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  • Once saved always saved : Amen Praise the Lord

    As on many Bible topics, I am not the sharpest tool in the shed, But God has showed me an angle on the once saved always saved issue, that I would like to share with all who will read this thread. To start with, let me say that there are many verses on the left side ( the side that says we can lose our salvation ) that I struggle with. But there are many verses on the right side ( or what I think is the right side, where I can't do anything to lose my salvation,Where I didn't do anything to earn my salvation, Not my works, But Jesus did the work for me, so to say that I can lose my salvation is to say that His works was not good enough for me, !!) that the other side can't answer either. Now here is the angle, I have heard from the left side many many times, that once we have called upon the Name of the Lord ( the key here is if we call upon the name of the Lord, we must then make Him Lord ) but even if we are saved and right before we are called home either way by the grave or the rapture, if we sin just before we are called home we can lose our salvation. IF this is true then would someone please explain the verses

    Heb 12:2 Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.
    Heb 12:3 For consider him that endured such contradiction of sinners against himself, lest ye be wearied and faint in your minds.
    Heb 12:4 Ye have not yet resisted unto blood, striving against sin.
    Heb 12:5 And ye have forgotten the exhortation which speaketh unto you as unto children, My son, despise not thou the chastening of the Lord, nor faint when thou art rebuked of him:
    Heb 12:6 For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth.
    Heb 12:7 If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not?
    Heb 12:8 But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye bastards, and not sons.


    Now here is the question if we lose our salvation with every little sin, where does Chastisement come in, for if God kicks us out of the Family with every little sin, then there is no need for Him to reprove, rebuke and then chasten us, for we are not sons/daughters but bastards and we have no Father, and we only become sons of God through faith in our adoption by Jesus Christ our big Brother. Please do not over load this thread with all the verses you have, where you believe we can lose our salvation just please keep the thoughts you share to the answering to my one question. if we can lose our salvation by sinning after we come to His knowledge then where does the doctrine of chastisement come in???

    Here I go I am saved, but I look at a woman with lust on my mind, that small little voice speaks up and says you know you really shouldn't think like that(reprove). But I keep looking then that voice becomes alot more stern I TOLD YOU YOU REALLY SHOULDN"T BE THINKING LIKE THAT!(rebuke) but this is really a good looking woman Lord, and You really did bless her. Bam here comes out the whip(chastisement), But by the whip I know that I am still one of His because whom He chastens He also loves For the Father chastens His children not the Lost.

    Or here I go I look at a woman with lust on my mind, Bam I burn!! For the Father lied when He said those He chastens He also loves.

    Now I don't mean to be so blunt here, but I know no other way to express this, it all comes down to our faith and where is, or whom is our faith in.

    Heb 12:2 Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.

    Jesus is my Author and He is my Finisher of my faith, I didn't write my plan of salvation and I can't keep it. Thats why My faith needs to be In Jesus not in me.

    Heb 11:6Butwithout faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.

    Yes There is a calling for His Children to Live right, so if the righteousness has to exceed the righteousness of scribes and Pharisees , How will any ever enter into heaven? I plea the BLOOD, not my works
    Romans 12:1 I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service. 2. And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.


    Pastor Keith

  • #2
    I don't think those that know OSAS for the lie it is would even come close to saying that "we lose our salvation with every little sin".

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by godsgirl View Post
      I don't think those that know OSAS for the lie it is would even come close to saying that "we lose our salvation with every little sin".

      Any sin no matter how little is more than enough to keep you out of heaven abd doomed to hell. That is why Jesus came .Salvation is never by works it cannot be so. If you can loose it you never had it to begin with. Jesu dies once and for all for our sins not again and again. Your are born again once and forever. Now you can make a big messed out of your life and God can even take you out of the world and cut your life short but you will stil be saved. The Holy Spirit stays inside you always you can deny him but he will never deny you.

      Satans lie is to accused the saved that be careful lest you loose your salvation. this makes a mock of God and brings down what Jesus did on the croos to a effect not of Grace but by works of msn.
      God Bless
      And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up: That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.
      For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by godsgirl View Post
        I don't think those that know OSAS for the lie it is would even come close to saying that "we lose our salvation with every little sin".
        Then just how many does it take? Is there a list or a number somewhere?
        I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.
        - Mahatma Gandhi



        Comment


        • #5
          I have always believed OSAS, but I believe that OSAS is actually AS. Before you were born, you were either chosen or not. God loved Jacob but hated Esau and this was before either had done anything good or bad, while they were still in the womb.

          As for sin causing one to lose salvation, I have mentioned before about lying to your children when you state "Santa Claus is coming to town". It is a lie, a sin, and also misleading little ones. A lot of those against OSAS will justify this saying "That sin isn't bad enough to lose salvation".

          Now, I move to one that would be. Suicide.

          I think most everyone agree that suicide is a sin. Suicide is certainly a sin that is impossible to repent of. However, Jesus stated there is only one unforgiveable sin.

          Either Suicide is blasphemy of the Holy Spirit OR suicide is a forgiveable sin and one that was forgiven when the person who committed it was chosen before he/she was born.

          Yuke

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Yukerboy View Post
            I have always believed OSAS, but I believe that OSAS is actually AS. Before you were born, you were either chosen or not. God loved Jacob but hated Esau and this was before either had done anything good or bad, while they were still in the womb.

            As for sin causing one to lose salvation, I have mentioned before about lying to your children when you state "Santa Claus is coming to town". It is a lie, a sin, and also misleading little ones. A lot of those against OSAS will justify this saying "That sin isn't bad enough to lose salvation".

            Now, I move to one that would be. Suicide.

            I think most everyone agree that suicide is a sin. Suicide is certainly a sin that is impossible to repent of. However, Jesus stated there is only one unforgiveable sin.

            Either Suicide is blasphemy of the Holy Spirit OR suicide is a forgiveable sin and one that was forgiven when the person who committed it was chosen before he/she was born.

            Yuke
            Well said when a person accept Jesus Christ and is saved it is a one time past, present and future event.
            god Bless
            And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up: That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.
            For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by looking4jesus View Post
              Well said when a person accept Jesus Christ and is saved it is a one time past, present and future event.
              god Bless
              I agree. In my mind, when Jesus said He would never leave us or forsake us, He meant that. His word depends on Him and not on us.
              I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.
              - Mahatma Gandhi



              Comment


              • #8
                Here's a question I've got, generally --

                If OSAS is true, then what happens in the following scenario: a young person accepts Christ, starts to live for Christ, and then falls away from Christ and stops living for Him or even admitting that He exists. Is this person still saved? Will God pull this person back to Him? Let's assume that this person was actually, genuinely a Christian, and lets not use the argument "well, they must not have been really saved".

                This scenario fits many, many people I know. I LIKE the OSAS position and hope that it's true, but this part of it's always bothered me. I'd love to know for sure that God creates us, saves us, and then nothing WE do can change that.... but if someone turns their back on God and walks away, does salvation still hold?

                If OSAS is absolutely true, then there are a LOT more saved people walking around in this world today than we or even they would suspect.
                -- Your ~sister~ in Christ.... a "Kaffinated Kittykat"!!

                ROMANS 5:8. Forgiven. Freed. Humbled. Amazed. Grateful. Relying on Christ.

                Love is not a place to come and go as we please
                It's a house we enter in, then commit to never leave
                So lock the door behind you, and throw away the key
                We'll work it out together, let it bring us to our knees.....
                Warren Barfield



                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by CoffeeCat View Post
                  Here's a question I've got, generally --

                  If OSAS is true, then what happens in the following scenario: a young person accepts Christ, starts to live for Christ, and then falls away from Christ and stops living for Him or even admitting that He exists. Is this person still saved? Will God pull this person back to Him? Let's assume that this person was actually, genuinely a Christian, and lets not use the argument "well, they must not have been really saved".

                  This scenario fits many, many people I know. I LIKE the OSAS position and hope that it's true, but this part of it's always bothered me. I'd love to know for sure that God creates us, saves us, and then nothing WE do can change that.... but if someone turns their back on God and walks away, does salvation still hold?

                  If OSAS is absolutely true, then there are a LOT more saved people walking around in this world today than we or even they would suspect.
                  your last comment first..yes you are probably right but there are a lot more unsaved people walking around that think they are saved also IMO

                  Yes on your first comment of course, God will bring thta person back ot take him back off this earth either way the Salvation is a done deal.
                  If you get a chance read my own story in the How do you know when your are saved section. For 25 years I turned away yet God did not turn a inch away from me. The work of th Holy Spirit continues in a saved person regardless of what that person does. The false doctrine that you can loose your salvation is not of God but of Satan. Satan wants all belivers to belive that their salvation in a conditional one based on works not grace.
                  God Bless
                  And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up: That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.
                  For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    In my opinion? God will try to guide the person back to a family relationship. The measures will be increasing more focused and strict or harsh. If the person continues to rebel, God will take him out of this world rather than "lose" him for etenity or allow him to bring shame on the name of Christ.

                    Hebrews 6:4-8

                    For in the case of those who have once been enlightened and have tasted of the heavenly gift and have been made partakers of the Holy Spirit,

                    and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come,

                    and then have fallen away, it is impossible to renew them again to repentance, since they again crucify to themselves the Son of God and put Him to open shame.

                    For ground that drinks the rain which often falls on it and brings forth vegetation useful to those for whose sake it is also tilled, receives a blessing from God;
                    but if it yields thorns and thistles, it is worthless and close to being cursed, and it ends up being burned.
                    I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.
                    - Mahatma Gandhi



                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Let's assume that this person was actually, genuinely a Christian, and lets not use the argument "well, they must not have been really saved".
                      Hmmm, the old I want you to debate with me, but please don't use your best arguments.

                      Seriously though, that person was never saved.

                      While I do believe in OSAS and the whole of the TULIP principles, I do not believe in "blessed assurance". Do I know I'm saved? I believe I am and therefore cannot lose it, but if I do reject God in the future, then it is not that salvation was taken away from me, but it was never granted to me to begin with.

                      Salvation is a gift of God and God's gifts are irrevocable. Romans 12 something...

                      Yuke

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Vhayes View Post
                        In my opinion? God will try to guide the person back to a family relationship. The measures will be increasing more focused and strict or harsh. If the person continues to rebel, God will take him out of this world rather than "lose" him for etenity or allow him to bring shame on the name of Christ.

                        Hebrews 6:4-8

                        For in the case of those who have once been enlightened and have tasted of the heavenly gift and have been made partakers of the Holy Spirit,

                        and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come,

                        and then have fallen away, it is impossible to renew them again to repentance, since they again crucify to themselves the Son of God and put Him to open shame.

                        For ground that drinks the rain which often falls on it and brings forth vegetation useful to those for whose sake it is also tilled, receives a blessing from God;
                        but if it yields thorns and thistles, it is worthless and close to being cursed, and it ends up being burned.
                        I agree 100%
                        thank you
                        God bless
                        And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up: That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.
                        For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Yukerboy View Post
                          Hmmm, the old I want you to debate with me, but please don't use your best arguments.

                          Seriously though, that person was never saved.

                          While I do believe in OSAS and the whole of the TULIP principles, I do not believe in "blessed assurance". Do I know I'm saved? I believe I am and therefore cannot lose it, but if I do reject God in the future, then it is not that salvation was taken away from me, but it was never granted to me to begin with.

                          Salvation is a gift of God and God's gifts are irrevocable. Romans 12 something...

                          Yuke
                          Dear Yuke I am new here and I like to make friends with everyone I can so please take no ofense but You nor I nor anyone but God can say if a person is saved or not. we cannot Judge this it is only for God to Judge is a person is truly saved.
                          God Bless you
                          And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up: That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.
                          For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Dear Yuke I am new here and I like to make friends with everyone I can so please take no ofense but You nor I nor anyone but God can say if a person is saved or not. we cannot Judge this it is only for God to Judge is a person is truly saved.
                            God Bless you


                            100% with you on that, but I even go one step further. Not only can we not judge if a person is saved or not, we cannot even judge if we ourselves are saved.

                            We are to make our election sure, but there is no guarantee that we are when we have accepted Christ. We may believe we have accepted Him, but until the end, there is no blessed assurance, which is why all those verses preach perseverance to the end.

                            I do know that God's elect shall persevere to the end. I do not know for a fact that I am one of the elect, or anyone else for that matter.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Yukerboy View Post


                              100% with you on that, but I even go one step further. Not only can we not judge if a person is saved or not, we cannot even judge if we ourselves are saved.

                              We are to make our election sure, but there is no guarantee that we are when we have accepted Christ. We may believe we have accepted Him, but until the end, there is no blessed assurance, which is why all those verses preach perseverance to the end.

                              I do know that God's elect shall persevere to the end. I do not know for a fact that I am one of the elect, or anyone else for that matter.
                              Hmmm can you support that with some scripture pelase..
                              Because if I understand you you are sayin gthat you are not sure of your own salvation but your hoping it to be so is that correct?
                              thanks
                              God Bless
                              And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up: That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.
                              For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

                              Comment

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