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  • Should christians surrender their firearms

    in the event that our government would ever make that a requirement?

  • #2
    Titus 3:1

    Remind them to be subject to rulers and authorities, to obey, to be ready for every good work,

    Romans 13:1-2

    1 Let every soul be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and the authorities that exist are appointed by God. 2 Therefore whoever resists the authority resists the ordinance of God, and those who resist will bring judgment on themselves

    I would say based on these verses, yes
    My soul does GLORIFY the LORD, my spirit REJOICES in GOD MY SAVIOUR
    ------
    "To be entirely safe from the devils snares the man of God must be completely obedient to the Word of the Lord. The driver on the highway is safe, not when he reads the signs but when he obeys them." A.W.Tozer

    The Lifehouse Skit

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Indueseason View Post
      Titus 3:1

      Remind them to be subject to rulers and authorities, to obey, to be ready for every good work,

      Romans 13:1-2

      1 Let every soul be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and the authorities that exist are appointed by God. 2 Therefore whoever resists the authority resists the ordinance of God, and those who resist will bring judgment on themselves

      I would say based on these verses, yes
      So true - but many will find a way around Scripture.

      Add to that:

      For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the powers, against the world forces of this darkness, against the spiritual forces of wickedness in the heavenly places.
      (Ephesians 6:12)

      And take THE HELMET OF SALVATION, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God. With all prayer and petition pray at all times in the Spirit, and with this in view, be on the alert with all perseverance and petition for all the saints
      ,
      (Ephesians 6:17-18)

      Our fight is not physical
      Our weapons are the Word of Elohim and prayer.
      --------------------------------------------------------------------

      As I asked in another thread, which no one addressed:
      Is the right to bear arms a christian issue?

      Comment


      • #4
        And so, the local government, led by the government that the Beast controls, tells you to hand over your firearms, and then tells you to bow before a statue of the Beast and take His Mark, you do still honor the authorities then?

        Comment


        • #5
          The right to bear arms, in my opinion, is not a spiritual issue. It's a "practical" one that is at the heart of the American debate. If government required that you give up your guns, Biblically speaking, it won't affect your worship with God so you need to give them up.

          To put you all at ease though, this won't happen in our life time, now that the supreme court made it legal to carry firearms in D.C. (even if it's only a revolver). It's more likely they'll ban a certain kind of gun.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by third hero View Post
            And so, the local government, led by the government that the Beast controls, tells you to hand over your firearms,

            I would have to hand them over

            and then tells you to bow before a statue of the Beast and take His Mark,

            then they would have asked me to disobey God and I would not submit to their authority

            you do still honor the authorities then?
            It depends on what their asking

            blessings
            My soul does GLORIFY the LORD, my spirit REJOICES in GOD MY SAVIOUR
            ------
            "To be entirely safe from the devils snares the man of God must be completely obedient to the Word of the Lord. The driver on the highway is safe, not when he reads the signs but when he obeys them." A.W.Tozer

            The Lifehouse Skit

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Indueseason View Post
              It depends on what their asking

              blessings
              Good answer. A really good answer!

              Comment


              • #8
                Going to put this over in Contro guys.


                sigpic

                Comment


                • #9
                  Yes,...

                  Originally posted by Eaglenester View Post
                  So true - but many will find a way around Scripture.

                  Add to that:

                  For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the powers, against the world forces of this darkness, against the spiritual forces of wickedness in the heavenly places.
                  (Ephesians 6:12)

                  And take THE HELMET OF SALVATION, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God. With all prayer and petition pray at all times in the Spirit, and with this in view, be on the alert with all perseverance and petition for all the saints
                  ,
                  (Ephesians 6:17-18)

                  Our fight is not physical
                  Our weapons are the Word of Elohim and prayer.
                  --------------------------------------------------------------------

                  As I asked in another thread, which no one addressed:
                  Is the right to bear arms a christian issue?
                  ...The Right To Keep And Bear Arms IS a Christian Value. That's why it's in the Constitution Of A Christian Nation:

                  A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, THE RIGHT OF THE PEOPLE TO KEEP AND BEAR ARMS, SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED.-The Second Ammendment of The Bill of Rights of The United States Constitution.

                  LK 11:21 When a strong man armed keepeth his court, those things are in peace which he possesseth.

                  LK 22:35 And he said unto them, When I sent you without purse, and scrip, and shoes, lacked ye any thing? And they said, Nothing.
                  LK 22:36 Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take [it], and likewise [his] scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.

                  MT 24:43 But know this, that if the goodman of the house had known in what watch the thief would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to be broken up.

                  REV 13:9 If any man have an ear, let him hear:
                  REV 13:10 He that leadeth into captivity shall go into captivity: he that killeth with the sword must be killed with the sword. Here is the patience and the faith of the saints.

                  DAN 11:22 And the arms of the fighter shall be overcome before his face, and shall be broken; yea also the prince of the covenant. (Douay)

                  DAN 11:32 And such as do wickedly against the covenant shall he corrupt by flatteries: but the people that do know their God shall be strong, and do exploits.
                  DAN 11:33 And they that understand among the people shall instruct many: yet they shall fall by the sword, and by flame, by captivity, and by spoil, many days.
                  DAN 11:34 Now when they shall fall, they shall be holpen with a little help: but many shall cleave to them with flatteries.
                  DAN 11:35 And some of them of understanding shall fall, to try them, and to purge, and to make them white, even to the time of the end: because it is yet for a time appointed.

                  LK 19:41 And when he was come near, he beheld the city, and wept over it,
                  LK 19:42 Saying, If thou hadst known, even thou, at least in this thy day, the things [which belong] unto thy peace! but now they are hid from thine eyes.

                  Many used to know that, "To bring peace, prepare for war". And now, for us also, this knowledge is hid from our eyes.
                  Last edited by dan; Nov 13th 2008, 11:01 PM. Reason: content
                  JER 14:13 Then said I: 'Ah, Lord GOD! behold, the prophets say unto them: Ye shall not see the sword, neither shall ye have famine; but I will give you assured peace in this place.'
                  JER 14:14 Then the LORD said unto me: 'The prophets prophesy lies in My name; I sent them not, neither have I commanded them, neither spoke I unto them; they prophesy unto you a lying vision, and divination, and a thing of nought, and the deceit of their own heart.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Ichiban View Post
                    The right to bear arms, in my opinion, is not a spiritual issue. It's a "practical" one that is at the heart of the American debate. If government required that you give up your guns, Biblically speaking, it won't affect your worship with God so you need to give them up.
                    Without the second amendment there is no protecting the first amendment and this does affect your worship of God.

                    To put you all at ease though, this won't happen in our life time, now that the supreme court made it legal to carry firearms in D.C. (even if it's only a revolver). It's more likely they'll ban a certain kind of gun.
                    I wouldn't be so sure.
                    "Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years." - Revelation 20:6

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Hello єℓℓσωѕ,

                      LK 22:36 Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take [it], and likewise [his] scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.
                      And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God. With all prayer and petition pray at all times in the Spirit, and with this in view, be on the alert with all perseverance and petition for all the saints,
                      (Ephesians 6:17-18)
                      Bible explains it self.


                      αяєуєωєℓℓ
                      Stay healthy

                      "Think white and get serious"

                      sigpic

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by dan View Post
                        ...The Right To Keep And Bear Arms IS a Christian Value. That's why it's in the Constitution Of A Christian Nation:

                        A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, THE RIGHT OF THE PEOPLE TO KEEP AND BEAR ARMS, SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED.-The Second Ammendment of The Bill of Rights of The United States Constitution.

                        LK 11:21 When a strong man armed keepeth his court, those things are in peace which he possesseth.

                        LK 22:35 And he said unto them, When I sent you without purse, and scrip, and shoes, lacked ye any thing? And they said, Nothing.
                        LK 22:36 Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take [it], and likewise [his] scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.

                        MT 24:43 But know this, that if the goodman of the house had known in what watch the thief would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to be broken up.

                        REV 13:9 If any man have an ear, let him hear:
                        REV 13:10 He that leadeth into captivity shall go into captivity: he that killeth with the sword must be killed with the sword. Here is the patience and the faith of the saints.

                        DAN 11:22 And the arms of the fighter shall be overcome before his face, and shall be broken; yea also the prince of the covenant. (Douay)

                        DAN 11:32 And such as do wickedly against the covenant shall he corrupt by flatteries: but the people that do know their God shall be strong, and do exploits.
                        DAN 11:33 And they that understand among the people shall instruct many: yet they shall fall by the sword, and by flame, by captivity, and by spoil, many days.
                        DAN 11:34 Now when they shall fall, they shall be holpen with a little help: but many shall cleave to them with flatteries.
                        DAN 11:35 And some of them of understanding shall fall, to try them, and to purge, and to make them white, even to the time of the end: because it is yet for a time appointed.

                        LK 19:41 And when he was come near, he beheld the city, and wept over it,
                        LK 19:42 Saying, If thou hadst known, even thou, at least in this thy day, the things [which belong] unto thy peace! but now they are hid from thine eyes.

                        Many used to know that, "To bring peace, prepare for war". And now, for us also, this knowledge is hid from our eyes.
                        Sorry - we see America (NOT and NEVER was a "christian" nation), Scripture, Yahweh's Kingdom from totally different perspectives.

                        Rebellion and disobedience to govt are NOT Messiah's ways.

                        Your looking at and fighting the WRONG battle.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          I can not imagine this,



                          But this:

                          Ye have heard that it hath been said, An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth:

                          But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also.

                          And if any man will sue thee at the law, and take away thy coat, let him have thy cloak also.

                          And whosoever shall compel thee to go a mile, go with him twain.

                          Give to him that asketh thee, and from him that would borrow of thee turn not thou away.

                          Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy.

                          But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;

                          That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.
                          Matthew 5:38-45.


                          αяєуєωєℓℓ
                          Stay healthy

                          "Think white and get serious"

                          sigpic

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Indueseason View Post
                            Titus 3:1

                            Remind them to be subject to rulers and authorities, to obey, to be ready for every good work,

                            Romans 13:1-2

                            1 Let every soul be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and the authorities that exist are appointed by God. 2 Therefore whoever resists the authority resists the ordinance of God, and those who resist will bring judgment on themselves

                            I would say based on these verses, yes
                            But if our government ever did this, what authority do they do it under? Certainly not our founders or constitution. And our constitution is supposed to be the ultimate authority. So what will you do with that? Obey a current false authority that has no authority under the greater authority?

                            You may just have to make this up as you go. Which would be much like our current leaders and courts do.

                            Now I personally would give them up if I had them based on God's word, but the authorities would be wrong and they would be violating the greater authority, namely the constitution, which by the way they swear to uphold. Not swear to change, manipulate, twist or pervert but to simply uphold.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              I agree, a little.

                              Originally posted by σяєяυииєя View Post
                              I can not imagine this,



                              But this:

                              Ye have heard that it hath been said, An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth:

                              But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also.

                              And if any man will sue thee at the law, and take away thy coat, let him have thy cloak also.

                              And whosoever shall compel thee to go a mile, go with him twain.

                              Give to him that asketh thee, and from him that would borrow of thee turn not thou away.

                              Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy.

                              But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;

                              That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.
                              Matthew 5:38-45.


                              αяєуєωєℓℓ
                              Jesus has no need of weapons, but you do and He said so. That's right, the Son of God told you that you possessing a sword is more important than your possession of a coat. I'll bet you have a coat, don't you?

                              Also, you do not appear to understand all the possible implications of the "eye for an eye" statement IMO. Try this:

                              The original OT verse is:

                              DEUT 19:21 And thine eye shall not pity; but life shall go for life, eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot.

                              Jesus mentioned eyes and teeth, which I agree are changed. However, He left life, hand, and foot unchanged. Therefore, you will take a hand for a hand and a foot for a foot and a life for a life.

                              If you can only accept part of the NT, does that only make you part Christian?
                              JER 14:13 Then said I: 'Ah, Lord GOD! behold, the prophets say unto them: Ye shall not see the sword, neither shall ye have famine; but I will give you assured peace in this place.'
                              JER 14:14 Then the LORD said unto me: 'The prophets prophesy lies in My name; I sent them not, neither have I commanded them, neither spoke I unto them; they prophesy unto you a lying vision, and divination, and a thing of nought, and the deceit of their own heart.

                              Comment

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