If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy

[divaD]

1 Corinthians 3:17

If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.


The way this reads to me, this indicates the persons themselves are the temple of God...which temple ye are.

So that to me means God will destroy the person that defiles their own body. Why then do some conclude this is meaning other persons defiling the temple of God, such as doing harm to them bodily, and they being whom God will destroy instead? I'm guessing all of the OSAS crowd don't interpret this the way I do, since it would contradict their position. But what about others who are not of the OSAS crowd, do some of you interpret this differently than I do as well?

[Trivalee]

Re: If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy

1 Corinthians 3:17

If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.


The way this reads to me, this indicates the persons themselves are the temple of God...which temple ye are.

So that to me means God will destroy the person that defiles their own body. Why then do some conclude this is meaning other persons defiling the temple of God, such as doing harm to them bodily, and they being whom God will destroy instead? I'm guessing all of the OSAS crowd don't interpret this the way I do, since it would contradict their position. But what about others who are not of the OSAS crowd, do some of you interpret this differently than I do as well?

The text above (1 Cor 3:17) is as clear as day. The preceding verse (16) said: "know ye not that you the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwells in you?" Anyone who refuses to accept responsibility for what they do to their own body and prefers to lay blame on the harm done to them by outside influences is either denying the word of God or simply as they say, conveniently burying their head in the sand.

[Golgotha]

Re: If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy

Read it in context.

1 Corinthians 3:10 According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon. 11 For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ. 12 Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble;

So this is talking about how a believer lives his or her life; sowing to the works of the flesh or the fruits of the Spirit.

A day will be coming when the Lord will judge how everybody had built on that foundation, because God will judge the House of God first; see 1 Peter 4:17-19

13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.14 If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward. 15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.

So a day will be coming where those who built poorly on that foundation of just wood, stubble, and hay will suffer a loss, but still be saved yet so as by fire. So what is that loss & yet still be saved?

16 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you? 17 If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.

The destruction of your physical body which is death, but your spirit still has His seal, & thus saved.

What proof do we have that a day will come with fire that will bring about physical death?

2 Peter 3rd chapter talks about that day of fire coming on the earth in relation to the Biblical flood.

Jesus said He is sending fire on the earth ( Luke 12:49 ) and stripes on those He calls His servants still after cutting them off ( left behind at the pre trib rapture ) for not being ready by not abiding in Him to join the unbelievers when the wrath of God comes on the world by fire to be followed by the great tribulation ( Luke 12:40-49 ).

In the second chapter in the Book of Revelation; specifically Revelation 2:18-29 ; the church at Thyatira was warned to repent of their spiritual fornication ( Rev. 2:20-21 ) that speak the utter depths of Satan for which they speak;( Rev. 2:24 ; chasing after what they think is the Holy Spirit to receive "again" after a sign of tongues which never comes with interpretation thus becoming an adulterous generation for doing that Matthew 12:39 & 2 Corinthians 11:1-4 ) If they did not repent, they would be cast into the great tribulation ( Rev. 2:22 ) and be judged with physical death, and so God's word is true still for saved believers that the wages of sin is death and God will judge believers in according to their works as this warning is given to all the churches ( Rev. 2:23 ).

Paul ends that chapter to remind believers and the unrepentant believers this important truth.

1 Corinthians 3:23 And ye are Christ's; and Christ is God's.

1 Corinthians 6:19 What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own? 20 For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's.

And in another epistle;

Ephesians 4:30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.

And that foundation stands sure which is why the call to depart from iniquity is given to saved believers to avoid being a vessel unto dishonor in His House that did not depart from iniquity.

2 Timothy 2:19 Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity. 20 But in a great house there are not only vessels of gold and of silver, but also of wood and of earth; and some to honour, and some to dishonour. 21 If a man therefore purge himself from these, he shall be a vessel unto honour, sanctified, and meet for the master's use, and prepared unto every good work.

So what is the consequence for not believing in OSAS?

2 Peter 2:1 But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.

So just because saved believers are left behind to face the fire and the coming great tribulation, it does not mean they are not His, because He has bought them, and He will finish His work in them.

That is how they will die a physical death in that day of fire and yet they are still saved.

Unless they repent with His help in laying aside every weight & sin before the Bridegroom comes.

[Old man]

Re: If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy

1 Corinthians 3:17

If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.


The way this reads to me, this indicates the persons themselves are the temple of God...which temple ye are.

So that to me means God will destroy the person that defiles their own body. Why then do some conclude this is meaning other persons defiling the temple of God, such as doing harm to them bodily, and they being whom God will destroy instead? I'm guessing all of the OSAS crowd don't interpret this the way I do, since it would contradict their position. But what about others who are not of the OSAS crowd, do some of you interpret this differently than I do as well?

The context begins at the beginning of the chapter which is talking about how other people build onto to you (or your temple). This is not talking about the physical body but your spiritual being. Do they build encouragement, hope and faith in Christ? Do they build your faith up or tear it down? Do they build truth in you or falsehood?

It is their work or what they have contributed to your relationship with Christ that will be tested. If their efforts have a destructive affect on you what Paul is saying is that God will destroy them for the damage they have done to God's temple which is you.

It works along the same lines as what happens (and why) to the goats before His throne. In that you did it (or not) to the least of these my brothers you did it unto Me.

[Golgotha]

Re: If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy

The context begins at the beginning of the chapter which is talking about how other people build onto to you (or your temple). This is not talking about the physical body but your spiritual being. Do they build encouragement, hope and faith in Christ? Do they build your faith up or tear it down? Do they build truth in you or falsehood?

It is their work or what they have contributed to your relationship with Christ that will be tested. If their efforts have a destructive affect on you what Paul is saying is that God will destroy them for the damage they have done to God's temple which is you.

It works along the same lines as what happens (and why) to the goats before His throne. In that you did it (or not) to the least of these my brothers you did it unto Me.

I do not see how you are applying it to mean it that way.

1 Corinthians 3:10 According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon. 11 For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ. 12 Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble;

It is beyond verse 12 that signify it is how the individual believer builds on his own foundation. The reward or the loss is on that believer, because his body is the temple of the Holy Spirit and if it gets defiled, then that physical body gets destroyed.

13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.14 If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward. 15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire. 16 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you? 17 If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.

1 Corinthians 6:19 What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own? 20 For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's.

So there is a consequence for defiling your own temple of God and that is physical death when that day comes when God shall judge His House first by fire.

[divaD]

Re: If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy

So what is the consequence for not believing in OSAS?

2 Peter 2:1 But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.

Given your thread in ETC "Getting Ready For the Pre Trib Rapture Part 1", and what you said in that thread, it then doesn't surprise me in the least that you would then apply the above passage to those that of the NOSAS crowd. While I don't agree OSAS is correct, I don't believe I have ever then applied 2 Peter 2:1 to them.

Then after applying that to fellow believers, you then go on to say.."So just because saved believers are left behind to face the fire and the coming great tribulation, it does not mean they are not His, because He has bought them, and He will finish His work in them."

How can false prophets, whom you apparently conclude are believers opposed to OSAS, still be saved believers then? Seems like a contradiction to me since I wouldn't take any of these false prophets in 2 Peter 2:1 to be meaning the saved in the end. After all, it does say this...even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.

[divaD]

Re: If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy

The text above (1 Cor 3:17) is as clear as day. The preceding verse (16) said: "know ye not that you the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwells in you?" Anyone who refuses to accept responsibility for what they do to their own body and prefers to lay blame on the harm done to them by outside influences is either denying the word of God or simply as they say, conveniently burying their head in the sand.

It is as clear as day, I agree. Why isn't it as clear as day to all then? I can fully understand those of the OSAS camp interpreting this differently, but what about others not of the OSAS camp? I'm guessing some might interpret it like you and I, while others might not. But why though, if they are not of OSAS camp, thus, it's not like interpreting it like you and I do is then contradicting NOSAS somehow.

[divaD]

Re: If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy

The context begins at the beginning of the chapter which is talking about how other people build onto to you (or your temple). This is not talking about the physical body but your spiritual being. Do they build encouragement, hope and faith in Christ? Do they build your faith up or tear it down? Do they build truth in you or falsehood?

It is their work or what they have contributed to your relationship with Christ that will be tested. If their efforts have a destructive affect on you what Paul is saying is that God will destroy them for the damage they have done to God's temple which is you.

It works along the same lines as what happens (and why) to the goats before His throne. In that you did it (or not) to the least of these my brothers you did it unto Me.

As to the goats though, they are not being destroyed because of what they did to others, but because of what they didn't do for others. As to 1 Corinthians 3:17, they are being destroyed because of the things they did in their body after having had the Holy Spirit take up residence in them. That's how it reads to me, regardless that the context may start some verses earlier. It still says what it says, thus has to mean what it means.

[CadyandZoe]

Re: If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy

1 Corinthians 3:17

If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.


The way this reads to me, this indicates the persons themselves are the temple of God...which temple ye are.

So that to me means God will destroy the person that defiles their own body. Why then do some conclude this is meaning other persons defiling the temple of God, such as doing harm to them bodily, and they being whom God will destroy instead? I'm guessing all of the OSAS crowd don't interpret this the way I do, since it would contradict their position. But what about others who are not of the OSAS crowd, do some of you interpret this differently than I do as well?

In this context, the "temple" of God is the Corinthian church and the topic of his discourse up to this point is his dismay at finding factions and divisions in the church. He has discovered behaviors in the church that are not fitting for someone who believes the gospel of Christ, and he has encountered resistance to his teaching also. So, how would someone "defile" the temple in this context? To answer that question we need only examine the rest of the letter to discover that various false teachers have brought in destructive doctrine.

[Aristarkos]

Re: If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy

1 Corinthians 3:17

If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.


The way this reads to me, this indicates the persons themselves are the temple of God...which temple ye are.

So that to me means God will destroy the person that defiles their own body. Why then do some conclude this is meaning other persons defiling the temple of God, such as doing harm to them bodily, and they being whom God will destroy instead? I'm guessing all of the OSAS crowd don't interpret this the way I do, since it would contradict their position. But what about others who are not of the OSAS crowd, do some of you interpret this differently than I do as well?

I think Paul is talking about division in the church.

1Co 3:3 For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men? 4 For while one saith, I am of Paul; and another, I am of Apollos; are ye not carnal? 5 Who then is Paul, and who is Apollos, but ministers by whom ye believed, even as the Lord gave to every man?

1Co 3:11 For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.

Or in other words, falls teachings and those false teachers are those who destroy (defile) the temple of God « ye » are and God will destroy them.

Aristarkos

[divaD]

Re: If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy

In this context, the "temple" of God is the Corinthian church and the topic of his discourse up to this point is his dismay at finding factions and divisions in the church. He has discovered behaviors in the church that are not fitting for someone who believes the gospel of Christ, and he has encountered resistance to his teaching also. So, how would someone "defile" the temple in this context? To answer that question we need only examine the rest of the letter to discover that various false teachers have brought in destructive doctrine.

1 Corinthians 3:17 If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.

Let's say for the sake of argument we ignore my interpretation for the time being. What would that then mean? This perhaps? If any man NOT defile the temple of God, him shall God NOT destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.

Plenty of folks likely end up in the LOF who never defiled the temple of God though. If assuming like some are understanding this passage. So why are they getting destroyed if they never defiled the temple of God in some way? Meaning they personally done no one who is the temple of God harm one way or the other? Shouldn't that then equal...If any man NOT defile the temple of God, him shall God NOT destroy?

But if we understand it like I'm understanding it, the opposite would indeed be true of those that don't defile the temple of God, meaning via their bodies...equating to...If any man NOT defile the temple of God, him shall God NOT destroy.

[Trivalee]

Re: If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy

It is as clear as day, I agree. Why isn't it as clear as day to all then? I can fully understand those of the OSAS camp interpreting this differently, but what about others not of the OSAS camp? I'm guessing some might interpret it like you and I, while others might not. But why though, if they are not of OSAS camp, thus, it's not like interpreting it like you and I do is then contradicting NOSAS somehow.

Let me apologise for not knowing what OSAS and NOSAS stand for. That said, there is no scripture that you won't find those willing to dispute its meaning. Even some of the shortest verses in scripture like "Jesus wept" have different understanding and interpretations of its meaning depending on who ask. Do I bother myself about how someone else interprets a clear text? I don't! So long as I am convinced in the spirit (1 Cor 2:14) that my understanding is correct, am happy.

I can't help what OSAS and NOSAS think of (1 Cor 3:17) but to me, it's a clear warning that 'every individual' will be accountable to God for the things they do to themselves contrary to sound doctrine.

[CadyandZoe]

Re: If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy

1 Corinthians 3:17 If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.

Let's say for the sake of argument we ignore my interpretation for the time being. What would that then mean? This perhaps? If any man NOT defile the temple of God, him shall God NOT destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.

Plenty of folks likely end up in the LOF who never defiled the temple of God though. If assuming like some are understanding this passage. So why are they getting destroyed if they never defiled the temple of God in some way? Meaning they personally done no one who is the temple of God harm one way or the other? Shouldn't that then equal...If any man NOT defile the temple of God, him shall God NOT destroy?

But if we understand it like I'm understanding it, the opposite would indeed be true of those that don't defile the temple of God, meaning via their bodies...equating to...If any man NOT defile the temple of God, him shall God NOT destroy.

If Paul was talking about the treatment of the human body, one would expect to find a statement about the abuse or neglect of the human body in this context. I'm not saying that Paul didn't equate the human body to a temple; he does this three chapters later. Speaking about immorality he says,

1Corinthians 6:18-20
Flee immorality. Every other sin that a man commits is outside the body, but the immoral man sins against his own body. Or do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit who is in you, whom you have from God, and that you are not your own? For you have been bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body.

In Chapter 3, though, the topic of his discourse are unwise teachers, who seem to be leading the church according to the principles of Greek philosophy rather than the teachings of Jesus and the Apostles. I note the many times in chapters one through three Paul speaks about wisdom and foolishness, especially with respect to the truth about God, and the gospel of Jesus Christ crucified, which Paul says is foolishness to the natural man. At issue is the disheartening and dangerous situation in Corinth in which a faction of the church has rejected Paul and his teaching because his physical presence is not very impressive or appealing. Apollos was impressive and eloquent and was able to gain a hearing in Corinth but Paul found resistance there. In a nutshell, Paul exhorted the church to consider whether one should accept style over substance and if so, what does this say about the spiritual maturity of that person? In Paul's view, the message is more important than who delivers the message, or how impressive the messenger speaks. One should listen to both Apollos and Paul but one should also remember that Paul, not Apollos is laying the foundation of our faith and anyone who seeks to build a body of teaching would do well to build on the foundation that Paul already set down.

I agree with Aristarkos, that false teachers were present in Corinth. And such men were responsible for defiling the "temple" of God with their false teaching. But if false teachers defiled the temple of God with false teaching, much more did those who convinced others not to trust or believe Paul, who had the supernaturally ratified word from Jesus Christ himself. I suspect that the practice of immorality among them is evidence that certain men were leading church members astray with false and incorrect teaching.

[Golgotha]

Re: If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy

Given your thread in ETC "Getting Ready For the Pre Trib Rapture Part 1", and what you said in that thread, it then doesn't surprise me in the least that you would then apply the above passage to those that of the NOSAS crowd. While I don't agree OSAS is correct, I don't believe I have ever then applied 2 Peter 2:1 to them.

Then after applying that to fellow believers, you then go on to say.."So just because saved believers are left behind to face the fire and the coming great tribulation, it does not mean they are not His, because He has bought them, and He will finish His work in them."

How can false prophets, whom you apparently conclude are believers opposed to OSAS, still be saved believers then? Seems like a contradiction to me since I wouldn't take any of these false prophets in 2 Peter 2:1 to be meaning the saved in the end. After all, it does say this...even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.

If that swift destruction which is their physical bodies which comes about by being left behind to face the coming fire on the earth, and the subsequent great tribulation when the saints will be given over unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, then they are still saved, because they still have His seal unto that day of redemption. Ephesians 4:30

It cannot be eternal hellfire for how can it be swift? So it pertains to physical death.

My concern about those that do not believe in OSAS is not recognizing the power of God in salvation for having bought then or any one. The foundation stands sure. It cannot be removed. His seal is unto the day of redemption. Those believers that call God Father now is not going to cease calling Him that. He is our Father and because He is our Father, then the pre trib rapture, the fire, and the great tribulation is the Father chastening and scourging every child He receives so that we may be partakers of His holiness. See Hebrews 12:1-29

So as a vessel unto honor or as a vessel unto dishonor, the citizenship in the kingdom of heaven cannot be removed.

Better to repent by looking unto the author & finisher of our faith now to finish His work in us so that we may be ready rather than have Him finish His work in us the hard way where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

[Golgotha]

Re: If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy

If Paul was talking about the treatment of the human body, one would expect to find a statement about the abuse or neglect of the human body in this context. I'm not saying that Paul didn't equate the human body to a temple; he does this three chapters later. Speaking about immorality he says,

1Corinthians 6:18-20
Flee immorality. Every other sin that a man commits is outside the body, but the immoral man sins against his own body. Or do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit who is in you, whom you have from God, and that you are not your own? For you have been bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body.

In Chapter 3, though, the topic of his discourse are unwise teachers, who seem to be leading the church according to the principles of Greek philosophy rather than the teachings of Jesus and the Apostles. I note the many times in chapters one through three Paul speaks about wisdom and foolishness, especially with respect to the truth about God, and the gospel of Jesus Christ crucified, which Paul says is foolishness to the natural man. At issue is the disheartening and dangerous situation in Corinth in which a faction of the church has rejected Paul and his teaching because his physical presence is not very impressive or appealing. Apollos was impressive and eloquent and was able to gain a hearing in Corinth but Paul found resistance there. In a nutshell, Paul exhorted the church to consider whether one should accept style over substance and if so, what does this say about the spiritual maturity of that person? In Paul's view, the message is more important than who delivers the message, or how impressive the messenger speaks. One should listen to both Apollos and Paul but one should also remember that Paul, not Apollos is laying the foundation of our faith and anyone who seeks to build a body of teaching would do well to build on the foundation that Paul already set down.

I agree with Aristarkos, that false teachers were present in Corinth. And such men were responsible for defiling the "temple" of God with their false teaching. But if false teachers defiled the temple of God with false teaching, much more did those who convinced others not to trust or believe Paul, who had the supernaturally ratified word from Jesus Christ himself. I suspect that the practice of immorality among them is evidence that certain men were leading church members astray with false and incorrect teaching.

How does that work in application?

Does God destroy the church if that is the temple?

Does God destroy the sheep that went astray?

Does God only destroy the false teacher? If only the false teacher, what happens to the "corrupted church" or the sheep that went astray? Are they not still defiled?

Seems like the punishment is towards those defiled, and therefore how an individual believer builds on that foundation will be judged. If he sows to the fruits of the Spirit, then gold & silver; if he sows to the works of the flesh, wood, stubble, & hay. The wages of sin is still death as God is not mocked and so physical death is the destruction of that body which is the temple of the Holy Ghost. The foundation remains just as the seal unto that day of redemption remains, but the works on that foundation that is defiling the temple of God will be burned up & gone, because they are His.