Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Abiding in the true Vine....

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Discussion Abiding in the true Vine....

    Looking for an easy discussion here.... Jesus says for us to abide in Him.... Because we cannot of ourselves bear fruit.... Much like my cucumber plants.... Or my watermellon plants.... They are vining plants.... They are not going to produce fruit if their various branches are broken off.... Which leads to my question....


    (Joh 15:1-2 KJV)I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.
    Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away : and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.

    So what does it mean when Jesus says "Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away".... ?
    sigpic
    My Church...
    .


    My Facebook page....

  • #2
    Re: Abiding in the true Vine....

    define 'fruit' (sorry to complicate matters)
    Those who seek God with all their heart will find Him and be given sight. Those who seek their own agenda will remain blind.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Abiding in the true Vine....

      Originally posted by keck553 View Post
      define 'fruit' (sorry to complicate matters)
      My understanding of fruit is faith produced actions.... Doing everything we do for the Glory of God....
      sigpic
      My Church...
      .


      My Facebook page....

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Abiding in the true Vine....

        Originally posted by MaryFreeman View Post
        My understanding of fruit is faith produced actions.... Doing everything we do for the Glory of God....
        It's a good question. Here are a couple of statistics -

        The divorce rate in the church community is 2% higher than in the secular community
        and 90% higher than the religious Jewish community.

        Where would you find the most fruit based on this one moral failure/sucess?

        Can you honestly say God is pleased with Christians as a corporate in regards to the destruction of the family unit He established? Does God really need to lower His standards to accomodate our sin?
        Those who seek God with all their heart will find Him and be given sight. Those who seek their own agenda will remain blind.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Abiding in the true Vine....

          Originally posted by keck553 View Post
          It's a good question. Here are a couple of statistics -

          The divorce rate in the church community is 2% higher than in the secular community
          and 90% higher than the religious Jewish community.

          Where would you find the most fruit based on this one moral failure/sucess?
          I would say the Jewish community but most Jews are not Messianic....
          Originally posted by keck553
          Can you honestly say God is pleased with Christians as a corporate in regards to the destruction of the family unit He established? Does God really need to lower His standards to accomodate our sin?
          I don't believe I said anything like this....

          This is what I meant when I said I want an easy discussion.... What is it that Jesus means when He says "in me".... Because if the branches are in Him and are not broken off.... Why would they be taken away?

          Am I to gather from this response that sin is what causes the Father to take away the branch?

          But what about 1 John 1:9?
          sigpic
          My Church...
          .


          My Facebook page....

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Abiding in the true Vine....

            Originally posted by MaryFreeman View Post
            Looking for an easy discussion here.... Jesus says for us to abide in Him.... Because we cannot of ourselves bear fruit.... Much like my cucumber plants.... Or my watermellon plants.... They are vining plants.... They are not going to produce fruit if their various branches are broken off.... Which leads to my question....


            (Joh 15:1-2 KJV)I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.
            Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away : and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.

            So what does it mean when Jesus says "Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away".... ?
            Every Christian who doesn't bear fruit is taken away.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Abiding in the true Vine....

              Originally posted by Butch5 View Post
              Every Christian who doesn't bear fruit is taken away.
              From the vine??? And to where????
              sigpic
              My Church...
              .


              My Facebook page....

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Abiding in the true Vine....

                Originally posted by Butch5 View Post
                Every Christian who doesn't bear fruit is taken away.

                Without turning this thread into OSAS vs NOSAS, I simply think this is one of the clearer passages that absolutely shows OSAS is not Biblical. I tend to think these are the goats of Matthew 25 for one.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Abiding in the true Vine....

                  Originally posted by MaryFreeman View Post
                  I would say the Jewish community but most Jews are not Messianic....
                  True, but the several hundred thousand that are Messianic keep pretty much the same observances. Do you find that odd?

                  Originally posted by MaryFreeman View Post
                  I don't believe I said anything like this....

                  This is what I meant when I said I want an easy discussion.... What is it that Jesus means when He says "in me".... Because if the branches are in Him and are not broken off.... Why would they be taken away?

                  Am I to gather from this response that sin is what causes the Father to take away the branch?

                  But what about 1 John 1:9?
                  Sin? We're not supposed to be slaves to sin, are we? When I speak of the Church, I am assuming a group of saved people who, by revelation and imparting of the Holy Spirit, are held to a higher standard. In fact since our revelation is greater than non-messianic Jews, wouldn't you think we are held to even a higher standard?

                  How are we to be a witness if our fruit looks just like the fruit of the secular community?

                  People can choose to abide in Christ. His Word is in us after all.
                  Those who seek God with all their heart will find Him and be given sight. Those who seek their own agenda will remain blind.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Abiding in the true Vine....

                    Originally posted by Butch5 View Post
                    Every Christian who doesn't bear fruit is taken away.
                    Romans 11:21 comes to mind.....

                    Maybe....just maybe instead of ripping out all the parts of the Bible ("well I don't have to do that because.....") we don't want to abide in and custom forming God's word to abide in us, perhaps we should abide in God's Word? Just a thought....
                    Those who seek God with all their heart will find Him and be given sight. Those who seek their own agenda will remain blind.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Abiding in the true Vine....

                      Originally posted by MaryFreeman View Post
                      Looking for an easy discussion here.... Jesus says for us to abide in Him.... Because we cannot of ourselves bear fruit.... Much like my cucumber plants.... Or my watermellon plants.... They are vining plants.... They are not going to produce fruit if their various branches are broken off.... Which leads to my question....


                      (Joh 15:1-2 KJV)I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.
                      Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away : and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.

                      So what does it mean when Jesus says "Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away".... ?
                      Sorry I derailed your thread......
                      Those who seek God with all their heart will find Him and be given sight. Those who seek their own agenda will remain blind.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Abiding in the true Vine....

                        Originally posted by MaryFreeman View Post
                        Looking for an easy discussion here.... Jesus says for us to abide in Him.... Because we cannot of ourselves bear fruit.... Much like my cucumber plants.... Or my watermellon plants.... They are vining plants.... They are not going to produce fruit if their various branches are broken off.... Which leads to my question....


                        (Joh 15:1-2 KJV)I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.
                        Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away : and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.

                        So what does it mean when Jesus says "Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away".... ?
                        In 1 Corinthians 5:5 We are shown an example of a branch being broken off. "To deliver such a one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus."

                        They will be saved scarcely by fire.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Abiding in the true Vine....

                          Originally posted by MaryFreeman View Post
                          Looking for an easy discussion here.... Jesus says for us to abide in Him.... Because we cannot of ourselves bear fruit.... Much like my cucumber plants.... Or my watermellon plants.... They are vining plants.... They are not going to produce fruit if their various branches are broken off.... Which leads to my question....


                          (Joh 15:1-2 KJV)I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.
                          Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away : and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.

                          So what does it mean when Jesus says "Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away".... ?
                          The fruit is belief. If a man becomes a disciple of Jesus (the vine) but he doesn't continue to believe (continue to bear fruit) that man finds it harder and harder to understand the teachings of Jesus until he is incredulous as to why he believed in the first place (God removes that man from the vine.)

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Abiding in the true Vine....

                            Originally posted by BroRog View Post
                            The fruit is belief. If a man becomes a disciple of Jesus (the vine) but he doesn't continue to believe (continue to bear fruit) that man finds it harder and harder to understand the teachings of Jesus until he is incredulous as to why he believed in the first place (God removes that man from the vine.)
                            Then why is belief... pruned? To create more belief in God? Then what does MORE belief in God accomplish? The person is saved more?
                            Slug1--out

                            ~"In the turmoil of any chaos, all it takes is that whisper that is heard like thunder over all the noise and the chaos seems to go away, focus returns and we are comforted in knowing that God has listened to our cry for help."~

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Abiding in the true Vine....

                              .................................................. .............................
                              sigpic
                              My Church...
                              .


                              My Facebook page....

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X