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  • Perseverance of the Saints

    Wikipedia definition in Black, Scripture in Purple

    None who are truly saved can be condemned for their sins or finally fall away from the faith (For false Christs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and miracles to deceive even the elect—if that were possible.; whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life and will not be condemned; he has crossed over from death to life.; All that the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never drive away. For I have come down from heaven not to do my will but to do the will of him who sent me. And this is the will of him who sent me, that I shall lose none of all that he has given me, but raise them up at the last day.; The sheep listen to his voice. He calls his own sheep by name and leads them out. When he has brought out all his own, he goes on ahead of them, and his sheep follow him because they know his voice. But they will never follow a stranger; I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one can snatch them out of my hand. My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all; no one can snatch them out of my Father's hand.; there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus, because through Christ Jesus the law of the Spirit of life set me free from the law of sin and death.; Who will bring any charge against those whom God has chosen? It is God who justifies.; for God's gifts and his call are irrevocable.; He will keep you strong to the end, so that you will be blameless on the day of our Lord Jesus Christ.; he will suffer loss; he himself will be saved, but only as one escaping through the flames.; it is God who makes both us and you stand firm in Christ. He anointed us, set his seal of ownership on us, and put his Spirit in our hearts as a deposit, guaranteeing what is to come.; it is God who has made us for this very purpose and has given us the Spirit as a deposit, guaranteeing what is to come.; Having believed, you were marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit, who is a deposit guaranteeing our inheritance until the redemption of those who are God's possession; he who began a good work in you will carry it on to completion until the day of Christ Jesus.; When Christ, who is your life, appears, then you also will appear with him in glory.; May your whole spirit, soul and body be kept blameless at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. The one who calls you is faithful and he will do it.; by one sacrifice he has made perfect forever those who are being made holy; we are not of those who shrink back and are destroyed, but of those who believe and are saved.; who through faith are shielded by God's power until the coming of the salvation that is ready to be revealed in the last time.; They went out from us, but they did not really belong to us. For if they had belonged to us, they would have remained with us; but their going showed that none of them belonged to us.; No one who is born of God will continue to sin, because God's seed remains in him; he cannot go on sinning, because he has been born of God.; Everyone born of God overcomes the world.; I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God so that you may know that you have eternal life.; anyone born of God does not continue to sin; the one who was born of God keeps him safe, and the evil one cannot harm him.)

    You could almost type out the whole Bible to prove this point. Wikipedia...5 for 5.

  • #2
    Agreed - this is such an important doctrine. OSAS folk think we don't really need to persevere - we'll just lose our reward if we drift. NOSAS folk think we have to persevere ourselves - and God is waiting to reject us if we screw up once too often - only POTS has the right balance!!!!!

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Yukerboy View Post
      None who are truly saved can be condemned for their sins or finally fall away from the faith.
      Why can't one appostisize. do they still not have free will?

      Comment


      • #4
        Agreed...

        Perseverance... Perseverance Perseverance........

        As a part of that perserverance... 'testing', being sober, being vigilant, 'watching'.... praying in the Holy Ghost.. 'keeping' yourselves in the Love of God.. looking for His mercy unto Eternal Life...

        But ye, beloved, building up yourselves on your most holy faith, praying in the Holy Ghost,

        Keep yourselves in the love of God, looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life.
        Many appear Righteous and Just because they say 'yes' to Jesus Christ , yet they don't do His Will.
        ------------------------------------------------
        Verily I say unto thee, the tax collectors and the prostitutes go into the Kingdom of Heaven before you do.
        ------------------------------------------------
        The LORD hath appeared of old unto me, saying. YEA, I have loved thee with an everlasting love; therefore with LOVINGKINDESS have I DRAWN THEE.
        Jeremiah 31:3

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Diolectic View Post
          Why can't one appostisize. do they still not have free will?
          -----------------------------------------------------

          Now unto HIM, that is 'able' to 'keep' you from falling, and to present [you] faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy,

          To the only wise God our Saviour, [be] glory and majesty, dominion and power, both now and ever. Amen.

          Jude 1:24-25
          Many appear Righteous and Just because they say 'yes' to Jesus Christ , yet they don't do His Will.
          ------------------------------------------------
          Verily I say unto thee, the tax collectors and the prostitutes go into the Kingdom of Heaven before you do.
          ------------------------------------------------
          The LORD hath appeared of old unto me, saying. YEA, I have loved thee with an everlasting love; therefore with LOVINGKINDESS have I DRAWN THEE.
          Jeremiah 31:3

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by theBelovedDisciple View Post
            Agreed...

            Perseverance... Perseverance Perseverance........

            As a part of that perserverance... 'testing', being sober, being vigilant, 'watching'.... praying in the Holy Ghost.. 'keeping' yourselves in the Love of God.. looking for His mercy unto Eternal Life...

            But ye, beloved, building up yourselves on your most holy faith, praying in the Holy Ghost,

            Keep yourselves in the love of God, looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life.
            Greetings TBD,

            All God centered! If we try to perservere in our strength then we will fail. But when our focus is on what God does, rather than what we think we can do for Him, we look to Him to sustain us through this life.

            Heb 12:2 Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.

            Php 2:12 Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.
            Php 2:13 For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.

            Php 4:13 I can do all things through Christ which strengtheneth me.

            Many Blessings,
            RW

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by theBelovedDisciple View Post
              -----------------------------------------------------

              Now unto HIM, that is 'able' to 'keep' you from falling, and to present [you] faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy,

              To the only wise God our Saviour, [be] glory and majesty, dominion and power, both now and ever. Amen.

              Jude 1:24-25
              Notice that HE is only able to keepr from falling.
              It don't say that HE will keep you from falling.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by RogerW View Post
                Greetings TBD,

                All God centered! If we try to perservere in our strength then we will fail.
                That is why we apostasize. One does not remain Christ centered.
                I know one who was full of the Spirit and faith.
                However she fell away in the "Toronto blessing" junk and now she will have nothing to do with the chusrch.

                There are to many examples of aposatcy to claime that Perseverance of the Saints is true.
                If it was, there would not be any warning in the Bible about doung so.

                Comment


                • #9
                  The warnings are to make your election sure. Those who "fall away" never belonged to Christ as John says "They went out from us, but they did not really belong to us. For if they had belonged to us, they would have remained with us; but their going showed that none of them belonged to us."

                  Those who remain with us belong to us. Those who do not remain with us did not really belong to us.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Great post for OSAS

                    Originally posted by Yukerboy View Post
                    Wikipedia definition in Black, Scripture in Purple

                    None who are truly saved can be condemned for their sins or finally fall away from the faith (For false Christs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and miracles to deceive even the elect—if that were possible.; whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life and will not be condemned; he has crossed over from death to life.; All that the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never drive away. For I have come down from heaven not to do my will but to do the will of him who sent me. And this is the will of him who sent me, that I shall lose none of all that he has given me, but raise them up at the last day.; The sheep listen to his voice. He calls his own sheep by name and leads them out. When he has brought out all his own, he goes on ahead of them, and his sheep follow him because they know his voice. But they will never follow a stranger; I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one can snatch them out of my hand. My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all; no one can snatch them out of my Father's hand.; there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus, because through Christ Jesus the law of the Spirit of life set me free from the law of sin and death.; Who will bring any charge against those whom God has chosen? It is God who justifies.; for God's gifts and his call are irrevocable.; He will keep you strong to the end, so that you will be blameless on the day of our Lord Jesus Christ.; he will suffer loss; he himself will be saved, but only as one escaping through the flames.; it is God who makes both us and you stand firm in Christ. He anointed us, set his seal of ownership on us, and put his Spirit in our hearts as a deposit, guaranteeing what is to come.; it is God who has made us for this very purpose and has given us the Spirit as a deposit, guaranteeing what is to come.; Having believed, you were marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit, who is a deposit guaranteeing our inheritance until the redemption of those who are God's possession; he who began a good work in you will carry it on to completion until the day of Christ Jesus.; When Christ, who is your life, appears, then you also will appear with him in glory.; May your whole spirit, soul and body be kept blameless at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. The one who calls you is faithful and he will do it.; by one sacrifice he has made perfect forever those who are being made holy; we are not of those who shrink back and are destroyed, but of those who believe and are saved.; who through faith are shielded by God's power until the coming of the salvation that is ready to be revealed in the last time.; They went out from us, but they did not really belong to us. For if they had belonged to us, they would have remained with us; but their going showed that none of them belonged to us.; No one who is born of God will continue to sin, because God's seed remains in him; he cannot go on sinning, because he has been born of God.; Everyone born of God overcomes the world.; I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God so that you may know that you have eternal life.; anyone born of God does not continue to sin; the one who was born of God keeps him safe, and the evil one cannot harm him.)

                    You could almost type out the whole Bible to prove this point. Wikipedia...5 for 5.
                    I do not get it every word in this post makes vaild the OSAS doctrine and so many simply do not get the truth of it.
                    God Bless
                    Randy
                    And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up: That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.
                    For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by theBelovedDisciple View Post
                      -----------------------------------------------------

                      Now unto HIM, that is 'able' to 'keep' you from falling, and to present [you] faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy,

                      To the only wise God our Saviour, [be] glory and majesty, dominion and power, both now and ever. Amen.

                      Jude 1:24-25
                      Just because He can doesn't mean He will.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by looking4jesus View Post
                        I do not get it every word in this post makes vaild the OSAS doctrine and so many simply do not get the truth of it.
                        God Bless
                        Randy
                        It's simple they are out of context.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Butch5 View Post
                          It's simple they are out of context.
                          The above quote is the standard NOSAS euphemism for "I don't care what the Bible says, I'm sticking to my guns".

                          If I had quoted the whole Bible, it wouldn't matter to you.

                          Either all of the Bible is true, or none of it is. Even if one or two verses is taken out of context as you say, then the other 468 passages would still be applicable.

                          God doesn't make mistakes, he shows throughout the Bible that Perseverance of the Saints is a fact.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Yukerboy View Post
                            The above quote is the standard NOSAS euphemism for "I don't care what the Bible says, I'm sticking to my guns".

                            If I had quoted the whole Bible, it wouldn't matter to you.

                            Either all of the Bible is true, or none of it is. Even if one or two verses is taken out of context as you say, then the other 468 passages would still be applicable.

                            God doesn't make mistakes, he shows throughout the Bible that Perseverance of the Saints is a fact.
                            Amen I am afraid that some here have their hearts harden That is why they cannot see the truth.
                            God Bless
                            Randy
                            And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up: That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.
                            For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Diolectic View Post
                              Notice that HE is only able to keepr from falling.
                              It don't say that HE will keep you from falling.
                              Well it wouldn't be much of a promise if He didn't, now, would it? But elsewhere it actually says He will.....

                              Therefore you do not lack any spiritual gift as you eagerly wait for our Lord Jesus Christ to be revealed. He will keep you strong to the end, so that you will be blameless on the day of our Lord Jesus Christ. God, who has called you into fellowship with his Son Jesus Christ our Lord, is faithful. 1 Cor 1:7-9 NIV

                              May God himself, the God of peace, sanctify you through and through. May your whole spirit, soul and body be kept blameless at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. The one who calls you is faithful and he will do it. 1 Thess 5:23-24 NIV

                              I'd make the letters even bigger if I could! Notice that it's all about God's faithfulness and commitment to us - we can't apostasize because He won't let us do so ultimately - He WILL bring us back, if we are His. And if we are those who persist in apostasy - we were never His in the first place - "I never knew you" - not "I no longer know you".

                              Comment

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