be born and an appointed time to die?

                              Ec*3:2
                              A time to be born, and a time to die; a time to plant, and a time to pluck up that which is planted;

                              Ps*31:15
                              My times are in thy hand: deliver me from the hand of mine enemies, and from them that persecute me.

                              Heb*9:27
                              And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:

                              Can a man alter or reverse/stay the fixed times he/she is appointed to be born or to die?

                              Many Blessings,
                              RW

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X