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Why Pray for the Unsaved?

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  • Why Pray for the Unsaved?

    Why Pray for the Unsaved? This question is directed to both the Pelagian types and the Calvinist types.
    To the Pelagian types isn't it an attempt to intrude on man's free will? (God will interfere with mans will giving him an unfair advantage).
    To the Calvinist types. Isn't it an attempt to overthrow God's already established 'elect' amount or identities?
    ♪ Each day may Christ become clearer, His Cross dearer, Our Hope nearer. ♫

  • #2
    Originally posted by crossnote View Post
    Why Pray for the Unsaved?
    We are to pray for and teach the lost because Jesus died for ALL men and “God is not willing that any should perish, but all should come to repentance.” God "foreordains to eternal life" those whom he foresees will obey the gospel of grace by their own free-will.

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    • #3
      As one of the former, praying for someone does not de-emphasize the necessity of free will for anyone to choose God. What it does (should) make us is an active participant in God's work in that person's life.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by crossnote View Post
        Why Pray for the Unsaved?
        To the Pelagian types isn't it an attempt to intrude on man's free will? (God will interfere with mans will giving him an unfair advantage).
        Where does scripture say to pray for the salvation of the unsaved?

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        • #5
          There are two intercessors in all of human history: Jesus and the Holy Spirit.

          When darkness overcomes us, who will intercede for us? Jesus always lives to make intercession for us. The Bible says so. Why would He have to do that if there was no need for it? The Holy Spirit is here to do the same, to pit His power against that of the enemy and the world under his sway, and to draw people to the Savior. We are His fellow laborers. If He is the Chief Intercessor, then we are to make ourselves available to join Him in that. Why would God in Ezekiel bemoan the lack of intercessors? Why would He find it necessary to gird up His own loins and handle things Himself? Why would He check far and wide and search for an intercessor if one wasn't necessary? Is God a liar? Is Ezekiel not part of His inspired Scripture?

          If you really believe that everything is predestined by God and you make zero difference, then why pray at all? Why intercede at all? Why be here and not just have God yank you outta here the second you are born again? What's the point of staying?

          I think that's my greatest issue with any theology that states that God a) doesn't require anything from us as if His original mandate to Adam and Eve has been nullified and b) works around us and over our heads to accomplish whatever He wants, as if we made zero difference. That to me is the ultimate conclusion I must reach when I look at such theology at its extremis when I think it through. Because you can't have it both ways. What we do either matters, or it doesn't. God either requires our cooperation, or He doesn't.

          I also believe that while man is capable to make free decisions and that we've all been given that capability by God Himself, our wills have been touched by the fall. No unregenerated man's will is truly free, because he has all sorts of things tugging at it, drawing him into the world and skewing his desires and perverting them. How is that free will? It's not. We do have freedom of choice, though, and there is a big difference.

          From where I sit, intercession helps to truly free up a person's will for them to see God clearly and be brought into a position where they can actually make an unencumbered choice, where the pull of the Spirit is at least equal to or supersedes the pull of the world and of darkness. And I know this is true and can testify to it because I have seen it happen over and over and over and over again through the span of many years.

          Maybe I just don't understand certain types of theology (I probably don't because I'm pretty ignorant when it comes to lots of theological matters and so beg pardon), but that is where I stand.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by DaniHansen View Post
            There are two intercessors in all of human history: Jesus and the Holy Spirit.
            Moses?
            At any rate intercession is always for His people.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Sirus View Post
              Where does scripture say to pray for the salvation of the unsaved?

              First of all, then, I urge that supplications, prayers, intercessions, and thanksgivings be made for all people, for kings and all who are in high positions, that we may lead a peaceful and quiet life, godly and dignified in every way. This is good, and it is pleasing in the sight of God our Savior, who desires all people to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.
              (1Ti 2:1-4 ESV)

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              • #8
                who desires all people to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth
                has nothing to do with
                supplications, prayers, intercessions, and thanksgivings be made for all people

                that we may lead a peaceful and quiet life, godly and dignified in every way
                is the
                This is good, and it is pleasing in the sight of God our Savior

                who
                desires all people to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth

                The
                supplications, prayers, intercessions, and thanksgivings be made for all people
                are so
                we may lead a peaceful and quiet life, godly and dignified in every way

                Comment


                • #9
                  Why pray for the unsaved?
                  Who wants to see anyone go to hell? We all know people in this world that we think arent saved. It could be a family member, a neighbor, a close friend or fellow employee. We have a relationship with these people. You grow to like them and even love them. Of course you consider where they stand before God because you are a Christian. We tend to think alot about our actions and how it affects our standing with the Almighty Creator.

                  We as people typically desire the best for people. Therefore you find people praying for the salvation of others.
                  Originally posted by Job 34:19
                  God is not partial to princes and does not favor the rich over the poor, for they are all the work of His hands.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Sirus View Post
                    who desires all people to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth
                    has nothing to do with
                    supplications, prayers, intercessions, and thanksgivings be made for all people

                    that we may lead a peaceful and quiet life, godly and dignified in every way
                    is the
                    This is good, and it is pleasing in the sight of God our Savior

                    who
                    desires all people to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth

                    The
                    supplications, prayers, intercessions, and thanksgivings be made for all people
                    are so
                    we may lead a peaceful and quiet life, godly and dignified in every way
                    The text is pretty straightforward - Christians are to pray for all people that we may lead a peaceful, godly and dignified life and we are to pray that all people will come to the knowledge of the truth and be saved. Why - because God our Savior desires us to live peaceful, godly and dignified lives and He desires all people to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.

                    Why would you refuse to pray that the lost be saved? We you ever lost?

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by losthorizon View Post
                      The text is pretty straightforward
                      This said by someone that thinks work of God mean work of man.....

                      Originally posted by losthorizon View Post
                      Christians are to pray for all people that we may lead a peaceful, godly and dignified life and we are to pray that all people will come to the knowledge of the truth and be saved
                      It doesn't say that. It simply states it is His will that all be saved, and people are not going to hear what we have to say if we are in contention with them. That's what it says!

                      Originally posted by losthorizon View Post
                      because God our Savior desires us to live peaceful, godly and dignified lives and He desires all people to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.
                      So we cannot live peaceably with all men unless they are saved? Absurd. you are not understanding the simple text.

                      Originally posted by losthorizon View Post
                      Why would you refuse to pray that the lost be saved? We you ever lost?
                      I never said we should not pray for the lost. It plainly says here we should. It just doesn't say pray for their salvation. Why are you going to pray for what we already know is His will? Kinda futile isn't it? You can pray for laborers....and/or be one yourself

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Sirus View Post
                        Moses?
                        At any rate intercession is always for His people.
                        Yes, Moses and Abraham and Esther and Daniel and Paul and others. But always with the Holy Spirit behind them and meeting them, if you think about it. God is our Redeemer. He is always searching for those of us who will join Him in His great act of redemption. For His people, for the human race as a whole, for His creation. It's all about redemption, don't you think? That's what I see when I look at Scripture and how God works with us and strives with us according to His great plan for us. Intercession is all about identification. Moses identified himself with Israel. Their destiny was his own. He was willing to do whatever it took for God to take them where they needed to go. God challenged him and said "lemme do away with them and I'll start over with you like I did with Abraham." Moses said "no if you blot them out, then blot me out too." See how great the work of the Spirit was in Moses' own heart for him to say such a thing and mean it? Can you not see the big smile on God's face when those words came out of Moses' mouth? Can you imagine? Paul was willing to be accursed if it meant that Israel could be saved. That takes a seriously deep, solid work of the Spirit in somebody's heart. Daniel identified himself with God's people and confessed their sins as his own and stood with them. He didn't have to. He was friends with the king because of his faithfulness to God and his righteousness before the Lord, yet he humbled himself before God and took that position and his access to God to stand with his exiled people, and God heard and met him and then gave him a vision of what was to come.

                        Jesus, our ultimate Intercessor, identified Himself with us to the point of the cross and death and everything else that affects us in our human condition before God, and by so doing became our Savior and Deliverer and Redeemer and everything else. Jesus didn't have to do that, except love compelled Him. What kind of love is this, I must ask? And so He emptied himself of His own position and chose to lay His life down for us and walk the depths of darkness and sin out for us. And not just for God's people, but as it turns out, for all people, Jew and Gentile alike. Which took Paul and Peter and the other apostles some time to sink in, but they eventually got it. But who can blame them? It was a new thing. Sometimes we're a little slow to catch up.

                        If you're going to pull people out of the fire, you have to be willing to go in it and get singed. If you're going to save a drowning person, sometimes you have to go into the water yourself and take that risk to your own life and get them out. Tossing a ring isn't always enough. You have to be willing to go where the rubber hits the road and where people actually are, not where you wish them to be. You have to be willing to get your hands dirty and for it to cost you something, and if need be, everything. How often do we stop short because self-preservation gets the better of us? He who seeks to save his life, will lose it. He who loses his life for Jesus' sake, will find it. That is intercession. That is the great exchange. That is entering into what God is already doing. But you also can see where that goes beyond prayer into something else entirely and becomes a way of life.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Joh 17:20 Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word;

                          He did not pray they would believe

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Sirus View Post
                            Joh 17:20 Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word;
                            And those are .... ????

                            We're all sinners before we believe and are saved. He died for the ungodly. All of us. It is not ours to judge who has potential for salvation and who doesn't. It's not ours to judge who is ready and who will receive and who won't and under what conditions. It's ours to preach equally to all and labor equally for all, and let God decide the rest. We are not God and so we cannot afford to be picky and hold back as if we knew, when we don't know.

                            I don't pray for people to believe. I pray for everyone to have the same shot. The Bible also says that satan blinds people's minds so that they cannot receive the Gospel. What do you do with that?


                            2 Corinthians 4:4
                            whose minds the god of this age has blinded, who do not believe, lest the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine on them.


                            I pray for laborers, as we're commanded to do, because nobody can believe unless they hear, and nobody can hear unless they're being told, and nobody gets told unless somebody goes and tells them. I pray for the veil to be lifted. I make myself available to be a laborer in whichever way God directs. There is a ton of hindrance to the Gospel out there, in a great many ways, in all parts of the world, until this day. It's up to us to work with God to see to it that those hindrances are removed. If we haven't done that, then we have nothing to say, and any theology we think we have, is worth exactly squat.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              If God would that all men be saved, who am I to try and determine ahead of time who will and will not be saved? I have prayed for family members as well as people I have never met that the Holy Spirit work in their hearts and in their life circumstances to bring them to Him. Is that wrong? If it is, I'll just call myself a Pharisee, feel reallllly good about the fact that I'm special and walk away now.
                              I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.
                              - Mahatma Gandhi



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