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The Law And The Prophets Were until John:

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  • The Law And The Prophets Were until John:

    The kingdom of God is the continuation or next stage leading from the what is written in the law and the prophets.

    Lk 16:15 And he said unto them, Ye are they which justify yourselves before men; but God knoweth your hearts: for that which is highly esteemed among men is abomination in the sight of God.
    Lk 16:16 The law and The prophets were until John: since that time The kingdom of God is preached, and every man presseth into it.

    Lk 24:44 And he said unto them, these are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, And in the prophets, And in the psalms, concerning me.

    The Pharisees it seems were not concerned with the Kingdom of God.
    They sought their own justification.

    Firstfruits

  • #2
    Yep........................

    Comment


    • #3
      The law and the prophets concept is a fascinating study. The symbology they represent is a real eye opener to the whole of the scriptures.

      One example that is easy to see. Look at Israel in the old testament, it was always ruled over by a King and a priest. The king represented the law and the priest represented the prophets. The law and the prophets are the two witnesses to the word of God and you can find the representation all through out scripture.
      I am a Christian man in the Devil's land, spreading the gospel man to man.
      Have you laid your burdens down?

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Firstfruits View Post
        The kingdom of God is the continuation or next stage leading from the what is written in the law and the prophets.

        Lk 16:15 And he said unto them, Ye are they which justify yourselves before men; but God knoweth your hearts: for that which is highly esteemed among men is abomination in the sight of God.
        Lk 16:16 The law and The prophets were until John: since that time The kingdom of God is preached, and every man presseth into it.

        Lk 24:44 And he said unto them, these are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, And in the prophets, And in the psalms, concerning me.

        The Pharisees it seems were not concerned with the Kingdom of God.
        They sought their own justification.

        Firstfruits
        SO did John fulfill the Torah and Prophets. LOL. Just kidding fruit. I know you did not mean that. But, what do you mean kind sir. I am little lost and do not want to speculate.
        Edify the brethren, love the brethren, and forgive the brethren until I have nothing left.

        www.woc-church.org

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Firstfruits View Post
          The kingdom of God is the continuation or next stage leading from the what is written in the law and the prophets.

          Lk 16:15 And he said unto them, Ye are they which justify yourselves before men; but God knoweth your hearts: for that which is highly esteemed among men is abomination in the sight of God.
          Lk 16:16 The law and The prophets were until John: since that time The kingdom of God is preached, and every man presseth into it.

          Lk 24:44 And he said unto them, these are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, And in the prophets, And in the psalms, concerning me.

          The Pharisees it seems were not concerned with the Kingdom of God.
          They sought their own justification.

          Firstfruits

          Php 3:
          8 Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but dung, that I may win Christ,
          9 And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith:

          I agree Firstfruits, since John, this new and exciting message has come on the scene.
          Notice verse 8. The knowledge Jesus has brought on many points are in a form of excellence that was not revealed under the OT (though sometimes in the OT we see examples or an alluding to some of these points)

          Take the sermon on the mount for example.
          There we see things they were so used to (from the law) and he drops bombshells, one after another, as to say, 'you've heard this or that, but I say no'.

          It is a sad day in Christianity when the glorious things from the Sermon on the Mount are not recognised as Jesus bringing the new covenant on the scene. I say it is sad to see that the old things (that are not in agreement with these new things) cannot be let go of in faith. Those not letting go in faith and not accepting Jesus' new and better way cannot say like Paul did:
          "not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith".

          God, now, because of Jesus, has a righteousness which is by faith as opposed to the righteousness that existed under the OT law. Paul said the law is not of faith.

          This conflict between these two kinds of righteousness is what Paul is addressing in Romans 10:

          2 For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge.
          3 For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.
          4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.
          5 For Moses describeth the righteousness which is of the law, That the man which doeth those things shall live by them.
          6 But the righteousness which is of faith speaketh on this wise, Say not in thine heart, Who shall ascend into heaven? (that is, to bring Christ down from above)
          7 Or, Who shall descend into the deep? (that is, to bring up Christ again from the dead.)
          8 But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach;
          9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
          10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

          The righteousness in verse 10 that a "man believeth unto" is the righteousness that Jesus revealed by his teaching that has to be accepted by faith, and which is often in opposition to something from the OT. [Like what is seen in the Sermon on the Mount.]

          Notice the two righteousnesses in verses 5 and 6. Paul is making a comparison between the two as seen in how he begins verse 6.

          Paul is not making reference to an 'end of righteousness' as is often assumed by many who read verse 4 in this section of scripture.
          Rather, Paul is making reference to the "end of the law for righteousness'.

          Under the NT, when we see believers following and obeying Jesus by the grace of God, [that by Jesus' death and resurrection has made the power of the Holy Spirit and its regenerative effects available to us] we do not see a continuation 'of the law for righteousness'.
          We are witnessing the promised manifestation of the righteousness which is of faith as a result of having knowledge of his New Covenant.

          But many do not have this knowledge (See Php 3:8 and Rom. 10:2 above) and seek to use the OT to justify certain actions that "the righteousness by faith", does not allow, such as killing and divorce and swearing and vengeance. All these things could be easily justified by the first covenant. [Swearing and vengeance, for example, were directly commanded]
          So lacking the knowledge of the righteousness that is from faith in Jesus can cause someone to try to enforce particular OT commandments, which are, by the NT, obsolete. This is done, like Paul said, by those having a zeal, but not according to knowledge.

          What Paul wrote, as follows, applies to those that would do this:

          Gal. 5:
          4 Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace

          Comment


          • #6
            But was the new covenant ushered in by the teachings of Jesus or by His death and resurrection?

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by manichunter View Post
              SO did John fulfill the Torah and Prophets. LOL. Just kidding fruit. I know you did not mean that. But, what do you mean kind sir. I am little lost and do not want to speculate.
              What is written in the law and the prophets was written in order to prepare us for when Jesus would come, and when Jesus came all that is written in the law and the prophets concerning Jesus was fulfilled as confirmed by Jesus;

              Lk 24:44 And he said unto them, these are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, And in the prophets, And in the psalms, concerning me.

              Lk 24:46 And said unto them, Thus it is written, and Thus it behoved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day:
              Lk 24:47 And that repentance And remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.

              This is the law and the prophets we ought to be concerned with.

              Firstfruits

              Comment


              • #8
                Jesus Had To Die!!!

                Originally posted by Bethany67 View Post
                But was the new covenant ushered in by the teachings of Jesus or by His death and resurrection?
                Jesus had to die in order for the first covenant/testament to end, and establish the new.

                Heb 9:15 And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.

                Heb 9:16 For where a testament is, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator.

                Heb 9:17 For a testament is of force after men are dead: otherwise it is of no strength at all while the testator liveth.

                Firstfruits

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Alaska View Post
                  Php 3:
                  8 Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but dung, that I may win Christ,
                  9 And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith:

                  I agree Firstfruits, since John, this new and exciting message has come on the scene.
                  Notice verse 8. The knowledge Jesus has brought on many points are in a form of excellence that was not revealed under the OT (though sometimes in the OT we see examples or an alluding to some of these points)

                  Take the sermon on the mount for example.
                  There we see things they were so used to (from the law) and he drops bombshells, one after another, as to say, 'you've heard this or that, but I say no'.

                  It is a sad day in Christianity when the glorious things from the Sermon on the Mount are not recognised as Jesus bringing the new covenant on the scene. I say it is sad to see that the old things (that are not in agreement with these new things) cannot be let go of in faith. Those not letting go in faith and not accepting Jesus' new and better way cannot say like Paul did:
                  "not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith".

                  God, now, because of Jesus, has a righteousness which is by faith as opposed to the righteousness that existed under the OT law. Paul said the law is not of faith.

                  This conflict between these two kinds of righteousness is what Paul is addressing in Romans 10:

                  2 For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge.
                  3 For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.
                  4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.
                  5 For Moses describeth the righteousness which is of the law, That the man which doeth those things shall live by them.
                  6 But the righteousness which is of faith speaketh on this wise, Say not in thine heart, Who shall ascend into heaven? (that is, to bring Christ down from above)
                  7 Or, Who shall descend into the deep? (that is, to bring up Christ again from the dead.)
                  8 But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach;
                  9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
                  10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

                  The righteousness in verse 10 that a "man believeth unto" is the righteousness that Jesus revealed by his teaching that has to be accepted by faith, and which is often in opposition to something from the OT. [Like what is seen in the Sermon on the Mount.]

                  Notice the two righteousnesses in verses 5 and 6. Paul is making a comparison between the two as seen in how he begins verse 6.

                  Paul is not making reference to an 'end of righteousness' as is often assumed by many who read verse 4 in this section of scripture.
                  Rather, Paul is making reference to the "end of the law for righteousness'.

                  Under the NT, when we see believers following and obeying Jesus by the grace of God, [that by Jesus' death and resurrection has made the power of the Holy Spirit and its regenerative effects available to us] we do not see a continuation 'of the law for righteousness'.
                  We are witnessing the promised manifestation of the righteousness which is of faith as a result of having knowledge of his New Covenant.

                  But many do not have this knowledge (See Php 3:8 and Rom. 10:2 above) and seek to use the OT to justify certain actions that "the righteousness by faith", does not allow, such as killing and divorce and swearing and vengeance. All these things could be easily justified by the first covenant. [Swearing and vengeance, for example, were directly commanded]
                  So lacking the knowledge of the righteousness that is from faith in Jesus can cause someone to try to enforce particular OT commandments, which are, by the NT, obsolete. This is done, like Paul said, by those having a zeal, but not according to knowledge.

                  What Paul wrote, as follows, applies to those that would do this:

                  Gal. 5:
                  4 Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace
                  Thank you Alaska

                  God Bless You,

                  Firstfruits

                  Comment

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