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The Law, the New Covenant, and the Feasts

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  • The Law, the New Covenant, and the Feasts

    Recently, I ended up in a discussion with a family member concerning the Passover. She indicated that Communion the way we celebrate it is unbiblical - Jesus celebrated the Passover and commanded us to do that too in remembrance of Him, once a year during the feast of Passover. As an extension, we began talking about the Feasts and how they relate to the New Testament. I quoted Hebrews and argued that we no longer are required to celebrate the Feasts because we are under a new covenant; she argued that the Feasts, while part of the Law, are instituted by God eternally as the Law says and so also apply to us Christians.

    What do you think? Should we still celebrate the Feasts? Why not?
    Who have I in heaven but You oh God? Besides You, I desire nothing here on earth. My heart and my flesh may fail me, but God will be the strength of my heart and my portion forever...as for me, the nearness of God is my good - Psalm 73:25-26, 28a

    Check out my new blog at pilgrimtozion.blogspot.com

  • #2
    Re: The Law, the New Covenant, and the Feasts

    Originally posted by Pilgrimtozion View Post
    Recently, I ended up in a discussion with a family member concerning the Passover. She indicated that Communion the way we celebrate it is unbiblical - Jesus celebrated the Passover and commanded us to do that too in remembrance of Him, once a year during the feast of Passover. As an extension, we began talking about the Feasts and how they relate to the New Testament. I quoted Hebrews and argued that we no longer are required to celebrate the Feasts because we are under a new covenant; she argued that the Feasts, while part of the Law, are instituted by God eternally as the Law says and so also apply to us Christians.

    What do you think? Should we still celebrate the Feasts? Why not?

    Gal 4;9-11 tells you forget about the feasts.

    Jesus said, as often as you meet, celebrate the lords supper.

    Shalom

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: The Law, the New Covenant, and the Feasts

      Originally posted by Pilgrimtozion View Post
      Recently, I ended up in a discussion with a family member concerning the Passover. She indicated that Communion the way we celebrate it is unbiblical - Jesus celebrated the Passover and commanded us to do that too in remembrance of Him, once a year during the feast of Passover. As an extension, we began talking about the Feasts and how they relate to the New Testament. I quoted Hebrews and argued that we no longer are required to celebrate the Feasts because we are under a new covenant; she argued that the Feasts, while part of the Law, are instituted by God eternally as the Law says and so also apply to us Christians.

      What do you think? Should we still celebrate the Feasts? Why not?
      Actaully, it is my undertandig also that the feasts will be kept in the kingdom. I believe what she says has some merit, however, I cannot give you the Scriptrues as I've not studied this area in depth. Here is alink to site with some good auios on the feasts. Scroll down to the section, Feasts of the Lord.

      http://www.oasischristianchurch.org/audio.html

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: The Law, the New Covenant, and the Feasts

        The Feasts and the Temple were all given by God in order that the people would have a means of worship. It was not just a matter of God demanding worship but it was for the people that they would have a way to approach God. We now have a Way to approach God, through Christ Jesus. We now have a means to worship and seek His will, the Holy Spirit. We no longer have priest that approach Him for us, with the exception of our High Priest, Jesus Christ. We now no longer have men appointed to mediate because Jesus is our Mediator. So all the means to approach God is now through Jesus Christ and no longer the temple, priest, feast, and animal sacrifices. And the means/way of worship is no longer in the physical realm in terms of priest and temple, but as you know, it is spiritual, we approach the throne of God spiritually through Jesus, and indwelt by the Spirit.

        In other words, the means for men to approach & worship God during the covenant of the Law was via the priest, feast, and sacrifices - and all was in the physical realm because God's presence came to them in the temple as opposed to the means of men to approach God under the New Covenant which is provided by and through Christ that we may enter in His presence spiritually at His throne in heaven. Not that God isn't around us because He is, but the means for men to approach, how and where they may approach.

        As far as sacrifices go, as I said, God's presence was in the temple, and also with in the camps of the soldiers and so on. Thus the sacrificial system to make the people ritually and ceremonially clean because as we know, the animal sacrifices did not "cleans" the conscience or reunite men spiritually to their Creator, did not cleanse the soul/spirit.

        Of course the Law and Feast were a teacher also. But God's provision for men to approach Him went from the physical to the spiritual. There is IMHO no reason or need to approach God via the means of a Covenant that is more physical when God has provided a means for us to approach spiritually, not only approach, but having through His Son, been reunited. Israel worshiped God in an earthly temple in their physical bodies. Through Christ Jesus, beleivers worship God in His heavenly temple in their spirit.

        Not sure any of that came out well, so if not, ask and I will try to clarify. My heart understands more than my brain.

        P.S. I do agree with Butch that there will be Feast kept in the Millennial Kingdom, but that does not really pertain to us at present and would make this post realllly loooooonger....lol


        sigpic

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        • #5
          Re: The Law, the New Covenant, and the Feasts

          Originally posted by Pilgrimtozion View Post
          Recently, I ended up in a discussion with a family member concerning the Passover. She indicated that Communion the way we celebrate it is unbiblical - Jesus celebrated the Passover and commanded us to do that too in remembrance of Him, once a year during the feast of Passover. As an extension, we began talking about the Feasts and how they relate to the New Testament. I quoted Hebrews and argued that we no longer are required to celebrate the Feasts because we are under a new covenant; she argued that the Feasts, while part of the Law, are instituted by God eternally as the Law says and so also apply to us Christians.

          What do you think? Should we still celebrate the Feasts? Why not?
          Here's another point The writer of Hebrews (Paul) said that the those things in the OT with the priest were symbols of what was taking place in the heavenly places.

          Hebrews 9:1-28 ( KJV )
          Then verily the first covenant had also ordinances of divine service, and a worldly sanctuary.
          For there was a tabernacle made; the first, wherein was the candlestick, and the table, and the showbread; which is called the sanctuary.
          And after the second veil, the tabernacle which is called the Holiest of all;
          Which had the golden censer, and the ark of the covenant overlaid round about with gold, wherein was the golden pot that had manna, and Aaron’s rod that budded, and the tables of the covenant;
          And over it the cherubims of glory shadowing the mercyseat; of which we cannot now speak particularly.
          Now when these things were thus ordained, the priests went always into the first tabernacle, accomplishing the service of God.
          But into the second went the high priest alone once every year, not without blood, which he offered for himself, and for the errors of the people:
          The Holy Ghost this signifying, that the way into the holiest of all was not yet made manifest, while as the first tabernacle was yet standing:
          Which was a figure for the time then present, in which were offered both gifts and sacrifices, that could not make him that did the service perfect, as pertaining to the conscience;
          Which stood only in meats and drinks, and divers washings, and carnal ordinances, imposed on them until the time of reformation.
          But Christ being come an high priest of good things to come, by a greater and more perfect tabernacle, not made with hands, that is to say, not of this building;
          Neither by the blood of goats and calves, but by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us.
          For if the blood of bulls and of goats, and the ashes of an heifer sprinkling the unclean, sanctifieth to the purifying of the flesh:
          How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?
          And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.
          For where a testament is, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator.
          For a testament is of force after men are dead: otherwise it is of no strength at all while the testator liveth.
          Whereupon neither the first testament was dedicated without blood.
          For when Moses had spoken every precept to all the people according to the law, he took the blood of calves and of goats, with water, and scarlet wool, and hyssop, and sprinkled both the book, and all the people,
          Saying, This is the blood of the testament which God hath enjoined unto you.
          Moreover he sprinkled with blood both the tabernacle, and all the vessels of the ministry.
          And almost all things are by the law purged with blood; and without shedding of blood is no remission.
          It was therefore necessary that the patterns of things in the heavens should be purified with these; but the heavenly things themselves with better sacrifices than these. For Christ is not entered into the holy places made with hands, which are the figures of the true; but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for us:
          Nor yet that he should offer himself often, as the high priest entereth into the holy place every year with blood of others;
          For then must he often have suffered since the foundation of the world: but now once in the end of the world hath he appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of himself.
          And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:
          So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation.

          According to the writer, the earthly tabernacle was a replica of the heavenly. God told Moses to make the tabernacle exactly as He said. He went so far as to put His spirit on the builders to guide them.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: The Law, the New Covenant, and the Feasts

            Originally posted by Pilgrimtozion View Post
            Recently, I ended up in a discussion with a family member concerning the Passover. She indicated that Communion the way we celebrate it is unbiblical - Jesus celebrated the Passover and commanded us to do that too in remembrance of Him, once a year during the feast of Passover. As an extension, we began talking about the Feasts and how they relate to the New Testament. I quoted Hebrews and argued that we no longer are required to celebrate the Feasts because we are under a new covenant; she argued that the Feasts, while part of the Law, are instituted by God eternally as the Law says and so also apply to us Christians.

            What do you think? Should we still celebrate the Feasts? Why not?


            Isaiah 5:12 And the harp, and the viol, the tabret, and pipe, and wine, are in their feasts: but they regard not the work of the LORD, neither consider the operation of his hands.


            Why the Passover, why the feast? It was solely so that Israel would recognize the Messiah, the Saviour. Jesus is the Temple, Jesus is the Lamb, Jesus is the High Priest, Jesus is the unleavened bread.


            Why would you want to keep that which portrays a future event, when that event has already occurred? Wouldn't it be a better testimony not to partake of these feasts, which indicate that the Messiah has never come?


            Israel cannot keep the Passover, they have no Priest. Isn't it obvious that God does not desire Israel to keep the Passover? They have to have a Temple to cleanse themselves so that they can keep the Passover. There has been no Temple for that purpose for almost two thousand years, because Jesus is the Temple. They have had no priest for almost two thousand years, because Jesus is the High Priest. Jesus is the unleavened bread, and Israel has rejected that for almost two thousand years. The Word of God is Jesus, and Jesus is the bread of life, therefore the Word is the bread of life. Israel is to be eating the New Testament if they want to keep the feasts.


            Attempting to keep the Passover and the feasts is putting a covering over Christ, as if he didn't exist, and helping to blind the eyes of Israel.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: The Law, the New Covenant, and the Feasts

              Originally posted by Pilgrimtozion View Post
              Recently, I ended up in a discussion with a family member concerning the Passover. She indicated that Communion the way we celebrate it is unbiblical - Jesus celebrated the Passover and commanded us to do that too in remembrance of Him, once a year during the feast of Passover. As an extension, we began talking about the Feasts and how they relate to the New Testament. I quoted Hebrews and argued that we no longer are required to celebrate the Feasts because we are under a new covenant; she argued that the Feasts, while part of the Law, are instituted by God eternally as the Law says and so also apply to us Christians.

              What do you think? Should we still celebrate the Feasts? Why not?
              I find nothing in scripture that would prevent a person from observing the feasts if they were so inclined.

              WRT Communion, I agree that the church may not necessarily have it all right... but (IMHO) communion is of GREATER utility then we give credit for.

              1 Corinthians 11:25 In the same manner He also took the cup after supper, saying, “This cup is the new covenant in My blood. This do, as often as you drink it, in remembrance of Me.”

              In the body, we have at times moved communion to the fellowship hall... I have celebrated it with a couple in their home when healing was being accomplished.. it is a wonderful, portable, act of obedience... and I LOVE it.
              * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * ** * * * * ** * * * ** * *** * * * * ***** * * * * ** * * * * ** ** * *
              ~ * You get 10 'reps' to bless others with each day... don't log off until you have used them up......
              ....Live your life the same way.... ~ *

              Please pray for the 'Persecuted Church'.


              Bible Forums Vision: "To be a community of believers who are actively engaged in pursuing the truth of God as revealed in His Son Jesus Christ by way of studying the Scriptures diligently in order to discover this truth."


              Comment


              • #8
                Re: The Law, the New Covenant, and the Feasts

                Originally posted by Pilgrimtozion View Post
                Recently, I ended up in a discussion with a family member concerning the Passover. She indicated that Communion the way we celebrate it is unbiblical - Jesus celebrated the Passover and commanded us to do that too in remembrance of Him, once a year during the feast of Passover. As an extension, we began talking about the Feasts and how they relate to the New Testament. I quoted Hebrews and argued that we no longer are required to celebrate the Feasts because we are under a new covenant; she argued that the Feasts, while part of the Law, are instituted by God eternally as the Law says and so also apply to us Christians.

                What do you think? Should we still celebrate the Feasts? Why not?
                Communion and the Passover are two different things though both are similar. Jesus was not celebrating Communion or the Eucharist at the Last Supper. He was celebrating the Passover.

                The Passover is uniquely Jewish, not for Gentiles, and celebrates the Exodus of the Twelve Tribes from Egypt. According to Exodus 12:43 "no foreigner shall eat of it." This includes all Gentiles. As a Jew, Jesus celebrated the passover with other Jews and at the last supper Jesus ate the passover with his apostles. The Passover meal was not simply a gathering of people to eat food; it was intended to be pedagogical -- to remember the events of the Exodus and to contemplate the implications of these events in terms of God's project to create a nation of holy people.

                As such, the Passover meal is eaten according to a script known as the Seder. (Seder means "order.") The script varied from rabbi to rabbi and household to household but they all seemed to share common elements among them. Typically, the head of the household would give the Seder. His job is to announce what each element of the meal represents in the story of the Exodus. For instance, at some point in the Seder, every one eats bitter herbs, which represents the bitterness of slavery while in Egypt.

                On the night that Jesus died, he ate the Passover meal with his disciples, and Jesus performed the Seder for them. This time, however, Jesus places a new meaning on one of the elements of the Seder. As I understand it, at four different times during the Seder, the participants drink a cup of wine and the head of household announces the meaning each time. During this particular Seder, Jesus raises one of the cups (perhaps the third one) and gives it a new interpretation. Whereas the third cup typically represents God's promise "I will redeem", Jesus announces that from now on, his Jewish apostles and disciples were to understand this third cup to represent something else. From now on this cup represents "the new covenant in my blood." And Jesus instructions were "do this in remembrance of me."

                It's important to understand that when Jesus says, "do this" his focus is on the cup of wine and the Seder meal. He isn't commanding them to eat the Seder. They were already doing that. Rather he was commanding them to change their interpretation of that particular cup in the meal such that this cup would be a memorial of his death on the cross and the implications his death would have on God's promise of a new covenant.

                What about Gentiles?

                The Gentiles were not obligated to eat the Passover Seder and in fact, they were not supposed to eat it. I believe that for this reason, Paul incorporated the third cup memorial into a Christian feast so that the Gentiles could also celebrate and memorialize the cross and the implications of the cross for all peoples. Christians don't celebrate the passover, but they do reenact the third cup memorial as borrowed from the Jewish Seder meal as reinterpreted by Jesus. When we take communion or the Eucharist, we are remembering what Jesus did for us on the cross and not only us, but our Jewish brethren too. Both Jews and Gentiles are united at the cross.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: The Law, the New Covenant, and the Feasts

                  Originally posted by BroRog View Post
                  Communion and the Passover are two different things though both are similar. Jesus was not celebrating Communion or the Eucharist at the Last Supper. He was celebrating the Passover.

                  The Passover is uniquely Jewish, not for Gentiles, and celebrates the Exodus of the Twelve Tribes from Egypt. According to Exodus 12:43 "no foreigner shall eat of it." This includes all Gentiles.
                  While it is true that no foreigner or hireling could eat of the Passover Lamb, God made a way they could eat of the Lamb. The hired servant could become a bond servant by choice, thus allowed to eat of the Lamb.

                  Also in this verse (Exodus 12:44 But every man's servant that is bought for money, when thou hast circumcised him, then shall he eat thereof.), a foreigner who was circumcised, and bought with a price could eat of the Passover Lamb.

                  I am a Gentile, who has been circumcised in the heart, and bought with a price. I am entitled to partake of the Passover Lamb, Jesus Christ.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: The Law, the New Covenant, and the Feasts

                    Originally posted by Amos_with_goats View Post
                    I find nothing in scripture that would prevent a person from observing the feasts if they were so inclined.

                    WRT Communion, I agree that the church may not necessarily have it all right... but (IMHO) communion is of GREATER utility then we give credit for.

                    1 Corinthians 11:25 In the same manner He also took the cup after supper, saying, “This cup is the new covenant in My blood. This do, as often as you drink it, in remembrance of Me.”

                    In the body, we have at times moved communion to the fellowship hall... I have celebrated it with a couple in their home when healing was being accomplished.. it is a wonderful, portable, act of obedience... and I LOVE it.
                    Tried to read your post but in vain with the BP-Brown skin I have set... Just fyi...
                    Who have I in heaven but You oh God? Besides You, I desire nothing here on earth. My heart and my flesh may fail me, but God will be the strength of my heart and my portion forever...as for me, the nearness of God is my good - Psalm 73:25-26, 28a

                    Check out my new blog at pilgrimtozion.blogspot.com

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: The Law, the New Covenant, and the Feasts

                      Originally posted by rejoice44 View Post
                      While it is true that no foreigner or hireling could eat of the Passover Lamb, God made a way they could eat of the Lamb. The hired servant could become a bond servant by choice, thus allowed to eat of the Lamb.

                      Also in this verse (Exodus 12:44 But every man's servant that is bought for money, when thou hast circumcised him, then shall he eat thereof.), a foreigner who was circumcised, and bought with a price could eat of the Passover Lamb.

                      I am a Gentile, who has been circumcised in the heart, and bought with a price. I am entitled to partake of the Passover Lamb, Jesus Christ.
                      I don't think so. Circumcision of the flesh is the requirement.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: The Law, the New Covenant, and the Feasts

                        Originally posted by Pilgrimtozion View Post
                        Tried to read your post but in vain with the BP-Brown skin I have set... Just fyi...
                        HINT: Highlight the text, then you can read it
                        The LORD is my Miracle

                        G_d was gracious He has shown favor


                        Hope is a seed
                        God plants in our hearts
                        to remind us
                        there are better things ahead.
                        -Holley Gerth

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: The Law, the New Covenant, and the Feasts

                          Originally posted by BroRog View Post
                          I don't think so. Circumcision of the flesh is the requirement.
                          ...requirement for what??
                          The LORD is my Miracle

                          G_d was gracious He has shown favor


                          Hope is a seed
                          God plants in our hearts
                          to remind us
                          there are better things ahead.
                          -Holley Gerth

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: The Law, the New Covenant, and the Feasts

                            No Jew in this present day is celebrating Passover, for they can not, for the ultimate Passover Lamb was sacrificed nearly two thousand years ago. Without a Temple, and without a Priest there can be no Passover. The Passover Lamb came, was sacrificed, and told us to take the bread and cup to remember him by, until he comes again.

                            It would seem that no Christian should be able to argue this point. The Jew that does not recognize Jesus Christ as Lord and Saviour is lost and on his way to Hell, for "there is no other name given under heaven whereby we must be saved".

                            That said, Israel is God's chosen people, and God has not yet completed his work with them. Israel is our salvation because through them, through their seed, we have obtained mercy.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: The Law, the New Covenant, and the Feasts

                              Originally posted by Pilgrimtozion View Post
                              Recently, I ended up in a discussion with a family member concerning the Passover. She indicated that Communion the way we celebrate it is unbiblical - Jesus celebrated the Passover and commanded us to do that too in remembrance of Him, once a year during the feast of Passover.
                              The third cup of the Passover is the Cup of Redemption, This is the cup that was used by Christ to institute the Holy Communion.

                              Christ took the bread.... notice this is after they have taken part of the meal already, so one could only assume that it is the Afikomen He takes, and says : Take eat this is My Body...... 1Cor says .. 'often'

                              As an extension, we began talking about the Feasts and how they relate to the New Testament. I quoted Hebrews and argued that we no longer are required to celebrate the Feasts because we are under a new covenant; she argued that the Feasts, while part of the Law, are instituted by God eternally as the Law says and so also apply to us Christians.
                              If we no longer celebrate the Feast (OF THE LORD) why do you keep the Passover (Easter)? Not all the Feasts are fulfilled in Christ yet

                              What do you think? Should we still celebrate the Feasts? Why not?
                              We celebrate the fulfilled feast Of which Pentecost is also one
                              The LORD is my Miracle

                              G_d was gracious He has shown favor


                              Hope is a seed
                              God plants in our hearts
                              to remind us
                              there are better things ahead.
                              -Holley Gerth

                              Comment

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