Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

If there is no free will then why will the lost be cast into the lake of fire?

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • If there is no free will then why will the lost be cast into the lake of fire?

    There are those who have chosen to believe that man does not have free will as far as being responsible to freely choose to believe in Christ or not. Instead, they believe God gives faith in Christ to some and does not give it to the rest. But if that is the case then what exactly would unbelievers be held accountable and responsible for on judgment day?

    They wouldn't be held responsible for not choosing to believe in Christ in this case because they wouldn't have even had the ability to do so. So, why exactly would they be held accountable and punished by being cast into the lake of fire on judgment day if they had no choice but to not believe in Christ? I don't see how they would be responsible for anything.

    John 3
    16For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. 17For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
    18He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

    We know that the wages of sin is death. Not just physical death, but eternal separation from God, which is the second death (Rev 20:14-15). Ultimately, though, the reason that a person is condemned is for not believing in Christ, as we can see from John 3:18.

    So, again, why would people who supposedly have no ability to believe in Christ and/or aren't given faith in Christ be punished for not doing so? How does that make any sense whatsoever? I think it makes far more sense that they will be punished because they had the opportunity to believe in Christ but chose not to do so. In that case man is responsible for not believing rather than God being responsible because He did not give them faith.

    Scripture teaches that man will be held accountable for his own behavior.

    Matt 16:27 For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works.

    Rev 22:12 And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be.

    Rev 20
    11And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them.
    12And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
    13And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.

    Rom 14
    10But why dost thou judge thy brother? or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for we shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ.
    11For it is written, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God.
    12So then every one of us shall give account of himself to God.

    If the lost didn't believe because they had no ability to believe then it seems that they could say to God on judgment day "Lord, you didn't give us faith so that's why we didn't believe.". And it seems that would be a legitimate excuse if that was the case. But instead they will have no excuse because God did give them the opportunity to believe and they chose not to do so.

  • #2
    Great post...I agree!

    God bless
    "People do not drift toward holiness. Apart from grace-driven effort, people do not gravitate toward godliness, prayer, obedience to Scripture, faith, and delight in the Lord. We drift toward compromise and call it tolerance; We drift toward disobedience and call it freedom; We drift toward superstition and call it faith. We cherish the indiscipline of lost self-control and call it relaxation; we slouch toward prayerlessness and delude ourselves into thinking we have escaped legalism; we slide toward godlessness and convince ourselves we have been liberated?" - D A Carson

    Comment


    • #3
      One might do well to take note that no one jumps into the lake of fire of their own free will. They are cast into the fire. The soverignity of God allows man to have a free will but mans free will does not trump Gods soverignity. God is mericiful and not willing that any should perish but rather willing that all should come to repentance. Men who refuse Gods great offer of saving grace do so because they love darkness their deeds being evil. They tread under foot the precious blood of Christ. How shall they escape? It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God. Heb 2:3 & 10:26-31

      For the cause of Christ
      Roger

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by John146 View Post
        There are those who have chosen to believe that man does not have free will as far as being responsible to freely choose to believe in Christ or not. Instead, they believe God gives faith in Christ to some and does not give it to the rest. But if that is the case then what exactly would unbelievers be held accountable and responsible for on judgment day?

        They wouldn't be held responsible for not choosing to believe in Christ in this case because they wouldn't have even had the ability to do so. So, why exactly would they be held accountable and punished by being cast into the lake of fire on judgment day if they had no choice but to not believe in Christ? I don't see how they would be responsible for anything.

        John 3
        16For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. 17For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
        18He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

        We know that the wages of sin is death. Not just physical death, but eternal separation from God, which is the second death (Rev 20:14-15). Ultimately, though, the reason that a person is condemned is for not believing in Christ, as we can see from John 3:18.

        So, again, why would people who supposedly have no ability to believe in Christ and/or aren't given faith in Christ be punished for not doing so? How does that make any sense whatsoever? I think it makes far more sense that they will be punished because they had the opportunity to believe in Christ but chose not to do so. In that case man is responsible for not believing rather than God being responsible because He did not give them faith.

        Scripture teaches that man will be held accountable for his own behavior.

        Matt 16:27 For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works.

        Rev 22:12 And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be.

        Rev 20
        11And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them.
        12And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
        13And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.

        Rom 14
        10But why dost thou judge thy brother? or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for we shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ.
        11For it is written, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God.
        12So then every one of us shall give account of himself to God.

        If the lost didn't believe because they had no ability to believe then it seems that they could say to God on judgment day "Lord, you didn't give us faith so that's why we didn't believe.". And it seems that would be a legitimate excuse if that was the case. But instead they will have no excuse because God did give them the opportunity to believe and they chose not to do so.
        Eric, if unsaved, unrepentant man is cast into the LOF because he/she refused to believe, then salvation would not be by grace, it would be by our own goodness. At the end of the age, when fallen, unregenerate man is forever cast into the LOF it will not be because he/she did not make the right choice, it will be because they have no covering for their sins. They are not clothed in the righteousness of Christ, and therefore they must stand for themselves in the Judgment, where they will be condemned.

        Man is accountable for their sins! Why? Because they know that God is, and that He requires all glory, honor and praise. Since every man knows God exists, they should all believe Christ, and turn to Him for life. But the simple truth is that ALL men love the darkness rather than the Light of Chirst. So ALL men, without exception, willfully chooses to supress their knowledge of God. There is not a single man, born in Adam, who would not change the glory of God into an image made by corruptible man...unless God, from before the foundation of the world, chooses an elect people for Himself. A people who will give Him all glory, honor and praise that is rightfully His alone! If God had not determined to save some people, then no people would be saved. Salvation is of the LORD ALONE! Not by the will of the fallen flesh, not by the will of fallen man, but by the will of God alone! To God Be All Glory...AMEN!

        Many Blessings,
        RW

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by RogerW View Post
          Eric, if unsaved, unrepentant man is cast into the LOF because he/she refused to believe, then salvation would not be by grace, it would be by our own goodness.
          It sure sounds like you are saying that believing has nothing to do with our salvation.
          John 8:24 KJV I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins.
          Joh 20:31 But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by RogerW View Post
            Eric, if unsaved, unrepentant man is cast into the LOF because he/she refused to believe, then salvation would not be by grace, it would be by our own goodness.
            Show me scripture that teaches that, Roger.

            At the end of the age, when fallen, unregenerate man is forever cast into the LOF it will not be because he/she did not make the right choice, it will be because they have no covering for their sins. They are not clothed in the righteousness of Christ, and therefore they must stand for themselves in the Judgment, where they will be condemned.
            God desires that all people would repent and be saved. With that being the case the only thing we can conclude is that people will be cast into the LOF because they chose not to repent and believe rather than it being a case of God not having given them faith or given them the ability to believe. If they will be cast into the LOF only because they have no covering for their sins then that would mean God alone is responsible for them being cast into the LOF and not them. But scripture says people will be rewarded/judged according to their own works. That means man has responsibility. But you place the responsibility for man not believing in Christ on God instead.

            Man is accountable for their sins! Why? Because they know that God is, and that He requires all glory, honor and praise. Since every man knows God exists, they should all believe Christ, and turn to Him for life. But the simple truth is that ALL men love the darkness rather than the Light of Chirst.
            That's not true. Do you love darkness rather than the light of Christ, Roger? I know I don't. Maybe at one time we did but once we learn of the truth then a choice had to be made, to either love the light or continue to love the darkness.

            So ALL men, without exception, willfully chooses to supress their knowledge of God. There is not a single man, born in Adam, who would not change the glory of God into an image made by corruptible man...unless God, from before the foundation of the world, chooses an elect people for Himself. A people who will give Him all glory, honor and praise that is rightfully His alone! If God had not determined to save some people, then no people would be saved. Salvation is of the LORD ALONE! Not by the will of the fallen flesh, not by the will of fallen man, but by the will of God alone! To God Be All Glory...AMEN!
            Yes, to God be all glory, but may there be no glory for your false doctrine that God alone is responsible for man being cast into the LOF rather than man alone being responsible for that.

            Comment


            • #7
              But instead they will have no excuse because God did give them the opportunity to believe and they chose not to do so.

              ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

              So if they have the ability 'not to choose' God.. then that would mean it was thru their own ability that 'they chose God'..

              But you see Eric, Scripture tells us differently... Its Jesus Christ Himself that chooses His Own... man doesn't choose God... and no man comes to the Father except by Jesus Christ.. and no man comes to Jesus Christ unless the Father Draws him/her... Salvation is Initiated in Heaven, Eric,

              Not the will of the flesh and those in religion..

              God chooses.. the Issues and Merits of Salvation belong with Him alone Eric..


              not man.. and what you propose and set forth is a man centered gospel and salvation...

              We'll never be able to convince you Eric... but you Know God can conivnce you.. and He is ABLE...
              Many appear Righteous and Just because they say 'yes' to Jesus Christ , yet they don't do His Will.
              ------------------------------------------------
              Verily I say unto thee, the tax collectors and the prostitutes go into the Kingdom of Heaven before you do.
              ------------------------------------------------
              The LORD hath appeared of old unto me, saying. YEA, I have loved thee with an everlasting love; therefore with LOVINGKINDESS have I DRAWN THEE.
              Jeremiah 31:3

              Comment


              • #8
                not my area of expertise, but i think the standard answer is that the fallen nature causes man to freely choose to reject God. I think a lot depends on your concept of freedom. is freedom the ability to pursue all options? if so, God is not free, since he cannot lie. perhaps free will means that we are able to choose what we want - what is in agreement with our nature. if so then God is free, since it is his nature to tell the truth and he chooses to do so. And man would be free to do what he wants, and the fallen nature will only ever want to reject God.

                i also agree w the previous posts that point out that it is our own sins that rightfully earn us the punishment. It is our denial if Christ that keeps us in that state (where we belong). God is fully justified in punishing all sinners and is not in any way obligated to save any, but has chosen to do so as an act of mercy.

                consider:

                Rom 9:14 What shall we say then? There is no injustice with God, is there? May it never be!
                Rom 9:15 For He says to Moses, "I WILL HAVE MERCY ON WHOM I HAVE MERCY, AND I WILL HAVE COMPASSION ON WHOM I HAVE COMPASSION."
                Rom 9:16 So then it does not depend on the man who wills or the man who runs, but on God who has mercy.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by theBelovedDisciple View Post
                  But instead they will have no excuse because God did give them the opportunity to believe and they chose not to do so.

                  ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

                  So if they have the ability 'not to choose' God.. then that would mean it was thru their own ability that 'they chose God'..
                  What else can we conclude when scripture teaches that God desires all people to repent (Eze 33:11, 2 Peter 3:9, Acts 17:30-31) and be saved (1 Tim 2:3-6)? Since that is God's desire we have to conclude that the reason people don't believe is not that God didn't want them to and didn't give them faith, but rather that they chose not to believe.

                  [quote]But you see Eric, Scripture tells us differently..[/qutoe]What scripture would that be?

                  Its Jesus Christ Himself that chooses His Own... man doesn't choose God... and no man comes to the Father except by Jesus Christ.. and no man comes to Jesus Christ unless the Father Draws him/her... Salvation is Initiated in Heaven, Eric,
                  Yes, it is. God sent His Son from heaven to die for the sins of the whole world, friend. The whole world. Not some of the world. But you take bits and pieces of scripture and draw conclusions from them without looking at the big picture. You say man doesn't choose God. Please tell that to Joshua when you see him one day, okay? He will get a good laugh from that (Joshua 24:15). No man comes to the Father unles the Father draws him. Yes, that's right. But does God just randomly draw some and not the rest? No. He draws people according to His will. What is His will?

                  John 6:40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

                  So, who does the Father draw to come to a relationship with Christ? Those who believe in Him.

                  We shouldn't speak of the concept of being drawn to Christ without looking at this verse:

                  John 12:32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me.

                  Now, I'm sure you would falsely try to say that "all men" actually means "all the elect". That is what people who hold to your doctrine have to do repeatedly to explain scripture away that contradicts your view. The world or the whole world doesn't refer to all people in the world. The phrase "all men" never refers to all people. You have to do quite a bit of scriptural gymnastics to keep your doctrine afloat. But Jesus said that He would draw all people to Him. Did that mean all people would believe in Him and become His people? No. We can see from the parable of the sower that some are drawn to Him but then the riches of the world or the cares of the world make them draw back. Some are drawn to Him and receive the good news with joy at first but then they fall away once tribulation and persecution comes. The gospel sounds good to them, but not if it means they have to give anything up for it including their desires and even their lives.

                  Not the will of the flesh and those in religion..

                  God chooses.. the Issues and Merits of Salvation belong with Him alone Eric..
                  If that is the case then why does scripture say that man must humble himself and that man must repent and that man must believe? When the prison keeper asked Paul and Silas what he had to do to be saved why didn't they tell him there was nothing he could do to be saved but that God does it all?

                  not man.. and what you propose and set forth is a man centered gospel and salvation...
                  What you propose is that man has no responsibility before God and that God punishes people for not believing in Him even though they supposedly have no ability to do so. But scripture does not teach that God is partial or that He punishes people for things they have no control over.

                  We'll never be able to convince you Eric..
                  That is true. I will not be convinced to believe in false teaching.

                  but you Know God can conivnce you.. and He is ABLE...
                  God would not try to convince me of false doctrine.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by subarctic_guy View Post
                    not my area of expertise, but i think the standard answer is that the fallen nature causes man to freely choose to reject God. I think a lot depends on your concept of freedom. is freedom the ability to pursue all options? if so, God is not free, since he cannot lie. perhaps free will means that we are able to choose what we want - what is in agreement with our nature. if so then God is free, since it is his nature to tell the truth and he chooses to do so. And man would be free to do what he wants, and the fallen nature will only ever want to reject God.

                    i also agree w the previous posts that point out that it is our own sins that rightfully earn us the punishment. It is our denial if Christ that keeps us in that state (where we belong). God is fully justified in punishing all sinners and is not in any way obligated to save any, but has chosen to do so as an act of mercy.

                    consider:

                    Rom 9:14 What shall we say then? There is no injustice with God, is there? May it never be!
                    Rom 9:15 For He says to Moses, "I WILL HAVE MERCY ON WHOM I HAVE MERCY, AND I WILL HAVE COMPASSION ON WHOM I HAVE COMPASSION."
                    Rom 9:16 So then it does not depend on the man who wills or the man who runs, but on God who has mercy.
                    The question this raises is this: Does God arbitrarily have mercy on some and not others or is there a basis for who He has mercy on and who He doesn't?

                    There are different aspects of God's mercy. There is the aspect where He shows mercy to those who did nothing to deserve it. That would be everyone, IMO. No one did anything to deserve having God send His only Son to die for the sins of the whole world. God did that out of His own grace and mercy and not because He felt that man deserved for Him to have done that.

                    But there is also the aspect of God's mercy where He gives mercy to people as a reward for their attitudes and behavior towards Him. Here are a few examples of that:

                    Psalm 33
                    21For our heart shall rejoice in him, because we have trusted in his holy name.
                    22Let thy mercy, O LORD, be upon us, according as we hope in thee.

                    Psalm 86:5 For thou, Lord, art good, and ready to forgive; and plenteous in mercy unto all them that call upon thee.

                    Psalm 103:11 For as the heaven is high above the earth, so great is his mercy toward them that fear him.

                    Prov 28:13 He that covereth his sins shall not prosper: but whoso confesseth and forsaketh them shall have mercy.

                    Luke 1:50 And his mercy is on them that fear him from generation to generation.

                    So, while no one can tell Him who He should have mercy on, it was His decision to show mercy upon those who hope in Him, fear Him, forsake their sins and call upon Him. There is no basis for thinking that God arbitrarily has mercy on some and not the rest. He desires to have mercy upon all, but requires that they believe.

                    Romans 11
                    30For as ye in times past have not believed God, yet have now obtained mercy through their unbelief:
                    31Even so have these also now not believed, that through your mercy they also may obtain mercy.
                    32For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by John146 View Post
                      There are those who have chosen to believe that man does not have free will as far as being responsible to freely choose to believe in Christ or not. Instead, they believe God gives faith in Christ to some and does not give it to the rest.
                      Hi John! When i was reading your posts somethings popped into my head and i felt the need to dialogue

                      Actually I think Man has the ability to have "free will" in terms of choosing to be a "christian". There are those who have an intellectual knowledge of God, Jesus and even specific passages/stories/doctrines from scripture but that in and of itself does not save.

                      I think we here on this forum can agree that there are some people in physical church buildings that come every sunday and wednesday, go through the motions and claim the title Christian. Does that make them so?

                      Let trek back to Matthew 7 with specific verses in mind

                      Mat 7:21 "Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven.
                      Mat 7:22 On that day many will say to me, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?'
                      Mat 7:23 And then will I declare to them, 'I never knew you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness.'
                      These people themselves must have known the Lord to some extent. They evidently prophesied, cast out demons and did many might works in the name of Christ. They "knew" him intellectually but their heart was far from Him. What immediately comes to mind is Isaiah 29:13

                      Isa 29:13 And the Lord said: "Because this people draw near with their mouth and honor me with their lips, while their hearts are far from me, and their fear of me is a commandment taught by men
                      When i think of Matthew 7 i see people going through motions yet with no attachment of any saving faith. So what is it that makes some saved and others not? What can we do that Christ's blood be applied to us that our sins may be blotted out?

                      Those being turned away in Matthew 7 seem earnest to me. They plead to the Lord the things that they did. They knew the Lord yet the Lord did not know them in a saving sense (v23)

                      Originally posted by John146
                      But if that is the case then what exactly would unbelievers be held accountable and responsible for on judgment day?
                      I guess the main thing is.... who really deserves to be saved at all? There isnt one that is just among us. unbelievers are held accountable for sin. God would be just in not saving anyone if He so chose and holding us responsible for our own sin.

                      What comes to mind here is the Old Testament. When they did sacrifices for sin who exactly were they applied to? There were people outside of Israel in the OT. Were those people covered by those sacrifices made or were they applied to specific people in Israel?

                      For example Job 1:5 comes to mind. Those burnt offerings were specifically were in case his sons or daughters have committed sin.

                      What I see is that the same applies to the blood of Christ. Is it applied to all men? I think we see that is not the case. There are those who will not enter the kingdom but no longer is salvation a thing of the Jews. It extends to all peoples as there is no Jew or Greek in Christ.

                      So to answer your question the actual saving Faith is something that is of God. We can agree that we do nothing to merit it with our works. It is a gift freely given by God to undeserving sinners.

                      I know you made a longer post but i figured i didnt want to over do it and we could take our time! Blessings!
                      Originally posted by Job 34:19
                      God is not partial to princes and does not favor the rich over the poor, for they are all the work of His hands.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Are we now saying that God is willing that MANY should perish?
                        We are his body, We are his representative, We are the extension of God to the earth. Every action should be a extension of God's love.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Kahtar View Post
                          It sure sounds like you are saying that believing has nothing to do with our salvation.
                          John 8:24 KJV I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins.
                          Joh 20:31 But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name.
                          Hi Kahtar,

                          It's not that believing has nothing to do with whether or not we inherit eternal life. Those who inherit eternal life will absolutely believe, and those who do not will die in their sins. But why will they die in their sins? Is it because they refused Christ? Or is it because Christ's atonement does not cover them?

                          Here's my point...if we say our sins keep us from inheriting eternal life, then no man could have life everlasting, because every single one of us (even after re-birth) continues to sin. But it is not our sins that keep us from inheriting eternal life. We inherit eternal life only when we have the blood of Christ to atone for our sins. Not because we sin, but because we have no way of being reconciled to God apart from Christ. Without Him we do not inherit eternal life because we have no atonement for our sins, so we die in our sins, just as Jo 8:24 shows us. Is not refusal to believe one of many sins? Is not even this sin covered when we are clothed with the righteousness of Christ?

                          Many Blessings,
                          RW

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Frankly, the "Man is fallen and can freely choose to reject God, but not freely choose to accept him" line of argument seems, imo, intellectually dishonest. If that is the case, then choice has nothing to do with it. If God decrees 'X' to hell and 'Y' to Heaven (even if He only decrees 'Y' to heaven, he is likewise decreeing 'X' to hell), then it seems to me that the entire reason some go to hell is because God wishes to display his "glory" and "power" and whatever else it is one might say God wishes to display. But, what a sadistic God to have to damn people, and then say 'You did not believe in my Son!' According to the view of some, I don't think free will has anything to do with it.

                            And I suppose those people can really only say, "God likes me and hates you. Na na na na naaa naaaaaaaaaa *stick tongue out". Don't like that? Well, don't hide behind the language of "God doesn't have to save any of us!" "I'm saved entirely by grace, because I'm part of the elect!" Etc. etc. etc. I wonder how many people God had to decree to damn before He was satisfied that his power and glory was sufficiently displayed.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Xel'Naga View Post
                              Frankly, the "Man is fallen and can freely choose to reject God, but not freely choose to accept him" line of argument seems, imo, intellectually dishonest. If that is the case, then choice has nothing to do with it. If God decrees 'X' to hell and 'Y' to Heaven (even if He only decrees 'Y' to heaven, he is likewise decreeing 'X' to hell), then it seems to me that the entire reason some go to hell is because God wishes to display his "glory" and "power" and whatever else it is one might say God wishes to display. But, what a sadistic God to have to damn people, and then say 'You did not believe in my Son!' According to the view of some, I don't think free will has anything to do with it.

                              And I suppose those people can really only say, "God likes me and hates you. Na na na na naaa naaaaaaaaaa *stick tongue out". Don't like that? Well, don't hide behind the language of "God doesn't have to save any of us!" "I'm saved entirely by grace, because I'm part of the elect!" Etc. etc. etc. I wonder how many people God had to decree to damn before He was satisfied that his power and glory was sufficiently displayed.
                              What in the World?
                              Do you understand what you are saying?
                              God sends people to hell, and then later damn them to eternal torment in the Lake of fire, BURNING AND IN TORMENT FOR EVER AND EVER AND EVER AND EVER?
                              Just because he wanted to? and you say, Your proud because your chosen? Chosen for what? What kind of God is that?
                              Who would want to be with God if they knew that they made Heaven by a Roll of a Dice and their family were Damned because the dice didn't fall on them?
                              That would sound like an Un-Just and Evil God to me!
                              That isn't my God, Thank God my Jesus is merciful and full of compassion!
                              We are his body, We are his representative, We are the extension of God to the earth. Every action should be a extension of God's love.

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X