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Is Abbadon/Apollyon good or bad?

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  • #16
    Re: Is Abbadon/Apollyon good or bad?

    Originally posted by Beckrl View Post
    So when you read Revelation you understand it to be read literal word for word? For example in context of chapter 9 concerning locusts and scorpions which look like horses with heads that had crowns and having hair like a women, etc....They are to have a king over them....I would dare to say this pretty much describes the Roman solider of the first century in hhow they dressed for battle. Well using the Greek Myth's to reveal the truth, but I guess no one can see that...Maybe need a picture of the Roman solider or is there are literal beast of that type.
    One need not take it literal without knowing that God would not have used a Greek god to reveal a biblical truth when those gods to God were an abomination. Just saying.


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    • #17
      Re: Is Abbadon/Apollyon good or bad?

      Originally posted by Beckrl View Post
      So when you read Revelation you understand it to be read literal word for word? For example in context of chapter 9 concerning locusts and scorpions which look like horses with heads that had crowns and having hair like a women, etc....They are to have a king over them....I would dare to say this pretty much describes the Roman solider of the first century in hhow they dressed for battle. Well using the Greek Myth's to reveal the truth, but I guess no one can see that...Maybe need a picture of the Roman solider or is there are literal beast of that type.
      So it's all referring to
      those that where killed becaused they believed a lie and was slain in Jerusalem by the king Titus
      ?
      Mal 3:16 Then they that feared the Lord spake often one to another: and the Lord hearkened, and heard it, and a book of remembrance was written before him for them that feared the Lord, and that thought upon his name.

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      • #18
        Re: Is Abbadon/Apollyon good or bad?

        Originally posted by ProjectPeter View Post
        That and it means destroyer and all. Gotta go with not good.
        Really? God destroys and He is good, holy and righteousness.

        Im not saying Apollyon is good or isnt good, but we do have to agree that a name presents nothing.

        Grace to you, peace from God and the Lord Jesus Christ

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        • #19
          Re: Is Abbadon/Apollyon good or bad?

          Originally posted by The Mighty Sword View Post
          Abbadon/Apollyon/Destroyer
          Hebrew / Greek / English

          How many good angels live in a bottomless pit???
          The thing i would contemplate is the angel who has the key to the bottomless pit, is that angel also the angel presented as Apollyon. 2 angels are depicted in those verses, are they one and the same or 2 different angels?
          I can say neither Apollyon is good nor bad.
          It seems this Apollyon has the power over the "stingers" who affect only those who do not have the seal of God, the Holy Spirit.

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          • #20
            Re: Is Abbadon/Apollyon good or bad?

            Originally posted by mattlad22 View Post
            The thing i would contemplate is the angel who has the key to the bottomless pit, is that angel also the angel presented as Apollyon. 2 angels are depicted in those verses, are they one and the same or 2 different angels?
            I can say neither Apollyon is good nor bad.
            It seems this Apollyon has the power over the "stingers" who affect only those who do not have the seal of God, the Holy Spirit.
            Let's see:

            Revelation 9:1 And the fifth angel sounded, and I saw a star fall from heaven unto the earth: and to him was given the key of the bottomless pit.

            So we know an Angel blasted his horn, a star (Angel) because only good angels are in Heaven with "the key" of the bottomless pit.

            Seems simple enough to understand that the bottomless pit holds an evil creature

            9:2And he opened the bottomless pit; and there arose a smoke out of the pit, as the smoke of a great furnace; and the sun and the air were darkened by reason of the smoke of the pit.

            Where there is smoke there is fire so scripture would be referring to hell.

            9:11 And they had a king over them, which is the angel of the bottomless pit, whose name in the Hebrew tongue is Abaddon, but in the Greek tongue hath his name Apollyon.

            GOD is the only King and angels are referred to as "princes".

            So if abbadon was a good angel he wouldn't need a key from another angel of GOD.
            Last edited by The Mighty Sword; May 26th 2011, 04:01 PM. Reason: typo
            If Satan can keep us busy swinging our swords at one another, there is no hope of a united attack on the kingdom of darkness. KJV, NIV, ESV or ABCDEFG; there is no time to bicker over such things. We'll devour each other if allowed to continue. We should grab the marching orders written in the way we best understand and get to work.

            Andrew_no_one




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            • #21
              Re: Is Abbadon/Apollyon good or bad?

              Abaddon can very well mean the devil himself, IMO.

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              • #22
                Re: Is Abbadon/Apollyon good or bad?

                Originally posted by Raybob View Post
                Abaddon can very well mean the devil himself, IMO.
                True, but from that point on, there is no mention of Abaddon, but there is mention of the devil, serpent and satan not to mention satan doesn't need to be loosed if he's already the prince of the air.
                If Satan can keep us busy swinging our swords at one another, there is no hope of a united attack on the kingdom of darkness. KJV, NIV, ESV or ABCDEFG; there is no time to bicker over such things. We'll devour each other if allowed to continue. We should grab the marching orders written in the way we best understand and get to work.

                Andrew_no_one




                Comment


                • #23
                  Re: Is Abbadon/Apollyon good or bad?

                  Originally posted by ProjectPeter View Post
                  One need not take it literal without knowing that God would not have used a Greek god to reveal a biblical truth when those gods to God were an abomination. Just saying.
                  I also believe it was speaking of Titus and his Roman Army that destroyed Jerusalem.
                  It was identified as coming from the bottomless pit, so there is no reason why it couldn't be used. Peter used "tartarus" (Greek Mythology) in 2 Peter 2:4 as an example in his writings.

                  "The name Apollo (Gk Apollon) was often linked in ancient Greek writings with the verb apollymi or apollyo, "destroy." From this time of Grotius, "Apollyon" has often been taken here to be a play on the name Apollo." -Anchor Bible Dictionary

                  One of Apollo's symbols was the locust, among many things, he was the god of pestilence.

                  Legio quinta decima Apollinaris (Fifteenth Apollonian Legion) was a Roman legion. It was recruited by Octavian in 41/40 BC. The emblem of this legion was probably a picture of Apollo, or of one of his holy animals.
                  After the conclusion of the war with Parthia, the legion was sent to Alexandria but soon found itself engaged in the fierce fighting of the First Jewish Revolt, capturing the towns of Jotapata and Gamla. It was the Fifteenth that captured the Jewish general later to become famous as the historian Josephus. During this period the legion was commanded by Titus, who would later become Emperor. After the suppression of the revolt, the legion returned to Carnuntum and rebuilt its fortress. - Wickipedia

                  Titus arrived to Jerusalem with the 15th Apollonian Legion around Passover 70AD.

                  Meanwhile the Jews had become embroiled in a civil conflict of their own, splitting the resistance in the city among two factions; the Sicarii led by Simon Bar Giora, and the Zealots led by John of Gischala. Titus seized the opportunity to begin the assault on Jerusalem. The Roman army was joined by the twelfth legion, which was previously defeated under Cestius Gallus, and from Alexandria Vespasian sent Tiberius Julius Alexander, governor of Ægyptus, to act as Titus's second in command. Titus surrounded the city, with three legions (Vth, XIIth and XVth) on the western side and one (Xth) on the Mount of Olives to the east. He put pressure on the food and water supplies of the inhabitants by allowing pilgrims to enter the city to celebrate Passover, and then refusing them egress. Jewish raids continuously harassed the Roman army, one of which nearly resulted in Titus being captured.
                  After attempts by Josephus to negotiate a surrender had failed, the Romans resumed hostilities and quickly breached the first and second walls of the city. To intimidate the resistance, Titus ordered deserters from the Jewish side to be crucified around the city wall. By this time the Jews had been thoroughly exhausted by famine, and when the weak third wall was breached bitter street fighting ensued. The Romans finally captured the Antonia Fortress and began a frontal assault on the gates of the Temple.
                  Titus reportedly refused to accept a wreath of victory, as he claimed there is "no merit in vanquishing people forsaken by their own God."- Wickipedia
                  Last edited by RockSolid; May 26th 2011, 03:26 PM. Reason: adding clarity

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                  • #24
                    Re: Is Abbadon/Apollyon good or bad?

                    Originally posted by Raybob View Post
                    Abaddon can very well mean the devil himself, IMO.
                    I don't disagree with that. Not totally convinced yet.. but probably close.


                    Visit our new website
                    ! The Blog might interest some.. and Lord help me!!!... for those that twitter... there as well.

                    A.W. Tozer said,
                    "To escape the error of salvation by works we have fallen into the opposite error of salvation without obedience.”

                    GO.... SERVE YOUR KING!

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Re: Is Abbadon/Apollyon good or bad?

                      Originally posted by ProjectPeter View Post
                      One need not take it literal without knowing that God would not have used a Greek god to reveal a biblical truth when those gods to God were an abomination. Just saying.
                      One may simply think that it's a fulfillment of the curses placed on those that disobey as to Deu.28:21,49-53. But again it's all in how one would want to describe those events. How would you describe a nation that comes against you as a nation of fierce countenance? I see these desciptions relating of the hair like a woman to the Roman helmets and to their battle ready dress. Those are descibed as locusts that comes to hurt the trees and grass. Like elsewhere we can fine where trees are described as men. Mark 8:24 "And he looked up, and said, I see men as trees, walking." Knowing that the Hebrew literary style of writting uses symbols, metaphors, poerty, parables and yes mythology.

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                      • #26
                        Re: Is Abbadon/Apollyon good or bad?

                        Originally posted by Raybob View Post
                        Abaddon can very well mean the devil himself, IMO.
                        I dont disagree with that either, the only thing i ponder is Satan has not been declared thrown out of heaven yet and we know God has Angels decreed for all sorts of purposes, Angels of the 4 winds, Micheal another, the euphrates river Angels.
                        This event is the first "woe" the third "woe" of Revelation depicts Satan being cast out of heaven.

                        Is there anywhere in scripture where it says the dragon or Satan in any other form is the king of the bottomless pit? O.T or N.T?

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                        • #27
                          Re: Is Abbadon/Apollyon good or bad?

                          Originally posted by shepherdsword View Post
                          So it's all referring to ?
                          One can view the hurting of the men for five months as to the torment that men went through by Gessius Florus.

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                          • #28
                            Re: Is Abbadon/Apollyon good or bad?

                            Originally posted by The Mighty Sword View Post
                            Let's see:

                            Revelation 9:1 And the fifth angel sounded, and I saw a star fall from heaven unto the earth: and to him was given the key of the bottomless pit.

                            So we know an Angel blasted his horn, a star (Angel) because only good angels are in Heaven with "the key" of the bottomless pit.

                            Seems simple enough to understand that the bottomless pit holds an evil creature

                            9:2And he opened the bottomless pit; and there arose a smoke out of the pit, as the smoke of a great furnace; and the sun and the air were darkened by reason of the smoke of the pit.

                            Where there is smoke there is fire so scripture would be referring to hell.

                            9:11 And they had a king over them, which is the angel of the bottomless pit, whose name in the Hebrew tongue is Abaddon, but in the Greek tongue hath his name Apollyon.

                            GOD is the only King and angels are referred to as "princes".

                            So if abbadon was a good angel he wouldn't need a key from another angel of GOD.
                            Yeah but even with tha interpretation it still doesnt say its a fallen angel it just says one angel has the key to the pit and another Angel rules over the "stingers" they cant touch the sealed but affect only those without the seal of God, the Holy Spirit.
                            When Satan is bound we are shown an Angel with those very keys again as the one who chains Satan and seals him in the bottomless pit.

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                            • #29
                              Re: Is Abbadon/Apollyon good or bad?

                              Originally posted by mattlad22 View Post
                              Yeah but even with tha interpretation it still doesnt say its a fallen angel it just says one angel has the key to the pit and another Angel rules over the "stingers" they cant touch the sealed but affect only those without the seal of God, the Holy Spirit.
                              When Satan is bound we are shown an Angel with those very keys again as the one who chains Satan and seals him in the bottomless pit.
                              I never said it was a "fallen angel" scripture says "a star" fell from heaven, no one ever stated it was "fallen angel". Thank you.

                              When Satan is bound we are shown an Angel with those very keys
                              So scripture says, "the same keys that freed abbadon are the same keys the bind satan"??? Huh, this I gotta see.

                              You're right, so the star that fell from heaven was an angel of the Lord, so I was right, thank you.
                              If Satan can keep us busy swinging our swords at one another, there is no hope of a united attack on the kingdom of darkness. KJV, NIV, ESV or ABCDEFG; there is no time to bicker over such things. We'll devour each other if allowed to continue. We should grab the marching orders written in the way we best understand and get to work.

                              Andrew_no_one




                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Re: Is Abbadon/Apollyon good or bad?

                                Originally posted by The Mighty Sword View Post
                                I never said it was a "fallen angel" scripture says "a star" fell from heaven, no one ever stated it was "fallen angel". Thank you.



                                So scripture says, "the same keys that freed abbadon are the same keys the bind satan"??? Huh, this I gotta see.

                                You're right, so the star that fell from heaven was an angel of the Lord, so I was right, thank you.
                                No. You didnt say the first angel was bad, but you said Apollyon is, because "if he was a good angel He wouldnt need a key"
                                I'm saying we cant really say because all kinds of Angels have thier different roles as i gave earlier, so is this Apollyon given decree to be the ruler over the bottomless pit or is he the angel of the bottomless pit in judgement from God, thats all i was presenting.
                                As i type though i question who is "Apollyon" and does Apollyon have a relation to Death and Hades as it is used in Revelations.

                                Also i contemplate this knowing that Satan and His angels are not thrown out until the third "woe" and Apollyon and the "stingers" is the first "woe", so is this angel already thrown out? Or is He in that position due to His decree, just as the Angels of the four winds or the Angels of Euphrates.

                                I have alot of questions on this, alot more than i thought i did.

                                So yeah i thats why i said what i said Mighty, didnt mean it as anything bad or anything though, i obviously have alot of questions regarding this also, i just presented another side, no harm intended.

                                I'm actually going to drop out of this topic because i have too many questions that will only stir confusion, i dont feel comfortable trying to serve in this because i am coming up with so many questions, so im going to just back-off for now.

                                Grace to you, peace from God and the Lord Jesus Christ.

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