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Why is the word " hades " in Greek constructed like it is ?

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  • Why is the word " hades " in Greek constructed like it is ?

    I see that the concordances say that it is written by prefixing the word eido with alpha as the negative particle, meaning " un / not " when used as a prefix in Greek

    αδης hades - from 1 (as negative particle) and 1492




    So if eido basically means " to know / understand / perceive " and prefixing it with alpha turns the word into " not knowing / understanding / perceiving ", is this meant to be congruent to the metaphorical meaning of " darkness " as it's listed in the same concordance ?

    σκοτοω skotoo {skot-o'-o} from 4655; TDNT - 7:423,1049; v AV - full of darkness 1; 1 1) to darken, cover with darkness 2) metaph. to darken or blind the mind

    .

    I can see how hell and darkness are commonly associated with the kingdom of the antichrist in scripture, textually, so is it another layer to the meaning of the scriptures ?

    Hades - not knowing
    Darkness - to have the mind blinded


    Both " not knowing " and a " blinded mind " basically refer to ignorance, do they not ?

    Do these terms refer to ignorance of the kingdom of God and the scriptures themselves, or possibly both ?

    I don't recall any scriptures saying that those in hell will have their minds blinded, so this seems rather strange to me

    Any ideas ?

    ~ Winepress

  • #2
    Re: Why is the word " hades " in Greek constructed like it is ?

    Originally posted by Winepress View Post
    I see that the concordances say that it is written by prefixing the word eido with alpha as the negative particle, meaning " un / not " when used as a prefix in Greek

    [FONT="]αδης[/FONT] hades - from 1 (as negative particle) and 1492




    So if eido basically means " to know / understand / perceive " and prefixing it with alpha turns the word into " not knowing / understanding / perceiving ", is this meant to be congruent to the metaphorical meaning of " darkness " as it's listed in the same concordance ?

    σκοτοω skotoo {skot-o'-o} from 4655; TDNT - 7:423,1049; v AV - full of darkness 1; 1 1) to darken, cover with darkness 2) metaph. to darken or blind the mind

    .

    I can see how hell and darkness are commonly associated with the kingdom of the antichrist in scripture, textually, so is it another layer to the meaning of the scriptures ?

    Hades - not knowing
    Darkness - to have the mind blinded


    Both " not knowing " and a " blinded mind " basically refer to ignorance, do they not ?

    Do these terms refer to ignorance of the kingdom of God and the scriptures themselves, or possibly both ?

    I don't recall any scriptures saying that those in hell will have their minds blinded, so this seems rather strange to me

    Any ideas ?

    ~ Winepress
    The meaning of the word « hades », is taught to us by the Holy Spirit by His quotation of the O.T. in Acts 2:27 of Psa. 16:10: « For thou wilt not leave my soul in sheol ... ». Sheol is the grave.

    The literal meaning of Hades is a (privative) and eidon to see, so the unseen as used in the unconsecrated literature. However when we read it in Scripture, it has the same meaning as Sheol, which is the grave and those there no nothing at all as Ecc. 9:5 clearly says: « For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten »

    Aristarkos

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Why is the word " hades " in Greek constructed like it is ?

      Originally posted by Winepress View Post
      I see that the concordances say that it is written by prefixing the word eido with alpha as the negative particle, meaning " un / not " when used as a prefix in Greek

      αδης hades - from 1 (as negative particle) and 1492




      So if eido basically means " to know / understand / perceive " and prefixing it with alpha turns the word into " not knowing / understanding / perceiving ", is this meant to be congruent to the metaphorical meaning of " darkness " as it's listed in the same concordance ?

      σκοτοω skotoo {skot-o'-o} from 4655; TDNT - 7:423,1049; v AV - full of darkness 1; 1 1) to darken, cover with darkness 2) metaph. to darken or blind the mind

      .

      I can see how hell and darkness are commonly associated with the kingdom of the antichrist in scripture, textually, so is it another layer to the meaning of the scriptures ?

      Hades - not knowing
      Darkness - to have the mind blinded


      Both " not knowing " and a " blinded mind " basically refer to ignorance, do they not ?

      Do these terms refer to ignorance of the kingdom of God and the scriptures themselves, or possibly both ?

      I don't recall any scriptures saying that those in hell will have their minds blinded, so this seems rather strange to me

      Any ideas ?

      ~ Winepress
      The word "hell" is an invention of the Roman Church which subscribes to pagan doctrine. At best, it is a CONCEPT - the concept of suffering. So it should not be brought into connection with "Hades". "Hades" is a place in the heart of the earth (Matt.12:40) for the souls of dead men to wait for the resurrection. Our Lord Jesus went there for three days and nights after His death (Matt.12:40; Act.2:27, 31).

      The word "Hades", which, as you have rightly reported, means "unseen" and is called that because of two reasons;
      1. The dead, by decree of God, are separated from the living. There is a natural barrier between the living, which are "seen" and the dead, who are "unseen". The Law of Moses, which shows the mind of God, called for the death penalty for anyone trying to make the dead "seen". Even Paul, in 2nd Corinthians 12:4, when caught "away" (lit. Gk) - not "up"*, to Paradise was forbidden to report what he "saw" there.
      2. Death makes and man unclean and naked (Num.6:7 etc., 2nd Cor.5:1-4). Thus, he cannot "appear" before God. He is placed in a place called "Unseen" - Hades.


      * Our eminent translators, for all the great job they did in translating the Bible, all suffered from 1,000 years of Roman Catholic tradition. Thus, in a few glaring cases they introduced tradition instead of literalness. The Greek for Paul's rapture - "Harpazo" in 2nd Corinthians 12:4 indicates movement but NOT DIRECTION. The word "up" is not warranted. It is correctly translated in Acts 8:39 as "caught away" - horizontal in that case. The whole Bible shows Hades to be "down" - in the heart of the earth. So also the word "Hell". "Hell" appears nowhere in scripture. There are three words which our translators translated as "hell", but not one is actually "hell". They are (1) "Gehenna" - the CONDITION of suffering ("their worm" and "their fire"), (2) "Hades" - the PLACE of the souls of dead men, and (3) "Tartaroo" - the subterranean prison of angels who mixed with women (2nd Pet.2:4).

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Why is the word " hades " in Greek constructed like it is ?

        Aristarkos,, you quote:

        Ecc. 9:5 « For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten »

        You say it " clearly says ", but are you aware that the concordance also " clearly says " that " dead " in this case metaphorically refers to being " spiritually " dead, and actually dead, physically ?

        νεκρος nekros {nek-ros'} from an apparently primary nekus (a corpse); TDNT - 4:892,627; adj AV - dead 132; 132 1) properly 1a) one that has breathed his last, lifeless 1b) deceased, departed, one whose soul is in Hades 1c) destitute of life, without life, inanimate 2) metaph. 2a) spiritually dead 2a1) destitute of a life that recognises and is devoted to God, because given up to trespasses and sins 2a2) inactive as respects doing right 2b) destitute of force or power, inactive, inoperative

        We can actually add this to the 2 previous terms:

        Hades - not knowing
        Darkness - to have the mind blinded
        Dead - Spiritually dead ( to God )



        Thanks for your response !

        ~ Winepress

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Why is the word " hades " in Greek constructed like it is ?

          Walls

          I don't know how to respond to conspiratorial claims, but thank you for your input

          Any tidbits to offer in respect to the root of " Dragon " ?

          drákōn ( dragon ) ( from derkomai, "to see,"

          Isn't that the opposite of " unseen / not seen / not known " ?

          Thanks !

          ~ Winepress

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Why is the word " hades " in Greek constructed like it is ?

            Here's a little more of what the concordance says on " darkness " ( in Greek at least )


            " And the fifth angel poured out his vial upon the seat of the beast; and his kingdom was full of darkness; and they gnawed their tongues for pain "



            σκοτοω skotoo {skot-o'-o}; TDNT - 7:423,1049; v AV - full of darkness 1; 1 1) to darken, cover with darkness 2) metaph. to darken or blind the mind

            from 4655

            σκοτος skotos {skot'-os} ; TDNT - 7:423,1049; n n AV - darkness 32; 32 1) darkness 1a) of night darkness 1b) of darkened eyesight or blindness 2) metaph. 2a) of ignorance respecting divine things and human duties, and the accompanying ungodliness and immorality, together with their consequent misery in hell 2b) persons in whom darkness becomes visible and holds sway

            from the base of 4639

            σκια skia {skee'-ah} apparently a primary word; TDNT - 7:394,1044; n f AV - shadow 7; 7 1) shadow 1a) shade caused by the interception of light 1b) an image cast by an object and representing the form of that object 1c) a sketch, outline, adumbration





            ------------------------------


            Also, there seem to be some things about modern exegesis that don't line up with the scriptures, as far as " the pit " and " hades / hell " being commonly associated in the ways they are

            Some interpretations do, however, and it's rather interesting

            From ancient pre-biblical priestly texts, I have identified the phrasing " in the abyss / saw of the abyss / pit " as referring to a high priest being shown hidden knowledge, but not just any hidden knowledge, revealed by God/s

            This " hidden knowledge " specifically regarded the interpretation of texts that pertained to the priest himself

            We know this by the modern term of " exegesis "

            ( This in itself is a rather complex topic and delves into cuneiform cognates to Hebrew, Aramaic and Koine Greek, so let me know if you want me to start a thread on it )


            Looking at the concordance ( I always use the concordance )


            In Hebrew, " pit " is : בור , ( bowr ) which is from the root word בור buwr {boor} a primitive root; - declare - to make clear, clear up, explain, prove , which in turn is in the sense of באר bo'r {bore} which ultimately derives from the word באר ba'ar {baw-ar'} a primitive root; - plain , plainly , declare- to make plain, distinct, to make clear, to declare*, *letters on a tablet


            In Greek, in the New Testament, however, the " pit " is " bottomless ", αβυσσος ( abussos ) ( Abyss ) which is from a variation of : βυθος buthos {boo-thos'} - deep , the bottom or depth of the sea, which is a variation of βαθος bathos {bath'-os} depth , deepness , deep thing depth, height of the deep sea , metaphorically as deep, extreme, poverty or of the deep things of God

            If we compare this to:

            Hades - ( Greek ) not knowing
            Darkness - ( Greek ) to have the mind blinded
            Dead - ( Greek ) Spiritually dead ( to God )

            Pit ( Hebrew ) from the primitive root referring to proper exegesis
            Pit ( Greek ) with a root meaning metaphorically of the deep things of God
            Dragon ( Greek ) with the root to see


            One group of words seems to be referring to seeing / understanding things of God and one not seeing / not understanding things of God


            As far as Revelation's " star in the pit ":

            Priest-kings for several thousand years prior to the Bible always had their names written with something known as a determinative, not part of the name read out loud , rather written as a signifier like a " tm " symbol


            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Determinative


            It was a symbol known as a dingir, and comes from the Sumerian word for " god ", and tells you the name is of a priest-king who was considered a god on earth

            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dingir

            The concept of "divinity" in Sumerian is closely associated with the heavens, as is evident from the fact that the cuneiform sign doubles as the ideogram for "sky", and that its original shape is the picture of a star. The original association of "divinity" is thus with "bright" or "shining" hierophanies in the sky.

            It is the Sumerian ideogram of a star



            Properly, from the ePSD:

            an [SKY] (1598x: ED IIIa, ED IIIb, Old Akkadian, Lagash II, Ur III, Early Old Babylonian, Old Babylonian, unknown) wr. an "sky, heaven; upper; crown (of a tree)" Akk. šamű


            Btw, there are several thousand years of pre-biblical literature that use the common title " serpent / dragon " to refer to a high priest / priestly king

            Just thought I would mention that

            ~ Winepress

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Why is the word " hades " in Greek constructed like it is ?

              Originally posted by Winepress View Post
              Walls

              I don't know how to respond to conspiratorial claims, but thank you for your input

              Any tidbits to offer in respect to the root of " Dragon " ?

              drákōn ( dragon ) ( from derkomai, "to see,"

              Isn't that the opposite of " unseen / not seen / not known " ?

              Thanks !

              ~ Winepress
              Thanks for your answer. I have not done a word study of the "Dragon" but Strong gives the meaning as "something fascinating to behold or see". Vine approaches it slightly differently indicating that the Serpent itself had "keen sight" and for this was renown. I would probably lean towards Strong as Eve must have been fascinated by him to grant him any credence, and the multiple designations in Revelation indicate a fascination by the world's population, which of course ends in worship (Rev.13:4). Interesting.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Why is the word " hades " in Greek constructed like it is ?

                It is interesting you brought up the character of Eve

                In the Bible she is tempted by the serpent with what is commonly translated as fruit, and assumed by many to be an apple


                However, in Judaic tradition, iirc, it's taught that it was a pomegranate, which is interesting, as they are found mentioned on the hems of the robe of the High Priest

                רמון rimmown {rim-mone'} or רמן rimmon {rim-mone'}; TWOT - 2170; n m AV - pomegranate 31, pomegranate tree 1; 32 1) pomegranate 1a) as tree 1b) as fruit 1c) as pomegranate shaped ornaments in temple

                Here are a few scriptures with the word:

                Exo 28:34 A golden bell and a pomegranate, a golden bell and a pomegranate, upon the hem of the robe round about.
                Exo 39:26 A bell and a pomegranate, a bell and a pomegranate, round about the hem of the robe to minister in; as the LORD commanded Moses.
                1Sa 14:2 And Saul tarried in the uttermost part of Gibeah under a pomegranate tree which is in Migron: and the people that were with him were about six hundred men;
                Sol 4:3 Thy lips are like a thread of scarlet, and thy speech is comely: thy temples are like a piece of a pomegranate within thy locks.
                Sol 6:7 As a piece of a pomegranate are thy temples within thy locks.
                Sol 8:2 I would lead thee, and bring thee into my mother's house, who would instruct me: I would cause thee to drink of spiced wine of the juice of my pomegranate.
                Joe 1:12 The vine is dried up, and the fig tree languisheth; the pomegranate tree, the palm tree also, and the apple tree, even all the trees of the field, are withered: because joy is withered away from the sons of men.
                Hag 2:19 Is the seed yet in the barn? yea, as yet the vine, and the fig tree, and the pomegranate, and the olive tree, hath not brought forth: from this day will I bless you.


                Pomegranates were known in Ancient Israel as the fruits which the scouts brought to Moses to demonstrate the fertility of the "promised land"

                According to the Books of Kings, the capitals of the two pillars (Jachin and Boaz) that stood in front of Solomon's Temple in Jerusalem were engraved with pomegranates

                Solomon is said to have designed his coronet based on the pomegranate's "crown" (calyx)

                The pomegranate appeared on the ancient coins of Judea, and when not in use, the handles of Torah scrolls are sometimes covered with decorative silver globes similar in shape to "pomegranates" (rimmonim)



                The fact that the hems of the robe of the High Priest are said to have this fruit on them, is not surprising in the least when one considers a High Priest was given the sobriquet " fruit " when personifying the new moon, where the moon god was named " Sin "



                That the scriptures associate the " fruit " with " sin " is no mistake at all, nor is the usage of the phrasing " serpent ' dragon " ( a high priest )


                Then we have the " garden "


                This is a unit ( sar ) taken directly from priestly texts on astronomy, and regarding measurement conventions in Mesopotamia


                sar [GARDEN] (4917x: ED IIIa, ED IIIb, Old Akkadian, Ur III, Early Old Babylonian, Old Babylonian, uncertain, unknown) wr. sar "garden; a unit of area; a unit of volume" Akkadian mūšaru

                I do have a very in-depth discussion of the sar and the mathematics, located on another website of my own design, if any are interested, but I feel for right now a cursory mention is good enough, it's a fiendishly complex topic that require a serious interest in mathematics, astronomy, and linguistics


                As far as " the tree/s " in the garden, this seems to likely be based on the Sumerian " Mes tree " and the " Mes ", which were decrees handed down by the gods as to the leadership roles of a godly king-priest

                There are 60 known, here are the first few

                ENship ( where " en " means " lord / priest " )
                Godship
                The exalted and enduring crown
                The throne of kingship
                The exalted sceptre
                The royal insignia
                The exalted shrine
                Shepherdship
                Kingship



                Food for though

                ~ Winepress

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Why is the word " hades " in Greek constructed like it is ?

                  Originally posted by Winepress View Post


                  As far as " the tree/s " in the garden, this seems to likely be based on the Sumerian " Mes tree " and the " Mes ", which were decrees handed down by the gods as to the leadership roles of a godly king-priest



                  Food for though

                  ~ Winepress
                  The Garden of Eden ?

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Why is the word " hades " in Greek constructed like it is ?

                    I'm so dizzy right now. This has spiraled into just about anything.
                    9 Let us not lose heart in doing good, for in due time we will reap if we do not grow weary. 10 So then, while we have opportunity, let us do good to all people, and especially to those who are of the household of the faith. - Galatians 6:9-10 NASB

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Why is the word " hades " in Greek constructed like it is ?

                      Originally posted by jesusinmylife View Post
                      I'm so dizzy right now. This has spiraled into just about anything.

                      I am with you brother.
                      “A” cannot be “A” & not “A” at the same time.

                      מקום כניעה סך הכל

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Why is the word " hades " in Greek constructed like it is ?

                        I take it " spiraled into anything " is fancy-speak for " I'm not familiar with what you are saying " ?

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Why is the word " hades " in Greek constructed like it is ?

                          Imagine buying a plane ticket from New York to Texas. Boarding the plane. Hearing the captain tell you how the weather is in Texas. Then hours later, you get off the plane and you're in Alaska.
                          9 Let us not lose heart in doing good, for in due time we will reap if we do not grow weary. 10 So then, while we have opportunity, let us do good to all people, and especially to those who are of the household of the faith. - Galatians 6:9-10 NASB

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Why is the word " hades " in Greek constructed like it is ?

                            Originally posted by Winepress View Post
                            Aristarkos,, you quote:

                            Ecc. 9:5 « For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten »

                            You say it " clearly says ", but are you aware that the concordance also " clearly says " that " dead " in this case metaphorically refers to being " spiritually " dead, and actually dead, physically ?

                            νεκρος nekros {nek-ros'} from an apparently primary nekus (a corpse); TDNT - 4:892,627; adj AV - dead 132; 132 1) properly 1a) one that has breathed his last, lifeless 1b) deceased, departed, one whose soul is in Hades 1c) destitute of life, without life, inanimate 2) metaph. 2a) spiritually dead 2a1) destitute of a life that recognises and is devoted to God, because given up to trespasses and sins 2a2) inactive as respects doing right 2b) destitute of force or power, inactive, inoperative

                            We can actually add this to the 2 previous terms:

                            Hades - not knowing
                            Darkness - to have the mind blinded
                            Dead - Spiritually dead ( to God )



                            Thanks for your response !

                            ~ Winepress
                            Concordances are a great help, but Scripture itself should be our teacher. From the opposite in Ecclesiastics 9 it is as clear as I said it was:

                            For the living know that they shall die:
                            but the dead know not any thing

                            Spiritual dead people know a lot, just not about the spiritual things because they are « spiritually discerned » as 1 Cor. 2:14 says.

                            Aristarkos

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Why is the word " hades " in Greek constructed like it is ?

                              Did you know that " in " in Greek is a primary preposition that doesn't necessarily denote a place ?

                              " In heaven "
                              " In hell "

                              " in " in Koine Greek as a primary preposition denotes any of the following 3 things:

                              ~ time
                              ~ place
                              ~ state ( of a situation )


                              ~ Winepress

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